In light of some people moving to the Free State with little to nothing,
http://newhampshireunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=10653.0
I thought it would be a great idea to start a sort of food-bank thing.
The idea has been brought up and talked about a little bit, but we've got some concrete goals to meet by helping out Porcs, so that goal may help the rest of the infrastructure get established.
Once, in college, I survived for a week solely on a large box of Minute Rice.
Warehouse stores like Sam's Club, Price Club, BJ's, etc have giant sacks of rice, flour, sugar and other staple foods. If a few porcupines went in on a big sack, split up what they wanted, and gave the rest to the food bank, the bulk savings would make the donations cheap-to-free.
Some folks have metric tons of fresh garden vegetables looking for a home.
There are also a lot of things in people's pantries and kitchen drawers that they may not need or even want. Every last calorie can help ease a new Porc's physical and psychological hardship and help get them on their feet so that they can make the transition from "wretched refuse" to realizing the American dream.
We can set something like this for Porcs to get the logistics worked out (sales, storage, distribution, etc.) and then maybe expand it to be a charity organization for folks in NH hit hard by the tax-and-spenders, the we-just-regulated/banned-you-out-of-a-jobbers, or the we-liked-your-home-so-we-took-its.
Anyone interested in discussing something like this is welcome to contact me by any of the usual methods.
Quote from: Bald Eagle on September 13, 2007, 09:45 AM NHFT
I thought it would be a great idea to start a sort of food-bank thing.
This is a great idea. I'd personally like to see it combined with temporary housing (we're going to need it much more than we need it now) but just food is a good start.
I've put in about 2 years with a group called Food Not Bombs, an anarchist group that feeds the homeless "without the government's help". Most soup kitchens are, after all, very much dependent on government funding. We linked up with "Friendship Donation Network", which basically one elderly woman and a host of short-term volunteers worked with area supermarkets to get food which was about to expire, day old bread, etc.
One supermarket, Wegmans, gave her 1/6th of their storage space for her use. She processes thousands of dollars worth of food a week, and she is why our local food pantries are always brimming. Granted half of that is in bread and bagels.. but she pays nothing but gas out of pocket.
We may also find some people willing to donate produce from the Manchester Farmer's Market. It doesn't hurt to ask.
Point is that the supermarkets get a tax writeoff and people who need food are fed. We should be able to replicate what Mrs. Pines is doing here in Manchester. This is very much in line with how the Irish organized support for their own people just getting off the boat in NYC who spent all their resources for the trip (or were forcibly exiled). We need to take care of our own, but with all the food being thrown away we need not do so out of our own pockets.
Quote from: Bald Eagle on September 13, 2007, 09:45 AM NHFT
Some folks have metric tons of fresh garden vegetables looking for a home.
This is very applicable today. It won't be in three months through the Spring.
This is an awesome idea! I might even have a small amount of storage space to help get this going...and a membership at costco....and a nice big garden.
I may be able to help with canning and buying in bulk.
i like it
Quote from: Bald Eagle on September 13, 2007, 09:45 AM NHFT
Once, in college, I survived for a week solely on a large box of Minute Rice.
Mine was a big box of elbow noodles, but in looking back it feels like a month that I had to eat it every meal of every day and out of the micowave no less :P I remember selling (yes, I'm dating myself) my rollerblades to buy the noodles, till I finally got a job at the theater and I was back on my salad and beer....
I'd be glad to donate -- food or money.
Quote from: lawofattraction on September 13, 2007, 09:44 PM NHFT
I pretty much lived on Kraft macaroni and cheese in college. Sometimes they'd go on sale for something like 8 boxes for a dollar and I would stock up!
Yuck....I can taste the metallic cheese flavor right now.
Ramen noodles here. If I had a bit of extra money I would buy that huge 3 pound bag of smoked sausages and chop a few of those up and throw them in.
Quote from: error on September 13, 2007, 09:52 PM NHFT
Ramen noodles here. If I had a bit of extra money I would buy that huge 3 pound bag of smoked sausages and chop a few of those up and throw them in.
Ohhh... smoked sausages and ramen.... uhhhh...
I've got some frozen veggies I could donate to your ramen....
Yall sure ate some cheap food in college. I just don't know how yall were able to do that.
Also, this seems like a pretty good idea.
About crashing at people's houses for a short amount of time. I have found, as long as you know pro-freedom person (even online for a year) they are often willing to let you crash at their place for a short amount of time (and it helps if you can give them a good reason why you want to crash at their place).
Quote from: Rosie the Riveter on September 13, 2007, 09:54 PM NHFT
Quote from: error on September 13, 2007, 09:52 PM NHFT
Ramen noodles here. If I had a bit of extra money I would buy that huge 3 pound bag of smoked sausages and chop a few of those up and throw them in.
Ohhh... smoked sausages and ramen.... uhhhh...
I've got some frozen veggies I could donate to your ramen....
Thanks dear, but I don't eat ramen noodles anymore.
I can get a deep discount on some pantry items like mac and cheese,
instant oatmeal, cereal, microwave popcorn, etc. Shipping is the issue.
Seems like donations of used dishes, furniture - household stuff - would be useful also.
Quote from: Kat Kanning on September 14, 2007, 05:31 AM NHFT
Seems like donations of used dishes, furniture - household stuff - would be useful also.
Well, there already are large Freecycle groups all over NH so I am not sure if that is really needed. In fact, Freecycle numbers tend to be higher in NH per capita than most of New England.
http://www.freecycle.org/groups/usnortheast/#New%20Hampshire
Maybe used dishes and silverwave but for most needed things, there is a ton of it already out there for free in NH.
I think a general mission statement of the proposed food bank is a good start. What you had posted initially looks like the beginnings of one to me. What I would suggest is to start looking at potential locations for storage, offices for counseling (seeing who's just hitting a rough patch and needs to get back into work and what not), and possible regular sponsors (businesses, and folks you can count on). If you focus on the issue of individual liberty and self-reliance, I think your idea would work well. :)
-- Brede
Quote from: error on September 13, 2007, 10:31 PM NHFT
Quote from: Rosie the Riveter on September 13, 2007, 09:54 PM NHFT
Quote from: error on September 13, 2007, 09:52 PM NHFT
Ramen noodles here. If I had a bit of extra money I would buy that huge 3 pound bag of smoked sausages and chop a few of those up and throw them in.
Ohhh... smoked sausages and ramen.... uhhhh...
I've got some frozen veggies I could donate to your ramen....
Thanks dear, but I don't eat ramen noodles anymore.
I'm glad
Quote from: Kat Kanning on September 14, 2007, 05:31 AM NHFT
Seems like donations of used dishes, furniture - household stuff - would be useful also.
Yes, I've already given a stove and clothes dryer away...and as soon as this election madness is over will have other stuff to give away.
Quote from: GraniteForge on September 14, 2007, 07:23 PM NHFT
How would you set up the group so that donors could get a tax writeoff, considering that the purpose is to help porcs (rather than the general public)?
Systemic exclusion. All groups practice it at some level and to some ends. We simply don't advertise it except to porcs. The people we want to help will find it and take advantage of it, those who, well, don't know about the project wouldn't.
Quote from: GraniteForge on September 15, 2007, 12:44 PM NHFT
Quote from: ArcRiley on September 15, 2007, 12:46 AM NHFT
Quote from: GraniteForge on September 14, 2007, 07:23 PM NHFT
How would you set up the group so that donors could get a tax writeoff, considering that the purpose is to help porcs (rather than the general public)?
Systemic exclusion. All groups practice it at some level and to some ends. We simply don't advertise it except to porcs. The people we want to help will find it and take advantage of it, those who, well, don't know about the project wouldn't.
You have to be very careful how you structure such an organization on paper, and also how you apply the criteria. The Charitable Trusts department is very aggressive about scrutiny and enforcement (and assessing fines).
If you just want to help new movers get a leg up, why open the door to government involvement at all?
I think people would want to help with this on a personal basis, not for a tax write off. The work involved in getting non-profit status sounds pretty overwhelming for a simple project like this.
Here is the first project for our Porcupine food bank donors!!
Food drive on Sept. 29th!
____________________________________
The New Hampshire grassroots organization, RonPaulHQ (www.ronpaulhq.com) is proud to sponsor a food drive in conjunction with the upcoming Ron Paul Family walk on Sept 29 in Manchester New Hampshire. This food drive will supply food to needy people throughout the state.
"Voluntary charities also promote self-reliance, but government welfare programs foster dependency." – Ron Paul 2003 (http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul80.html)
This food drive will help Americans understand that opposition to government welfare programs doesn't mean opposition to charity, since private charities are more efficient and responsive than government programs. And they involve one-on-one caring, rather than forced participation through taxation.
To participate, bring at least one bag of food items to the rally on the 29th in Manchester, NH. For more details on the rally, see http://www.ronpaul2008.com/events/manchester-nh-rally-canvassing. PLEASE RSVP to the national site, and to your local meetup. Cash donations will also be accepted with half of the funds going to RonPaulHQ, and half to the food bank.
Food items urgently needed are:
• Protein items such as canned tuna or chicken and canned stews and pasta
• Peanut butter
• 100% juice boxes (no glass please)
• Canned fruits in light syrup, applesauce
• Canned vegetables, tomatoes and tomato sauce
• Soups
• Healthy cereals
• Pasta, rice
• Dry beans
• Financial Donations: $1 = 4 meals!
Don't be bashful, the truck can hold 20,000 lbs of food! Feel free to ask friends and family for donations.
__________________________________
I received this message from Ron Paul for President - HQNH.
Just one note..
Ronpaulhq will not be taking half... there will be a jar for ronpaulhq and a jar for the food bank.
Also, please don't forget to RSVP for the Family Walk at:
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/states/new-hampshire/
added the food drive to the calendar...sounds cool :D
Quote from: CNHT on September 20, 2007, 08:13 PM NHFT
Also, please don't forget to RSVP for the Family Walk at:
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/states/new-hampshire/
Why RSVP? Why not just show up? I filled out the form and it didn't like my answers.
If we do this so people can get a tax right off then we have to follow the governments rule about how to handle the food and how to distribute it. Many small groups have given up due to the bullshit they had to jump though when the government was included. No applying for grants either. Even more rules.
Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on September 21, 2007, 07:36 AM NHFT
Quote from: CNHT on September 20, 2007, 08:13 PM NHFT
Also, please don't forget to RSVP for the Family Walk at:
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/states/new-hampshire/
Why RSVP? Why not just show up? I filled out the form and it didn't like my answers.
Because they are setting up the literature and drivers vs walkers according to the responses they get.
Also, what do y'all think would be the best food item desired to donate?
Beer. ;D
Quote from: Scott Roth on September 21, 2007, 02:48 PM NHFT
But Pat, you know you'll never "donate" beer. C'mon.... ;D
Not so I would be Happy too.
I always bring extra for folks who may be Beerless it breaks my heart
to see that.
If you love someone something .................set it free!
Did this idea die?
I hadn't seen the thread before, but now that you brought it back I have some thoughts. I keep a stockpile (I would gladly donate to a porc in need) and spend time each month rotating items into my regular pantry. I suspect we as a group could collect far more food than anyone is needing at a given time. With donated storage space, we could hold for awhile if there were good rotate or throw away procedures in place. Not being wasteful people it might morph into a buying club for ourselves when we take the stuff before it goes bad.
As far as helping those of us in need, we do it all the time now. I can't list all the stuff including food that I have given to new movers. Longer time residents have usually established their network of friends and get help as needed.
The need seems spotty to me. Maybe what we really need is an established process to get the request, get the word out, and meet the need as it happens? How about a list of interested donors, what they have committed to store and supply at a moments notice and contact information? Then each of us would only commit to one case of something in the closet, can use and resupply as we want. One list to be kept up to date and distribute to porcs shouldn't be too tough a task.
Cathleen
Would it be something to do for non-porcs also?
I think it would be really cool to set something up to help anyone we learn of that's in need. From time to time, there are major disasters in NH for people, like a house burning to the ground or a parent dying in a car crash. If we could reach out to people like that in their time of need, it could be a win-win.
For our liberty-loving friends it might be nice to set something up for when one of our friends is down and out - maybe an operation - or too busy to cook - maybe having just had a baby, for examples. I think of what church groups often do and wonder if we can replicate the bringing of dinners and helping with things that need to be done, etc.
For someone who does not want to be politically active, I think ideas like all of these being shared would be a great way to bring non-governmental assistance to those in some kind of need.
I can attest to the fact that while I did not need any monetary assistance, (I gave them the money for the groceries and such) several FSPers 'took care' of me while i was bedridden and sick for several months and could not leave the house to drive.
They did my food shopping for me and came over to check on me regularly during that time, kept me company, watched movies with me and did some chores around the house.
Sometimes the people you think you are very close to and for whom YOU have been doing a lot, suddenly disappear in your time of need, while others you could never imagine, jump to the task when needed.
I was VERY grateful! (You know who you are) :tiphat:
Quote from: dawn on November 20, 2007, 07:43 AM NHFT
I think of what church groups often do and wonder if we can replicate the bringing of dinners and helping with things that need to be done, etc.
My wife was on bed rest for moneky #1 and I used to travel for a living... her church members brought her food every day for 5 months!!!!!
Question for caring foodbankers --
I see a homeless person siting on a median strip with a sign "homeless please help" near my neighborhood almost everyday for the past week or two on my way home from work.
The guy looks like a wreck, and I feel sad for him but down deep I really don't want to help him. I want him to get the hell up off that median strip and get a job. I have not given him food or money and really I just want him to go away.
Am I a bad person for feeling this way? Should I be helping this guy?
Quote from: Rosie the Riveter on November 20, 2007, 09:09 PM NHFT
Question for caring foodbankers --
I see a homeless person siting on a median strip with a sign "homeless please help" near my neighborhood almost everyday for the past week or two on my way home from work.
The guy looks like a wreck, and I feel sad for him but down deep I really don't want to help him. I want him to get the hell up off that median strip and get a job. I have not given him food or money and really I just want him to go away.
Am I a bad person for feeling this way? Should I be helping this guy?
You are definitely not a bad person. Whether you should help is a very personal decision. I have had good experiences from helping needy people, and bad experiences. I had a friend back in Illinois who had a wonderful talent for discerning the needy from the greedy. It was wonderful doing charity work with her because it actually changed people's lives. There is a good discussion of this on the old "Ethics in America" PBS program, which can be watched (registration required) at http://www.learner.org/resources/series81.html (http://www.learner.org/resources/series81.html)
Quote from: Dreepa on November 20, 2007, 05:47 PM NHFT
Quote from: dawn on November 20, 2007, 07:43 AM NHFT
I think of what church groups often do and wonder if we can replicate the bringing of dinners and helping with things that need to be done, etc.
My wife was on bed rest for moneky #1 and I used to travel for a living... her church members brought her food every day for 5 months!!!!!
This is why it's so important to encourage religion instead of secularism -- they are the extended family some, at times.
As if people helping others doesn't happen outside of religion :P
Quote from: Rosie the Riveter on November 20, 2007, 09:09 PM NHFT
Am I a bad person for feeling this way? Should I be helping this guy?
most guys begging ... make money that way
but you could ask him what is going on
Quote from: Rosie the Riveter on November 20, 2007, 09:09 PM NHFT
Question for caring foodbankers --
I see a homeless person siting on a median strip with a sign "homeless please help" near my neighborhood almost everyday for the past week or two on my way home from work.
The guy looks like a wreck, and I feel sad for him but down deep I really don't want to help him. I want him to get the hell up off that median strip and get a job. I have not given him food or money and really I just want him to go away.
Am I a bad person for feeling this way? Should I be helping this guy?
I understand what you're saying, and no you're not bad for feeling like that. I have volunteered at several shelters and soup kitchens and most homeless really don't want to bother finding work, let alone steady work. This is going to sound cold but most of them really ARE lazy folk who prefer just to let others give them their drug and food money.
The shelter I worked at for several years had a great program where they had a Labor Ready van come every morning at 5am sharp and the folk that wanted to would work and put money into an savings account the shelter would set up for them and after they had saved up enough money would help them find an apartment through a network of landlords that they knew and a steady job.
So there was no excuse for folk not getting involved in this program and getting back on their feet. But yet the majority of the homeless that stayed in that shelter chose NOT to do this. They got their free food and their cot and fairly nice shower and bathroom facility too and were out begging for most of the day or getting drunk.
Like someone else posted, this guy that you see on the road every morning if he was really desperate could find a job and could do something about his condition.
But isn't it psychological problems that underly it? Isn't that why they can't bring themselves to get in the work programs? Taking away the charity doesn't straighten the head cases out. I imagine some are gaming it, but surely not most. I won't hand them a dollar but I will hand them a sandwich.
Cathleen
Quote from: cathleeninnh on November 21, 2007, 09:13 AM NHFT
But isn't it psychological problems that underly it? Isn't that why they can't bring themselves to get in the work programs? Taking away the charity doesn't straighten the head cases out. I imagine some are gaming it, but surely not most. I won't hand them a dollar but I will hand them a sandwich.
Cathleen
For a few there really are psychological problems and they need help.They're the ones I was (and am) happy to help out, along with those that just were in a bad time and needed assistance. Problem is, the majority had a prevalant psychological problem that is easily fixed, lazyness.
Quote from: CNHT on November 20, 2007, 11:34 PM NHFT
Quote from: Dreepa on November 20, 2007, 05:47 PM NHFT
Quote from: dawn on November 20, 2007, 07:43 AM NHFT
I think of what church groups often do and wonder if we can replicate the bringing of dinners and helping with things that need to be done, etc.
My wife was on bed rest for moneky #1 and I used to travel for a living... her church members brought her food every day for 5 months!!!!!
This is why it's so important to encourage religion instead of secularism -- they are the extended family some, at times.
Generosity has little to do with religion IME.
I have known plenty of religious people who do not practice what they "preach".
Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on November 21, 2007, 05:59 AM NHFT
As if people helping others doesn't happen outside of religion :P
It does, but a great part of the 'work' that churches do is charity, no?
Quote from: cathleeninnh on November 21, 2007, 09:13 AM NHFT
But isn't it psychological problems that underly it? Isn't that why they can't bring themselves to get in the work programs? Taking away the charity doesn't straighten the head cases out. I imagine some are gaming it, but surely not most. I won't hand them a dollar but I will hand them a sandwich.
Cathleen
One of the few guys I've met that I've considered true to christianity (not that I know that much about it) was this friend from college....he would never give vagrants money, but he'd take them to a restaurant to buy them a meal and have like an hour long conversation with them about their lives, just listening mostly and finding out how they got where they were in life.
He was such a strange and beautiful person...one of those guys that everyone loves. He rode his bike all the way across the US, and people along the way just took him in and gave him a place to sleep - he was that kind of person. It was so sad, the last time I saw him he seemed destroyed by an unhappy marriage.
[reminicing off]
I have to say that I don't think that is true of my wife's church.
Last night they served over 300 meals and they made a point not to mention it was from a church.
Granted they also do perpetuate themselves but I think that the charity is truly for charity's sake. (at least it seems to me)
If you donate food to a local food bank anytime soon, you might consider stamping the container with a Ron Paul stamp to let the receivers know who the givers support. As far as the idea of forming our own food bank, I think it is a good idea. I don't know why I never noticed this thread before. One time when I was traveling through Atlanta, Georgia, I stopped for gas and some guy came up to me and asked for money for food. I told him that I didn't have any money but I had some food. I gave him a little container of soy milk. A little while later while sitting at a red light, another guy asked for money for food, so I gave him a banana. I had just enough cash to pay for the tolls on the way up and was paying for everything else with credit cards. I've gone through some difficult times, and have lived on ramen noodles or beans and rice or occasionally packaged food from dumpsters that was "expired" but not moldy or rotten yet. I remember one time before we had kids, we were going through a really difficult time and had no money or food. A friend of mine gave me a grocery bag full of food, which really helped out a lot. A few times anonymous people from the church we go to have given us gifts of food, heating oil or money to help us out during difficult times. Whenever possible I try to supplement my diet with edible wild plants. When I was younger I ate violets, sweet clover, wild grapes, wild blueberries, wild mushrooms and some other plants that my mom showed me were edible. Unfortunately some of the plants I ate aren't common in this part of NH. Rich Angell is familiar with a lot of edible wild plants that grow around here. Fortunately I haven't been homeless for more than a few months and was usually able to stay with family or friends while I was looking for work and housing. I've slept outside a bit, and have on occasion waken up in a snowbank that formed during the night. A good sleeping bag and sleeping bag cover make it a lot more comfortable to sleep outside. I would be happy to try to help out if someone is in a pinch if I am able to.
Rich Angell Rocks...
Thank you all for your thoughts about the homeless guy with the sign....
OK, I searched all through this thread for a reply by Rich Angell to see his words of wisdom, but couldn't find anything by him :-\
Quote from: Porcupine_in_MA on November 21, 2007, 09:45 AM NHFT
For a few there really are psychological problems and they need help.They're the ones I was (and am) happy to help out, along with those that just were in a bad time and needed assistance. Problem is, the majority had a prevalant psychological problem that is easily fixed, lazyness.
Might I ask, how was this viewpoint gained? Is this just an opinion?
I lived on the streets for the better part of a decade and my experience does not support such a view in the least.
Quote from: Kat Kanning on November 23, 2007, 04:37 AM NHFT
OK, I searched all through this thread for a reply by Rich Angell to see his words of wisdom, but couldn't find anything by him :-\
Defender of Liberty said -- "Rich Angell is familiar with a lot of edible wild plants that grow around here." That is why I think he rocks ;)
Quote from: EJinNH on November 23, 2007, 07:30 AM NHFT
Quote from: Porcupine_in_MA on November 21, 2007, 09:45 AM NHFT
For a few there really are psychological problems and they need help.They're the ones I was (and am) happy to help out, along with those that just were in a bad time and needed assistance. Problem is, the majority had a prevalant psychological problem that is easily fixed, lazyness.
Might I ask, how was this viewpoint gained? Is this just an opinion?
I lived on the streets for the better part of a decade and my experience does not support such a view in the least.
Please go back in this thread and look at my lengthy post describing how my view was gained.
People are always welcome to call me or write, to inform me about people who may need help or to request help themselves.
I'm always happy to have fellow porcupines stop by to visit, stay over, and share meals with.
Although I don't have any experience running any charities, especially the logistics of handling perishables, I remain interested in providing relief for Porcs experiencing hard times and further discussing the establishment of a small food bank so that we are already prepared to help those in need.
Quote from: Bald Eagle on November 23, 2007, 07:05 PM NHFT
People are always welcome to call me or write, to inform me about people who may need help or to request help themselves.
I'm always happy to have fellow porcupines stop by to visit, stay over, and share meals with.
Although I don't have any experience running any charities, especially the logistics of handling perishables, I remain interested in providing relief for Porcs experiencing hard times and further discussing the establishment of a small food bank so that we are already prepared to help those in need.
I want to second this. I'd be more than happy to donate my time or food if needed.
Quote from: EJinNH on November 23, 2007, 07:30 AM NHFT
Quote from: Porcupine_in_MA on November 21, 2007, 09:45 AM NHFT
For a few there really are psychological problems and they need help.They're the ones I was (and am) happy to help out, along with those that just were in a bad time and needed assistance. Problem is, the majority had a prevalant psychological problem that is easily fixed, lazyness.
Might I ask, how was this viewpoint gained? Is this just an opinion?
I lived on the streets for the better part of a decade and my experience does not support such a view in the least.
Well........you're prejudice! :P
Quote from: Rosie the Riveter on November 23, 2007, 05:42 PM NHFT
Quote from: Kat Kanning on November 23, 2007, 04:37 AM NHFT
OK, I searched all through this thread for a reply by Rich Angell to see his words of wisdom, but couldn't find anything by him :-\
Defender of Liberty said -- "Rich Angell is familiar with a lot of edible wild plants that grow around here." That is why I think he rocks ;)
Aha! srqrebel is another forager. Try his famous poison ivy sandwich! ;D
Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on November 24, 2007, 07:33 AM NHFT
Well........you're prejudice! :P
Yes Lloyd, I am; and if anyone had similar life experiences I'm sure they would be as well. :P
Quote from: Porcupine_in_MA on November 23, 2007, 07:02 PM NHFT
Quote from: EJinNH on November 23, 2007, 07:30 AM NHFT
Quote from: Porcupine_in_MA on November 21, 2007, 09:45 AM NHFT
For a few there really are psychological problems and they need help.They're the ones I was (and am) happy to help out, along with those that just were in a bad time and needed assistance. Problem is, the majority had a prevalant psychological problem that is easily fixed, lazyness.
Might I ask, how was this viewpoint gained? Is this just an opinion?
I lived on the streets for the better part of a decade and my experience does not support such a view in the least.
Please go back in this thread and look at my lengthy post describing how my view was gained.
So no first hand experience living the lifestyle in several different socio-economic locals; simply judging it by a partial perspective?
Spend enough time living with, and getting to know, these people, and it is apparent that they have some form of psychological disorder. Just because one is not a full blown wing-nut, does not mean they do not have serious issues; and let us not forget that appearances can be very deceiving.
Perhaps in certain areas ( mostly urban I would presume.) this may be a more factual statement; and if you meant to say that the majority of those, you have had experiences with, were lazy, I would be more willing to accept your perspective; but I have been all across this country and IME, that is simply not an accurate, across the board, assessment.
There are many, many people who do not even frequent shelters/food banks/kitchens; so how do they fit in?
Some of the most active, kind, and helpful people I have ever met were transients and from such experiences I have a hard time with people that suggest that the majority of transients are simply lazy when they have no clue how it is to walk in their shoes. I know how difficult and strenuous it can be by first hand experience and let me assure you that it is much harder than most would imagine and thats from someone who does not have "serious" psychological imbalances.
I'm sorry that the majority of those you have experience with have mislead you to assuming the worst about most. 8)
Quote from: Bald Eagle on November 23, 2007, 07:05 PM NHFT
People are always welcome to call me or write, to inform me about people who may need help or to request help themselves.
I'm always happy to have fellow porcupines stop by to visit, stay over, and share meals with.
Although I don't have any experience running any charities, especially the logistics of handling perishables, I remain interested in providing relief for Porcs experiencing hard times and further discussing the establishment of a small food bank so that we are already prepared to help those in need.
Same here; more than happy to help anyone in need in any way I am capable of.
I just hope no-one has too much pride to ask for assistance; I know it can be very difficult for some to ask for help as I'm loath to ask myself; but that is exactly why some of us are here, to help.
Those of us who seek to serve in this fashion cannot do so if we are unaware of the situation. ;)
EJ I worked with and lived with the homeless in the shelter I worked at. I have plenty of experience as I ALREADY said. Don't go spouting off on what you think I don't know. Thanks.
Oh and I worked at several different soup kitchens and a food pantry on top of that. Plenty of homeless have access to job programs and are perfectly capable of working but choose not to, they would rather pan handle and make lots of money, spend it on the drugs they prefer and live at a shelter, than work. Sad but true. Of course this is not all of them, and I believe in helping those that are mentally ill or who are down and out and really want to try to get back on their feet.
Panhandling = tax free income :D
Quote from: Porcupine_in_MA on November 24, 2007, 05:24 PM NHFT
EJ I worked with and lived with the homeless in the shelter I worked at. I have plenty of experience as I ALREADY said. Don't go spouting off on what you think I don't know. Thanks.
Fair enough, but IMO, that exposure only represents a very small cross-section of the many transients in our country. IME, Working/living at a shelter/food kitchen in no way compares to living on the streets, no matter how one slices it.
This is not a personal attack, and I'm not disavowing your experiences; just strongly suggesting such is an incomplete assessment IME.
I'm merely commenting on what you have written; that's what happens on BB's. If you don't wish to have any dissenting comments then perhaps you should not post such sweeping accusations; or avoid posting altogether. I agree that there are "plenty" that take advantage of others kindness and generosity, but that is different than "most".
There is a vast difference between "many" and the "majority"; which was my main point.
Not to get it all twisted, I do applaud you for your generosity and willingness to make a difference. ;)
I simply hope that some who are truly deserving aren't ignored, passed by or misjudged because of faulty assumptions on our part.
If someone asks for help, I feel it is my duty to assist, regardless of my judgement of their worthiness to receive. 8)
Quote from: EJinNH on November 25, 2007, 07:58 AM NHFT
Fair enough, but IMO, that exposure only represents a very small cross-section of the many transients in our country. IME, Working/living at a shelter/food kitchen in no way compares to living on the streets, no matter how one slices it.
This is not a personal attack, and I'm not disavowing your experiences; just strongly suggesting such is an incomplete assessment IME.
I'm merely commenting on what you have written; that's what happens on BB's. If you don't wish to have any dissenting comments then perhaps you should not post such sweeping accusations; or avoid posting altogether. I agree that there are "plenty" that take advantage of others kindness and generosity, but that is different than "most".
There is a vast difference between "many" and the "majority"; which was my main point.
Not to get it all twisted, I do applaud you for your generosity and willingness to make a difference. ;)
I simply hope that some who are truly deserving aren't ignored, passed by or misjudged because of faulty assumptions on our part.
If someone asks for help, I feel it is my duty to assist, regardless of my judgement of their worthiness to receive. 8)
I've had quite some experiences with the homeless I've worked for and I've posted my conclusions that I've come across and since you didn't like them have made several assumptions about it, which is what I didn't like, now you're telling me that I shouldn't post on a message board if I don't like someone making fairly condescending remarks about my experiences.
Believe me I can deal with differing opinions on things, its just how you express them thats the issue.
Peace, we're just going to have to agree to disagree. It's not worth arguing over.
Quote from: Porcupine_in_MA on November 25, 2007, 09:31 AM NHFT
now you're telling me that I shouldn't post on a message board if I don't like someone making fairly condescending remarks about my experiences.
Believe me I can deal with differing opinions on things, its just how you express them thats the issue.
I would not tell someone else what to do, think, or relate; even when it is a differing opinion; though there are some here who do just that. I think you are overly simplifying my point in that instance.
Everyone is of course free to reply in what way they feel they need to, but IMO, it should be remembered that while relating in public, disagreements and differing perspectives/opinions are bound to arise and we should all remain aware that others have just as much right to express themselves as we ourselves do. I was pointing out that if one cannot except derision/confliction that perhaps it would be wiser not to post; thats all.
Of course there are limits, and I did not wish or infer any harm/threat to your freedom/liberties.
Sorry if my posts seemed like it was only a condescending rebuttal, that was not my intent; I was merely trying to expand the view that many seem to hold towards homeless/transients when they label them as simply lazy; because that is not the case for the majority of those in such a position.
Some, yes.
Many, yes.
The majority/most, no, not in my experience anyway. I still hold to my claim that my perspective is likely wider, than most on this BB, on this particular subject.
Agreeing to disagree is fine with me; I would rather be at peace, than right. :peace:
I got an idea tonight. My family and I went to Walmart this evening. I ran in to buy a few things. I noticed that there weren't many carts near the entrance to the store, but they were scattered all over the parking lot. When I got back my wife told me that she and the kids gathered up enough stray carts to fill a cart corral in a matter of just a few minutes. This got me to thinking. What if an agreement was made with a store manager where volunteers would help collect stray carts and bring them to the cart storage area at the front of the store, and in return the store manager would donate food, mostly non-perishable, to "The Liberty Food Pantry". The food pantry would consist of numerous small locations, which could be in homes, churches, businesses, etc., and would be run by a bunch of volunteers. These volunteers would have plenty of leeway in how they would collect and distribute the food, but would have a basic SOP that they could refer to that would be more like a list of suggestions rather than rules. This food bank would not participate in any government programs and would be completely independent and sovereign. Of course they could accept any donations with no strings attached if they wanted to. The people managing each location could maintain an inventory of what they have on a free website or something along those lines. When an emergency occurs like a house burning down or getting washed away by a flooded river, someone nearby who is managing one of the pantries could ask the displaced family if there is anything they need/want for food. If they request specific items, such as angel hair pasta and spaghetti sauce, the pantry manager could check their inventories to see if they have what the displaced family wants. They could offer a list of groceries to the displaced family (or other family in need) and they could accept all or part of the list of offered items. I'm sure there's more than one way to feed hungry folks without involving the government, but this is one idea I had. Please share any thoughts on my idea and any suggestions you might have.
Neat idea :D
I like the idea.
We may find all sorts of volunteer projects to do for food drives.
Does anyone have any good ideas for storage for this stuff?