I've been 'lurking' on the FSP for years.
I'm more than a little surprised to see so little effort to free 'ourselves' from the false burdens of Transportation and Housing, not just Government.
Is anyone interested in CHEAP Alternative Housing? I've been studying Off The Grid Energy and Alternative Housing for 15+ years. Lots of hippy pipe-dreams, but a lots of real science, too.
There is simply no reason to be paying monthly (or at all) for a place to live that meets or exceeds most modern standards.
Are there any Porcs in the same vein as myself? Know anything about the Building Code Bureaucracy? Have you guys reigned it in?
So far, there's a few bubbles of what you're talking about.
My wife and I are living in a motorhome that will be partially solar powered, already has a generator and batteries and is "off the grid". I know one Porc who is solar-powered most of the time and sells energy "back" to the Grid since he doesn't have a battery bank yet.
There's the Bardo Project (http://bardoproject.com) that are looking at off-the-grid energy and sustainable farming as part of their path to freedom.
I'm involved in a project in the early planning stages that will focus on cheap, easy to deploy, full and partially self-contained housing using commodity (i.e. easy to procure, repurpose, swap) materials.
Keep in mind that there are about 750 FSP movers. Factor in capital sometimes needed to do some of these things and you'll realize why it's not yet a visible part of people's path to freedom, but there are many seeds already being planted and cultivated along that path. You're certainly welcome and encouraged to jump in and help if you like something, or start your own thing and invite others. I think it's one valuable subject.
Earthbag homes would be a great way to accelerate just about everything in the FSP's interest. Getting people to NH on the cheap. Rent at a 2nd or 3rd world rate, but still live in the 1st.
Literally, dirt cheap; because that's what it is made of! Can be earth-bermed like an earthship (as well as being passive-solar), but much less labor intensive. A community like this could build a small city in a month, working part-time minimum-wage jobs.
I'm coming up for a visit, just not sure I can take the cold... I've never touched snow, or even seen it in person. And it STILL gets way too cold for my taste here.
With no mortgage or rent to pay, how much more effective, politically and socially, could a person become? An entire community?
Quote from: PorcAtHeart on August 28, 2009, 03:23 PM NHFT
Are there any Porcs in the same vein as myself? Know anything about the Building Code Bureaucracy? Have you guys reigned it in?
New Hampshire has a state building code. Fortunately one and two-family homes are exempt.
Unfortunately most towns (except Grafton) have building and zoning codes which are stricter than the state code.
There is a state plumbing code, which says that if you have running water in the house you must have a state approved septic system.
There is also a state fire code which you must comply with if you have electric wiring.
There are a few porcs here who are totally off the grid. (ok, ok some of them have propane refrigerators... sheesh, damn purists)
Here's a picture of the Earl of Thurman Road constructing his solar water heater.
What about unincorporated areas? I'm a country boy. Even small towns make me feel dirty.
Quote from: PorcAtHeart on August 29, 2009, 01:49 AM NHFT
What about unincorporated areas? I'm a country boy. Even small towns make me feel dirty.
This is not the West. There are no available unincorporated areas.
But "town" may not mean what you think. Where I came from (PA) these towns would be called townships. There are built-up areas within the towns sometimes called "villages" but most of the "towns" are very rural, so country boys fit right in.
We have many people interested in such possibilities. But as Jerry pointed out, there is a well entrenched busybody network covering just about every inch of available land. As all humans do under pressure, we wiggle around, try this and that and ultimately find a comfortable position that lets us live relatively free from harassment. So there is a mishmash of different living approaches around the state. It is great to see all the different ways people are living.
Lots of doing, not as much online chatter.
Quote from: jerry on August 29, 2009, 08:29 AM NHFT
Quote from: PorcAtHeart on August 29, 2009, 01:49 AM NHFT
What about unincorporated areas? I'm a country boy. Even small towns make me feel dirty.
This is not the West. There are no available unincorporated areas.
But "town" may not mean what you think. Where I came from (PA) these towns would be called townships. There are built-up areas within the towns sometimes called "villages" but most of the "towns" are very rural, so country boys fit right in.
I like to describe NH "towns" as being like small counties. Most of the "town" isn't "in town" at all, and lays outside what most people would think of as the city limits.
I'm still going to come up and see for myself, but it sounds like NH is behind the curve compared to AZ in the ways that matter most to me.
The FSP is not about moving people to NH to go hide in the woods. Hiding in the woods is not pro-liberty activism. It's about moving to NH to dismantle the system and change the world.
Well, that's a bit presumptive and insulting. Great way to tell a person that they aren't welcome. But to each their own. I'm just an asocial person. Maybe that is because I've been surrounded by entitled mobs of anti-constitutional people that I can't stand for my entire life. Hence why I said I'm still coming up to have a look around. Maybe 'my kind of people' does exist, and I'm not the only one.
But from the sound of it, NH may be WAY out of my price range. If I can't snag an unimproved acre for 5K+/-, then it is most definitely off the list.
Coconut is a brash young man from Keene where they are mostly into civil disobedience.
We are hoping he becomes less abrasive as he matures.
If it annoys you, just put him on ignore.
A single acre for 5K will be difficult to find. I've seen many properties for much less per acre, but they are usually 10+ acre lots. Remember, the further north you go the lower the prices.
I kinda like the brash and abrasive, but the presumptive is where the lack of maturity shows. I was young once as well. Grain of salt and all that. Even if I did 'go hide in the woods,' NH is a tiny state, 20 minute drive to 'be useful.' I drive 80 miles just for kicks. And in a diesel 4cyl that runs on veg oil, gas prices be damned! I can drive many thousands of miles before seeing a gas pump. I'd like to move that science and philosophy into my housing.
Guess I'll have to get in touch with some Building Inspectors.
Quote from: PorcAtHeart on August 29, 2009, 07:54 PM NHFT
I'm just an asocial person.
Me too. Clearly. I apologize for the way I come across.
Quote from: jerry on August 29, 2009, 10:08 PM NHFT
We are hoping he becomes less abrasive as he matures.
Whose we? You and my therapists?
Just wondering since you sound like you know a bit about me, but I don't remember who you are if we've met. For all I know we've had lots of conversations and I just don't know your forum name.
Quote from: PorcAtHeart on August 29, 2009, 10:19 PM NHFT
Guess I'll have to get in touch with some Building Inspectors.
Sorry, I'm from Grafton; what's a Building Inspector? ;D
Quote from: jerry on August 29, 2009, 11:01 PM NHFT
Quote from: PorcAtHeart on August 29, 2009, 10:19 PM NHFT
Guess I'll have to get in touch with some Building Inspectors.
Sorry, I'm from Grafton; what's a Building Inspector? ;D
I think I like Grafton. But the State has certain requirements, it would seem. The building methods I would employ are superior in many ways to 'onventional' building, but most bureaucrats are unfamiliar with it and prejudiced... I appreciate the tip on where I should center my inquiries.
I think the most important line in the state building code
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/xii/155-a/155-a-mrg.htm
is:VII. For any municipality which has not adopted an enforcement mechanism under RSA 674:51, the contractor of the building, building component, or structure shall notify the state fire marshal concerning the type of construction before construction begins excluding one- and 2-family dwellings.
So if you pick a town that as not adopted the code you have fewer problems to deal with. As far as I know, Grafton is the only town south of the White mountains that qualifies.
Come to Grafton, build what you like, we won't tell. ;)
I know several dozen folks working on alternative housing. I know even more that are into alternative transportation.
I've been browsing real estate sites, and I wonder if any quantity of land is available for less than $20,000 in a non-brutally-regulated building area. That is 4x my budget. Land that costs more than that is too densely populated to appeal to me, nor have I an desire to buy up a large portion of the state.... Just little chunk. Am I asking too much?
Grafton being a place to look, but holy craptasticness batman, the prices are outrageous!
Quote from: PorcAtHeart on August 31, 2009, 09:19 PM NHFT
I've been browsing real estate sites, and I wonder if any quantity of land is available for less than $20,000 in a non-brutally-regulated building area. That is 4x my budget. Land that costs more than that is too densely populated to appeal to me, nor have I an desire to buy up a large portion of the state.... Just little chunk. Am I asking too much?
Grafton being a place to look, but holy craptasticness batman, the prices are outrageous!
You are asking a lot.
One dirty little secret of Grafton is that, while we don't have zoning or building ordinances, we do have a planning board. Their power is restricted to approving subdivision of properties. They have a minimum lot size of 2 acres.
There are smaller lots here, but they are usually grandfathered in, like small waterfront lots (you don't even want to ASK what their price$ are).
We are trying to eliminate the board, but we need more porcs to move here to vote them out of existence.
But this is New England, not Arizona. We don't have any land developers buying a chunk of desert and dividing it up into quarter-acre building lots. We've got hills and streams and trees, so it's basically worth more to start with.
Quote from: jerry on August 31, 2009, 10:54 PM NHFT
Quote from: PorcAtHeart on August 31, 2009, 09:19 PM NHFT
I've been browsing real estate sites, and I wonder if any quantity of land is available for less than $20,000 in a non-brutally-regulated building area. That is 4x my budget. Land that costs more than that is too densely populated to appeal to me, nor have I an desire to buy up a large portion of the state.... Just little chunk. Am I asking too much?
Grafton being a place to look, but holy craptasticness batman, the prices are outrageous!
You are asking a lot.
One dirty little secret of Grafton is that, while we don't have zoning or building ordinances, we do have a planning board. Their power is restricted to approving subdivision of properties. They have a minimum lot size of 2 acres.
There are smaller lots here, but they are usually grandfathered in, like small waterfront lots (you don't even want to ASK what their price$ are).
We are trying to eliminate the board, but we need more porcs to move here to vote them out of existence.
But this is New England, not Arizona. We don't have any land developers buying a chunk of desert and dividing it up into quarter-acre building lots. We've got hills and streams and trees, so it's basically worth more to start with.
I'm sure it is worth it, but simply unattainable. I guess I'm just being priced-out by the elites. No Freedom for me, I can't afford it.
Don't give up so easily.
Consider moving here and staying at one of the Porc Manors while you save some bucks and search out that ideal property.
Quote from: jerry on August 31, 2009, 11:59 PM NHFT
Don't give up so easily.
Consider moving here and staying at one of the Porc Manors while you save some bucks and search out that ideal property.
If I could find rationally priced land, I have money saved already.
Even a quarter acre is just crazy excessive.
I am not kidding around or being rhetorical when I quote the man whom I impersonated for Halloween when I was 10: "I know not what course others may take, but as for me..." I would rather die than go back to being a slave again. I will not do it. Period. And it that means I must die, so be it. There are worse things than death. 'Conventional Society' is at the top of that list.