New Hampshire Underground

John Connell of Grafton purchased the historic 212-year-old church on Route 4 in the center of Grafton today.
The building will continue to be used as a church.
The board of the Peaceful Assembly Church is eager to open its doors soon after several repairs are made.

More news to follow . . .

Congratulations Reverend John. :cardinal:  :)

Another picture:

+

Congratulations, John!

John:

I haven't been to church in a decade but I'm looking forward to attending the first and many more meetings at the Peaceful Assembly Church. Congratulations to you and to Grafton.

Jason

(http://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2008/7/22/thankyajesus128612311789646425.jpg)

That's awesome, John.  The Good Work continues... :)

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on June 25, 2010, 08:33 PM NHFT
Congratulations Reverend John. :cardinal:  :)

FRERE JACQUES -FRENCH - BABELZONE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wyKqvCg4gs#)
Brother John

"Tish, that's french."
;D

Masochism Tango (The Addams Family) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdnKND8qMDE#)

(http://welcometotheshire.com/sites/default/files/images/IMG_1028.JPG)
the other night on the way home

Nice shot.   :)

After seeing that... I had a flashback to 'The Fifth Dimension'

When the moon is in the Seventh House   
And Jupiter aligns with Mars         
Then peace will guide the planets      
And love will steer the stars         

This is the dawning of the Age of Aquarius   
Age of Aquarius            
Aquarius!  Aquarius!            

Harmony and understanding      
Sympathy and trust abounding   
No more falsehoods or derisions   
Golden living dreams of visions   
Mystic crystal revelation      
And the mind's true liberation   
Aquarius!  Aquarius!         

(http://www.heartstory.co.nz/resources/intuitive/heartstory_updates/images/aquarius.jpg)
:D

whooooaaaa let it shine

A little church history (http://www.millbrookchristianfellowship.org/newbldg/index.html)

It is unfortunate that the history of the Grafton Christian Church is not as well preserved as one might hope or expect. What is known is that the church building, or meetinghouse, was constructed by John Kimball in 1798, just twenty years after the town of Grafton was incorporated. At that time it was known as the Center Baptist Church. In 1856 the building was sold to Alexander Williams for $12. It was then moved across the street from the Green, enlarged, and remodeled. The upper section was used as the sanctuary and the lower section for a town hall. This dual arrangement continued for over one hundred years, until the 1960's, when the town took over one of the old school houses and it became the new town hall. In 1980, the spire was added to the top of the existing bell tower. The belfry and the bell were probably added in the mid 1800's after the building became the property of Alexander Williams. No record is known of what the building originally looked like before it was moved from the Green and remodeled though the search continues.

Many reorganizations have taken place over the years; along with Center Baptist Church, it has been known as the Christian, Christian Congregational, and Congregational Christian Church. Because of the great length of the official name: Grafton Center Congregational Christian Church, in 1999 the name was for practical purposes shortened to the name that has become common usage amongst the townspeople, The Grafton Center Church, but as of the year 2000, the name was again changed to Grafton Christian Church.

Millbrook is now  affiliated with the Conservative Congregational Christian Conference.

In the summer of 2004, a tract of land on Route 4 in East Grafton was purchased as the proposed site of a new worship and ministry facility.  In 2006, the ground was prepared for the new building, and in the summer of 2007, Maranatha Custom Churches of Jamestown, ND, erected the steel skeleton and sheathed it with super-insulated paneling.  In the summer of 2008, Kevin McCullough, general contractor, and his crew began the work of completing the interior and exterior of the building.

On November 29, 2009, the Cross, the communion service, and the pulpit Bible were ceremonially removed from the old building in Grafton Center and taken to the new building in East Grafton.  At that time the name of the church was changed from Grafton Christian Church to MillBrook Christian Fellowship.

Our first service of worship at the new building was conducted on December 6, 2009.

http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XXIX/306/306-mrg.htm (http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XXIX/306/306-mrg.htm)

I particularly like 306.2 ;D

So John won't have to take out the garbage for a long time, right?  ;D

At lest, not until Thanksgiving.

Bible study Sunday morning at 8:00.

I shall look for my Koran, Infidel!

yes i will hold my first Bible Study Breakfast
this is a strange beginning to a bible study .... no one has requested it, so I may be by myself the first time :)
we will eat breakfast as we talk, read and discuss a chapter, then answer a question from the group, then discuss what sort activities we may want to embark on. That will last about an hour.
This first time you have to cook your meal before you get to the church, since the stove has not been bought yet.

We look forward to seeing some of you in church tommorrow morning.

So This went pretty well. Five people seems pretty good for such short notice and no sign out in front of the church yet.

We also discussed how we might organize our Sunday morning activities.
So far our plan is to do Bible study from 8 to 9 then breakfast from 9 to 10.

what do guys think about having a Family Fun Night and holding it on Fridays?
we were thinking about playing basketball, inside games, and lawn bowling on the town green

Good works and fun going on...    8)

Quote from: John on July 05, 2010, 05:33 PM NHFT
We also discussed how we might organize our Sunday morning activities.
So far our plan is to do Bible study from 8 to 9 then breakfast from 9 to 10.

Perhaps combining events...

Communion and Breakfast....  just serve Jesus pancakes...  :D


Seriously, I this is great.    :)

we figured we had trouble combining them ... so the run back-to-back

Come see the church where the pews face the choir and away from the pastor.

that would be a funny picture ..... cardinal canning could be at the pulpit and the crowd is looking the other way

One word... swivel-chairs.

Quote from: TackleTheWorld on July 05, 2010, 09:53 PM NHFT
Come see the church where the pews face the choir and away from the pastor.

That's what I thought it looked like, too.

I appeared and testified in a county court in VA that was an old church set up like that.

Quote from: Jim Johnson on July 06, 2010, 06:18 AM NHFT
One word... swivel-chairs.

Swivel Bar Stools, with the bar.

The website is basically up and running:

http://peacefulassemblychurch.org/ (http://peacefulassemblychurch.org/)

They had a music night last night which sounded like a lot of fun...John on guitar, Evan on pots and pans, Kira on piano, lots of people singing :)

Friday night will be a family fun night with lawn bowling, basketball, and a potluck.

Grafton Globetrotters starring Basketball Jones

 ;D 8)
Basketball Jones (http://s0.ilike.com/play#Cheech+%26+Chong:Basketball+Jones:465136:s1255181.8524762.14182839.0.2.34%2Cstd_b525ce68d6404eb8a747f3e63017a57d)


Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones
Got a Basketball Jones, oh baby, oo-oo-oo

Yes, I am the victim of a Basketball Jones
Ever since I was a little baby, I always be dribblin'
In fac', I was de baddest dribbler in the whole neighborhood
Then one day, my mama bought me a basketball
And I loved that basketball
I took that basketball with me everywhere I went
That basketball was like a basketball to me

I even put that basketball underneath my pillow
Maybe that's why I can't sleep at night
I need help, ladies and gentlemens
I need someone to stand beside me
I need, I need someone to set a pick for me at the free-throw line of life
Someone I can pass to
Someone to hit the open man on the give-and-go
And not end up in the popcorn machine
So cheerleaders, help me out

{cheerleaders sing repeatedly...}
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones)
(I got a Basketball Jones, oh baby, oo-oo-ooo)

{while Tyrone Shoelaces sings/speaks...}
Oh, that sounds so sweet
Sing it out
C'mon Coach Booty, Red Blazer, sing along with me
That be bad, honky
Yeah
I want everybody in the whole stadium to stand up and sing with us
Oh yeah, sing it out like you're proud
All right, everybody watchin' coast-to-coast, sing along with us
Bill Russell, sing along with us
Chick Hearn, sing along with us
Chris Schenkel, don't sing nothin'

Oh, it feels so good
Gimme the ball
I'll go one-on-one against the world, left-handed
I could stuff it from center court with my toes
I could jump on top of the backboard, take off a quarter, leave fifteen cents change I
could, I could dribble behind my back I got more moves than Ex-Lax I'm bad I could
dribble with my tongue Here I go down court, try to stop me You can't stop me 'cause I
got a Basketball Jones Here I come That's my hook shot with my eyebrow Yeah, I could
dunk it with my nose I'm, I'm bad as King Kong, gimme the ball I'm hot, I'm hot as...,
I'm hot as..., I'm hot as... uh Uh, uh, uh, uh

(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, Basketball Jones)
X4

Ya got a Cross and everything!

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 08, 2010, 06:37 AM NHFTFriday night will be a family fun night with lawn bowling, basketball, and a potluck.

This - as are all - Peaceful Assembly Church activity is open to the public. All we ask is that you are peaceful and respectful of the church environment.

Minor children should be accompanied by a parent or guardian.

Peaceful Assembly Church is currently working with WaveComm to help bring better internet to Grafton.

Peaceful Assembly Church is also figuring out how we are going to be able to help the food pantry.
We will likely be a drop off and distribution point for canned and dry goods.

Cool  :D

I gather John got interviewed about the church by the Valley News yesterday, and they may be at the bible study Sunday.

Yes. A reporter from Valley News was here for about an hour yesterday.
She had sent an email asking if she could bring a photographer but, I didn't get to the email until much later.
She asked if it would be OK if she came by for our bible study. I said sure. She also asked that if she does come by if it would be OK to bring a photographer and again I said sure.

tonights family fun night brought relaxed basketball and some more intense stuph, so that was cool
i have to practice up so one of these young guys can't get the best of me

The church website said you needed bibles John.  Is this still the case?

Thank you! Yes.

My friend works and preaches at a mission here and says they have stacks of unopened bibles.  They have and get so many through donations they could never use them all. 

Would 20 be sufficient?  Ship them to the church address?  And what is the best method to do so?

Sure that would be great. Whatever works best for you.
Thanks!

Kat and I will be starting a Shire society that will do an hour or 2 of work at people's houses each week.
We will start this Sunday, at 10am, cleaning up the yard at the church after breakfast.

During breakfast we can discuss our next victim. I mean next project.
We also need to name the group. :)

Quote from: Russell Kanning on August 28, 2010, 06:21 AM NHFTKat and I will be starting a Shire society that will do an hour or 2 of work at people's houses each week.
We will start this Sunday, at 10am, cleaning up the yard at the church after breakfast.

During breakfast we can discuss our next victim. I mean next project.
We also need to name the group. :)

Fred.

I like it.

sorry .... only participating members get to decide the name

Obviously.  I presume others can yell out suggestions, though...

"The Organization For Hatred Of Everything"... because the headlines would be priceless.

The Organization For Hatred Of Everything Feeds The Homeless.

The Organization For Hatred Of Everything Rescues A Kitten

The Organization For Hatred Of Everything Says, "Love Thy Neighbor"

That would confuse folks... ;D

Joe

Quote from: MaineShark on August 28, 2010, 10:00 AM NHFT
Obviously.  I presume others can yell out suggestions, though...

"The Organization For Hatred Of Everything"... because the headlines would be priceless.

You are kindly asked to refrain from "yelling" "Hatred" around the Peaceful Assembly Church; "priceless" headlines not withstanding.
We have no room for hatred here.   :peace:

Anyway, does someone have a ladder which I can use to get to the roof of the shed to patch it?

There is a short extension ladder leaning on the trailer here that you can use.

Thank you. I'll be over in a while.

Quote from: John on August 28, 2010, 10:15 AM NHFT

Quote from: MaineShark on August 28, 2010, 10:00 AM NHFTObviously.  I presume others can yell out suggestions, though...

"The Organization For Hatred Of Everything"... because the headlines would be priceless.

You are kindly asked to refrain from "yelling" "Hatred" around the Peaceful Assembly Church; "priceless" headlines not withstanding.
We have no room for hatred here.   :peace:

;D

Joe

When possible I'd like to help out and take video. I think this is a very nice idea.

After Bible Study and breakfast on Sunday, I normally have to go into town for groceries & laundry, etc.
If you guys need the church while I'm away I can leave a key with someone.

Oh and BTW:
Next week's Friday Family Fun Night (FFFN) will be our first Movie Night.
We are planing to watch Steve Martin's "The Jerk" starting at 8:00.
We can still do the pot luck if folks come during normal FFFN hours (6-8).

QuoteWaiter... there are snails on her plate.

;D

Quote from: John on August 28, 2010, 10:19 AM NHFT
Anyway, does someone have a ladder which I can use to get to the roof of the shed to patch it?

If Lloyd's ladder isn't tall enough, I have several that are. 

Thanks. Lloyd's should be fine.

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on August 28, 2010, 04:42 PM NHFT

QuoteWaiter... there are snails on her plate.

;D

So are you and the family going to make it? Or, are you just going to throw in a few random lines from waaay over there?
I hope you can make it.

I have a sneaking suspicion that I may need to start a separate thread for favorite lines from "The Jerk."

We would like to John... however our wings are clipped pretty short these days.  I would like to help out up there sometime though.  :)

I heard Russell call it Shire Services. I like that name.

Sounds like the Mower Gang  (http://www.mowergang.com/)in Detroit. Their motto is "Winning Detroit's Other Turf War."

The Mower Gang cleans up Detroit (http://www.freep.com/article/20100811/NEWS01/8110350/The-Mower-Gang-cleans-up-Detroit)

I nominate the name 'Fred' for the group.  :P

well that worked well
a few guys helped clean up at the church getting ready for the grafton apple festival
it was part of the shire society
closely related to shire services
but unnamed

Ya mean 'fred'?

Movie night following family fun night this week.  The movie is The Jerk with Steve Martin.  Movie's been received  :)

Quote from: Kat Kanning on September 01, 2010, 06:44 PM NHFT
The movie is The Jerk with Steve Martin.  Movie's been received  :)

And downloaded. It might be easier to hook a laptop up to the projector in the "movie room" than a DVD player - not sure. I'll bring it just in case.

Looking forward to it.

if it is not raining then i need to play a little basketball
if it is raining how about games then early movie?

Sounds good to me - though I'm thinking about a little 4 square.  ;D

Let's also chalk some lines again (and talk about what might be the correct measurements for our purposes) so I can get a better sense of how the parking lot might be arranged when we put down the pavement paint which I have bought. We might also talk about the placemen of some  of the "parking lot blocks" which I have acquired.

We could start the movie as early as it is dark enough. I think we told people 8:00? So if we know that someone is planning on coming at 8:00 let's give them a chance to arrive. But yes earlier sounds good to me.

Maybe we can also take an intermission to finish up some of the pot luck stuff - if any is left.  :o

I have The Jerk on my computer, in case it's difficult to hook a DVD player up to the projector. And I have the projector, though I can give it to John during the day today. I will be there sometime between 7:00p and 8:00p tonight.

almost there

That was fun! Thanks to everyone who came - and especially to Mike Barskey who offered the original suggestion of a Movie Night at the church and for his continued "encouragement" in that direction.

definitely a family fun night :)

Next week our Friday Family Fun Night Fall Field Trip will be to maybe the best little family contra dance I know of:

http://www.myspace.com/woodstockthirdfridaydance (http://www.myspace.com/woodstockthirdfridaydance)

Possible "Meet & Greet" of potential mover here at the church tomorrow after Bible Study ...

That would be me!  ;D

Tryin' to decide where to move to within NH.  Will be checking out Grafton tomorrow.  Perhaps I shall see some of you at the church tomorrow.

-Libertango

that worked out pretty well

Indeed.  Thanks to everyone who was there to see me; I got a wonderfully detailed tour of Grafton.  Definitely sneaking up towards the top of my list...

-Libertango

i heard you had the longest tour of grafton evah :)

Just a note that Sunday morning bible study will be starting at 9 am instead of 8 starting next week, Oct 10th.

i guess breakfast starts at the same time or afterwards :)

OH! - - - I though that breakfast was moving to the 8-9 slot. - - - just kidding.

More likely is Bible Study 9-10 and then Breakfast 10-11.

Next Friday Family Fun Night is the Fall Field Trip to the 3rd Friday Woodstock, Vt. family contra dance.
8)

I could use LOTS of hands to help move a piano at the church. It only has to move a shot distance but it is going onto a rug which I'm trying to keep in place. Then I can continue with my "rugs before it gets cold" project.

aha

I have to get over to the church!  I never know what my knee is going to do lately.

How about Sunday after Bible Study? Let's say just after 10:00.
I'll put on some nice warm oatmeal. Maybe a little apple and almonds in it as well? Does everyone like that?

If I put the oatmeal on right before we move the piano, we'll have the job done before the oatmeal is done. Then we can hang around and relax.

And don't let the injured knee stop you from coming over Lloyd. The oatmeal might will be good for you - maybe.

The Peaceful Assembly Church hosted choir practice for Rich Angell and the Peaceful Assembly Choir's rendition of Weeda Claus's Chronic Christmas Carols last Thursday. And hopefully, they'll be another choir practice this upcoming Thursday as well, so if you're in Free Grafton around 7pm and would like to join the Peaceful Assembly Choir in their mission to spread Christmas cheer, you might consider joining us.

Sounds like fun... look forward to seeing ya'll there. :)

Cool. I hear that Roger is quite the singer.  ;D

For next week's (Nov. 12) Friday Family Fun Night we are taking another Fall Field Trip.
This time we are going to the Quaker Meeting House in Jaffrey.
This should be fun.

Some of us could carpool from here, and others who are in other areas might want to meet us there.

Find out what's up over here:
http://jgiddings.home.igc.org/quaker/calendar.html (http://jgiddings.home.igc.org/quaker/calendar.html)

John was saying tonight that it's too expensive for him to have events at the chuch - the heat and the lights....so I'm thinking we might want to have bible study and the Set the Captives Free at our house to save him money.  Certainly we could have the choir practice here too if Jason wanted.

Thanks for opening your home to the choir, Kat. I think it would be smart to have choir practice at Hoyt during the Winter. Thanks to John for his generosity in letting us get underway at the Church. When Free Grafton thaws from the Winter I hope we can resume having weekly choir practices in the beautiful Peaceful Assembly Church.

Quote from: Kat Kanning on November 11, 2010, 07:53 PM NHFT
John was saying tonight that it's too expensive for him to have events at the church - the heat and the lights....so I'm thinking we might want to have bible study and the Set the Captives Free at our house to save him money.  Certainly we could have the choir practice here too if Jason wanted.

Actually, when the issue of when to hold choir practice came up, John was once again suggesting that it might be more efficient to consolidate some of our church activities into the same night because, yes, it is expensive to heat the hall (which is about 25 feet by 40 feet with 10 foot ceilings). And the heat does not get turned on just as people start arriving. It gets turned on well in advance so that the furniture and walls are not cold ... Some of our meetings have only lasted for about an hour and it seems that it could be possible to fit several things into one night.
John also mentioned that during the cold winter months that it might even make sense to consolidate all of our church activities into the weekends, keeping the building always warm from Friday night until Sunday night. This would allow for all of our current activities and leave plenty of room for other stuff, including the "Social Saturdays" events which John has been talking about which might be a chance for all sorts of visitors (both to and from Grafton) to come by for various social activity such as doing meet and greets, etc.
John made certain to mentioned that the Bible Study and the Nonviolence Class would have first choice of times in such a winter schedule.

As one of our guys might say; You can tell how much people value things by how much they are willing to help out. Most people who come here like to be helpful.

Earlier today there was another post here which seemed to carry a bunch of negative energy regarding me making that person feel unwelcome.  I tried to answer some of its concerns without getting into the negativity, and then posted my responce. When I did post, the other post was gone so I removed my responce.
Since that time it has occurred to me that others may have read the post I was responding to. I had not noticed how long it had been there. So I decided that I should probably at least address the issue where it was saying something about me "watching the clock" and something about me counting every minute that I "had to" heat the church hall.

Several things were going on regarding the clock- and me worrying about how many minutes the heat was on was not one of them.
Time had been part of the conversation since at least the afternoon. I was told in the late afternoon that folks had decided that they wanted to start at 5 rather than 6 and that some folks were hoping to have some comfort food during the evening. This is all fine with me and I am happy to be ready. Some folks arrived around 5 and there was conversation about when others might arrive. Some folks ate some comfort food which began to get a bit low early, so I went to the store to get more ingredients for another batch. I also put on a pot of long grain brown rice. I always "watch the clock" when cooking my rice. That is why it almost always turns out perfectly. I keep an eye on the clock to adjust it once and then check it occasionally, I continue keeping an eye on the clock so as not to over cook. More folks arrived at other times and when they did there was small talk about time again - you know what time did you arrive ... do you think anyone else is coming ... that sort of thing. Someone asked if a particular person was coming and I said that if he was coming I think that it would be no later than 10 after 7. This was based on the fact that last week we had changed from 6 and started at 7. He arrived just after 7, and then time was a small part of the conversation again. So there you go - more talk about time.

Sorry to have made that person (and anyone else) feel uncomfortable or "not welcome."

Turns out that no one ever asked for any more comfort food. Yummy. :)

I don't normally post spelling corrections, but...

"Coming" is the word you want.  "Comming" is incorrect, which I normally wouldn't mention, except that it can be taken to mean something substantially different, in certain dialects of English...

Joe

Thanks Joe. (I'm wondering which dialects.)
As folks have probably noticed my spelling is atrocious. I'll sometimes even spell the same word two different ways in the same post. Sometimes I can even misspell the same (simple) word two different ways in the same darn sentence. These things, I'll often not even notice.
I try to not do that but there seems to be some sort of verbal dyslexia.
I'll keep trying.
If anyone knows a good way to improve on this I'd be interested in checking into it. Most people I've talked to have said that reading a lot should help. I like to read and have been doing plenty of it for a very long time. It doesn't seem to work for me.
I can actually butcher words so badly that spell check even has no idea what I am trying for.
Seems I have a lot of imperfections.  :-[

many of the spellchecks say I am misspelling half of my words
i think they have trouble reading my handwriting

If you don't know how to spell a word, but have two choices that you really like, you should use them both in a sentence. They average out.

Quote from: John on November 13, 2010, 10:57 PM NHFTI'm wondering which dialects.

Ones that lean more toward British spellings.

Quote from: John on November 13, 2010, 10:57 PM NHFTAs folks have probably noticed my spelling is atrocious.

Bah.  I've never had trouble reading any of your posts.  That just jumped at me because I have British friends who would start snickering if they read that.

Joe

Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on November 14, 2010, 06:49 AM NHFT
If you don't know how to spell a word, but have two choices that you really like, you should use them both in a sentence. They average out.

Hey, just a minute, that's what I was trying (kidding) to do but Joe didn't like it - do to certain dialects.  ;D
It's sure not easy being just an average guy around here any more - now is it?  :)
(Some of my favorite talkshows ever were the "Word Police" shows that Gene Burns used to have. Good clean fun with all sorts of language issues.)

BTW - I knew that the British talk all sorts of funny ways, but I had forgotten that they also spell funny sometimes..
I'll try to be more careful.
And, I may take this over to the word police thread before I ruin the nice church thread. ;)

I try to spelling out the word in the Google Box. It tries to guess the word you are looking for.

I been told by numerous people that the church looks very nice with all the little lights in the windows.
I agree.

Winter Weekend Workshop.

Peaceful Assembly Church is considering hosting the showing of "Lost Christianities: Christian Scriptures and the Battle over Authentication," one of "The Great Courses" produced by "The Teaching Company."
It is taught by Professor Bart D. Ehrman of The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill and is 24 lectures/30 minutes per lecture. We could do one or two lectures each week on Sunday mornings. But, we may decide that afternoon, evening, or even a different weekend day is better.

Peaceful Assembly Church is also considering other full courses and selected lectures from various other courses as part of a Winter Weekend Workshop. More info soon ...

I look forward to feedback about possible interest, particularly regarding time of showing, etc.

PM me, email me, or post interest here.

Quote from: John on November 26, 2010, 08:36 PM NHFT
Winter Weekend Workshop.

Peaceful Assembly Church is considering hosting the showing of "Lost Christianities: Christian Scriptures and the Battle over Authentication," one of "The Great Courses" produced by "The Teaching Company."
It is taught by Professor Bart D. Ehrman of The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill and is 24 lectures/30 minutes per lecture. We could do one or two lectures each week on Sunday mornings. But, we may decide that afternoon, evening, or even a different weekend day is better.

I don't know anything about the professor or the course or any conclusions drawn, but it's a great topic for discussion.

Been previewing some of the courses for the Winter Weekend Workshops.

Lots of possibilities as far as scheduling ... So far, leaning towards late afternoons and/or early evenings.

Quote from: John on November 12, 2010, 10:16 PM NHFTthe Bible Study and the Nonviolence Class would have first choice of times in such a winter schedule.

We/I neglected to put a 15 min. buffer between choir practice and our "Set The Captives Free" Nonviolence Class.  :duh:
If people want to do extra choir/music stuff they are definitely very welcome to come early and do it on the early side, or they can pick it back up after the Nonviolence Class.
The Nonviolence Class starts at 7:00.  :fingerscrossed:

Just found this picture while poking around the interwebs: http://www.concordmonitor.com/photo/bible-study-at-peaceful-assembly-church-1 (http://www.concordmonitor.com/photo/bible-study-at-peaceful-assembly-church-1)
This is the picture that I told Kira (and maybe others) that I felt certain would make the paper.

There is just a bit of small talk in Grafton that because Peaceful Assembly Church does not have deep connections into the comunity some are showing quite a lusting to try to nip our little church in the bud.

A select few are rumored to even be calling for a tax on our church.

I have not really focused any energy towards that negative possibility, but things will definitely get interesting if people start messing with our church, and thereby also the 212 year tradition of this building.

It will be interesting to see who stands on which side.
I was warned before I began that if we started seriously preaching TRUE PEACE some people will begin to attack right away. Maybe tax season is the first time that the haters get to try to use the government to do their attacking for them.

Anyway, if it happens, my reaction will also be interesting; whatever I decide that reaction will be.
The first 2 things that will likely happen are that the board will meet and a PORC411 will go out - not necessarily in that order.

Just a heads up on some small talk ....  :peace:

Maybe someone would be willing to act as sexton.
And with a title like that, you can probably find some young guy to agree to take the job before he even finds out what it is...!

Oh, I failed to report it here earlier that on the other hand there are others in Grafton who think enough of us that Peaceful Assembly Church was asked (just yesterday) to help out with gathering Christmass gifts for children. I only had posted it on the Graftom forum without details of drop off times etc. and already some gifts have arrived.

Kidda glad I forgot to post this here earlier. That way I'm ending on a positive note.

Quote from: Sam A. Robrin on December 11, 2010, 05:48 PM NHFT
Maybe someone would be willing to act as sexton.
And with a title like that, you can probably find some young guy to agree to take the job before he even finds out what it is...!

Hey now, just wait a minute there. I'm the full-time caretaker around here. Was someone thinking don't look enough like as sexton to have the title?  ;D

John:


That's good news. FreeGrafton.com (http://freegrafton.com/) would like to do a story about the Peaceful Assembly Church's involvement in collecting gifts for kids in need.


When and where can people make donations? What (if any) are the requirements for donations (new / used, under a certain $ limit, etc.). Any other details, like the primary organizer for the toy drive, would be appreciated.


Jason

Thanks for your interest.
This is all happening very last minute as you can tell. We are scrambling to get some details... age of kids? number of kids? value of gifts? all unknown to me. I'm sure that unwrapped is the norm for this sort of thing...who will do wrapping? when?
Grafton Forum may be first place I find out more ... Two ladies will be here tomorrow to make posters.

"Officially" (meaning what will be on the poster) drop off at this church will be Monday and Wednesday from 4:30 to 6:30 and call 523-7111 for other times. Quite by surprise, some gifts have already arrived here.

Other places and times will be confirmed tomorrow. Almost certainly the old Town Hall on Turnpike Road on Tuesday and Thursday at the same times.

Sounds good, John. I'm crossing my fingers that the age limit will include 36 year olds and that someone drops off a terabyte hard drive. If so, DIBS!

I was thinking a gift that works well for most everyone is a box of crayons:
http://www.quotegarden.com/crayons.html (http://www.quotegarden.com/crayons.html)

Next Friday (the 18th) is the last Friday of Fall which means its time for our very last Friday Family Fun Night Fall Field Trip of 2010, which takes us to the best little family contra dance I've found:
http://www.myspace.com/woodstockthirdfridaydance (http://www.myspace.com/woodstockthirdfridaydance)
Folks can car pool from here or meet there.

Quote from: John on December 11, 2010, 08:04 PM NHFTI'm sure that unwrapped is the norm for this sort of thing...

I have found that unwrapped toys are normal for government gift drives, but wrapped (with notes for appropriate recipient) are normal for church gift drives.

Thanks for that info.

One donor went to the store right away and came right here from the store with unwrapped toys, which was very generous of him. Tracey will be happy to wrap them. It's probably also a "Yankee swap" so the individual recipient would not be know.

Free

Peaceful Assembly comfort food this Monday & Wednesday, 4:30ish to 5:30ish. (Maybe next week also.)

This is a celebration of Peaceful Assembly Church establishing it's 1st physical home here in Grafton, six months ago.

All Peaceful people are wellcome.

aha

Quote from: John on December 18, 2010, 08:20 PM NHFT
Free

Peaceful Assembly comfort food this Monday & Wednesday, 4:30ish to 5:30ish. (Maybe next week also.)

I neglected to mention above that the opportunity exists for folks to stay afterwards and either take part in the warm up to our Winter Workshops series or (if it is meant to be) to take part in discusing Tolstoy's book, "The Kingdom of God Is within You."

I will stop by tonight

10/4

12/20

9/11

i should have seen that coming

Seen what comming? 9/11?

It all comes back to 9/11.

Well anyway, last night was fun - and our latest night here yet by far.
Conversation was all over the place from the quite mundane to quite the opposite of mundane.
Thanks to those who came by.

The (6th lunar-versary) celebration continues with more free comfort food on Wednesday. I'll prepare some as vegetarian. I'm hoping a vegetarian friend will join us. BTW, that is always easy for me to do so if you prefer vegetarian just give the word in advance.


It is unlikely that we will go so late this time.

Clara Isley is coming to Peaceful Assembly Church tommorrow at 5:30pm to give a very brief presentation about her "Freedom of Conscience Petition." She says that her talk should only take about 5 or 10 min. and then we can talk about it, and give her some ideas regarding possible future changes to the wording.
I personally have some issues with the petition, but have nonetheless signed.

I will make a batch of Peaceful Assembly Comfort food (this batch will be long grain brown rice, pork, one or more veggies, and tomato sauce - vegetarian orders in advance welcome) and I'll share it with those who want to pitch in. I'll start serving at about 4:30ish.

As always, the Peaceful Assembly Church is open to all Peaceful people.
Please come and join us.

Man, that was a long fading from winter to spring ... the dove has been shining ...

We (Peaceful Assembly Church) kept our Bible/Faith/Spiritual Studies going all winter...
We had some other events...
Friday Family Fun Day is back – late afternoon/early evening. Hoop, 4 square, swing, etc.

 ;D 8)

cool book to add to the library
The Irresistible Revolution

"These Songs of Peace and Freedom"
June 11 @ Peaceful Assembly Church

All Peaceful people are welcome to join us for a day of open-mike (and hopefully recording, if the presenter is OK with that, of) songs, poetry, and other short presentations. This will be mostly "unplugged."

We'll have food, fun, and companionship with other Peaceful and Freedom minded folks from the comunity.

We'll start coming together in the afternoon on Saturday and go at least until dark. Attendance and participation will effect hours.

Some quiet family tenting on site.

We'll have our regular Sunday Bible/Faith/Spiritual Study at 8am folowed by a light breakfast.

More details to follow.

 8) :)

aha
i bet the weedaclaus singers will visit

John Connell of the Peaceful Assembly Church in Grafton, NH (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZycKIHo1ko#ws)

Good on you John... and thanks to the Liberty on Tour (http://libertyontour.com/) guys for producing this video.

Thank you, John (and the LOT guys)!

Shared on Facebook.

I've been trying to do a better job keeping things posting over at http://www.peacefulassemblychurch.org/ (http://www.peacefulassemblychurch.org/)

Quote from: John on May 16, 2011, 07:15 PM NHFT
"These Songs of Peace and Freedom"
June 11 @ Peaceful Assembly Church

All Peaceful people are welcome to join us for a day of open-mike (and hopefully recording, if the presenter is OK with that, of) songs, poetry, and other short presentations. This will be mostly "unplugged."

We'll have food, fun, and companionship with other Peaceful and Freedom minded folks from the comunity.

We'll start coming together in the afternoon on Saturday and go at least until dark. Attendance and participation will effect hours.

Some quiet family tenting on site.

We'll have our regular Sunday Bible/Faith/Spiritual Study at 8am folowed by a light breakfast.

More details to follow.

THIS EVENT IS STILL ON, even though the other visit (this originally scheduled to coincide with that) happened earlier than originally planned .
Several more folks have said they plan on attending (and bringing food) than have replied on FB.

Who wants to do a song (or several) or some poetry, or some other reading, or some other presentation?

Please let us know what times are best for you, and if you might like to camp out here.

I do not have my video recorder back yet, so if other folks bring theirs and are willing to share their videos, that will be awesome!

Peace,
John

Started building the Peaceful Assembly Church youtube channel.
Long way to go. :)

http://www.youtube.com/user/PeacefulAssemblyChur#p/f (http://www.youtube.com/user/PeacefulAssemblyChur#p/f)

Valley News was here today... in paper tomorrow... town of Grafton, NH  (603) 523-7700
wants to tax nascent Peaceful Assembly Church (603) 523-7111.

Please support separation of church and state.
That is what this is actually about.

so which guys at unfree Grafton want to start taxing the church building after 200 years?

http://www.vnews.com/06202011/7876603.htm (http://www.vnews.com/06202011/7876603.htm)

Haha, pastor John.

there are tons of websites talking about "free churchs" and especially about filling out paperwork like wit the IRS to be a dreaded 501c3. When you ask the government permission to exist, then they like to tell you what you can talk about.
I can't imagine the Peaceful Assembly Church holding events like the love, joy, peace, and justice conference (forgot the actual name) :) while bowing to the evil murdering empire.

So what did the process with the state of NH look like John?

good story

I think these definitions cover the term "pastor" pretty well.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pastor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pastor)

It makes more sense to call you Brother John :) More of a buddy, than a shepherd.

If the states paperwork asks you to do stuph with the IRS that seem crummy. The church was around befor the US government or the unfree Town of Grafton. :) It is funny that the state says it is up to the town and the town is looking to the state, a lawyer, and the guys who make money appraising property.

I like the term reconciliation. Paul uses that term often in the Bible. He says that is our main ministry in this age.

Are you sleeping (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8uRB3cuz2g#)

QuoteState law allows for property tax exemptions for churches and religious organizations that are "organized, incorporated or legally doing business in the state"...

That's the problem... John needs to be more organized.  Then it will all be okay! ;D

In all seriousness, though, I think the selectboard needs to look up the definition of the word, "or."  John is clearly running an organized church.  Since that is one of the options, and "or" means he only needs to meet one of the three, he's obviously in the right.

I expect the selectboard imagine that's an "and" there, and that John needs to meet all three options, not just one.

Joe

If Peaceful Assembly doesn't qualify, then it must mean John is illegally doing business in the state. Perhaps Grafton should refer the charges and put this outlaw away!

or maybe the church is located outside the state's jurisdiction

I'll be looking for ways to help the town find it's way out of the nasty mess they are beginning to create for themselves, because it is going to either get better or worse.
I am answering a calling. My position can not and will not change; so it is entirely up to them.
I am not going to hire a lawyer to do their work for them, but I think I can help.

I figure that when people hire lawyers they tell the lawyer to find the answer that they are looking for.
Lawyers argue the position they are told to argue.
The government guys can not hide behind their lawyer.
The town guys should simply tell their lawyer to find lots of reasons to recognize Peaceful Assembly Church and the claim of exemption.
Seems like a VERY VERY simple way out. They will have solved their own problem and we can all move forward peacefully.

I had been told by VN staff that they do not generally publish full articles on line.
This one is published in full, with the picture.

The hard copy paper has the picture taking up about half (6.5 x 9 in.) of the space above the fold...

:)

I think that the article is fair. Katie Beth made one mistake which many people would make.
She was saying that there is a "reqest" for exemption.
Actualy I'm informing, not requesting.

Here is the article:


'Not the Government's Church'


Grafton Pastor Refuses to File With State for Tax-Exempt Status
By Katie Beth Ryan
Valley News Staff Writer


Grafton -- Some might be inclined to call him Pastor John, but John Connell, founder of Peaceful Assembly Church, views himself more as a brother or a friend.


Connell, 53, is no fire and brimstone preacher. Although he's an ordained minister in the Universal Life Church, the theology of the year-old faith group that meets in a 214-year-old church building on Main Street doesn't easily fit into any recognized denomination.


The Bible is studied at Peaceful Assembly, which has a congregation numbering in the single digits, but the stairs leading to the sanctuary are lined with copies of texts such as Henry David Thoreau's essay on civil disobedience and the autobiography of Mahatma Gandhi. As Peaceful Assembly's name might suggest, the overarching message is one of reconciliation and forgiveness.


"The bottom line is, how do we better interact with our neighbors?" Connell, 53, said.


But there's one neighbor with whom Connell is having a difficult time coming to terms: the tax collector.


Twice this year, the Selectboard has declined Peaceful Assembly's request for a religious tax exemption. Unlike most other churches, Peaceful Assembly is not registered with the state of New Hampshire as either a nonprofit or a limited liability corporation, and Connell, a member of the Libertarian Free State Project, has no intent to do so. It would mean state intrusion into a realm of life where, Connell says, it has no business.


"It's not the government's church. It's God's church," he said yesterday, sitting in the ground floor of the church, furnished with a motley crew of mismatched chairs and sofas.


Positioned about the entrance to the church's library is a small white cross. Posted to an adjacent wall is a poster of Michaelangelo's "Creation of Adam" painting; on another, there's an advertisement for the Liberty Scholarship Fund, to "help ensure freedom of choice in education."


However, that documentation is what the Selectboard wants to see before granting an exemption to the church.


"We're not writing it off altogether. We're just waiting for a response from the Peaceful Assembly Church," said Chairman Steve Darrow.


Darrow said the board was acting on the advice of the town's attorney and the firm conducting the town's property assessments.


State law allows for property tax exemptions for churches and religious organizations that are "organized, incorporated or legally doing business in the state," but applications for religious exemptions are submitted and granted at the local level, according to Steve Hamilton, director of property appraisal at the New Hampshire Department of Revenue Administration.


Connell said he liquidated his retirement account in order to purchase the 214-year-old building, which also serves as his residence, for around $60,000 in 2010. The building was home to Millbrook Christian Fellowship, formerly known as Grafton Christian Church, before that congregation moved to a new location further east on Route 4. At the time of the sale to Connell, the building was listed as tax-exempt.


After receiving a December tax bill from the town for $2,186, Connell submitted the state's form for real estate exemptions to the Selectboard, which voted to deny the request at a January meeting. The board also denied Connell's second exemption request, which he submitted in April.


In May, another tax bill went out in the amount of $1,094. Connell hasn't paid either bill.


"Even if I wanted to, I couldn't afford to," he said.


Eight people is the highest attendance yet for a Sunday service at Peaceful Assembly.


Yesterday morning, Grafton resident Pete Thoresen was the only one in attendance.


A typical Sunday gathering at Peaceful Assembly "inspires theological and spiritual discussion," said Thoresen.


"There's not so much doctrine. It's cool," he added. "We can discuss things that might not go over as easy in an organized religion environment."


Outside of Sunday mornings, Connell and churchgoers have organized family fun nights, coordinated a toy drive at Christmas, and established a food pantry. The ground floor of the church has been re-christened the "Common Ground Meeting Hall," where community members in conflict can meet to iron out their differences.


Connell said he hears two common charges against the church: first, that he purchased the church solely to have a tax-exempt living space, and second, that the congregation aims to be a spiritual home for the Free State Project, which has an number of members in Grafton.


"No, no, no. This is not where I would choose to live," Connell said.


As for the Peaceful Assembly's membership, Connell describes the church as "open to Catholic, Protestant, Muslim, Jewish, Hindu, Buddhist, nothing at all, or something in between."


A town landmark on Route 4, the church's activities during the past year have been hard to miss.


"It's nice to see signs of life in there. I know he's trying to do things that are very community-minded, and I think he's doing a good thing," Darrow said.


As for the tax exemption denial, Darrow said that the Selectboard is "just looking for the documentation, so we can either grant the exemption or not. ... We don't want everybody in town claiming a religious exemption, so we're trying to stick to what the state specifies."


For the time being, however, giving in to the government in exchange for a tax exemption is not something that John Connell feels he can do.


"I would be asking permission to exist from the IRS. I would be cooperating with the government," he said. "This church is not part of the federal government."


Katie Beth Ryan can be reached at kbryan@vnews.com or 603-727-3242.

Caption under picture:
John Connell, founder of Peaceful Assembly Church in Grafton, says he will not file paperwork with the state to qualify as a nonprofit so the town has denied his request for a property tax exemption that is typically provided religious organizations. (Valley News — Jenna Schoenefeld

Anyway, some good things are already coming about as a result of this article.
To name several:

One woman from nearby (within an hour) in Vermont has, as of today, begun working on some spiritual healing with Peaceful Assembly Church.
She is also thinking that she might like to have her children baptized here.

In Lebanon: Well wishes from numerous women and men at the health club, ranging in age from 20-something to 30, 40, 50, and 60-somethings. Three men expressed interest and gave general support. Two younger women thought the article was awesome and expressed enthusiastic support, and a woman in her early 50s said, "When did we ever loose that [freedom of religion]?"

A woman in Canaan said that if they were not already moving out of state at the end of the month, that she and her husband, and their kids would definitely be interested in attending this kind of church. She said she would keep us in her prayers.

good thinking John

wait until they get a picture of kids playing at the church sometime :)

Quote from: Russell Kanning on June 20, 2011, 09:06 PM NHFT
or maybe the church is located outside the state's jurisdiction

Well, then, that would be an easy solution to the issue of taxation, wouldn't it?  ;)

First Sunday in July is the 1st anniversary of Peaceful Assembly Church beginning Bible Study.
Thanks so much to all of our friends!

May we all walk in Peace.

Town of Grafton moves deeper into conflict with Peaceful Assembly Church
Connell requests supportive phone calls
http://nh.porcupine411.com/2011/08/03/audio-message-from-connell-john-6035237111-2/ (http://nh.porcupine411.com/2011/08/03/audio-message-from-connell-john-6035237111-2/)

Thanks for the link Dave.

Someone, elswere, said that I will loose my "investment" if I do not negotiate.
As posted by me, elswhere:

"There is nothing to negotiate. THIS IS A LINE I CAN NOT AND WILL NOT CROSS. Peaceful Assembly Church WILL NOT be paying taxes to the government. I do not consider this an "investment" in any financial sense. I am answering a calling. This is for real. I am ready and willing to put EVERYTHING on the line. EVERYTHING as in; my life, my "fortune," and my Sacred honor. Its what is left. Hopefully I am able to stand my ground.
Eventually INDIVIDUALS IN GOVERNMENT might decide/CHOOSE to order/provoke other INDIVIDUALS WITH GUNS to come and steal the Peaceful Assembly Church building and the small half acre grounds. Hopefully, that is something ENOUGH INDIVIDUALS will decide is a very bad idea and the wrong thing to do.
It would be much easier on EVERYBODY if the INDIVIDUAL POLITICIANS (board of selectmen [603] 523-7700) make the right decision sooner rather than later."

We know that at least one INDIVIDUAL politician who reads the underground regularly has been making bad CHOICES on this issue so far, and will be making more CHOICES about this issue.

I wonder if people who think they have an interest in the old white church in the middle of town would want to stop by and offer their ideas, time, talents, and money to have the church continue in the way that they think is best.
It seems very strange that the town of Grafton ... or at least a few people who try to run it ... think that they should start taxing the church after it changed hands.
I wonder what these folks think is John's "fair share" of support of government jailschools is.

I have to wonder what they think they're losing. There was no tax revenue there that suddenly stopped. It's not like John took over the general store and declared it to be a church... He bought a tax exempt church and continues to operate it as such.

"The Town of Grafton" neither lost revenue, nor incurred expenses. John probably saved them money, compared to an historic building sitting empty.

Never underestimate the rancor of the small and petty.

Quote from: KBCraig on August 05, 2011, 01:50 AM NHFT
I have to wonder what they think they're losing. There was no tax revenue there that suddenly stopped. It's not like John took over the general store and declared it to be a church... He bought a tax exempt church and continues to operate it as such.

"The Town of Grafton" neither lost revenue, nor incurred expenses. John probably saved them money, compared to an historic building sitting empty.

I understand that the town taxed the church before John owned it.

if that's true, then that's pretty dumb.  The building is a church, regardless of what government permissions allow it to be so.  If they went and taxed the church, then it's their loss for their mistake.

Other local church goers will flock to defend the PAC.  Even some non-locals.  Time for Grafton's elite to give up the fight against the church.

Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on August 05, 2011, 05:40 AM NHFT
I understand that the town taxed the church before John owned it.

That is strange. The old church group never mentioned that and I have not heard that before.
As far as I know they are wanting certain paperwork filled out to maintain the old status.
I wonder what the government assessed them at and what kinds of taxes they think the church should pay.

It is funny KBcraig .... it must be some people greedy to get more tax revenue. I have also heard tell that the taxes in the town could go down if people like the church paid in. I find that funny considering the amounts involved.

Many also do not know that the old church offered up the building for free to the town, boy scouts, and head start. None of which wanted the responsibility and expense. The Peaceful Assembly Church actually paid money for the building and has maintained it with the help of volunteers around town.

According to Silent Bob, they also continue to tax the new church. I guess they also refuse to get government approval.

The Taxpayers of Grafton presently pay, not just rent for several(dozens?) people, but also mortgage payments so those people won't be put to the trouble of having to find other housing should their landlords be forclosed upon.
If John is put out of the church, he will be eligible for a housing allowance from the town.

Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on August 05, 2011, 07:31 AM NHFT
The Taxpayers of Grafton presently pay, not just rent for several(dozens?) people, but also mortgage payments so those people won't be put to the trouble of having to find other housing should their landlords be forclosed upon.
If John is put out of the church, he will be eligible for a housing allowance from the town.

...first they break your legs....then they hand you crutches.   ;D

I'm surprised the left/ACLU hasn't gotten on the bandwagon of churches not paying taxes....  I'm sure they can come up with reasons why that violates the separation of church and state. 

Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on August 05, 2011, 05:40 AM NHFTI understand that the town taxed the church before John owned it.

Steve Darrow the (now chief) selectman CLAIMS that the property was put on the tax rolls right after the other guys moved out. However, Steve only started saying this WELL INTO the mess that the town - ie. the selectmen - has been creating.

The real estate paperwork showed the property as having tax exempt status, and it was only days between when it hit the market and it being announced that the property would continue being used as a church property; HOWEVER, at the same time it became clear that a Freedom activist was going to be the one buying it. It appears that it is only after this that things began to change.
Also, it is said that the selectmen were "consulting" their "tax assessors" about taxing this church WELL AFTER it was announced that the property was continuing to be used for church purposes. It is further said that the re evaluating of the other two churches in town began WELL AFTER the selectmen chose to start messing with this one.

It is even reported that the "BLTA-form 9" for one church in town had stopped being submitting quite some time ago - and YET that property was still being kept as tax exempt - - - until the selectmen started messing with this one.

The situation is rather troubling.

Quite frankly, and I'm probably not the only one around here, I have a hard time believing things which politicians say.

Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on August 05, 2011, 07:24 AM NHFT
According to Silent Bob, they also continue to tax the new church. I guess they also refuse to get government approval.

Continue? I'm told that SOME PORTION of that property (which is not used for religious purposes) is now taxed, and that this started happening only AFTER the selectmen chose to start creating problems for themselves by messing with Peaceful Assembly Church.

Quote from: John on August 05, 2011, 04:27 PM NHFT

Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on August 05, 2011, 07:24 AM NHFT
According to Silent Bob, they also continue to tax the new church. I guess they also refuse to get government approval.

Continue? I'm told that SOME PORTION of that property (which is not used for religious purposes) is now taxed, and that this started happening only AFTER the selectmen chose to start creating problems for themselves by messing with Peaceful Assembly Church.

I do not know details, I'm only extrapolating from what I'm reading in the selectmen meeting minutes.

http://www.townofgraftonnh.com/images/July_6_2011_Selectmen_Minutes.pdf (http://www.townofgraftonnh.com/images/July_6_2011_Selectmen_Minutes.pdf)

Page three: "Letter from Cleveland, Waters and Bass Attorneys at Law regarding Millbrook Christian Fellowship's denial of religious exemption"

Quote from: John on August 05, 2011, 04:27 PM NHFT

Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on August 05, 2011, 07:24 AM NHFT
According to Silent Bob, they also continue to tax the new church. I guess they also refuse to get government approval.

Continue? I'm told that SOME PORTION of that property (which is not used for religious purposes) is now taxed, and that this started happening only AFTER the selectmen chose to start creating problems for themselves by messing with Peaceful Assembly Church.

This is most likely

Sounds like the the churches need to stick together... the gooberment has established the line, and they are on the side against the churches.

Quote from: doobie on August 05, 2011, 01:47 PM NHFT
I'm surprised the left/ACLU hasn't gotten on the bandwagon of churches not paying taxes....  I'm sure they can come up with reasons why that violates the separation of church and state.

It truly is about separation of church and state. The government guys want more paperwork - and thereby, more control.

Peaceful Assembly Church will not be hiring any lawyers to fix the selectmen's problem. Hiring another lawyer would prolong the situation and make it much more complicated than it actually is.
The selectmen can simply tell their lawyer to fix the problem. He simply found the wrong answer the first time. He can just as easily go back and find the right answer.
More lawyers cause matters to get worse and cost LOTS and LOTS of money by creating BIG STINKING legal battles.
This battle could go on for many many years, DRAINING everybody's pockets - WHILE THE LAWYERS GET VERY STINKING RICH. Even if someone like the ACLU stepped forward and took one side for free, it would still cost people on the other side LOTS and LOTS of money.

The people in the town of Grafton do not have to fear Peaceful Assembly Church. Lawyers are not part of our plan.
Nor is hurting other people nor destroying property belonging to others.

The selectmen are creating this problem and it is they who can fix it.
If those INDIVDUALS continue making bad CHOICES and decide to steal this property, INDIVIDUALS with guns will come here and do that. All the INDIVIDUALS doing the harm will point their fingers at other guys and say, "Its not MY fault. THEY! They "made" me do it. I'M JUST FOLLOWING ORDERS. I'm just doing my job."

Just following orders as they march along. "Its not MY fault. I just drive the train."

Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on August 05, 2011, 07:24 AM NHFT
According to Silent Bob, they also continue to tax the new church. I guess they also refuse to get government approval.

interesting

It is nice to know that this church is not interested in involving the bloodsucking lawyers. :)

I guess they would rather have you fill out some paperwork and get their permission to run a church .... then fill out some more paperwork and have the government pay you to continue.

EXACTLY! Its a trap.

One long time Grafton woman, who fashions herself a Peaceful person because she is against foreign WARS, stopped at Peaceful Assembly Church and said to me, "So John, When are you going to file as a 501c3?"
When I said, "We're not," she looked perplexed and replied, "Then how are you going to get any grant money?"
Knowing that someone else had previously introduced and talked to her about the concept of "the gun in the room," I said, "We are not interested in taking any money which was taken from people at gun point."
She looked rather surprised and a bit uncomfortable to hear this and so I said, "You think you are against WAR because you are against internation WAR, but you appear to be OK with being at WAR with your neighbors."

She stopped coming to the church.
I'm thinking that she probably realizes that when we say "Peaceful Assembly Church is open to all Peaceful people," that she is really not quite ready for DOMESTIC Peace. Maybe in time. There is always hope.

for most people it is just assumed that you fill out that paperwork and start getting the goodies

Very sad, but very true.
Its also assumed that one should hire lawyers.

Posted at http://www.graftonforum.com/forum/index.php (http://www.graftonforum.com/forum/index.php) :

Subject: 8/6/11 - Government vs. Church - deadline passes

Government vs. Church

The 12 NOON, August 6, 2011 deadline threatened by town of Grafton (523-7700) for Peaceful Assembly Church (523-7111) to pay taxes - or else - has passed.

Peaceful Assembly Church continues to claim exemption.

Lawyer for town can very easily fix the error.The sooner this happens the easier it will be on everyone.
1 day has passed. Do 730 remain?
How long will it take?

Why do governments hate independent churches so much?

Peaceful Assembly Church remains open :) to all Peaceful people - Catholic, Protestant, Muslim, Jew, Hindu, Buddhist, nothing-at-all, or something-in-between.
Peace & Metta.

PS - If you call either number, please try not to be nasty. (I've not heard the recording of any of the calls to another number, but I'm told more than one was less than civil. :( That's not necessary and its probably counterproductive.
Thanks.

When you call the town of Grafton, do they even know what you are talking about?

Our new flier:


Hello friend,
   
   When we say we are open to all Peaceful people, we mean you - AND your ideas. We mean: Catholic, Protestant, Muslim, Jew, Hindu, Buddhist, Nothing-at-all, or Something-in-between.

   Our mission is simply to foster Peace as prescribed by God, and, if you have a different word or way of describing our Creator or your higher Power, that's OK. If you do not believe (or are not sure) there is one, that's OK also. We still can learn from each other. We always want to share ways to better and more Peacefully interact with our neighbors. There is Peace inside each individual.
   
   All major religions in the world claim to be Peaceful, and yet there are endless WARS all over the planet, and smaller WARS everywhere. WARS are generally supported by organized religious people and their governments. We want to see this change, and to better understand how we can change and how we were conditioned to going along with violence, we are currently recommending people read (or listen to for free online) Leo Tolstoy's "The Kingdom Of God Is Within You."

   Individuals don't generally control what happens around the world. We as individuals control ourselves. We control how we interact with our neighbors. When we sit as a JUROR we decide whether we will do direct violence against others by hitting them with fines and/or locking them into prisons. Every day, we make choices about how we treat the guy down the street, or the woman across the way, or the person who cuts us off in traffic. We might think about the Budha's teachings on compassion and Jesus's teaching regarding mercy. Forgiveness often leads to external as well as internal Peace. 
      
   Our faith/spiritual/bible/moral study every Sunday morning is open to EVERYONE who is Peaceful - including atheists/non-theists/agnostics/etc. so long as they are not here to hassle or harass.

   Peaceful Assembly Church is unincorporated and totally independent. We get ZERO money from any other church and, will NEVER take any money from local, state or federal governments. We have been mostly funded by the dwindling personal saving of Peaceful Assembly Church fonder (John Connell.) This will not last. We have received some small gifts. Any small or large voluntary donations to keep us going are appreciated.  Please help us help others - if you can.

interesting
there are a couple of typos that you might have fixed in official versions :)

Quote from: John on October 02, 2011, 06:18 AM NHFTWe want to lean from each other

:o When one guy pointed at this on the paper so as to bring it to my attention, I said; "Oh my! That was suppossed to say "on."  ;D

While the spiritual mission of Peaceful Assembly Church (organized in Grafton, NH in two-0-one-0), to foster Peace as prescribed by God, and the personal message of Pastor/brother John Connell (born in NE, oh-so-many years ago) that we can all find Peace-through-Forgiveness continue to spread near and far; now Peaceful Assembly Church "flag" is also inspiring imitation.

Below is the first know imitation of Peaceful Assembly Church's "flag," the "new gadsden."  HOW COOL IS THIS?

As we each - as individuals - usher in the "New Beginning", the various versions of the Gadsden-flags-of-old, with their implied threats, demands, and personalization are being replaced with this new and quite-simple Call-to-Conscience; no demand, no implied threat, and the subtle message that we will find iner-Peace by giving and promoting outer-Peace.


The End is Over. Be the change!
Peace & Metta

I respect the tactic of appealing to an oppressor's sense of pity - or, more likely, the pity of the public opinion at large, which all modern-day oppressors must take into account due to the economic benefits of keeping their serfs on a longer leash.  It hasn't worked very often in the past, but it likely will work in the future, because the world is increasingly driven by public opinion, and a dove is a lot more difficult to vilify than a snake.  A peaceful philosophy would be a very good complement to my "big idea", the tactic of creating public opinion pressure to allow Private Land Secession (http://forum.freestateproject.org/index.php?topic=19215).

But this is the real world, and saying please will only get you so far.  We live in a gray reality of fractional probabilities.  Maybe you can be a white dove, but I can't.  I am a vulgar gray pigeon, and you do not want me in your flock.  I will never cease being gray.  I will never cease pursuing the Truth, in all its dehumanizing ugliness.  But I will always respect people who uphold the fantasy of humanity as a white dove, because that fantasy is beautiful.

I think your flag might help someone to decide to not harm others.
I like the purple better than the yellow also.

Thanks for the feedback guys. I noticed an H in there (again – so not just I who does that :) ) after posting this in several places. I'm thinking its an error. I've emailed it's creator, but haven't heard back yet. I kinda like that he used "DO NOT" rather than "DON'T" in his design. His design also inspires me to think of other possibilities in design.

Original concept (about 2+ years ago) for the "Peace gadsden" was to look very much like the yellow Gadsdens; just replacing the snake or porcupine with a dove. Then the idea developed further, and is still developing.
Peaceful Assembly Church will likely always stick with Purple (we're promoting "All Shades of Purple for PEACE") but, I can also imagine this idea over other flags: particularly; the anarcho-pacifist/christian-anarchist and Buddhist-pacifist flags.

Quote from: John on October 03, 2011, 08:59 PM NHFT

Quote from: John on October 02, 2011, 06:18 AM NHFTWe want to lean from each other

:o When one guy pointed at this on the paper so as to bring it to my attention, I said; "Oh my! That was suppossed to say "on."  ;D

Here's an obscurity I'll bet you didn't know: If it was intended to say "learn from each other," it should actually be "from one another," if more than two. 

This quote made me think of John.  :)

Thanks. I posted the pic to facebug.

Quote from: John on October 21, 2011, 06:52 AM NHFT
Thanks. I posted the pic to facebug.

That's where I got it.  ;D

This has some resources you might like:

http://peace.mennolink.org/index.html (http://peace.mennolink.org/index.html)

We're going to a Mennonite church now.

Thanks... I'll read more later... I've seen some of their clip art before...

:o Mennonite? - inspire by JP I presume.  ;D - obviously kidding.

Peace & Metta

It's cuz Russell liked their cool hats.  :D

the guys at our church don't wear the hats .... but the beards are seen around town a lot. I guess the beards mean you are married.
That means you have gotten hitched for the guys in the man cave.

Quote from: Russell Kanning on October 20, 2011, 03:29 PM NHFT
I think your flag might help someone to decide to not harm others.
I like the purple better than the yellow also.

;D
Being used by some "libertarian left" folks heading to a Peace conference in southern NE...

Changes in organizational structure are under consideration as we move toward the second anniversary of opening our Peaceful Assembly Church doors here in Grafton Center.
MANY MANY ideas will be sorted through in the next three months.

We look forward to hearing from folks who care about, and have ideas regarding, the sustainability of the Peaceful Assembly Church mission, "To foster Peace as prescribed by God."

Also, under consideration are issues regarding maintaining this historic property as a "Common Ground" community asset into the future - during my lifetime - - - and well beyond.

If you want to (or know others who may want to) take part, you know where to find us.

Peace,
John

The Forgiveness Key from Bruce Wilkinson:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhahvUd4Bzg

This is a short clip. I liked some of his others even better. I like all of his stuff. :)

Cool. Good tip.
4Giveness is "the tip" of the iceberg. :)

I have seen people changing physically (outwardly) as they begin to "get it."
Its wonderful seeing people learn to 4give. So few need much more than a bit of guidance. And when it is so apparent on the outside, you know that inside the healing miracle is happening.

He calls 4giveness a key. :)
I tell people 4giveness is actually THE master key, because it unlocks almost all problems.

As the saying goes, anger is letting someone else live rent-free in your head.

Forgiveness is the opposite of that.

There are people who have wronged me, from whom I have to admit I have envisioned extracting revenge. Fantasized, even. Perchance, even dreamed up plans.

In the end, I always knew that even if I could get away scot-free, legally speaking, the burden on my soul would be too great a price to pay.

For one particular sumbitch, the one who has created the greatest temptation, I have entrusted revenge to Karma or God or his own lonely crushing guilt, which is of his own creation. He knows what he did. He's suffering the consequences every single day. A news report of blowing his own brains out would not surprise me, nor would a report of being caught up in a vice sting and facing decades in prison.

I feel sad for him. I actually hope he doesn't get what he deserves, but I won't mourn if he does.

you have put a lot of thought into that one eh?

It was hard not to, after a decade of him actively working against my happiness. I would have been perfectly happy to never think of him at all, but he made that difficult.

Quote from: KBCraig on April 08, 2012, 03:31 AM NHFTAs the saying goes, anger is letting someone else live rent-free in your head.
...I feel sad for him. I actually hope he doesn't get what he deserves, but I won't mourn if he does.

Sounds like you're getting much better. Total 4giveness can be very hard to achieve.

Most people never realize that Forgiveness is a skill. We improve with practice.  8)

Forgiveness seemed like it was easier for me when I was younger and I used to tell myself that I wouldn't ever become bitter and angry towards certain people because I didn't want to become that kind of person.

Anyways, I thought I had really, really, forgiven those people but for the past couple of years I keep thinking about the past and becoming angry to the point of feeling like I'm bitter and maybe haven't forgiven them like I thought I did. :-\

I'm going to the church website to check it out John, so far it sounds awesome :)

fyi - We will be closed the rest of this week.
We plan to reopen next Sunday, for our regular Sunday meeting at 11:00.
SORRY FOR ANY INCONVENIENCE.

2 full years

will we make it to 3

I vote 'yes'.

John,

I had a hard time understanding your Porc-411 calls (noisy environment on my end). Did you get the issue resolved with your visitor who had called police? Any problems with the police?

Either John is peacefully sleeping ..... or they dragged him away. Or he is trapped under a piece of monument granite.

Quote from: KBCraig on July 02, 2012, 05:24 PM NHFT
John,

I had a hard time understanding your Porc-411 calls (noisy environment on my end). Did you get the issue resolved with your visitor who had called police? Any problems with the police?

details are still quite spotty... he had said that he had called - but it was actually a neighbor who called...? he had told a neighbor that he heard gunfire? it might have actually been fireworks?...

James, a friend here at Peaceful Assembly Church, is having a VERY bad week.
It seems he may have been exposed to some unfamiliar and harmful experiences (while a big party was in town?) which caused him some sort of breakdown.

What kinds of "experiences" did people "share" with him that made him break quite dramatically into this twisted, warped, comfused, disruptive, etc. ... person? 

Many of us who care about James would like to know more.  >:(
James is currently in the hospital and is said to be getting better.

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 02, 2012, 05:03 PM NHFT

I vote 'yes'.

thanks :)

good to hear from you John
Do I know James? What happened to the guy?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zx3z5hsZ_PQ

Matthew West, Forgiveness

thanks!

John,

Thank you for your courage.  You are an inspiration.   :glasses1:

Any news regarding the confused people at town hall who are threatening you?

Thanks for the kind words, Ian.

No big news on that to report right now. The threats remain the same. :(
I'll try to make time to report some interesting "small" news soon.


Presently, I'm busy focusing energy towards pioneering a bold Fully Informed JUROR (warrant) Article(s) idea here in Grafton.:)

Painting with purple reminds me of this peace nic.:-)
http://www.salvationmountain.us/history2.html

 ;D

I like it when the people thwart the will of the government. :-)

Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 07, 2013, 05:53 AM NHFT
I like it when the people thwart the will of the government. :-)

How come when the government thwarts they say it smells like roses?  But when WE thwart, NOOOO, they say it smells gaseous?

It is all the higher edumacation they have

They can go thwart themselves.

I really am way too busy to be resisting their stupid evil.
I've got TONS of Peace and 4Giveness stuff to do.
Really I'm way too busy to even spend much time even thinking about any gov-thugs.

Sounds like a good time was had by all at the 3rd anniversary event John. Congrats  8) :)

Wish we had been able to come and enjoy it as well.

Loads of people from here and elsewhere.
Hot but lots of fun.

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on July 08, 2013, 07:22 PM NHFT
Sounds like a good time was had by all at the 3rd anniversary event John. Congrats  8) :)

Wish we had been able to come and enjoy it as well.

It's a long drive from Bangor.  We missed you.

Hanging with firecracker Joe right now.

I think the birthday/visit party (wich started Sunday morning) just ended.

Thanks to ALL who participated.

Peace

Chuck Baldwin makes some excellent points:

http://libertycrier.com/chuck-baldwin-stand-fast-in-liberty/?utm_source=The+Liberty+Crier&utm_campaign=962f7eb3e1-The_Liberty_Crier_Daily_News_7_26_2013&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_600843dec4-962f7eb3e1-284783341

Excellent.

While Dr. Gene Scott of University Cathedral in Los Angeles had some very unorthodox views, one thing he had right was that he refused tax exemption. He said the power to grant tax exemption carried with it the power to take it away and impose taxes, and he wouldn't let his message be subject to government control. (Plus, he had Merle Haggard and Playboy bunnies on stage with him!)

Don't get me wrong, I support John and Peaceful Assembly, because the law should apply for him the same as any other church. But, this is where it leads... if they don't like you, if you don't just through the hoops, then you're not a "real church".

We should be treated the way churches used to be treated. Not the other way around. :-)

Finally made it to the peak...

It looks really good, John.   :)

Indeed,  :)  I bet that was challenging.

Very nice!

Cool
So that is what 'you guys' were doing with the bucket truck :-)

Almost done...

Cool

Tax filings by an organization are not what determines whether donations are deductible. Check with your tax advisor.
When I was a tax advisor at H&R Block they told us that donations to any non profit were deductible if nothing of value was received. They also said it was customary for the IRS to not question donations to churches.

https://www.vnews.com/Judge-rules-against-Peaceful-Assembly-Church-25250295

Give it to the F'n town. I would hope that the ghost of John Connell would haunt their asses.

yea
particularly crazy when the town didn't want the property for free before John bought it
but once you buy it ... they want to tell you how to manage it
looks like they have made it their problem

The town and state (using collectivists terms for a moment here) want to punish people for disobedience.

It's the only tool in their toolbox. 


In hindsight John should have kept the church, never "given" it away and followed thru on his plan to peacefully disobey.   I think he wanted to follow thru with his disobedience, but couldn't muster the will do it and it troubled him. That's understandable, since disobedience can be lonely, scary and carrries consequences.     

Not a condemnation of John, but had he kept the church and not asked government if he could pretty please not pay them, most likely the disobedience would have borne more fruit.   

Easy for me to say, but I felt that way when he "gave" control of the church to a board.    Of course we all know, neither John or the church board has ever really had control of the church....right or wrong...that power still resides with the town and state.   Which is being played out now.

exactly
and most people were probably telling John to be reasonably and do things the normal pro-government way