New Hampshire Underground

Comments on this press release?  Should I add anything?


After seeing my friend Dave Ridley put behind bars yesterday for the "crime" of Distributing Handbills, I decided that I must stand up to this oppressive government, even if only a small way.  So tomorrow I will sit in the Keene IRS office with a sign saying, "Taxes pay for torture" until I'm hauled away. 

I first realized the federal government was completely evil when I watched as church people in Waco were burned alive by federal agents.  Since then, this government has engaged in a war of aggression against Iraq, killing perhaps 700,000 Iraqi civilians.  It has become the open policy of the US to torture prisoners and hold them without charges or trial.  Somehow, good people in this country have been able to justify in their minds that this is necessary for our protection.  I want to make a stand so people will rethink these kinds of justifications.  How can our freedoms come from torturing others, who have not even been shown to have committed any crimes?  I don't want this kind of freedom.  I want the kind of freedom where initiation of force against others is the exception, rather than public policy.

In times such as these, it is incumbent upon each individual to look at his own actions and decide, "Am I aiding this atrocity or resisting it?  Am I giving them money?  Am I working for them?"  I don't want to have to explain to my grandchildren why I didn't stand up against the murder and torture - and at least attempt to put a stop to it, no matter if the attempt seems like "tilting at windmills."

What:  Civil disobedience against Federal atrocities
Where:  Keene IRS Office
When:  Thursday July 19th, 10:00am
Contacts:  Kat Kanning 357-2049, Lauren Canario 721-1490

Add contact: Lauren Canario 721-1490

OK, thanks Lauren!

give them hell girls

A comment from "an outsider" (I'm not in the Shire yet, but I AM on my way, come on housing market).

I think the idea is great.  I very much applaud your effort.  Coming from a marketing point of view (and nothing else), I wonder if the message could be slightly different.  The media and many people, when they see the word "torture," are going to associate you with the far left, Cindy-Sheehan type radicals and they'll dismiss you (and ignore you).  In order to attract the most attention, I'd humbly suggest that you'd be less marginalized with a message like "Taxes are Evil"  or "Taxes are Wrong" or even (to connect with Dada), "IRS Employees work for Evil."

Just a suggestion.

I guess that Judge Muirfield judged our reaction to Dave Ridley's jailing wrongly.

Thanks for the suggestion, Ogre.  I'll think it over.

maybe Kat is part of the extreme left .... if they are the ones that are not OK with torture

I understand that one, Russell -- that's why I tried to word my response the way I did.  I'm not saying that *I* disapprove of the sign, I'm just thinking it will garner less attention worded that way.  Of course, I could be completely wrong about it -- marketing, the media, and people are a very weird science.  :)

also lefties could view the message of "taxes are evil" ... and think that you are just an evil rightwing capitalist pig.

Frigg'in Commie Kat and that 'refuses to pay his fair share' Ogre!

Okay, so a message for everyone...Torture offends the right, "taxes are evil" offends the left...

Maybe the sign could just say:

TAXES

I'm not sure how effective that one would be.  ;)

I don't feel you can make your message politically correct. We are talking about dealing with reality. The Feds torture detainees.

I understand what you're saying.  I really wasn't going for politically correct (because any anti-tax anything, by it's very nature cannot BE PC).  I was just trying to think of a way that the most people would see the message, or the most media might pick it up and tell the sheeple.

'Honk If You Hate Taxes'

Works on both the subjective  and PC levels ;D

Quote from: Ogre on July 18, 2007, 09:18 AM NHFT
Coming from a marketing point of view (and nothing else), I wonder if the message could be slightly different.  The media and many people, when they see the word "torture," are going to associate you with the far left, Cindy-Sheehan type radicals and they'll dismiss you (and ignore you).  In order to attract the most attention, I'd humbly suggest that you'd be less marginalized with a message like "Taxes are Evil"  or "Taxes are Wrong" or even (to connect with Dada), "IRS Employees work for Evil."

Just a suggestion.

Just my own two cents, torture is clearly wrong, and it is unfortunately now a part of a long history of abuses by the feds.  However, as a popular issue it seems to have come and gone, whether in actual practice or just being ignored by the media.

At any rate, I like the statement, "Taxation Is Theft".  It states THE point, is self-explanatory, and is never out of date.

luckily some of us are not effected by what is or is not a popular issue

Quote from: Russell Kanning on July 18, 2007, 11:02 AM NHFT
luckily some of us are not effected by what is or is not a popular issue

Of course not.  Taxes are evil (because taxation constitutes theft) regardless of the popularity of the issue.  The same goes for torture.

I see that I used the wrong word to try and make my point.  The word I should have used is current issue.  The only thing I was trying to point out is that if the goal is to open peoples' minds, perhaps one would not want to be seen as protesting against a thing of the past.  As far as I can tell, the Bush administration seems to have backed off on the use of torture at least for now, or else they are doing a better job of concealing it.  I was just trying to offer some food for thought, and I do not know for a fact that the anti-torture message will not resonate.

Perhaps I am misrepresenting the real purpose of the protest.  Can you or Kat clarify the purpose of the protest, or what you are ultimately hoping to accomplish by it?  (You and I already know each others' positions on the best approach to activism.  I will refrain from debating the merits of your approach; I just want to make sure I am not assuming something that is not true.)

I hope you do not perceive my input as antagonistic.  For better or worse, I appreciate the stand you are (both) taking.  If I saw your protest as being without merit, I would not offer any input at all.

The back of my sign says "taxes = theft", so I can switch back and forth.

I'm off tomorrow, so i'll be there. 

Since the government is still torturing people ... the sign works for me.

I will be in my orange jumpsuit and black hood.

I think the Bush admin is backing away from torture .... because people have pushed the issue. No reason to stop until they stop.

Sent press release to Keene Sentinel, Concord Monitor, Union Leader, WKBK, WMUR, NHPR, Alex Jones.  Feel free to send anywhere else.  Caleb told Keene Police last night.

I doubt they'll care much, but I'm going to start working on my Congresscritters from NC (with a copy of the press release, too).

I called the Federal Protective Service # and told them that there was going to be a Don Quixote style attack on the Keene IRS building.

Kat thinks I used the wrong word "attack". She may be right.
I think they will figure out what we are doing after a while. :)

Can you come pick me up?  I will attend and shoot video.

Because you used the word "attack", I doubt they will even let her in the front door of the lobby.

Quote from: FTL_Ian on July 18, 2007, 02:48 PM NHFT
Can you come pick me up?  I will attend and shoot video.

Sure, thanks :)

Can't take anymore of this statist video I'm editing... I'm coming out to play.

See ya'll at the happening.  :)

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on July 18, 2007, 08:29 PM NHFT
Can't take anymore of this statist video I'm editing... I'm coming out to play.

See ya'll at the happening.  :)

Consider bringing a press identification badge.  It will be good having you there with me.   :icon_pirat:

According to a Porc 411 voice mail Lauren Canario has been arrested and Kat was upstairs at the Keene Federal building and is probably going to be arrested.

Quote from: slim on July 19, 2007, 09:47 AM NHFT
According to a Porc 411 voice mail Lauren Canrio has been arrested and Kat was upstairs at the Keene Federal building and is probably going to be arrested.

Any word on why?

Quote from: lildog on July 19, 2007, 09:49 AM NHFT

Quote from: slim on July 19, 2007, 09:47 AM NHFT
According to a Porc 411 voice mail Lauren Canrio has been arrested and Kat was upstairs at the Keene Federal building and is probably going to be arrested.

Any word on why?

I believe that they were performing a protest in honor of Dave Ridley.

A second voice mail has came out confirming Lauren's arrest she apparently went limp and there are Keene police at the Keene Federal building/ Post Office

Lauren Canario has been arrested, and Kat Kanning may be arrested. :(

(See this thread (http://newhampshireunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=5248.0) for more on Porc-411 and to get voicemail blasts delivered to you.)

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Another message has come out that Kat Kanning has been taken by the goons also.

Quote from: slim on July 19, 2007, 10:18 AM NHFT
Another message has come out that Kat Kanning has been taken by the goons also.

You didn't post the message! :(

[attachment deleted by admin]

Quote from: error on July 19, 2007, 10:20 AM NHFT

You didn't post the message! :(

Sorry me retarded  ;D

If it's anything like before, they'll be hauled in, given a citation and an appointment with Judge Muirhead, and released.

This is chilling to me. If nothing else this will put the FSP squarely on radar.

Quote from: RattyDog on July 19, 2007, 10:28 AM NHFT
WTF??


My god...where does it end?

Do we have any word on where they will be taken? I'm not familiar with Keene at all...will they be booked and released...or not? I guess they probably will not post bail, will they? Okay...so, what should we do?

Where does it end? Good question I would think it would end when people are free. But even if someone snapped their fingers and people were free there would still be work to do but it would be much easier work and I would envision it would involve education.

According to a voice mail Kat and Lauren have been released from the Ministry of Love


:jailbird:

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Glad their out. Though knowing those 2 it won't be the last time
they are under the goons um care.


My best to the both of them.

Is there any intelliegent honest lawyers that can give some assitance???

This is BULLSHIT!!

Kola

when they start putting handcuffs on people like lauren and kat , Its  time for change . when soldiers go on tv and dare any congressman to sit next to him on his next 15 month tour. Its time to stop sending our children to foriegn lands to be killed and smuggle drugs back in their corpses under the american flag, and drag their mothers to jail for protesting big govt.We need to stick together and WIN.

Both Lauren and Kat walked out of the 'taj mahal' aka keene police department headquarters.  they both have a 100 dollar fine and a 25 dollar processing fee.  Exactly what Dave Ridley originally had. 

Maybe I just missed it.... but what exactly were they charged with?

Quote from: CA_Libertarian on July 19, 2007, 12:35 PM NHFT
Maybe I just missed it.... but what exactly were they charged with?

Wait, I'm sure Kat will scan the ticket in and post a picture of it.

They were ready for them.  Therrian was there.  The feds used nhfree.com to identify Lauren. 
This is the first time I have gotten close to Therrian.  As easy as it can be to villify him as completely evil, I don't think he is.  He is another in a long line of people making a lot of money working for the gov't that doesn't believe he is doing anything wrong.  When Russell took his picture as he was returning Kat's Taxes are Theft, Therrian joked that he can't be seen holding that sign. 
I do not believe the feds feels threatened by us, which is good.  We waved everytime a fed or keene police passed by. 
Dr. King would routinely emphasize that he didn't want to 'win' at the expense of his white brethren.  Our parrallel is that even as they harrass , ticket, and arrest us, we will always have to coexist with them, so it is prudent not to make them our 'enemy'.  At the same time, those ultimately responsible for Daves', Kats', and Laurens' arrests or tickets or summons are Law EnForcers,  who can choose not to do those things anytime they want to. 

Quote from: CA_Libertarian on July 19, 2007, 12:35 PM NHFT
Maybe I just missed it.... but what exactly were they charged with?

I am not certain but I am going to guess distributing handbills

trespassing or something, i don't actually remember.

Tag team camera men, ahhh, life is good.   ;D

Disorderly conduct and loitering, failure to obey a lawful order.

I went upstairs when I saw Therrien coming so he wouldn't prevent me from going into the building.  I sat down on some seats in the IRS office.  The woman there told me I'd have to leave.  Therrien came up huffing after me.  Lauren and Ian came up, too.  They didn't let Ian keep filming and he had to take the camera outside.  They let him observe later as press.  Therrien gave me a minute to leave before he was going to cite me.  They were having trouble writing the ticket cause I wouldn't give my ssn or birthdate, so the guy was disturbed by having blanks in his form.  They got the point where they wanted Lauren to take off the mask, she didn't comply, so the dyke officer ordered Lauren to put her hands on the counter.  She didn't so they cuffed Lauren.  Dyke lady was amped for a fight.  Therrien told them not to hurt her.  She wouldn't walk out, so they had to carry her.  The IRS looked like she was about to cry at one point.  She had her grandson at work, who was asking, " Grandma, what are the police doing?"  I couldn't hear her reply.  Later I told the guy who helped carry Lauren that if he complained about Lauren hurting his back, we'd have to make serious fun of him.  They dealt with Lauren for a long time while I sat there with my sign.  Eventually Therrien said that if I didn't give my ssn and dob, they'd have to arrest me.  They took me out the back of the post office.  The guy was going to turn the wrong way to get to the police station, so I told him where it was, but he didn't want to believe me.   They spent a long time at the police station trying to figure out who Lauren was.  Finally they looked on nhfree.com and found Lauren was arrested in New London and got her info from the NL police.  Dyke chick told me to take off my shoes, but I didn't want to, so she took them off.  I told her she seemed really angry and uptight, which she denied.  They eventually decided to just cite us and let us go.  I think we have two $125 fines each.  I have no intention of paying or showing up in court voluntarily.

At various times, Therrien lectured me about wasting his time on petty stuff while he needed to be out hunting terrorists.  They chose to go after Dave, weeks after he left a flyer in the IRS.  It's not like Dave forced them to do anything.  And the stuff today wouldn't have happened but for Dave's imprisonment.

Oh yeah, I left a stack of flyers in the IRS office when they weren't looking.

Some photos
http://www.newhampshireunderground.com/wiki/tiki-browse_gallery.php?galleryId=100

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 19, 2007, 12:57 PM NHFT
At various times, Therrien lectured me about wasting his time on petty stuff while he needed to be out hunting terrorists.

You weren't wasting his time. He was wasting his time. He chose to go in there and arrest the two of you instead of going out hunting terrorists at Dunkin Donuts.

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 19, 2007, 12:57 PM NHFT
Disorderly conduct and loitering, failure to obey a lawful order.

It's all always up to you, of course. And of course I wasn't there and so I don't know the specifics.
But... if you should wish to neutralize their authority...

I would bet a decent lawyer could get these charges thrown out.
"disorderly conduct" is something I've never seen you engage in, and Lauren only did when severely provoked (in that infamous stairwell)
"failure to obey a lawful order" has all kinds of fun opportunities for defense. Which specific orders? Was the defendant given the opportunity to obey? Can the prosecution enumerate the statutes that make those orders lawful? Do those statutes survive Constitutional scrutiny? ... and so on...

What I'm getting at is, if their charges against you were overturned, you could wind up with basically carte blanche (or if you prefer a "don't go to jail" card) allowing you, and anybody else to petition against the IRS in the way which you are now doing.

 ;D 8)


"Oh yeah, I left a stack of flyers in the IRS office when they weren't looking."


LOL.   You Ladies are so brave, glad you are out of their clutches .

 :protest:   FREE DAVE RIDLEY
>:(  FREE LAUREN CANARIO
>:(  FREE KAT KANNING

Two out, and one to go. 

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 19, 2007, 12:57 PM NHFT
Oh yeah, I left a stack of flyers in the IRS office when they weren't looking.

;D ;D ;D

:tiphat: Good job!

I think this is what is called "blowback"
Perhaps if they stopped stealing people's property, arresting them, and destroying lives, they wouldn't have dangerous leaflet-terrorists on their hands. *shrugs*

There oughtta be law! (so richard can have some new fanfic to read)

:icon_pirat:

[edit] I'm grateful it hasn't come to this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Rose) ... oh crap "Godwin's Law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_Law)". I guess that comparison isn't valid now *pouts*

Quote from: shyfrog on July 19, 2007, 01:45 PM NHFT
I think this is what is called "blowback"
Perhaps if they stopped stealing people's property, arresting them, and destroying lives, they wouldn't have dangerous leaflet-terrorists on their hands. *shrugs*

When asked if I had any dangerous items on me, I answered that I had two very dangerous flyers in my pocket.  The guy gave me this blank stare then said Oh, sarcasm.

Do these tickets count if they spelled my name wrong?  ::)

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 19, 2007, 12:57 PM NHFTAt various times, Therrien lectured me about wasting his time on petty stuff while he needed to be out hunting terrorists.

You should have asked him how many he's caught so far.

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 19, 2007, 02:41 PM NHFT
Do these tickets count if they spelled my name wrong?  ::)

I don't think they care about that, but you can certainly bring it up.

Heh, lildog...I never think of the good comebacks on time.

(http://www.newhampshireunderground.com/wiki/show_image.php?name=IMG_7834-IRS-Office.jpg)

More Images in the gallery. (http://www.newhampshireunderground.com/wiki/tiki-browse_gallery.php?galleryId=100)

(http://www.newhampshireunderground.com/wiki/show_image.php?name=IMG_7834-IRS-Office.jpg)

More Images in the gallery. (http://www.newhampshireunderground.com/wiki/tiki-browse_gallery.php?galleryId=100)

QuoteWhen asked if I had any dangerous items on me, I answered that I had two very dangerous flyers in my pocket.  The guy gave me this blank stare then said Oh, sarcasm.

LMAO!

Did they put on gloves, seal them in plastic baggies and label them as evidence #1 ?


Kola

This is just what was on my mind today...Why did Germans support Hitler...Why didn't they see it coming or do something about it?

  Why Germans Supported Hitler

by Jacob G. Hornberger

It has long intrigued me why the German people supported Adolf Hitler and his Nazi regime. After all, every schoolchild in America is taught that Hitler and his Nazi cohorts were the very epitome of evil. How could ordinary German citizens support people who were so obviously monstrous in nature?

Standing against the Nazi tide was a remarkable group of young people known as the White Rose. Led by Hans and Sophie Scholl, a German brother and sister who were students at the University of Munich, the White Rose consisted of college students and a college professor who risked their lives to circulate anti-government pamphlets in the midst of World War II. Their arrest and trial was depicted in the German movie Sophie Scholl: The Final Days, which was recently released on DVD in the United States.

Of all the essays on liberty I have written in the past 20 years, my favorite is "The White Rose: A Lesson in Dissent," which I am pleased to say was later reprinted in Voices of the Holocaust, an anthology on the Holocaust for high-school students. The story of the White Rose is the most remarkable case of courage I have ever come across. It even inspired me to visit the University of Munich a few years ago, where portions of the White Rose pamphlets have been permanently enshrined on bricks laid into a plaza at the entrance to the school.

A contrast to the Scholl movie is another recent German movie, Downfall, which details Hitler's final days in the bunker, where he committed suicide near the end of the war. Among the people around Hitler was 22-year-old Traudl Junge, who became his secretary in 1942 and who faithfully served him in that capacity until the end. For me, the most stunning part of the film occurred at the end, when the real Traudl Junge (that is, not the actress who portrays her in the film) says,

    All these horrors I've heard of ... I assured myself with the thought of not being personally guilty. And that I didn't know anything about the enormous scale of it. But one day I walked by a memorial plate of Sophie Scholl in the Franz-Joseph-Strasse.... And at that moment I actually realized ... that it might have been possible to get to know things.

So here were two separate roads taken by German citizens. Most Germans took the road that Traudl Junge took – supporting their government in time of deep crisis. A few Germans took the road that Hans and Sophie Scholl took – opposing their government despite the deep crisis facing their nation.

Why the difference? Why did some Germans support the Hitler regime while others opposed it?

Each American should first ask himself what he would have done if he had been a German citizen during the Hitler regime. Would you have supported your government or would you have opposed it, not only during the 1930s but also after the outbreak of World War II?

After all, it's one thing to look at Nazi Germany retrospectively and from the vantage point of an outside citizen who has heard since childhood about the death camps and of Hitler's monstrous nature. We look at those grainy films of Hitler delivering his bombastic speeches and our automatic reaction is that we would have never supported the man and his political party. But it's quite another thing to place one's self in the shoes of an ordinary German citizen and ask, "What would I have done?"

What we often forget is that many Germans did not support Hitler and the Nazis at the start of the 1930s. Keep in mind that in the 1932 presidential election, Hitler received only 30.1 percent of the national vote. In the subsequent run-off election, he received only 36.8 percent of the vote. It wasn't until President Hindenburg appointed him as chancellor in 1933 that Hitler began consolidating power.

Among the major factors that motivated Germans to support Hitler during the 1930s was the tremendous economic crisis known as the Great Depression, which had struck Germany as hard as it had the United States and other parts of the world. What did many Germans do in response to the Great Depression? They did the same thing that many Americans did – they looked for a strong leader to get them out of the economic crisis.

Rest of the article (http://www.lewrockwell.com/hornberger/hornberger132.html)

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 19, 2007, 02:35 PM NHFT

Quote from: shyfrog on July 19, 2007, 01:45 PM NHFT
I think this is what is called "blowback"
Perhaps if they stopped stealing people's property, arresting them, and destroying lives, they wouldn't have dangerous leaflet-terrorists on their hands. *shrugs*

When asked if I had any dangerous items on me, I answered that I had two very dangerous flyers in my pocket.  The guy gave me this blank stare then said Oh, sarcasm.

Perhaps you should carry a pocket constitution for these situations.  "Yes, the Bill of Rights."

the FPS guy carries one with him ... it doesn't matter though.

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 19, 2007, 03:24 PM NHFT
Standing against the Nazi tide was a remarkable group of young people known as the White Rose.

We should find a tactful and respectful way to use the term "White Rose" in our protest efforts; perhaps a homage of sorts. Maybe we could even take up a modified name that uses it in a way that pays respects to the original group. People would wonder what it means and maybe google it and learn something and look at us a little differently.

Good idea Dale and good article Kat... and a fine example of bravery and principle today.  8)

Quote from: lildog on July 19, 2007, 02:47 PM NHFT

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 19, 2007, 12:57 PM NHFTAt various times, Therrien lectured me about wasting his time on petty stuff while he needed to be out hunting terrorists.

You should have asked him how many he's caught so far.

Wow this should make the papers..... Terrorists are in NH?  Where?

I haven't logged in here in a while but I'm happy that Lauren and Kat were let go after stickin' it to the man. Free Dave Ridley!

Thomas

So what happened?  It looks like the guy took your V mask and a sign and then brought them back?

Terrorists, you know, those shadowy guys who want to attack us. Especially federal buildings. And FPS is understaffed. So Col. Therrien has taken it upon himself to protect every federal property in New Hampshire from terrorist attack, without having enough people to do the job.

There being no actual terrorists to hunt today, I guess he had plenty of time to devote to arresting a couple of harmless people.

A discussion of the day's events occupies the first half hour of tonight's Free Talk Live:
http://media.libsyn.com/media/ftl/FTL2007-07-19.mp3

GJ Ian I'm listening to the archives right now as a matter of fact.

Quote from: FTL_Ian on July 19, 2007, 10:37 PM NHFT
A discussion of the day's events occupies the first half hour of tonight's Free Talk Live:
http://media.libsyn.com/media/ftl/FTL2007-07-19.mp3

Oh, it was you Therrien was yelling at about being nonobjective.  I couldn't see.  I thought it was Russell he was talking to.

I just remembered one conversation I had with the ICE guys yesterday.  That Mellor guy asked where my daughter was and asked what she thought about all this.  I said she was proud of what we do.  I said yes and he asked if I forced her to believe that and be involved in all this.  I told him that would be very un-libertarian and that she has a choice whether to join in or not and that I was disturbed when she just adopts my point of view cause I'm her mother, and doesn't think it all out herself.

Quote from: outatime on July 19, 2007, 09:40 PM NHFT
I haven't logged in here in a while but I'm happy that Lauren and Kat were let go after stickin' it to the man. Free Dave Ridley!

Thomas

They were "let go" with a $125 citation, pretty much what they did to Dave Ridley. I highly doubt either Lauren or Kat will be willing to give them their $125...

Quote from: RattyDog on July 20, 2007, 09:58 AM NHFT
Kat, Lauren, Russ, Jim....I don't know all of your names...I'm in awe of how awesome and brave you are.

So brave. So right and so nice to these clowns about being right. It takes courage...you guys rock. I absolutely love to death the picture of you all standing together. Can I get a copy of that picture??? I'd like to make it into a poster!

I keep intending to offer the images I've created in one place for folks to enjoy and see what fun is to be had. Make a gallery, I'll put this in my to do list...

Come out and play, I'd love to have you in one of my images... :)

Welcome to the Underground. 8)

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 20, 2007, 05:17 AM NHFT
...he asked if I forced her to believe that and be involved in all this.  I told him that would be very un-libertarian and that she has a choice whether to join in or not and that I was disturbed when she just adopts my point of view cause I'm her mother, and doesn't think it all out herself.

More positive karma for you Kat!  I wish my parents understood that the most important thing you can teach a child is how to think, not what to think.

Lucky for me, at the age of 16 I got my hands on forbidden books that taught me the how, and I quickly abandoned the what that I had been force-fed.

Quote from: RattyDog on July 20, 2007, 09:58 AM NHFT
I would like to know, actually, exactly WHY my tax dollars are being wasted on paying a HS Department to stand by, ready at a moments notice, in Keene New Hampshire.

Further underscoring your point, my understanding is that they 'stand by' in Concord, wasting even more taxpayer dollars driving to Keene whenever they smell "trouble" brewing.

Quote from: RattyDog on July 20, 2007, 09:58 AM NHFT
This is just ridiculous. Homeland Security = This is our plan for slowly turning your state into a Police State. Why else would they be here?

Good point.  The job description on their SUVs says it remarkably well: Federal Protective Service.  They do just that -- "protect" the Federal gov't from dissenting patriotic Americans.

Quote from: Bald Eagle on July 19, 2007, 10:05 PM NHFT
So what happened?  It looks like the guy took your V mask and a sign and then brought them back?

Therrian brought them back to us. 

Quote from: srqrebel on July 20, 2007, 12:05 PM NHFT

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 20, 2007, 05:17 AM NHFT
...he asked if I forced her to believe that and be involved in all this.  I told him that would be very un-libertarian and that she has a choice whether to join in or not and that I was disturbed when she just adopts my point of view cause I'm her mother, and doesn't think it all out herself.

More positive karma for you Kat!  I wish my parents understood that the most important thing you can teach a child is how to think, not what to think.

Lucky for me, at the age of 16 I got my hands on forbidden books that taught me the how, and I quickly abandoned the what that I had been force-fed.

Agree. 

Russell called the feds and let them know what we were going to do, but apparently they already knew.  Caleb talked to keene police about it Tuesday night and I assume they called the feds and told them.

Any superstitious folks out there?

Kat's karma is 911.

:D

Quote from: srqrebel on July 20, 2007, 01:04 PM NHFT
Kat's karma is 911.

It's obviously an inside job!

My vast network of conspirators have been working overtime.

Quote from: penguins4me on July 20, 2007, 05:56 AM NHFT

Quote from: outatime on July 19, 2007, 09:40 PM NHFT
I haven't logged in here in a while but I'm happy that Lauren and Kat were let go after stickin' it to the man. Free Dave Ridley!

Thomas

They were "let go" with a $125 citation, pretty much what they did to Dave Ridley.

I'm aware of that. I meant that I'm glad they weren't kept in jail.

Quote from: penguins4me on July 20, 2007, 05:56 AM NHFTI highly doubt either Lauren or Kat will be willing to give them their $125...

Bravo to these ladies. I realize they will be jailed for this stand. I salute their courage to do what is right in the face of evil.

So you can carry a sidearm in NH but you can't hand the IRS a piece of paper?

Zat seem a little lopsided?

Oh yeah, for some reason they acted shocked that I have a concealed carry license.

I'm surprised too!

You asked NH govt's permission?   (Or is it from another state?)

She could tell ya, but then she'd have to kill ya.  ;D

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 21, 2007, 06:25 PM NHFT
Oh yeah, for some reason they acted shocked that I have a concealed carry license.

"Officer, it's so an otherwise peaceful lady like myself doesn't have to worry about brutal thugs that might try and hurt me...."

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 21, 2007, 06:25 PM NHFT
Oh yeah, for some reason they acted shocked that I have a concealed carry license.

I'm shocked too but that's because I thought you and Russell were pacifists.

Kat/Lauren:  means a great deal to me what both of u have done! i will endeavor to assist in making your efforts worth while!

Both Russell and Kat are familiar with firearms, as far as I know, and I do believe they own some.

Quote from: FTL_Ian on July 21, 2007, 07:03 PM NHFT
I'm surprised too!

You asked NH govt's permission?   (Or is it from another state?)

I got it when I first moved, before I became such an anarchist.

Quote from: d_goddard on July 21, 2007, 08:34 PM NHFT
"Officer, it's so an otherwise peaceful lady like myself doesn't have to worry about brutal thugs that might try and hurt me...."

and guess what we have learned ..... basically the only guys out to get us are government thugs

Quote from: srqrebel on July 20, 2007, 01:04 PM NHFT
Any superstitious folks out there?

Kat's karma is 911.

:D

not anymore :)

Re:  pacifist,  Russell is, I've never decided.  I think pacifism toward the government is the way to go.  Not sure about some brute breaking into the house.  But the only brutes who have ever broken into my house or done any violence against me have been government.  Not looking for a debate here, just answering a question.

I know I am late to the party, and I haven't read the entire thread.

However... it seems as though there is some uncertainty about the message, and I'm not convinced that the reference to torture won't turn some people off immediately and prevent them from thinking things through.

Perhaps something along the line of what follows would cause people to question what they "know" and see the light:

TAXES...
TAKEN BY GOVERNMENT FORCE
TO FUND GOVERNMENT FORCE

DON'T BELIEVE IT?
WATCH WHAT HAPPENS TO US.
[insert graphic of handcuffs & fines]

Subtext: FREE SPEECH AIN'T FREE NO MORE.
AVERAGE PAY & BENEFITS PER LEO = $XXX,XXX/YEAR

Quote from: Sam Adams on July 22, 2007, 09:31 AM NHFT
I know I am late to the party, and I haven't read the entire thread.

However... it seems as though there is some uncertainty about the message, and I'm not convinced that the reference to torture won't turn some people off immediately and prevent them from thinking things through.

Why would a reference to torture turn people off?

We got a lot of positive comments when we were walking up and down main st. with Russell in the Guantanamo outfit.  One guy said, "thanks for the reminder"

If the idea of supporting torture doesn't start people thinking about where the money they give to the government goes, what will?

The problem is that people have been indoctrinated to believe that the only ones getting "tortured" are the "bad guys," and that it is "okay" to torture them. It isn't that I think "torture" is too strong. On the contrary, I think it is too weak, specifically because people think that it is only "evil terrorists" that are the recipients and they don't see themselves as the victims of government. Also, many, many people justify the torture of people whom they believe to employ even worse methods, simply because they have been taught to be guided by irrational fear.

The other thing is that they know that not all their tax dollars go for torture ("Just a little bit of them."), and that the rest goes to do "good things" for them. Somehow they must be re-educated to see how they are the victims of that government force in their daily lives. It isn't the knowledge of the torture of "bad guys" that will motivate people, it is the awakening to the realities of their own personal slave status. Historically, remote injustices are the territory of saints and crusaders, and personally-experienced injustices are the breeding grounds of revolutions.

People won't "risk" themselves and their families on behalf of faceless "terrorists." That's the reality of the human condition. I think it's our job to show them HOW unbridled government force affects THEM every day of their lives.

JMHO

Quote from: Lloyd  Danforth on July 22, 2007, 10:23 AM NHFT
If the idea of supporting torture doesn't start people thinking about where the money they give to the government goes, what will?

GUANTANAMO BAY NAVAL BASE, Cuba (AP) - Twice a day at the U.S. military prison here, Abdul Rahman Shalabi and Zaid Salim Zuhair Ahmed are strapped down in padded restraint chairs and flexible yellow tubes are inserted through their noses and throats. Milky nutritional supplements, mixed with water and olive oil to add calories and ease constipation, pour into their stomachs.

If you pay Federal Taxes .... this is your tax $s at work.

And SADLY, that just about draws a yawn from about 99% of the population.

WE HERE know that #1 that's just plain evil, and #2 we could be next in line. But Joe Sixpack responds with, "Good! I hope they get the rest of those evil bastards and do the same to them." That's not pretty, but it is the reality we live with. If you walk among them, you will hear it too. They fear the unknown, particularly if those unknowns have strange names and customs and if they believe the bad guys are coming for them.

It isn't enough for us to be right, we must also be effective.

I just finished watching Lauren's 10 minute rough cut of the events surrounding the arrest, and it is very good.   8)   

Look for a Youtube version coming soon.   8)

Quote from: Sam Adams on July 22, 2007, 11:10 AM NHFT
It isn't enough for us to be right, we must also be effective.

We?

In my experience only a small % like defending torture .... and only in "yell and drive off" situations. For others it is very sobering.
The Federal employees try to ignore it.

Most people want to distance themselves from it.

Quote from: Russell Kanning on July 22, 2007, 11:15 AM NHFT
Most people want to distance themselves from it.

It's hard to distance yourself from it when it appears on your every paystub. Perhaps a sign showing a giant paycheck could be used in some context...

Quote from: error on July 22, 2007, 11:39 AM NHFT
It's hard to distance yourself from it when it appears on your every paystub. Perhaps a sign showing a giant paycheck could be used in some context...

2nded, Error. I was thinking of this recently in the form of a tax bill where what you're paying for is itemized.

Quick, off the top of my head example that should be expanded upon with research:

Maintaining imperialist bases in other people's countries: $1 trillion
Indoctrinating people into being submissive to their aggressive government: $400 billion
War on Drugs and making criminals out of innocent people: $50 billion

Stealing half of your hard-earned money and using it to keep you enslaved under the iron hand of government: Priceless

EDIT: This msg got truncated for some reason. Fixing.

Quote from: error on July 22, 2007, 11:39 AM NHFT

Quote from: Russell Kanning on July 22, 2007, 11:15 AM NHFT
Most people want to distance themselves from it.

It's hard to distance yourself from it when it appears on your every paystub. Perhaps a sign showing a giant paycheck could be used in some context...

I was talking about "torture" :'(

Kat,

The "we" was in reference to libertarian activists in general, not to a particular event or events. Hopefully, people are employing multiple methods in pursuit of the common goal of less government. I don't believe that any one of those methods is inherently better than any other. I'm sorry if that was misunderstood.

Certainly, if people believe that focusing on "torture" will educate and motivate potential converts, that avenue should be pursued. In this case we have a huge segment of the population who gladly pay their taxes (and increases) specifically to get government "protection" to make them "safe" from terrorists. They are not sympathetic to the torture issue, and at an optimum they consider it ugly, but necessary, collateral damage.

I don't think the torture issue should be discounted or ignored. I just think that government does a whole lot of other evil stuff that negatively impacts individuals on a daily basis, and that it wouldn't hurt to point those out as well.

Quote from: Russell Kanning on July 22, 2007, 11:01 AM NHFT

Quote from: Lloyd  Danforth on July 22, 2007, 10:23 AM NHFT
If the idea of supporting torture doesn't start people thinking about where the money they give to the government goes, what will?

GUANTANAMO BAY NAVAL BASE, Cuba (AP) - Twice a day at the U.S. military prison here, Abdul Rahman Shalabi and Zaid Salim Zuhair Ahmed are strapped down in padded restraint chairs and flexible yellow tubes are inserted through their noses and throats. Milky nutritional supplements, mixed with water and olive oil to add calories and ease constipation, pour into their stomachs.

If you pay Federal Taxes .... this is your tax $s at work.

At least you know their liver won't be sold at a restaurant in Chicago.

Quote from: Russell Kanning on July 22, 2007, 02:14 PM NHFT

Quote from: error on July 22, 2007, 11:39 AM NHFT
It's hard to distance yourself from it when it appears on your every paystub. Perhaps a sign showing a giant paycheck could be used in some context...

I was talking about "torture" :'(

I know. And I was talking about making torture visible on your paystub.

[attachment deleted by admin]

Quote from: Sam Adams on July 22, 2007, 03:21 PM NHFT
I don't think the torture issue should be discounted or ignored. I just think that government does a whole lot of other evil stuff that negatively impacts individuals on a daily basis, and that it wouldn't hurt to point those out as well.

Well .... when you show up to the IRS office with your sign .... you can inform people about all that other evil stuff the government does. I think that will be wonderful.

Video of the event (http://www.youtube.com/v/zpAK3DbTsNY)
Thanks for the camera work FTL_Ian

Lauren's citations (http://www.newhampshireunderground.com/wiki/tiki-browse_image.php?imageId=2869)
(http://www.newhampshireunderground.com/wiki/show_image.php?id=2869)

Quote from: TackleTheWorld on July 22, 2007, 10:41 PM NHFT
Video of the event (http://www.youtube.com/v/zpAK3DbTsNY)
Thanks for the camera work FTL_Ian

Well done TTW...
Your best work so far. Kind of cinematic. :)

They're only up to 758 citations issued? For how many years? This obviously isn't making them that much money.

Wow, they're really reaching, aren't they?

   Preservation of Property (41 CFR 102-74.380). All persons entering
in or on Federal property are prohibited from:
    (a) Improperly disposing of rubbish on property;
    (b) Willfully destroying or damaging property;
    (c) Stealing property;
    (d) Creating any hazard on property to persons or things;
    (e) Throwing articles of any kind from or at a building or the
climbing upon statues, fountains or any part of the building.

    Conformity with Signs and Directions (41 CFR 102-74.385). Persons in
and on property must at all times comply with official signs of a
prohibitory, regulatory or directory nature and with the lawful
direction of Federal police officers and other authorized individuals.

Plead not guilty. I have GOT to hear how they justify those.

Also make a motion to allow the press to come in and videotape the proceedings.

Quote from: TackleTheWorld on July 22, 2007, 10:41 PM NHFT
Video of the event (http://www.youtube.com/v/zpAK3DbTsNY)
Thanks for the camera work FTL_Ian

Outstanding!

I think any message containing "taxes" and "torture" is highly appropriate, strategically as well as morally.

I only think the taxes=torture argument gets taken too far when it's dubiously implied that others (e.g. Ed Brown) are motivated by their disdain for torture.

This is a way to expose the very worst evils of government -- more power to you.

 :) Thanks Lauren!

A duo of dangerous dolls dissenting the dogma of dictators. Great video!! :clap:

http://www.keenefreepress.com/mambo/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=579&Itemid=36

Quote from: KBCraig on July 22, 2007, 11:06 PM NHFT
    Conformity with Signs and Directions (41 CFR 102-74.385). Persons in
and on property must at all times comply with official signs of a
prohibitory, regulatory or directory nature and with the lawful
direction of Federal police officers and other authorized individuals.[/b]

Plead INNOCENT.  Don't show ID, don't give a name, don't assume that YOU are the accused.
What does CFR define "persons" as?
What does "comply" mean?
What does "official" mean?
What is a "sign?"
What do "prohibitory, regulatory and directory" mean?
Why do they phrase it, "signs of a prohibitory, regulatory or directory nature" instead of "prohibitory, regulatory or directory signs?"
What is "lawful?"
What is "direction?"
Who are "authorized individuals"? Who authorized them?  By what law or statute?

Did the govt agents who arrested Dave, Kat, and Lauren swear oaths?  Do they know what that oath was?  Can you get them to recite it in court?  If they won't - RECITE IT FOR THEM to get it into official court records.  Did they post any sort of bond?  Who is that bond being held in trust with?

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on July 22, 2007, 11:03 PM NHFT
Well done TTW...
Your best work so far. Kind of cinematic. :)

I agree.  TTW is a very good editor, and shooting in anamorphic widescreen helps give it that cinematic feel.   :icon_pirat:

Posted to Free Keene:   http://freekeene.com/2007/07/23/feds-arrest-activists-at-keene-irs-building/

Was I correct in understanding that a copy of the Constitution is displayed on the wall inside the building?  Get some clear stickers with "REVOKED"  "CENSORED"  "REPEALED"  "OVERRULED" "NOT APPLICABLE" "NOT FOR PUBLIC USE" "VOID WHERE PROHIBITED BY TYRANTS" or with just a bunch of red lines, and stick them over relevant parts of the Constitution and Bill of Rights.   "I guess this living document is finally dead"   


I love how they like to cuff people and then drag them all over the place.

I think it would be fun to be sewn into a leather jacket with small spikes all over it so they couldn't grab me tightly or pull very hard.  Learn all the ninja pressure-point locations and put a spike right over it with a washer or wide leather backing on it, so they can't go crushing nerves for fun.

Even more hilarious would be to have somebody pull a Starchild, and show up in some outrageous outfit - already handcuffed in something plush and furry.   :o  I'd like to get a few choice photos of that and send them to the ICE guys wives and coworkers. 

Dress up in something equally outrageous that they'll have an amazingly difficult time restraining you in.  A fat suit.  The tin man.  Plate mail.  The Thing from the Fantastic Four.  Schmoo.  An Amoeba.  The boy in the plastic bubble.  Protest inside a giant hamster ball.  Let's hire a contortionist and have him protest from inside a really heavy steel or lead box.  Let's see how they handle arresting a quadruple amputee distributing mouthbills.

Some of these guys seem genuinely unhappy with dealing with the protesters.  Show up with T-shirts printed up with something like, "I USED TO HAVE A JOB LIKE YOURS, AND IT SUCKED.  I QUIT AND AM A LOT HAPPIER NOW."  Give them a business card with a job placement agency.

Distribute ... wait for it ... FOOTbills.  :icon_pirat:

Dress up like a duck or a platypus and distribute ... billbills.
Hell, I'll do it and it will be a Billbillbill.   ::)  :P

The Amoeba could distribute pseudopodbills.  I just want to hear them all try to say that in court.  Hand then out with several pseudopods at once and they'll be pseudopodiabills.  Correct them at every opportunity.

Have handbills delivered to each individual IRS employee at their job - by US MAIL. 

Strap a big inflatable raft to your back underneath a breakaway shirt, and connect the activation cord to a big stack of handbills you're distributing.  When they confiscate them - WHOOOOOOOOOOSH!  You instantly generate a "FREE RUSSELL KANNING" protest float and simultaneously make them crap their pants.

Wear a zillion helium balloons and ankle weights.  When they try to arrest you, slip off the ankle weights and fly away.

Protest on stilts.  Distribute handbills with one of those reacher/grabber devices.
http://www.productsforseniors.com/proddetail.asp?prod=HEA168 (http://www.productsforseniors.com/proddetail.asp?prod=HEA168)

Protest as Jesus, already "nailed" up on the cross.  We need a whole damn video crew, photographers, and reporters who simply WILL NOT STOP asking questions for that one.  Make the cross out of one of those rolling basketball-net stands, and then rip the wheels off it once it's in position.  Use some kind of titanium device or make an epoxy resin cast with chains inside to prevent them from cutting Hey-Seus off the cross easily.  Keep asking why they're not prepared with a roof rack.

Protest in hip boots with cement blocks cast onto the feet.  Drop off the protester with a hand-truck.  Wear a T-shirt proclaiming, "The Mafia wants their FEDERAL PROTECTION SERVICE money"

Dress up like a porcupine - COVERED IN REAL QUILLS.  Carry a Live Free or Die sign, or an FSP Gadsden flag. 

Build an armadillo suit and roll up into a ball when they try to arrest you.

Find someone harmless but truly insane.  Give them a handfull of handbills and let them loose in the IRS building.  See what they do with someone who has NO IDEA what is going on or what they're doing and just responds to everything with a big drooling smile.  Make sure he's got a complimentary FREE (your favorite activist) T-shirt. 

Project a handbill through the window and onto the wall inside the building with a slide projector or overhead projector.  Or with one of those really cool concert lasers.

Thanks for all of these wonderful ideas Bill

Quote from: error on July 22, 2007, 11:05 PM NHFT
They're only up to 758 citations issued? For how many years? This obviously isn't making them that much money.

and the last few guys haven't paid anything 8)

I think it's important to mention the fact that this event/protest was organized less than 24 hours from when it actually occurred, and 10 activists showed up with that short of notice!  (2 with video cams)

:clap: :clap:  Keep the great ideas coming!

I like this one best:

Quote from: Bald Eagle on July 23, 2007, 10:34 AM NHFT

Protest in hip boots with cement blocks cast onto the feet.  Drop off the protester with a hand-truck.  Wear a T-shirt proclaiming, "The Mafia wants their FEDERAL PROTECTION SERVICE money"

I might even be game for that one.  :)

Quote from: FTL_Ian on July 23, 2007, 10:51 AM NHFT
I think it's important to mention the fact that this event/protest was organized less than 24 hours from when it actually occurred, and 10 activists showed up with that short of notice!  (2 with video cams)

I added that to the article.

Bald Eagle is so quick with these strategies.  It would take us a week to come up with so many good tactics. 

Here's my favorite:

Quote from: Bald Eagle on July 23, 2007, 10:34 AM NHFT
Strap a big inflatable raft to your back underneath a breakaway shirt, and connect the activation cord to a big stack of handbills you're distributing.  When they confiscate them - WHOOOOOOOOOOSH!  You instantly generate a "FREE RUSSELL KANNING" protest float and simultaneously make them crap their pants.

It's going to be difficult to stay silent while that's happening. :biglaugh:

 :toothy12: Even better!

Are you volunteering?  Girls always get more attention than guys in bathing suits.

You could watch the video afterwards.

I think the handcuffs make up for the grease .... they would just use that for a handle. :(

Quote from: Russell Kanning on July 23, 2007, 11:56 AM NHFT
I think the handcuffs make up for the grease .... they would just use that for a handle. :(

You seem to forget the cement block shoes.  See, as gov't employees, they are liable for unnecessary injuries they inflict... and if the protester passively resists (like Lauren), they would have to pick up and carry the person.  Especially if the cement blocks were massive enough to cause serious injury to the protester if dragged.

Ouch  :o

Sort of like the projector idea, but what if two people had lights with a stencil in front to project words on the bldg:

"Ministry"
"of love"

We could turn them off when we draw attention from the wrong people... or not, depending on what we want to do.

Quote from: RattyDog on July 23, 2007, 02:07 PM NHFT
Somebody said something about t-shirts that struck a cord with me. If my sign is my shirt and not a sign, can they really say I'm demonstrating? That sort of thing.

They can if you aren't conducting IRS business within the office. So you would have to have legitimate IRS business to conduct. This would preclude Russell, Kat, and Lauren.

Quote from: RattyDog on July 23, 2007, 02:07 PM NHFT
I like the ideas to do with projecting or writing in chalk....anything that displays a message, without actually vandilizing, on a building, sidewalk, etc. Somebody said something about t-shirts that struck a cord with me. If my sign is my shirt and not a sign, can they really say I'm demonstrating? That sort of thing.

It would be neat to go to some sort of government building, at night, with a WHOLE BUNCH of people all holding BIG flashlights that have paper/cardboard over them with some sort of symbol ("V", or something simple like that) or writing (Ministry of love, or something) cut out so that when everyone turned their lights on, this message/symbol was displayed on the building. That would make for an awesome demonstration and GREAT pictures for the paper(s) and for flyers...oh, but what building?

I love hearing everyones ideas....god, we need more people.

;D

I like your thinking... it would be cool to project images on the wall of the imperial fortress. Maybe with a musical accompaniment. That would be a good.

http://nh.craigslist.org/pho/373669835.html projector

Quote from: srqrebel on July 23, 2007, 12:01 PM NHFT
See, as gov't employees, they are liable for unnecessary injuries they inflict...

they are? I haven't noticed it.

Quote from: Kat Kanning on July 23, 2007, 04:59 PM NHFT
http://nh.craigslist.org/pho/373669835.html projector

Thanks Kat.
Just e-mailed to see if it is still available.  8)

For future efforts a laptop and video projector would be awesome, but beyond my current budget.

you are going to have to put in a grant application from Soros for that one
remember ... we have big funding available :)

Quote from: RattyDog on July 23, 2007, 06:01 PM NHFT

Quote from: EthanAllen on July 23, 2007, 02:11 PM NHFT

Quote from: RattyDog on July 23, 2007, 02:07 PM NHFT
Somebody said something about t-shirts that struck a cord with me. If my sign is my shirt and not a sign, can they really say I'm demonstrating? That sort of thing.

They can if you aren't conducting IRS business within the office. So you would have to have legitimate IRS business to conduct. This would preclude Russell, Kat, and Lauren.

I have business to conduct....I want someone to sit down with me and explain to me exactly where the dollars they steal from me bi-weekly are going. I want graphs and pie charts. That ought to have someone staring at my protest t-shirt for a looong while.

BTW, I know what you're thinking: THey wouldn't be looking at your t-shirt for long because they'd jsut call the police and you'd be out of there"....but you see, Ethan, that is the faaareakin' point! They're stealing our money, we question it and we get arrested. <---- Seems like Kat, Russ and Lauren are the smart ones here. They get to keep their money!  ;)

It is not the duty of an IRS employee at a branch office in Keene to tell you with pie charts and graphs where the money they collect is going. That is the specific duty of your elected representative, who spends the money that the IRS collects.

I am not sure though what they would do with someone wearing a t-shirt demanding that employees of the IRS quit their jobs if you are there to transact legitimate business. That is why I posed the scenario.

Total Hypocrisy Of New Bush Executive Order
The only Americans destabilizing the peace in Iraq are the ones who invaded it
Infowars.net | July 23, 2007
Steve Watson

President Bush's newest executive order states that any American citizen who threatens the peace and stability of Iraq and undermines efforts to promote reconstruction and reform there may have all their property and interests seized by the Treasury department without warning. The hypocrisy on display here is astounding given that the only persons in America who are doing these things are the ones who invaded Iraq in the first place and continue to sow chaos and destruction in the face of all time high public opposition.

The Executive Order titled ' Blocking Property of Certain Persons Who Threaten Stabilization Efforts in Iraq ' was signed last week on the 17th of July and acts as an amendment to the National Emergencies Act.

While many have decried it as the latest in a string of legislation that constitutes a crack down on protest and free speech, few have pointed out the ultimate irony that under this order high ranking members of the Bush administration are the only ones that should be punishable.

The order focuses on
...acts of violence threatening the peace and stability of Iraq and undermining efforts to promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq

stating that since such acts pose an "unusual and extraordinary threat to the national security" of the United States, "all property and interests in property of the following persons, that are in the United States" should be "blocked and may not be transferred, paid, exported, withdrawn, or otherwise dealt in".

The order states that those who are subject to it include:
...any person determined by the Secretary of the Treasury, in consultation with the Secretary of State and the Secretary of Defense, (i) to have committed, or to pose a significant risk of committing, an act or acts of violence that have the purpose or effect of: (A) threatening the peace or stability of Iraq or the Government of Iraq; or (B) undermining efforts to promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq or to provide humanitarian assistance to the Iraqi people; (ii) to have materially assisted, sponsored, or provided financial, material, logistical, or technical support for, or goods or services in support of, such an act or acts of violence or any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order; or (iii) to be owned or controlled by, or to have acted or purported to act for or on behalf of, directly or indirectly, any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order.

Which "persons" in America were the ones who, according to the National Intelligence director , manipulated and altered the intelligence on Saddam Hussein's weapons capabilities because they "didn't like the answers" they were provided, thus providing a pretext to undermine the stability of the government of Iraq in the first place?

Which "persons" in America are responsible for initiating a war which has seen somewhere in the region of 655, 000 innocent Iraqis lose their lives?

Which "persons" in the U.S. are responsible for the orchestration of Death squads in Iraq?

Which "persons" in America, according to high ranking army officials and investigators are responsible for operating coordinated torture programs throughout Iraq?

Who are the "persons" in the U.S. calling for the balkanization of Iraq and its dissolution into three territories, and which "persons" have formulated plans such as the Salvador Option and P2OG , the objective of which is to provoke violence and separation amongst Iraqi tribal groups?

Which "persons" in the US are responsible for constructing highly unpopular separating walls around Baghdad neighborhoods despite the continued protests of the Iraqi government?

Which "persons" in America are arming, training and funding Sunni insurgents , the very same people they are supposedly in pitched battle with?

Which "persons" in the U.S.are now reportedly planning to topple the democratically elected government of Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki because they are opposed to his strong criticism of widespread and unwarranted interference by Washington in Iraqi domestic affairs?

Which "persons" are responsible for sending a further fifty thousand troops into the country saying they wish to quell the violence but instead end up increasing it to all time highs ?

So given all these facts, whose actions towards Iraq are responsible for endangering the national security of the U.S.and whose properties and interests should be at risk?

One thing is for sure, it's not peaceful anti-war protestors.

Quote from: RattyDog on July 23, 2007, 06:01 PM NHFT
....but you see, Ethan, that is the faaareakin' point!

Ethan's point is to make people angry.  That's why some of us have him on 'ignore'.  :glasses1:

Quote from: EthanAllen on July 23, 2007, 02:11 PM NHFT

Quote from: RattyDog on July 23, 2007, 02:07 PM NHFT
Somebody said something about t-shirts that struck a cord with me. If my sign is my shirt and not a sign, can they really say I'm demonstrating? That sort of thing.

They can if you aren't conducting IRS business within the office. So you would have to have legitimate IRS business to conduct. This would preclude Russell, Kat, and Lauren.

Walk in and ask for form 1040 for the prior year or two. That's less likely to be on the rack.
Then, ask for the instruction book. Start flipping through and ask for the next worksheet & instruction booklet listed for each schedule as you come across it. Considering the number of forms needed, this could take a while, and you be conducting business.

Plus, you'll have paper handy to start the fire for next year's U.N. flag burn.

That is first rate videography ian
and first rate editing lauren

professional grade and maybe a little better in some ways.

hope this airs on mark's show and or the free minds shows

Quote from: mappchik on July 23, 2007, 09:16 PM NHFT

Quote from: EthanAllen on July 23, 2007, 02:11 PM NHFT

Quote from: RattyDog on July 23, 2007, 02:07 PM NHFT
Somebody said something about t-shirts that struck a cord with me. If my sign is my shirt and not a sign, can they really say I'm demonstrating? That sort of thing.

They can if you aren't conducting IRS business within the office. So you would have to have legitimate IRS business to conduct. This would preclude Russell, Kat, and Lauren.

Walk in and ask for form 1040 for the prior year or two. That's less likely to be on the rack.
Then, ask for the instruction book. Start flipping through and ask for the next worksheet & instruction booklet listed for each schedule as you come across it. Considering the number of forms needed, this could take a while, and you be conducting business.

There you go. You got it.

would someone be willing to put a story on digg about these events with a link to the video?  dada no can post there

plz inform us if u do this so we can digg it

Someone put up my story:

http://digg.com/politics/The_government_is_bad_but_what_can_we_do

Well done.  8)
Dugg

Quote from: DadaOrwell on July 23, 2007, 10:18 PM NHFT

That is first rate videography ian
and first rate editing lauren

professional grade and maybe a little better in some ways.

:blush:    I consider that a high compliment, thanks!

Quotehope this airs on mark's show and or the free minds shows

Look for it on Free Minds TV this week.

sent this to pro liberty media, u are welcome to copy it and do the same

----

NH : Homeland Security arrests more leafletters

Video at
http://www.youtube.com/v/zpAK3DbTsNY 

Details at
http://newhampshireunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=9753.0

Yours,

Dave Ridley
NHfree.com

Quote from: mappchik on July 23, 2007, 09:16 PM NHFT
Walk in and ask for form 1040 for the prior year or two. That's less likely to be on the rack.
Then, ask for the instruction book. Start flipping through and ask for the next worksheet & instruction booklet listed for each schedule as you come across it. Considering the number of forms needed, this could take a while, and you be conducting business.

Get some Scot with a really THICK accent to go in there and start a-stirrin'n up a lively and somewhat loud conversation about ... whatever.  Make sure that he does a good job and all that the bureaucrats can understand are words like IS, THE, AND, etc.

He should be real jolly and friendly and absolutely delighted every time someone comes over to be 'helpful'. 

Bring in the Indian lady from either the AT&T or Microsoft help desk the next day.

The mumbling guy from the ghetto who laughs after every 3rd word visits the day after that.

Then he guy from China who smiles and nods at everything that they say, but won't go away because he can't understand a word that they're saying.

Then the guy from Nigeria who starts repeating everything that they say and constantly nods and says, "yes!" regardless of whether he knows what's going on or not.

Then the voodoo priestess who freaks out about everything the IRS does because of the evil spirits and how everything will come back on them 10 times, and she whips one of those big fuzzy things around and crosses herself and does crap with magic powders and whatnot.

Then the old deaf guy who doesn't put up with crap from anybody and screams at you so that you can hear him, asks "WHAT!?" 30 times, gets annoyed that you're yelling at him and being disrespectful of your elders and your parents should have taught you some manners with a fresh green switch, and constantly gets confused and forgets and has to have all this complicated IRS BS re-explained.

Then the hippie waif flake who channels energy from crystals and goes on and on about all the negative vibes and the IRS agent's inner anger, their childhood issues, their diet that makes them sick and so they should try being vegan, how the IRS office building really weighs on people's karma and is causing an imbalance in the universe.... then she starts singing some song about peace or love or something and is just so nice and peaceful - and lost.

Then the fundamentalist Christian/Mormon/Jehova's Witness/Jew for Jesus/Hari Krishna who is deeply concerned for the agents' souls.

Then the tax attorney - bet he's got a LOT of questions to be answered and clarified and has a big list of words he needs official definitions for.

Then the lady with 4 kids, one of who wets his pants - and the office floor.  One kid loses his pet frog/mouse/snake/roach/etc. 

Mr "I'm really important because I get a million cell phone calls a day." comes in and they can't get his attention for more than 30 seconds at a time.

Then the super meek, polite, and utterly petrified 75 pound, 90-year old lady who is so timid and soft-spoken that it takes forever to find out what she needs, for her to get out what she wants - and then she couches everything and uses a ton of euphemisms so they have to drag out of her what she really wants, and she gets very scared and terrified and cries in the process...

Thank you Lauren and Kat for once again showing inspirational courage in taking a stand against the police state :V_mask_50:

Great job on the video, Ian and Lauren

I'm glad and not surprised in the least that the number of folks participating has grown since last July 8)

sent msg to al kulas suggesting he have lauren or kat on his sho

QuoteNH : Homeland Security arrests more leafletters

Video at
http://www.youtube.com/v/zpAK3DbTsNY 

Dang, that was a cool video!

Ya know? I am always deeply moved when a tiny group of courageous people challenge a large group of monsters. As a kid I always relished the Davy vs. Goliath story, dragon slayer stories and I always rooted for the underdog teams. Little did I know the challenges that I would see today I the ones I will face tomorrow. I believe my past experiences have prepared me for what is to come.

peace and courage for all,
Kola

btw Bald Eagle, You need to work for SNL. They would have a ball bringing your creative ideas into comedy skits!

How about some sick guy coughing and hacking all over the place and wiping boogers on the countertop?

maybe have some women come in with skant bikinis on and some guys dressed in speedos?

How about have a guy come in who smells like cow shit? Have him track it in on his shoes and smear it on his pants and shirt..a lil' bit on his hand so he can smear it on the countertops too.

and another guy who was sprayed by a skunk?

a guy with nasty BO?

or another person doused in 4 bottles of Ol lady perfume.

Kola

Hoping to capitalize off of the success of Dave's recent video, I have submitted the video of Lauren and Kat's arrest to digg with a headline that will hopefully attract some attention:

http://digg.com/politics/VIDEO_Fed_Cop_Ejects_Press_from_Post_Office_w_Constitution_Posted_on_Wall

Please digg!

I'm trying, but digg isn't working quite right for me right now.

dugged.  is this on youtube?

one thing we're learning from this is that no matter how well edited and well shot the video is, you need video of the arrest happening, etc..... the money shot of the person being cuffed and dragged.
maybe next time it would be better to get arrested outside

In this case I would have waited for them to find me on the sidewalk, but Kat was in a hurry to complete her mission and she did get in before the huffing and puffing FPS/ICE/DHS guys. :)

Quote from: DadaOrwell on August 10, 2007, 12:33 AM NHFTthe money shot of the person being cuffed and dragged.

the hard part is the cops might start ordering camera men to stop or taking cameras before they arrest someone. They didn't want any of us near them.

The issue of "shotgun microphones" came up last night on FTL, and I'm sure I could rig up something good for any video camera that has a threaded base for mounting to a tripod.

If the video camera were based on top of a van, wired to send data to be recorded at a remote location, in the hands of someone who could switcheroo the recording media with something blank or hand it off to a runner, or handcuffed to the videographer, that would make things a little more difficult for them.

Maybe we could mount the video camera inside a plexiglass box, and cover the outside with pepper spray?

Or set up the box with an "alarm" connected to a smoke grenade.  Sure, go ahead, take it for evidence.   :icon_pirat:

Or secure the camera to a block of concrete or a box filled with lead (nope, sorry - don't have any of those laying around  ::) ) by a cable.  Cut the cable, and set off ... something.  Smoke?  A REALLY loud alarm on an SCR circuit?  A recording about the First Amendment?  A Tesla coil?

Maybe just mount it to an open-bottom box filled with squirrels or wolverines.

bump

let's not forget the disobedient ladies

I wonder if the feds have.

It's been a month since the arrest.

Kat has a trial date now, sept 17 i think