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New Hampshire Underground => General Discussion => Topic started by: dalebert on January 14, 2014, 01:26 PM NHFT

Title: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 14, 2014, 01:26 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/RbDkOAw.png)

Downlaod the January 13th episode free. (http://flamingfreedom.com/2014/01/14/episode-2014-january-13th/)

Or watch it on Ustream (http://www.ustream.tv/channel/flaming-freedom-lgbt-radio) (in the next 30 days--also free!).
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on January 14, 2014, 02:52 PM NHFT
Wait a minute.  There are conspiracy kooks? Who knew?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on January 14, 2014, 03:15 PM NHFT
There's a liberty movement?  Who knew?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 14, 2014, 08:16 PM NHFT
Wait a minute.  There are conspiracy kooks? Who knew?

And my co-host is one of them! :) Next week's show (http://flamingfreedom.com/2014/01/14/coming-up-on-the-january-20th-episode/) will be completely devoted to letting Neal try to convince me of his various conspiracy beliefs.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on January 14, 2014, 10:35 PM NHFT
Almost every crazy conspiracy theory has slowly looked plausible to me over time. And if the government is denying it .... then it has to be true.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: firecracker joe on January 14, 2014, 11:21 PM NHFT
 ;) that's exactly how I feel Russell, I trust no govt. paid, lying , thug and never will , even if their retired or fired for that fact still means they tried to be a pos but were rejected their probably the biggest pos
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 15, 2014, 12:11 AM NHFT
That's a false dichotomy. For instance, the gov't can be lying about 9/11 and what actually happened, about what they knew and when, lying about who did what, and so on. That doesn't mean any particular alternate theory about what did happen is true. Saying I don't believe in a very specific and very detailed account of what happened according to certain Truthers does not mean I automatically believe what the gov't said. Both accounts can be inaccurate to some degree or another, either because of lying or because of someone simply not knowing.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 15, 2014, 12:34 AM NHFT
"You dig in the litter too deep and your paws get all poopy."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUYfOVxdCYI&list=UUMSf9LmLDSAlF3mtrDk246Q
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 15, 2014, 12:53 AM NHFT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUYfOVxdCYI&list=UUMSf9LmLDSAlF3mtrDk246Q

I bet teh gov't denies that story. Therefore it must be true.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on January 15, 2014, 08:25 AM NHFT
Just so long as you don't try and refute the shape shifting reptilians! Alex Jones has the inside scoop on it all!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on January 15, 2014, 09:11 AM NHFT
Just so long as you don't try and refute the shape shifting reptilians! Alex Jones has the inside scoop on it all!


I've seen a Chameleon and it's real dammit!!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on January 15, 2014, 09:47 AM NHFT
That's a false dichotomy. For instance, the gov't can be lying about 9/11 and what actually happened, about what they knew and when, lying about who did what, and so on. That doesn't mean any particular alternate theory about what did happen is true. Saying I don't believe in a very specific and very detailed account of what happened according to certain Truthers does not mean I automatically believe what the gov't said. Both accounts can be inaccurate to some degree or another, either because of lying or because of someone simply not knowing.

Exactly.  One could easily argue that some government agents convinced and trained terrorists to fly planes into buildings (they've done the same sort of thing, before, in cases where it's provable, so there's not much stretching of the imagination required), without believing that the buildings were actually mined with explosives.  Neither would absolve the government of responsibility, but one is actually in accord with the laws of physics, and the other is not.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 15, 2014, 07:30 PM NHFT
Just so long as you don't try and refute the shape shifting reptilians! Alex Jones has the inside scoop on it all!


I've seen a Chameleon and it's real dammit!!

Check and Kingmate.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJnQ1wwtG3I
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on January 16, 2014, 09:36 PM NHFT
man Dale .... you protest the craziest theories the most ... why not just ignore them?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 17, 2014, 12:09 AM NHFT
why not just ignore them?

That has historically been my POA. It's harder lately now that my co-host is a rampaging Alex Jones fan. It just keeps coming up. I don't even care about "winning" any arguments as much as just getting him to shut up about them.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: JustUs on January 17, 2014, 02:46 AM NHFT
Hey, look, there are a lot of idiots in the libertarian movement that are too scared to  look at the truth when it's right in front of their face, eh? That just proves the propaganda machine is powerful enough to make you scared to question the (lie) official story the state apparatus puts out. It's called history, man. Grow up, open your eyes and help investigate and discover what really happened, instead of peeing your pants in fear whenever anyone questions an official story - Then you go and call them a conspiracy kook because they're brave enough to look beyond the propaganda. Man up, bro'.

On the question in the subject line - No, the sissies are hurting the liberty movement!

why not just ignore them?

That has historically been my POA. It's harder lately now that my co-host is a rampaging Alex Jones fan. It just keeps coming up. I don't even care about "winning" any arguments as much as just getting him to shut up about them.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 17, 2014, 10:23 AM NHFT
On the question in the subject line - No, the sissies are hurting the liberty movement!

Do you have that on a script to copy and paste? Because you clearly didn't bother to read the thread before you mouthed off and called people sissies. Go back and read about the "false dichotomy" that you once again are repeating as if it's a valid point.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: JustUs on January 18, 2014, 12:37 AM NHFT
Dale, no one says you're a sissy. We all know you're not. Methinks you took to the defensive too quickly without reading and understanding.

You said: "That's a false dichotomy. For instance, the gov't can be lying about 9/11 and what actually happened, about what they knew and when, lying about who did what, and so on. That doesn't mean any particular alternate theory about what did happen is true."

Yep, we all know that, it's basic. A sissy is someone who is afraid to look at the truth that's out there (has come out in hearings and in other eyewitness testimony) and who is afraid to question the whole fabrication of the 9/11 official story of events, as well as other important historical events, and in their desperate fear, calls others who are brave enough to question the official story the "weaponized" toxic smear term "conspiracy theorist or kook". Those are the sissies and they are hurting the movement for freedom. The organized statists use false flag events and other fabrications and diversions to create every war (see the work and analysis of those boys from Toronto - name and link to follow - for the list of 50 wars that have been started by using this same technique).

Real men don't shy from calling bullshit on the state propaganda organs' fabrications...

On the question in the subject line - No, the sissies are hurting the liberty movement!

Do you have that on a script to copy and paste? Because you clearly didn't bother to read the thread before you mouthed off and called people sissies. Go back and read about the "false dichotomy" that you once again are repeating as if it's a valid point.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on January 18, 2014, 09:47 AM NHFT
Yep, we all know that, it's basic. A sissy is someone who is afraid to look at the truth that's out there (has come out in hearings and in other eyewitness testimony) and who is afraid to question the whole fabrication of the 9/11 official story of events, as well as other important historical events, and in their desperate fear, calls others who are brave enough to question the official story the "weaponized" toxic smear term "conspiracy theorist or kook". Those are the sissies and they are hurting the movement for freedom.

Plenty of folks "question" things.  A conspirary theorist puts forth a particular hypothesis as to what "actually happened," and defends it as blindly as the Statists defend the official story.

There's a world of difference between, "well, the government is obviously lying; I wonder what actually happened?" and "well, the government is lying, and here's exactly what happened..."  The former is an intelligent individual who seeks knowledge, and not anyone who Dale's post addressed.  The latter is a "conspiracy theorist," and is damaging the freedom movement more than the Statists can manage, because he's damaging it from within.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 18, 2014, 10:17 AM NHFT
I would even go so far as to say there are two different things and a distinction is important. I might even qualify for the term "conspiracy theorist". There are lots things I theorize about and I certainly feel like we're being fed a lot of bullshit. A "kook" on the other hand is when someone clings to an elaborate and ridiculous fabrication. And it gets really old when their primary form of evidence is to just poke holes in the gov't story, but that's not evidence for their particular detailed account of events!

"Yes, it's very suspicious that a lot of key people seemed to have vacated the area on 9/11, but that doesn't mean that flying invisible unicorns genetically engineered by the NSA blew up the WTC with rainbow poop bombs."
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: JustUs on January 18, 2014, 11:06 AM NHFT
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/1526386_10151811951031286_1296519081_n.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on January 18, 2014, 06:18 PM NHFT
So I'm wondering if the previous post was the love child of Dennis Rodman and the big ant like monster from the Alien movie?

Anyhow, that's all I got, so please do carry on.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 18, 2014, 06:45 PM NHFT
"worst form of slavery"?   

I'm gon'a give you a choice:

  1.  I'm goin'a beat you with a whip until you decide to do things my way.

Or

  2.  I'm going to talk to you until you decide to do things my way.

Of all the slaverys, I think, the being whipped would be the worst.

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on January 18, 2014, 07:51 PM NHFT
and think Dale ... it could be worse ... your friend tells you Alex Jones conspiracy theories .... and he doesn't believe them all ... or the craziest ones. :)

I met a guy that thought 911 was planned by Bush. He thought that LBJ killed Kennedy. He hates Obama.
But he thought Bill Clinton was great and Hillary would make a great president. :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 18, 2014, 08:36 PM NHFT
Okay, but the rumor is Neal himself is conspiring to build an all-Asian all-male Mars colony!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 19, 2014, 10:14 AM NHFT
In The Big Lebowski, The $0.69 check The Dude writes for milk is dated September 11 1991, exactly 10 years before the 9/11 terror attacks. George Bush Sr can be heard on the TV, making his "This aggression will not stand" speech, in reference to the war. The film was made in 1998.

(http://i.imgur.com/uWKXbJ5.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on January 19, 2014, 11:18 AM NHFT
I think the answers are all right there in the cat videos Jim posted. I mean c'mon it's obvious!   

We've noticed our cats being sort of secretive too, so I think something big is coming...the cats know...they really do.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on January 19, 2014, 12:24 PM NHFT
Dale is obviously part of the coverup... I mean everyone knows that it was half and half the dude used to make his White Russians. This just shows the Shape Shifters have gotten to him!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 19, 2014, 12:36 PM NHFT
That shape shifter thing is bunk.  If you were a shape shifter, would you look like Dick Chaney? 

You know... even if you were a reptile.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on January 19, 2014, 12:57 PM NHFT
Why can't you see the truth right in front of you, you sissy!

Here I'll make it simple so even you cat conspiracy kooks can understand!

(http://i443.photobucket.com/albums/qq159/mcfinn234/Obama-Bushheredity.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 19, 2014, 01:48 PM NHFT
So, you're saying all of these people are shape shifting reptiles?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on January 19, 2014, 02:56 PM NHFT
.....
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 19, 2014, 03:08 PM NHFT
I'm pretty sure the top left and bottom right pictures are switched... just personal experience.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Silent_Bob on January 20, 2014, 12:49 PM NHFT
Screwup on the Mars set...

Nasa says Mars mystery rock that ‘appeared’ from nowhere is ‘like nothing we’ve seen before’

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/nasa-says-mars-mystery-rock-that-appeared-from-nowhere-is-like-nothing-weve-ever-seen-before-9070323.html



A mysterious rock which appeared in front of the Opportunity rover is "like nothing we've ever seen before", according to Mars exploration scientists at Nasa.

Experts said they were "completely confused" by both the origins and makeup of the object, which is currently being investigated by Opportunity's various measuring instruments.

Astronomers noticed the new rock had "appeared" without any explanation on an outcrop which had been empty just days earlier. The rover has been stuck photographing the same region of Mars for more than a month due to bad weather, with scientists at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL) in California monitoring the images it sends.

Nasa issued a Mars status report entitled "encountering a surprise", and lead Mars Exploration rover scientist Steve Squyres told a JPL event it seems the planet literally "keeps throwing new things at us".

He said the images, from 12 Martian days apart, were from no more than a couple of weeks ago. "We saw this rock just sitting here. It looks white around the edge in the middle and there’s a low spot in the centre that's dark red - it looks like a jelly doughnut.

"And it appeared, just plain appeared at that spot - and we haven't ever driven over that spot."

Squyres said his team had two theories on how the rock got there - that there's "a smoking hole in the ground somewhere nearby" and it was caused by a meteor, or that it was "somehow flicked out of the ground by a wheel” as the rover went by.

"We had driven a metre or two away from here, and I think the idea that somehow we mysteriously flicked it with a wheel is the best explanation," Squyres said.

Yet the story got even stranger when Opportunity investigated further. Squyres explained: "We are as we speak situated with the rover's instruments deployed making measurements of this rock.

"We've taken pictures of both the doughnut and jelly parts, and the got the first data on the composition of the jelly yesterday.

"It's like nothing we've ever seen before," he said. "It's very high in sulphur, it's very high in magnesium, it's got twice as much manganese as we've ever seen in anything on Mars.

"I don't know what any of this means. We're completely confused, and everyone in the team is arguing and fighting (over what it means).

"That's the beauty of this mission... what I've realised is that we will never be finished. There will always be something tantalising, something wonderful just beyond our reach that we didn't quite get to - and that's the nature of exploration."

Squyres was speaking at an event marking the 10th anniversary of the arrival of Opportunity and Spirit on the surface of Mars.

While Spirit lost contact with Earth and was later declared "dead" in 2010, Opportunity has now roamed the planet far in excess of what was originally planned as a three-month mission. Nasa said that with its maximum speed of just 0.05mph, as of "Sol 3547" (15 January 2014) Opportunity had covered just over 24 miles (38km).
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 20, 2014, 01:49 PM NHFT
There isn't any Sasquatches in that story.  Try to stay on topic. 

Jesus Christ, a man.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 20, 2014, 03:42 PM NHFT
Like that thing is ACTUALLY on Mars. It's in a sound stage somewhere in Hollywood.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 20, 2014, 04:26 PM NHFT
If it were me I'd'a just said, "Hey can someone get that extra rock out'a there before we take the next shot."
No one ever asks me.

That's the Script Bitch's job any way.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Silent_Bob on January 20, 2014, 04:54 PM NHFT
"It looks white around the edge in the middle and there’s a low spot in the centre that's dark red - it looks like a jelly doughnut."

Rock? Someone left their half-eaten doughnut on the set between takes.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on January 20, 2014, 06:20 PM NHFT
In The Big Lebowski, The $0.69 check The Dude writes for milk is dated September 11 1991, exactly 10 years before the 9/11 terror attacks. George Bush Sr can be heard on the TV, making his "This aggression will not stand" speech, in reference to the war. The film was made in 1998.

(http://i.imgur.com/uWKXbJ5.jpg)
didn't something else happen on 9/11?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on January 20, 2014, 06:26 PM NHFT
Who is Neal conspiring with.
I agree with Bob. Soon you will see golf balls showing up.
Probably filming in NV and broadcasting out of Goldstone. Soon all the records will disappear except really grainy ones.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 21, 2014, 11:27 AM NHFT
The video of last night's show is already up and will be view-able for about a month before it gets taken down. I'm currently editing the downloadable podcast so it should be available today.

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/42930735
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Pat K on January 21, 2014, 01:55 PM NHFT
Martian kids are throwing rocks at the rover.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 21, 2014, 03:16 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/IIxLxgv.png)

Download the January 20th episode
 (http://flamingfreedom.com/2014/01/21/episode-2014-january-20th/)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 22, 2014, 10:46 AM NHFT
The Truth of Chem-trails is Revealed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EV-Hz1uAgU
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 22, 2014, 10:51 AM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/IIxLxgv.png)

Download the January 20th episode
 (http://i.imgur.com/IIxLxgv.png)

Where has all the link has gone? 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 22, 2014, 11:05 AM NHFT
Where has all the link has gone?

DERP! I fixed it.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on January 22, 2014, 07:54 PM NHFT
Wait a minute...there's a liberty movement? 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: JustUs on January 25, 2014, 04:26 PM NHFT
Quote
The idea that behind the official story is the "secret history" is a very old one.
A Roman historian named Procopius of Caesarea wrote a number of official histories about Rome, but left unpublished until after his death a manuscript called "The Secret History," which told the true story of the reign of the Roman Emperor Justinian, which he’d been unable to publish while alive for fear of retribution.

2000 years later, in an era when "national security" has become a synonym for cover-up, not much has changed. "There’s a secret world all around us," a legendary CIA agent tells a young recruit in a recent eye-opening account, "Overworld." of the life of an American spy. "But you don’t see it, unless you know where to look."

So, basically, to deny history makes you what?... Here, let's make up a smear term... You're a "history denier", you swine!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on January 25, 2014, 06:10 PM NHFT
I think 'Are Swine Hurting the Liberty Movement?' should be in a different thread.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 26, 2014, 09:04 AM NHFT
I think 'Are Swine Hurting the Liberty Movement?' should be in a different thread.

That would be about the recent low-carb and paleo craze, I imagine.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 28, 2014, 11:24 AM NHFT
Neal continues to beg the question.

(http://i.imgur.com/36LeCGd.png)

Download episode 2014/01/27 (http://flamingfreedom.com/2014/01/28/episode-2014-january-27th/)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on January 28, 2014, 11:42 AM NHFT
What's your least libertarian position?

I'm going to have to assume something involving BDSM using ball gags.  While you should always have pre-consent from your sub, if s/he is gagged, then s/he may not be able to tell you that s/he had a change of heart about some particular activity.  So, that would probably be the least-libertarian position, right?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on January 28, 2014, 11:44 AM NHFT
I'm going to have to assume something involving BDSM using ball gags.

That's along the lines of Lauren's answer.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Silent_Bob on February 01, 2014, 02:13 AM NHFT
9/11 Conspiracy Theories Ridiculous' - Al Qaeda

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_OIXfkXEj0
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on February 01, 2014, 10:18 AM NHFT
Oooh...  baby pandas!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 02, 2014, 12:50 PM NHFT
there are the answers
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Silent_Bob on February 13, 2014, 09:47 PM NHFT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sixzE02wRw
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on February 13, 2014, 11:23 PM NHFT
Such singing.  Such dancing.

Good times are here again.   :butterfly:
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Silent_Bob on February 13, 2014, 11:27 PM NHFT
This is another good one, no singing or dancing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=htKScR5e4K8
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on February 13, 2014, 11:37 PM NHFT
I feel like singing 'Oh Happy Days'.  ...not the Jesus part.

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jaqeboy on February 14, 2014, 07:23 PM NHFT
Hey, just found this thread. Come on down to AltExpo#15 at Liberty forum for 9/11 Truth, Chemtrails, Geo-engineering, black ops assassinations, New World Order, etc. All Alt. History, all the time! Speakers and videos in the Amphitheater in the lower level, up in the penthouse social area and in the Expo Village suite on 2 - we're all over the hotel, top to bottom!

Plus, tons of other topics on how we'll create alternatives to the mainstream systems to build the freed society:

https://www.facebook.com/events/399312520215533/

Also, we'll have tons of crash space for modest donations, if you can't afford the rooms or tried to book a room in the hotel too late (I think they're all booked up now).

The parties in the Expo Village (Suite #206) are to be remembered - that's the best afterhours place to network with freedom folks at Liberty Forum til dawn!

If you can't make it and just want to help us keep doing what we're doing, throw us a couple of bucks, eh?
http://www.gofundme.com/altexpo15
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 14, 2014, 08:17 PM NHFT
ignorance is strength
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on February 14, 2014, 09:49 PM NHFT
Feel the Power!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jaqeboy on February 18, 2014, 05:08 PM NHFT
Looks like the AltExpo may have scored a coup and gotten an important truth movement leader to talk Thursday night and for another session on Saturday. Stay tuned. You won't want to miss this guy - he's an inspiration! Check AltExpo#15 on Facebook for the latest schedule info.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on February 19, 2014, 09:37 AM NHFT
"Llama tell ya the Truth." - Zero Dark Kitty

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Do6KKwATPhc
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on February 19, 2014, 02:35 PM NHFT
^^^   ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jaqeboy on February 19, 2014, 06:24 PM NHFT
It's true, we're going to have Luke Rudkowski, founder of We Are Change (http://wearechange.org/), now a worldwide movement to expose corrupt political and industry leaders! We're very excited to have Luke and he'll do other sessions on how to "be the media" and create change in our communities. We'll probably form a New Hampshire We Are Change chapter, too, so come on down to the Amphitheater in the Crowne Plaza Hotel Thursday to hear myself, Luke and others. We also have an AltExpo Open Roundtable tomorrow to hear YOU and what you think we should be doing in the movement and in general in our daily lives.

See you at AltExpo

PS: party later in the penthouse! We'll be up in an executive suite, room # 829.
Friday and Saturday, the late night parties will be in room 206 on the 2nd floor - we can't go as late on the executive level.

Schedule on your smartphone if you're running the Liberty Forum schedule app or on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/events/399312520215533/

Looks like the AltExpo may have scored a coup and gotten an important truth movement leader to talk Thursday night and for another session on Saturday. Stay tuned. You won't want to miss this guy - he's an inspiration! Check AltExpo#15 on Facebook for the latest schedule info.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on February 25, 2014, 08:55 AM NHFT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tieA5wfcgH4
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on February 25, 2014, 02:40 PM NHFT
^^^ Long winter huh Jim?  ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on February 25, 2014, 03:06 PM NHFT
"Let's face it. Boobs are the greatest thing ever."

I once felt that way. When I was an infant!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jaqeboy on February 25, 2014, 10:31 PM NHFT
Looks like we will start up We Are Change New Hampshire!

Luke regaled us with stories about being the change by being the media. Esp. good was his story about hounding Michael Bloomberg, NYC mayor.

Pm me if you want to be involved with WRCNH.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on February 26, 2014, 10:14 AM NHFT
"Let's face it. Boobs are the greatest thing ever."

I once felt that way. When I was an infant!


Please no boob blasphemy. 

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 26, 2014, 01:05 PM NHFT
nobody was doing we are change NH .... well this will be better
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 04, 2014, 07:56 PM NHFT
I only just realized this thread isn't in the Endless Debate & Whining section. Odd.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7MmRFk4Mp4
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 04, 2014, 08:15 PM NHFT
The AIDS conspiracy-ists? are pulling out all the stops to shut this guy up up starting with copyright claims and going all the way to physical threats.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k25d5AEYBpE
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jaqeboy on March 04, 2014, 09:01 PM NHFT
Here's the Facebook page for We Are Change New Hampshire: https://www.facebook.com/WeAreChangeNH

If you want to become involved, we can add you to the super secret inner circle conspirators club, aka the "planning group".

Also, should I start up the "Are Anti-conspiracy kooks hurting the freedom movement?" forum thread? Anybody in?

Looks like we will start up We Are Change New Hampshire!

Luke regaled us with stories about being the change by being the media. Esp. good was his story about hounding Michael Bloomberg, NYC mayor.

Pm me if you want to be involved with WRCNH.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 04, 2014, 09:45 PM NHFT
Also, should I start up the "Are Anti-conspiracy kooks hurting the freedom movement?" forum thread? Anybody in?

Hell. I'm already curious. Start up the straw-mans!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Roycerson on March 05, 2014, 08:59 AM NHFT
iirc This forum is the only place on the entire internet I have ever run into anyone who claimed that all types of weather manipulation are crazy conspiracy theory.  In the intervening years it has become a matter of public record (I think it already was, I learned it in air force weather school).  Whoever it was was adamant about it too like only a complete idiot would believe in cloud dissipation.  If knowledge is power than the people fighting "conspiracy kooks" (at least the anti weather control ones) are actively trying to deprive liberty people of power by spreading false information among them.   

I think refusal to see what is right in front of your face and extremely well-documented hurts every activity you engage in.

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on March 05, 2014, 09:05 AM NHFT
It's snowing this morning.  Fucking government!!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 05, 2014, 09:52 AM NHFT
Thanx, OBAMA!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jaqeboy on March 05, 2014, 10:32 AM NHFT
I think refusal to see what is right in front of your face and extremely well-documented hurts every activity you engage in.

You got that right. There's a kind of cognitive shut-down, a self-censoring practice going on with some people... Then they follow it up with drive-by smears of anyone who brings up honest questions or posts information that is real and on the public record.

Those are the "anti-conspiracy" kooks! They are the disgusting examples of nominally "pro-liberty" men who are hurting the freedom movement.

Revisionism is the practice of discovering how, when and where the ruling class and their lapdog politicians have lied to promote their agenda. It's one of the most honorable things a man can do.

As Konkin says in the New Libertarian Manifesto (http://agorism.info/docs/NewLibertarianManifesto.pdf), 25th Anniversary edn., p.17:

Quote
Libertarianism asked why society was not libertarian now and found the State, its ruling class, its camouflage, and the heroic historians striving to reveal the truth. Thus did Revisionist History become part of Libertarianism.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 05, 2014, 11:04 AM NHFT
Those are the "anti-conspiracy" kooks! They are the disgusting examples of nominally "pro-liberty" men who are hurting the freedom movement.

I resent the implied sexism here. Women can be anti-conspiracy kooks too!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 05, 2014, 11:35 AM NHFT
I think refusal to see what is right in front of your face and extremely well-documented hurts every activity you engage in.

You got that right. There's a kind of cognitive shut-down, a self-censoring practice going on with some people... Then they follow it up with drive-by smears of anyone who brings up honest questions or posts information that is real and on the public record.

This is a common straw-man, a tactic people resort to when failing to convince someone of a belief. If you are failing to persuade someone to believe something that you believe, you accuse that person of being close-minded or a government shill or a "gatekeeper"(?) or whatever.

Weather control is a good example. I believe in technology that can manipulate the weather to some extent in some circumstances. Present me with a certain scenario and I will come to some conclusion about how reasonable I think that is based on the evidence available. I don't know who was making the claims Roycerson mentioned but I don't think it was me.

I don't reject a claim simply because it contradicts what the government is telling me! I know very well governments are inherently prone to evil and they do all kinds of sneaky shit! I've been on this forum for years. People KNOW me.

I guess I would sum this up as a false dichotomy--the idea that you believe our detailed accounting of events or you believe the enemy's (the Feds). I don't know exactly what happened. I doubt anyone does. I bet the government is hiding something; how much, I don't know. But the very detailed scenarios I've heard from truthers don't hold water. This is ONE CASE where the broadly-believed accounting of events is far more believable, Hell--VIABLE, by comparison to something that isn't viable. And I'm not judging the viability on the basis of not believing government officials could be so evil. I've witnessed them do evil right out in the open. I'm judging it on the basis of objective reality.

If an actual government shill shows up, or someone who accepts whatever they're told without questioning it, I'll join you in questioning the motives of that person. I don't believe in 9/11 Truth (just as a for instance) because it's not believable based on the evidence.

I've had friends who believed we were visited by aliens and believed in ghosts and psychic stuph. I would love to believe in those things. They definitely make the world more interesting and ghosts give hope for some kind of after life and we all fear death. I feel like Truthers WANT desperately to believe in this stuph and it's making them heavily biased and affecting their judgment.

When I watched The God who Wasn't There, I was like "JACKPOT! This is some great ammo for showing how ridiculous Christianity is!" Turns out they were, at the very least, exaggerating some stuph, possibly worse. Here's the thing. They don't need to do that. Christianity is already absurd and silly without having to stretch such things to make their point. In the end, it just hurt the veracity of anyone who brings up those claims. I'm still agnostic/atheist-ish and I'm definitely no believer in Christianity, but when folks bring that shit up, I'm going to call them out on it. I'm on their side but it makes us look bad to use false claims. I also don't trust governments. I'm a free market ANARCHIST, for crying out loud! Me not believing in 9/11 Truth hasn't even put a dint in my hatred for governments, but it's just bullshit.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 05, 2014, 12:25 PM NHFT
I am positing that people, who think that there are conspiracies everywhere, were the victims of severe embarrassment over commonly held notions that are known to be false, like the Easter Bunny and Santa Clause.  This embarrassment happened at a time in life when they were given great surety by older people around them, until the lie was revealed.  The embarrassment was compounded when the person examined the lie. 

At this point, people have to consider the other things that people have been telling them.  One has to start cross referencing what people say and link it to what other people say and/or physical proof.

Over time people divide into groups:

1)  "I will believe anything I'm told."
2)  "Everything is bullshit."
3)  "I doubt you, Give me proof."
4)  "I can make shit up and embarrass you."

These groups tend to be transitory, depending on how much evidence one needs to secure one from the embarrassment.

The security most often takes place in a group that continues the lie.

The bigger the lie, the more violently it is defended.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jaqeboy on March 05, 2014, 01:00 PM NHFT
With all due respect, the following casual statements of yours are examples of "drive-by smears", Dale. You don't name the scenario, the person postulating the scenario in question, then you smear an un-named collective of people by associating them with another un-named person presumably with an untenable hypothesis (unable to tell if it's tenable or not, given that no one or hypothesis is named).

This is a use of a variety of propaganda techniques to varying degrees, known as "ad hominem", "ad nauseum", "black-and-white fallacy", "demonizing the enemy", "fear, uncertainty and doubt", "half-truth", "labelling (using dysphemisms)", "milieu control", "name-calling", "obfuscation", "oversimplification", "pensee unique", "scapegoating", "stereotyping", "strawman", "transfer" (ref. Wikipedia article on propaganda (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propaganda).)

As I've explained before (and you may not have seen this explanation), the term "9/11 Truth" was an attempt at branding proposed by a marketing guy in Western Massachusetts. Whether it was a good idea or not for people who questioned the government's official story about 9/11 (a conspiracy theory, by the way) to accept or choose to be "branded" is not clear. What is clear from the research conducted by independents is that the government did not prove its conspiracy theory, but ran with it to justify a stream of wars and domestic crackdowns, which, I think it's fair to say, we all oppose in this forum.

Those who question the official theory are not all professional criminal investigators and don't have all the best techniques down pat, but even professional investigators would propose narratives that they think make sense of the crime and pursue the investigation to see if additional facts support or refute that theory. They may then revise or reject that narrative and go down different investigative paths until they find a completely cogent narrative and enough evidence to bring to a grand jury to seek an indictment of the alleged criminals. In this new information age, with crowd-sourced "open intelligence", people are free to propose a narrative that they think fits the fact pattern (people do this at the bars, barbershops and taxicabs of the world - even on online forums!). Some of these are off completely, some have bits of the truth, some may be spot-on.

The independent investigators lack the subpoena power and access to records that the "officials" have, but have still turned up amazing information from open intel sources. The thing that's new about the information age we live in is that the independent's work is open for all to view (if the researcher/investigator/theorist chooses to post it online somewhere) - that means the good, solid work and the questionable work.

Now comes the "smoke-screen" and attempts to discredit good independent research by associating it with the questionable work - this is the area where propagandists have a field day. Not only is it done casually by other independents, but officially by government agencies and propagated through media channels. Mark Crispin Miller and others have pointed out the official policy of the CIA towards independent researchers of the JFK assassination, as stated in their 1 April 1967 memo (http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x765619), essentially instructing their media agents to smear researchers (such as attorney Mark Lane) by calling their work "conspiracy theory" - I believe this is the genesis of the current common "drive-by smear" technique. Please correct me if you find an earlier usage of the technique.

I think one of the things that libertarians pride themselves on is their resistance to propaganda, and the quest for truth burns in them. We proudly seek the truth and slough off all petty abuse for seeking the truth.


...But the very detailed scenarios I've heard from truthers don't hold water

...I feel like Truthers WANT desperately to believe in this stuph and it's making them heavily biased and affecting their judgment.

...Me not believing in 9/11 Truth hasn't even put a dint in my hatred for governments, but it's just bullshit.

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on March 05, 2014, 04:06 PM NHFT
I am positing that people, who think that there are conspiracies everywhere, were the victims of severe embarrassment over commonly held notions that are known to be false, like the Easter Bunny and Santa Clause.  This embarrassment happened at a time in life when they were given great surety by older people around them, until the lie was revealed.  The embarrassment was compounded when the person examined the lie.

Actually, most folks who believe in these sort of conspiracy theories have one thing in common: they used to be direct participants in - or heavy supporters of - the government.

You and I know that the government is able to commit great evil because individuals are willing to support it, and do the actual acts of evil.  Someone who once was a participant or supporter, who then realizes that what the government is doing is evil, has to face the fact that their choices made that evil possible, and it takes a heavy dose of integrity to admit that.  Or, they can bury their heads in the sand and refuse ot accept responsibility.  Conspiracy theories are one of the popular ways to do that, for those without the integrity to admit their responsibility.  If a massive conspiracy is making sure that these things happen, then it doesn't matter if any given cog is removed from the machine, because the all-powerful conspiracy will just find a replacement cog, adjust plans, and make sure that the evil things still happen.  No cog bears any personal responsibility, because the evil is being directed by a conspiracy which will brook no failure.

That's why the conspiracy theories are always outlandish and totally impossible in the real world.  The conspiracy has to be so overwhelmingly powerful that no one could have stopped it, so it has to be based upon an idea that is impossible absent these impossible feats by the conspirators.

Insisting upon physically-impossible things is not a bug; it's a feature.  It helps assure the believer that the conspiracy posesses powers which cannot be defeated, so his own personal participation is irrelevant.  That lets him bury his head firmly in the sand and avoid all acceptance of responsibility.

Those who question the official theory are not all professional criminal investigators and don't have all the best techniques down pat, but even professional investigators would propose narratives that they think make sense of the crime and pursue the investigation to see if additional facts support or refute that theory. They may then revise or reject that narrative and go down different investigative paths until they find a completely cogent narrative and enough evidence to bring to a grand jury to seek an indictment of the alleged criminals.

Really?  So, please point to folks who are "investigating narratives" that are actually possible?  Things like government officials knowing that terrorists intended to fly planes into the WTC, and hiding that.  Or maybe helping to train those terrorists.  Or possibly actually instructing them to do so.

Those are narratives which place the blame with the government, but which are actually within the realm of reason.  Surely, some of your "investigators" must be investigating such things, rather than looking for and fabricating "evidence" to support a particular fantasy story.  Any of them?  Or is it none of them, because none of them are actually interested in looking for truth?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 05, 2014, 04:25 PM NHFT
Jack, you're helping to make my point. 9/11 Truth has a certain image because of the very loud voices that most people hear making ridiculous claims that aren't supported by the evidence. There's not even any reason for you to feel that the thread title is directed at you. If you're just asking legitimate and reasonable questions, you're not one of the "kooks" referenced. That would actually put you in my camp. Welcome, brother!

If you want to change the image that people have of truthers, help to police the movement from within. Call out the Alex Jones drones. Call someone out when they start talking about thermite and controlled demolitions. Maybe you're doing that already. If so, kudos to you.

I gave the analogy of The God Who Wasn't There. I was referencing incorrect claims made by that movie until a fellow ATHEIST pointed me to some facts that effectively disputed it. Now I will do the same when I hear someone on my own side reference those claims because it makes our movement stronger when we can admit our mistakes and show that we're the open-minded ones who are actually seeking truth instead of just trying to win an argument or make the other side look stupid.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 05, 2014, 04:41 PM NHFT
I am positing that people, who think that there are conspiracies everywhere, were the victims of severe embarrassment over commonly held notions that are known to be false, like the Easter Bunny and Santa Clause.  This embarrassment happened at a time in life when they were given great surety by older people around them, until the lie was revealed.  The embarrassment was compounded when the person examined the lie.

Actually, most folks who believe in these sort of conspiracy theories have one thing in common: they used to be direct participants in - or heavy supporters of - the government.

You and I know that the government is able to commit great evil because individuals are willing to support it, and do the actual acts of evil.  Someone who once was a participant or supporter, who then realizes that what the government is doing is evil, has to face the fact that their choices made that evil possible, and it takes a heavy dose of integrity to admit that.  Or, they can bury their heads in the sand and refuse ot accept responsibility.  Conspiracy theories are one of the popular ways to do that, for those without the integrity to admit their responsibility.  If a massive conspiracy is making sure that these things happen, then it doesn't matter if any given cog is removed from the machine, because the all-powerful conspiracy will just find a replacement cog, adjust plans, and make sure that the evil things still happen.  No cog bears any personal responsibility, because the evil is being directed by a conspiracy which will brook no failure.

That's why the conspiracy theories are always outlandish and totally impossible in the real world.  The conspiracy has to be so overwhelmingly powerful that no one could have stopped it, so it has to be based upon an idea that is impossible absent these impossible feats by the conspirators.

Insisting upon physically-impossible things is not a bug; it's a feature.  It helps assure the believer that the conspiracy posesses powers which cannot be defeated, so his own personal participation is irrelevant.  That lets him bury his head firmly in the sand and avoid all acceptance of responsibility.

Those who question the official theory are not all professional criminal investigators and don't have all the best techniques down pat, but even professional investigators would propose narratives that they think make sense of the crime and pursue the investigation to see if additional facts support or refute that theory. They may then revise or reject that narrative and go down different investigative paths until they find a completely cogent narrative and enough evidence to bring to a grand jury to seek an indictment of the alleged criminals.

Really?  So, please point to folks who are "investigating narratives" that are actually possible?  Things like government officials knowing that terrorists intended to fly planes into the WTC, and hiding that.  Or maybe helping to train those terrorists.  Or possibly actually instructing them to do so.

Those are narratives which place the blame with the government, but which are actually within the realm of reason.  Surely, some of your "investigators" must be investigating such things, rather than looking for and fabricating "evidence" to support a particular fantasy story.  Any of them?  Or is it none of them, because none of them are actually interested in looking for truth?

I don't believe that contact with the Government is key: it's an exacerbation, in that parents are replaced by the Government as the source of deception.

As you have said, most of them are not looking for the truth.

The Truther mentality is a defensive mechanism that has to have developed at a younger age. 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 05, 2014, 10:39 PM NHFT
Obviously Johnson is a Shape Shifter spreading disinformation...
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on March 06, 2014, 09:02 AM NHFT
^^^ Have you ever noticed sometimes in really bright sun, his eyes get all squinty ? Almost lizard like.  He tries to hide it, but I've seen it.  ...and don't forget the robes, sometimes he wears robes.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 06, 2014, 10:10 AM NHFT
You ever notice how scary huge he is?  No human is that big.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: K neth on March 06, 2014, 03:59 PM NHFT

Summa scientia nihil scire

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 06, 2014, 04:50 PM NHFT

Summa scientia nihil scire

OK I guess that makes me a genius!  ;D

(Thanks internet for the definition)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 06, 2014, 05:18 PM NHFT
highest knowledge nothing known
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 07, 2014, 05:26 AM NHFT
I haven't met too many people in our movement that believe every anti-government conspiracy theory.
the crazy thing for me is that over time I am starting to believe almost every one. :)
My Dad just finished a CIA book ..... now he is really mad at them.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on March 07, 2014, 09:21 AM NHFT
I have a grandchild due in a few months.  The first book I hope to read to him is The Little Red Hen.  I think the Creature from Jekyll Island will just put him to sleep.  There's no pictures in that one. Fucking government!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 11, 2014, 12:53 AM NHFT
Myles is experiencing some pretty ridiculous blow back from kooks for his conspiracy debunking videos. He doesn't make any money to speak of, so he can't really justify the time and expense of fighting frequent frivolous claims being brought against him by people trying to shut his videos down.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOCCxcv6Rko
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on March 11, 2014, 08:50 AM NHFT
Myles is experiencing some pretty ridiculous blow back from kooks for his conspiracy debunking videos. He doesn't make any money to speak of, so he can't really justify the time and expense of fighting frequent frivolous claims being brought against him by people trying to shut his videos down.

But I thought they were interested in finding the truth?  Isn't their purpose specifically to try and open dialog on these issues?  So, how would they possibly be trying to silence someone?

Oh, wait, it's because they are actually interested in spreading lies, closing dialog, and gagging anyone who doesn't adhere to their prejudices, isn't it?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 11, 2014, 02:24 PM NHFT
how bad can the conspiracy kooks hurt this guy?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 11, 2014, 02:55 PM NHFT
how bad can the conspiracy kooks hurt this guy?

Imagine you had put hours and hours of time into a project, nothing more than a hobby that doesn't make you any money, just to express your views. Then you got onto YouTube and got thousands of views for your videos. Then some folks came along and exploited a convenient method to shut down your videos and silence you and all that work was for naught. You didn't get paid, and the whole point of doing it--to get the message out, was now gone. How motivated would you be to continue?

Sounds like it can hurt a lot.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 11, 2014, 04:10 PM NHFT
Maybe he should be creating his own content instead of using other peoples work.

But besides that Dale, tell us about that project that you're putting your life into that's not giving you the gratification that you deserve.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 11, 2014, 04:17 PM NHFT
aha
how do they get his videos taken down?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 11, 2014, 05:28 PM NHFT
Maybe he should be creating his own content instead of using other peoples work.

?? He's DEBUNKING propoganda so he kind of has to reference what he's debunking.

Quote
But besides that Dale, tell us about that project that you're putting your life into that's not giving you the gratification that you deserve.

That's different! No one is trying to censor me. They're just not listening because they're not interested.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 11, 2014, 06:29 PM NHFT
I thought that was considered fair use... ie. excerpts to illustrate/educate a point.

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 11, 2014, 06:36 PM NHFT
I thought that was considered fair use... ie. excerpts to illustrate/educate a point.

It is. If you listen to that podcast, he explains that every single DMCA claim that's been investigated has determined that he is engaging in fair use, but they just keep coming.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 11, 2014, 11:24 PM NHFT
now he has to debunk the hmca claims
but now this whole story is getting complicated and seems to involve many people ..... sounds like a conspiracy to me
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on March 12, 2014, 07:19 AM NHFT
but now this whole story is getting complicated and seems to involve many people ..... sounds like a conspiracy to me

Not really - a bunch of folks who all have the same goals can do similar things, without conspiring in advance.

For example, when police know there's a planned protest, and send their thugs to attack the protesters, that involves a conspiracy on the part of the police.

A lynch mob, on the other hand, does similar things, without any advance planning.  Folks who are upset about a similar thing all find each other, without a plan.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 12, 2014, 08:25 AM NHFT
sounds like a conspiracy to me

I know that's supposed to be a zinger but it's kind of silly to assume that, because someone does not believe in conspiracy X, that they don't believe in any, ever. Obviously people can get together and plan things and they are conspiring. It's a common straw man. The strategy of this "conspiracy" is relatively str8-fwd versus the ones Myles has chosen to debunk. And he's very specific. He address the veracity of specific claims one by one and then the response is not on topic -- "you don't believe in conspiracies", "you trust the government when you shouldn't", "that other thing happened. why don't you believe in this thing?"

Myles has addressed their claims directly and disassembled specific conspiracies brick by brick. Why hasn't anyone on this thread rebutted his responses specifically in typical healthy debate style? Because they can't. The claims were flimsy from the start and Myles' responses are rock solid. So after they saw him as a real threat to their propaganda, they started trying to shut him up.

Has anyone actually watched his films? I've watched his 9/11 Truth series and his House of Numbers series (still in progress). The House of Numbers one embarrassed me because I actually somewhat bought into their bullshit and made a couple of shows about it. I'm actually going back to put disclaimers on those episodes.

http://flamingfreedom.com/?s=house+of+numbers

I can admit when I am wrong.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 12, 2014, 12:47 PM NHFT
how bad can the conspiracy kooks hurt this guy?

Imagine you had put hours and hours of time into a project, nothing more than a hobby that doesn't make you any money, just to express your views. Then you got onto YouTube and got thousands of views for your videos. Then some folks came along and exploited a convenient method to shut down your videos and silence you and all that work was for naught. You didn't get paid, and the whole point of doing it--to get the message out, was now gone. How motivated would you be to continue?

Sounds like it can hurt a lot.

I don't see the problem.
This guy was looking for a conspiracy fight and got one.
...or looked to troll the conspiracy kooks and got a rise.
...or started a thing to which people responded.
...or pointed his squirt gun in a kidding type of way and everyone squirted him and then he cried.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on March 12, 2014, 02:08 PM NHFT
I don't see the problem.
This guy was looking for a conspiracy fight and got one.
...or looked to troll the conspiracy kooks and got a rise.
...or started a thing to which people responded.
...or pointed his squirt gun in a kidding type of way and everyone squirted him and then he cried.

He expressed an idea.  They responded by using the violence of government.

I don't see how using governmental violence is an acceptable response to someone proving you wrong on some point.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 12, 2014, 03:31 PM NHFT
I don't see the problem.
This guy was looking for a conspiracy fight and got one.
...or looked to troll the conspiracy kooks and got a rise.
...or started a thing to which people responded.
...or pointed his squirt gun in a kidding type of way and everyone squirted him and then he cried.

He expressed an idea.  They responded by using the violence of government.

I don't see how using governmental violence is an acceptable response to someone proving you wrong on some point.

Oh, I thought they were appealing to You Tube.
I didn't know guys with guns showed up at his door and they were turned away with the "fair use" argument.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on March 12, 2014, 03:36 PM NHFT
Oh, I thought they were appealing to You Tube.
I didn't know guys with guns showed up at his door and they were turned away with the "fair use" argument.

They are "appealing" to YouTube by saying, "take that video down or we'll have the government attack you."  YouTube complies under threat of that attack, and then it's up to the producer of the video to prove his innocence, each and every time they do it (because the law says that YouTube can be attacked if it does not immediately comply with a removal request, so it must comply regardless of the lack of evidence).
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 12, 2014, 03:45 PM NHFT
Sounds like a violent conspiracy to me
But I am not an expert
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 12, 2014, 07:21 PM NHFT
Oh, I thought they were appealing to You Tube.
I didn't know guys with guns showed up at his door and they were turned away with the "fair use" argument.

They are "appealing" to YouTube by saying, "take that video down or we'll have the government attack you."  YouTube complies under threat of that attack, and then it's up to the producer of the video to prove his innocence, each and every time they do it (because the law says that YouTube can be attacked if it does not immediately comply with a removal request, so it must comply regardless of the lack of evidence).

I take umbridge at your use of "government violence" in that you do not delineate between threats and violence.  Especially when there is many steps between the threat and the violence, as well as there being a private entity that is mediating the disputes. 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on March 12, 2014, 07:58 PM NHFT
I take umbridge at your use of "government violence" in that you do not delineate between threats and violence.

Credible threats of violence are, in and of themselves, violent acts.  If not, mugging would not be violent.  "Give me your wallet or I'll stab you" is violent, even if the guy gives the mugger his wallet and, therefore, does not get stabbed.

...as well as there being a private entity that is mediating the disputes.

Which one?  They are threatening YouTube with legal action if YouTube does not comply with their demands.  YouTube has to act immediately, because even mere delay in compliance can result in governmental violence.  Then they investigate and potentially determine that it is not a legitimate claim, and finally re-post the video.  At which point someone else threatens YouTube again, and the cycle repeats...
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 12, 2014, 08:11 PM NHFT
I've filed a complaint with the owners of this forum and am considering civil legal action against Johnson for his unauthorized use of the word umbridge umbrage. Clearly he stole that term from someone else and I find his use of the term umbrageous!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 12, 2014, 08:15 PM NHFT
I take umbridge at your use of "government violence" in that you do not delineate between threats and violence.

Credible threats of violence are, in and of themselves, violent acts.  If not, mugging would not be violent.  "Give me your wallet or I'll stab you" is violent, even if the guy gives the mugger his wallet and, therefore, does not get stabbed.

...as well as there being a private entity that is mediating the disputes.

Which one?  They are threatening YouTube with legal action if YouTube does not comply with their demands.  YouTube has to act immediately, because even mere delay in compliance can result in governmental violence.  Then they investigate and potentially determine that it is not a legitimate claim, and finally re-post the video.  At which point someone else threatens YouTube again, and the cycle repeats...

No, if a violent act is not a physical action then words have no meaning.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 12, 2014, 08:19 PM NHFT
I've filed a complaint with the owners of this forum and am considering civil legal action against Johnson for his unauthorized use of the word umbridge umbrage. Clearly he stole that term from someone else and I find his use of the term umbrageous!

Clearly a violent threat, and I take umbrage at being placed in the umbrage of your threats.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 12, 2014, 08:23 PM NHFT
I've filed a complaint with the owners of this forum and am considering civil legal action against Johnson for his unauthorized use of the word umbridge umbrage. Clearly he stole that term from someone else and I find his use of the term umbrageous!

Clearly a violent threat, and I take umbrage at being placed in the umbrage of your threats.

Where's my glove? My face smacking dueling glove!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on March 12, 2014, 08:23 PM NHFT
No, if a violent act is not a physical action then words have no meaning.

Violence does not require physical action.  Physical action may be violent, but actions other than physical may also be violent.

What you're suggesting is that most violations of others' rights are not actually wrongful.  If someone says, "do this or I'll hurt you" or, "stop doing that or I'll hurt you," and you have to modify your behavior to avoid him hurting you, that does not absolve him of responsibility.  He has engaged in violence against you as soon as he made a credible threat.

If not, you're left with a situation like this:

"So, then you raped her?"
"No, she consented to have sex with me."
"Why?"
"Well, I told her that if she didn't, I would stab her to death, but since I didn't actually do so, I did not actually engage in any violence, so it was consensual."

Or, for that matter, take it up a notch and consider those who commit crimes against humanity.  How many of those monsters (Bush, Obama, Hitler, etc.) actually pulled the trigger, even once?  They merely spoke or wrote words.  Are they absolved of all responsibility?  Or are they responsible, because words can be violent?

Credible threats are acts of violence.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 12, 2014, 08:49 PM NHFT
No, if a violent act is not a physical action then words have no meaning.

Violence does not require physical action.  Physical action may be violent, but actions other than physical may also be violent.

What you're suggesting is that most violations of others' rights are not actually wrongful.  If someone says, "do this or I'll hurt you" or, "stop doing that or I'll hurt you," and you have to modify your behavior to avoid him hurting you, that does not absolve him of responsibility.  He has engaged in violence against you as soon as he made a credible threat.

If not, you're left with a situation like this:

"So, then you raped her?"
"No, she consented to have sex with me."
"Why?"
"Well, I told her that if she didn't, I would stab her to death, but since I didn't actually do so, I did not actually engage in any violence, so it was consensual."

Or, for that matter, take it up a notch and consider those who commit crimes against humanity.  How many of those monsters (Bush, Obama, Hitler, etc.) actually pulled the trigger, even once?  They merely spoke or wrote words.  Are they absolved of all responsibility?  Or are they responsible, because words can be violent?

Credible threats are acts of violence.

That's confused.

Your equating some internet troll, who has no other probable means of contact with you, with immediate and probable danger.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on March 12, 2014, 08:59 PM NHFT
That's confused.

Your equating some internet troll, who has no other probable means of contact with you, with immediate and probable danger.

That troll is threatening YouTube, and if he were the legal owner of a copyright, which was being used illegally by someone else via YouTube's servers, and YouTube did not promptly take down the video, a simple phone call would bring immediate action against YouTube.

The threat is quite imminent.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 13, 2014, 10:08 AM NHFT
I feel like it's beside the most important point. When someone is trying to silence someone else rather than debate them, they know they're losing. That's true regardless of whether there's violence involved or not.

But while we're talking about the YouTubes...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CIXx9yP_Bw
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on March 13, 2014, 10:49 AM NHFT
I feel like it's beside the most important point. When someone is trying to silence someone else rather than debate them, they know they're losing. That's true regardless of whether there's violence involved or not.

Sorry for the diversion.  You're quite right - the issue is that those who are claiming to want open and honest debate are, in actual reality, wedded to a particular story, and perfectly willing to do whatever they can to silence those who actually want open and honest debate.

The technique used is nowhere near as important as the hypocrisy they are demonstrating.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 14, 2014, 12:34 AM NHFT
In the interest of full disclosure, I haven't read this yet. I'm dead tired and about to go to bed. But it seemed relevant.

http://torrentfreak.com/time-to-punish-dmca-takedown-abusers-wordpress-owners-say-140313/
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 14, 2014, 01:51 AM NHFT
If they made a law against claiming that you had copy rights, while being just a little needle dick loser, that would be all right by me.  But they always change the wording of a law before it gets to a final vote.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 14, 2014, 09:50 AM NHFT
Instead of a law, I would prefer YouTube make it part of their terms of use and it would jeopardize the account of the abuser.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 14, 2014, 10:34 AM NHFT
Instead of a law, I would prefer YouTube make it part of their terms of use and it would jeopardize the account of the abuser.

It's so easy to make a throwaway account though. I imagine that's what they do.

I finally read the article. I'm always leery of solving a problem with new laws. I think these are problems inherent with the idea of copyright laws in the first place. Any use should be fair use as far as I'm concerned.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on March 14, 2014, 05:01 PM NHFT
It's snowing this morning.  Fucking government!!
Zionist Occupation Government! (http://digitaljournal.com/news/politics/house-approves-israel-strategic-partner-bill-by-vote-of-410-1/article/375492)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 17, 2014, 11:28 AM NHFT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hgYSo0uZ2A
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 21, 2014, 12:28 PM NHFT
I'm now part of the occult for suggesting that men and women no longer need to conform to caveman notions of gender roles in modern society. I think I'm also woefully ignorant of the dimensions beyond four. What's that Internet rule that says it begins to be impossible to tell whether something is a joke or a parody or if people really are that crazy?

http://forum.freestateproject.org/index.php?topic=27556.msg293267#msg293267

These guys may very well be trolls and/or sock puppets. (Maybe it's just the one guy)

And this guy (http://forum.freestateproject.org/index.php?topic=27558.msg293305#msg293305) thinks I'm a Masonic troll. Something to do with Free Masons I guess. *shrug*
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 21, 2014, 04:07 PM NHFT
What's that Internet rule that says it begins to be impossible to tell whether something is a joke or a parody or if people really are that crazy?

Why would you need to delineate between the three of them?

I was instructed to decipher what was written, not what was meant to be written.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 21, 2014, 04:34 PM NHFT
If I'm a Free Mason, I want a luxurious underground tunnel to drive past all the traffic like in the Simpsons!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcV-SC6ha2I
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 21, 2014, 05:37 PM NHFT
I think Homer ruined that... in the same episode.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 21, 2014, 06:33 PM NHFT
What's that Internet rule that says it begins to be impossible to tell whether something is a joke or a parody or if people really are that crazy?

Why would you need to delineate between the three of them?

I was instructed to decipher what was written, not what was meant to be written.

Really it's differentiating between two states... joke or parody (funny, clever I'd hangout with them)     really that crazy (freaky, deluded, not gonna hangout with them)   ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 21, 2014, 06:49 PM NHFT
What's that Internet rule that says it begins to be impossible to tell whether something is a joke or a parody or if people really are that crazy?

Why would you need to delineate between the three of them?

I was instructed to decipher what was written, not what was meant to be written.

Really it's differentiating between two states... joke or parody (funny, clever I'd hangout with them)     really that crazy (freaky, deluded, not gonna hangout with them)   ;D

You mean the Masonic troll?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 21, 2014, 06:54 PM NHFT
it is a conspiracy to bring you down Dale
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 21, 2014, 07:29 PM NHFT
Dale's a Masonic Troll?

Oh wait the photo is Hitler on a nude beach... that is a couple levels creepier than I can imagine.  ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 21, 2014, 08:56 PM NHFT
it is a conspiracy to bring you down Dale

So far it's been hilarious. I can't tell if they're trolling me or if I'm trolling them (I sorta am but it's sincere trolling if that makes any sense) or maybe both.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on March 23, 2014, 05:13 PM NHFT
That thread is hilarious.  BTP is one of the last individuals to be giving "instruction" on manliness.  He whines about even the slightest hint of criticism.  Since a "man" must, be definition, be an adult, he doesn't have a chance.  He's just an overgrown child who likes to play at being an adult, without actually understanding why adults behave the way that they do.  He just mimics "adult" things without comprehension, which frequently leads to the wrong statement or behavior at the wrong time.

Hence why almost all he can do is quote others.  "Everyone agrees that that guy was manly, so I'll copy what he said!"
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 23, 2014, 06:19 PM NHFT
I would love to know exactly what he said in his message to the moderators. "That guy is picking on me! He said mean things!"
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 24, 2014, 05:35 PM NHFT
uh oh ..... I knew Dale was a bully
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on April 03, 2014, 12:07 AM NHFT
http://www.smh.com.au/environment/climate-change/conspiracist-climate-change-study-withdrawn-amid-legal-threats-20140402-35xao.html

Quote
Support for free markets was also a predictor of rejection of mainstream science in other fields, such the link between smoking and cancer, the authors wrote.

Endorsement of a range of conspiracy theories, such as a belief NASA faked the moon landing in a Hollywood studio or that the FBI had killed US civil rights campaigner Martin Luther King Jr., also predicted a climate change denial stance.

What a straw man. We don't all reject every mainstream thing. We just don't automatically take it hook, line, and sinker because the gubment says so.  ::)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 26, 2014, 08:05 PM NHFT
hey .... if you question anything ... you are messed up
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on May 07, 2014, 04:54 PM NHFT
From the FSP forum (http://forum.freestateproject.org/index.php?topic=27661.msg294208#msg294208).

Quote from: TJames
Jumping to paranoid conclusions about invisible monsters does not help the liberty movement. It takes energy from what we should be doing, working on being free. It actually makes us an insular community afraid of our own shadow. If we had less fear we could make friends and own the world.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on May 07, 2014, 07:25 PM NHFT
From the FSP forum (http://forum.freestateproject.org/index.php?topic=27661.msg294208#msg294208).

Quote from: TJames
Jumping to paranoid conclusions about invisible monsters does not help the liberty movement. It takes energy from what we should be doing, working on being free. It actually makes us an insular community afraid of our own shadow. If we had less fear we could make friends and own the world.

I think people who want to own the world are part of the larger problem.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on May 07, 2014, 10:03 PM NHFT
That probably wasn't the best choice of words.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on May 11, 2014, 12:15 AM NHFT
ignoring visible monsters seems silly to me :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on May 15, 2014, 08:47 AM NHFT
Sandy Hook 'Truther' Tells Victim's Mother Her Daughter Never Existed (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/12/grace-mcdonnell-playgroun_n_5310928.html)

Quote
During a brief conversation, the sign-stealer allegedly told McDonnell that he took the sign because he believes the school shooting was a hoax, CBS2.com reports.

He also taunted her that her daughter never existed, a comment that suggested he thought McDonnell was part of the alleged conspiracy.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on May 19, 2014, 03:40 PM NHFT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-sVnmmw6WY
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on May 24, 2014, 07:36 PM NHFT
I haven't heard this particular conspiracy around here, but it's still relevant to the topic, I suppose. That said, he has some excellent thoughts that I think are particularly relevant in the last 3 or 4 minutes.

Quote
Collins is not sure if men went to the moon. but he is sure they could not have faked it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGXTF6bs1IU
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on May 24, 2014, 08:37 PM NHFT
I disagree - the moon landings certainly could have been faked.

It would have required more effort than actually going to the moon, though...

Realistically, going to the moon was no big accomplishment - if it was done by efficient private enterprise rather than inefficient government, it would have been even smaller in cost.  It only seemed like a big deal, because it was done by bumbling imcompetents who had to try and puff their work to seem important.  In reality, speaking as someone who was formally trained as a "rocket scientist," rocket science isn't really all that difficult.  It sounds complex to outsiders, but calculating orbits isn't all that difficult, even if limited to 1960's technology.

Faking something like that would have taken far, far more work.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on May 24, 2014, 09:16 PM NHFT
I haven't heard this particular conspiracy around here, but it's still relevant to the topic, I suppose. That said, he has some excellent thoughts that I think are particularly relevant in the last 3 or 4 minutes.

Quote
Collins is not sure if men went to the moon. but he is sure they could not have faked it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGXTF6bs1IU

Thank You Dale, that was beyond awesome.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on May 25, 2014, 11:23 PM NHFT
so why dont people go there on vacation  if it is no big accomplishment?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on May 25, 2014, 11:47 PM NHFT
so why dont people go there on vacation  if it is no big accomplishment?

Government.  You can't launch a rocket larger than a toy without approval, or the best you can hope for is to be bankrupted by fines.  More likely, you'll be in prison.  If you actually manage to launch, they'll shoot you down.

There's a small level of sense to that - a rocket even smaller than that could deliver an atomic weapon to any place on the planet, and a rocket large enough to reach the moon could instead lift a large mass of weaponry to a Earth orbit.  Some sci-fi doomsday scenario, right there.

But that mostly represents their paranoia - that's what they would do with such an opportunity, so they cannot imagine that someone else would do otherwise.

The real threat is that folks would actually establish themselves on the moon, and declare themselves free.  Can't have a bunch of folks proving that voluntary society is possible, now can we?  Imagine a society where absolutely everyone there is only there because they volunteered to go.  None of this, "you were born within this border, so you are subject to this government."  Imagine a clean slate.  Imagine how much that terrifies Statists.  Deep down, they know that they are selling a load of garbage, and that a voluntary society would actually work, proving that they are worthless.

No, they won't allow it, unless they are in control.  It's a case of, "do it my way, or I won't let you do it at all."
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on May 26, 2014, 07:45 AM NHFT
so why dont people go there on vacation  if it is no big accomplishment?

Ya see how ya picked one phrase out of the guys argument, that confirmed your bias, and totally disregarded everything else he said.

The trip to the moon was actually a huge task and yielded little, which is why no one goes back.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on May 26, 2014, 01:36 PM NHFT
I didn't say I was fair. I was trying to be annoying. :)
they say they accomplished so much, but I agree that would be a ton of money and work .... to play some golf in the dust. :)
What I think is currently funny .... is that Bush promised they would go to the moon in 25 years and they are already behind schedule ...... they ain't never gunna make it.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 12, 2014, 05:55 PM NHFT
Conspiracy theorists actually think Michelle Obama is transgender after Joan Rivers joke

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2014/07/11/us-conspiracy-theorists-actually-think-michelle-obama-is-transgender-after-joan-rivers-joke/
11th July 2014, 6:15 PM
By Nick Duffy

Quote
Conspiracy theorists now actually believe that First Lady Michelle Obama is transgender, after Joan Rivers made a joke.

Rivers said last week: “You know Michelle is a tranny… She’s a transgender, we all know.”

Bucking calls to apologise, Rivers later said: “I think it’s a compliment. She’s so attractive, tall, with a beautiful body, great face, does great makeup… the most gorgeous women are transgender.”
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 12, 2014, 06:43 PM NHFT
If anyone is a Tranny, it would be Joan Rivers.

...and she is not funny.

...never has been.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 12, 2014, 10:02 PM NHFT
If anyone is a Tranny, it would be Joan Rivers.

...and she is not funny.

...never has been.

OK that's it... throw down, I can put up with a lot, but you insulting JOAN RIVERS!

 ;D

Wait a minute, bad plastic surgery and not funny bitch vs. Politburo, preachy bitch. I'd pay to see the Texas Chainsaws to the Death Cage Match.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 12, 2014, 10:26 PM NHFT
Conspiracy theorists actually think Michelle Obama is transgender after Joan Rivers joke

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2014/07/11/us-conspiracy-theorists-actually-think-michelle-obama-is-transgender-after-joan-rivers-joke/
11th July 2014, 6:15 PM
By Nick Duffy

Quote
Conspiracy theorists now actually believe that First Lady Michelle Obama is transgender, after Joan Rivers made a joke.

Rivers said last week: “You know Michelle is a tranny… She’s a transgender, we all know.”

Bucking calls to apologise, Rivers later said: “I think it’s a compliment. She’s so attractive, tall, with a beautiful body, great face, does great makeup… the most gorgeous women are transgender.”

So I read the article, Infowars, Alex Jones. He doesn't believe Michelle is a tranny, he just says whatever he thinks will get a reaction from his audience. Now that I think about it, I don't think Alex Jones believe much of anything he says, he's selling fear and preaching to his choir. Yeah, that's it. He's like one of those TV evangelists... Jim Baker couldn't have believed in the God he was selling. He would have been afraid of what that God would have thought of him ripping off old ladies pension money to buy his dog a luxury air conditioned dog house or paying for his prostitutes.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on July 13, 2014, 07:46 AM NHFT
If anyone is a Tranny, it would be Joan Rivers.

...and she is not funny.

...never has been.






But she has a certificate from the Board of Funny.  Are you doubting the validity of the certificate???!!!  Look she even knew Johnny Carson dammit.   ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 13, 2014, 09:56 AM NHFT
If anyone is a Tranny, it would be Joan Rivers.

...and she is not funny.

...never has been.






But she has a certificate from the Board of Funny.  Are you doubting the validity of the certificate???!!!  Look she even knew Johnny Carson dammit.   ;D

Must be a government certification.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 13, 2014, 10:03 AM NHFT
If anyone is a Tranny, it would be Joan Rivers.

...and she is not funny.

...never has been.

OK that's it... throw down, I can put up with a lot, but you insulting JOAN RIVERS!

 ;D

Wait a minute, bad plastic surgery and not funny bitch vs. Politburo, preachy bitch. I'd pay to see the Texas Chainsaws to the Death Cage Match.

Yeah, see now, that would be funny.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 13, 2014, 11:07 PM NHFT
If anyone is a Tranny, it would be Joan Rivers.

...and she is not funny.

...never has been.






But she has a certificate from the Board of Funny.  Are you doubting the validity of the certificate???!!!  Look she even knew Johnny Carson dammit.   ;D

5,000 comedians out of work and this guy is making jokes. Where's your permit to distribute jokes?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on July 14, 2014, 08:16 AM NHFT
I don't believe in permits to distribute jokes, but I'm afraid I'll get in trouble if I don't comply.

 I eke out a living by accepting charitable guffaws.  One time, a belly laugh was donated to me, but I had to pay like 34% to the IRS and fill out all kinds of forms to determine whether it was really a real belly laugh or just a sitcom laugh track.  Even smirks and chuckles are considered taxable unless you are in New Hampshire.   They don't tax smirks.  Live free or die!!!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 14, 2014, 09:22 AM NHFT
That's why I trade mostly in Backhanded and Deadpan, people can't even tell that I'm funny.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 14, 2014, 09:30 AM NHFT
That's why I trade mostly in Backhanded and Deadpan, people can't even tell that I'm funny.

It's true. I came very close to bursting into laughter at that comment but then I was like "Wait. Is that actually funny?"
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 14, 2014, 09:35 AM NHFT
That's it ya'll are involved in a conspiracy to comment tax evasion!  ;D

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 14, 2014, 09:57 AM NHFT
That's why I trade mostly in Backhanded and Deadpan, people can't even tell that I'm funny.

It's true. I came very close to bursting into laughter at that comment but then I was like "Wait. Is that actually funny?"

 :D ...wait,  :-\ that's not funny.  >:( Fuck You, Johnson.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Becky Thatcher on July 14, 2014, 10:28 PM NHFT
I don't believe in permits to distribute jokes, but I'm afraid I'll get in trouble if I don't comply.

 I eke out a living by accepting charitable guffaws.  One time, a belly laugh was donated to me, but I had to pay like 34% to the IRS and fill out all kinds of forms to determine whether it was really a real belly laugh or just a sitcom laugh track.  Even smirks and chuckles are considered taxable unless you are in New Hampshire.   They don't tax smirks.  Live free or die!!!

Or you could say Smirk Free or Die!!! ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 14, 2014, 10:32 PM NHFT
I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me comedy or give me death!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on July 16, 2014, 07:12 AM NHFT
That's why I trade mostly in Backhanded and Deadpan, people can't even tell that I'm funny.


The reason I've pulled you over Mr. Johnson is there seems to be a problem with your Funny License.  Would you step out of the car please and keep your hands where I can see them? 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 16, 2014, 08:15 AM NHFT
That's why I trade mostly in Backhanded and Deadpan, people can't even tell that I'm funny.


The reason I've pulled you over Mr. Johnson is there seems to be a problem with your Funny License.  Would you step out of the car please and keep your hands where I can see them?

Hey, that's a nice uniform there officer, how many circus tents is that?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on July 16, 2014, 12:27 PM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-0TEJMJOhk
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 16, 2014, 10:51 PM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-0TEJMJOhk

Oh, they're gonna take Weird Al's funny license fo sho now.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 16, 2014, 10:58 PM NHFT
I told ya it all comes down to the shape shifters, dang lizard people.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on July 17, 2014, 07:28 AM NHFT
^^^^ Excuse me sir?  We don't say "dang" in Maine.  It's just not right, not even when speaking about the lizard people.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 17, 2014, 12:09 PM NHFT
^^^^ Excuse me sir?  We don't say "dang" in Maine.  It's just not right, not even when speaking about the lizard people.

And now everyone gets to see why your license to practice comedy was revoked!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on July 18, 2014, 05:42 PM NHFT
^^^ You just wait....Mr. Johnson's gonna teach me to deadpan...then you'll see!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 18, 2014, 07:03 PM NHFT
awesome video
although weird al beat us to that joke again

when are we doing the tinfoil hat convention?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 18, 2014, 07:30 PM NHFT
^^^ You just wait....Mr. Johnson's gonna teach me to deadpan...then you'll see!

No so fast. He also needs a license to teach comedy.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 18, 2014, 09:59 PM NHFT
This month's civil disobedience will be teaching comedy without a license at the Tin Foil Hat Convention. EPIC and HEROIC!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on July 19, 2014, 07:43 AM NHFT
I lost my tin foil hat.  Can I wear an old metal bed pan? 

Maybe we could get Mr. Johnson to do a seminar...."dead pan with a bed pan". 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 19, 2014, 05:57 PM NHFT
I hear they sell them at Walmart. They come in boxes of about 20. Some assembly required.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 20, 2014, 10:11 AM NHFT
tinfoil hats or bedpans for the deadpanners
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on July 20, 2014, 07:35 PM NHFT
Think of the radio reception we'll be able to get!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 20, 2014, 08:54 PM NHFT
now they can kill us with radio waves
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on August 02, 2014, 09:00 AM NHFT
More I-don't-understand-it-so-it-really-scares-me anti-GMO hysteria.

(http://i.imgur.com/D7LMnvF.png) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGLWDGXgs88)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on August 04, 2014, 08:52 AM NHFT
I don't have to understand GMO s to hate them.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on August 04, 2014, 09:14 AM NHFT
I don't have to understand GMO s to hate them.

Considering how much hate is founded in not understanding something (or someone), I would have a hard time debating you on that point.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on August 04, 2014, 09:41 AM NHFT
Almost everything you eat is a GMO.  Humans have been selectively breeding plants and animals for thousands of years, and the food we now have bears little resemblance to what it once was.

If you actually hate GMO's, there are few, if any, grains that you can eat.  Beef, pork, chicken, etc. are all out.  Basically, only things that are not farmed by humans would be acceptable.  Wild-shot duck would work (but not duck from a farm - all commercial duck breeds are the result of selective breeding), as would snake and most lizards.  Wild venison or boar.  Etc.  But pretty much nothing you get at normal restaurants or grocery stores is absent genetic modification by humanity.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on August 04, 2014, 06:15 PM NHFT
I remember learning about Gregor Mendel's selectively-bred peas when I was about 12. Mendel documented the genetics of what humans had been doing for a couple-three thousand years: selectively breeding crops and animals.

I also remember seeing the sky full of jet contrails when I was a kid, and they weren't poisoning us or our crops.  ;)

We grew hybrid "Kandy Korn" sweet corn when I was a kid (awesome stuff!). Hybrids are as old as mules.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on August 05, 2014, 09:06 AM NHFT
The GMOs they are talking about have only been around since the 1970s.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetically_modified_organism
Quote
A genetically modified organism (GMO) is an organism whose genetic material has been altered using genetic engineering techniques.

...

Genetic engineering, the direct manipulation of genes, was first accomplished by Herbert Boyer and Stanley Cohen in 1973.[8] Advances have allowed scientists to manipulate, remove, and add genes to a variety of different organisms to induce a range of different traits. Since 1976 the technology has been commercialized, with companies producing and selling genetically modified food and medicine.




Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on August 05, 2014, 10:06 AM NHFT
"If it wasn't for mutation, we'd still be amoeba"

- Nuclear physicist Ed Teller.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on August 05, 2014, 09:16 PM NHFT
it's a conspiracy
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: MaineShark on August 05, 2014, 11:58 PM NHFT
The GMOs they are talking about have only been around since the 1970s.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetically_modified_organism
Quote
A genetically modified organism (GMO) is an organism whose genetic material has been altered using genetic engineering techniques.

The difference being that direct manipulation is faster than waiting for the same gene to appear through mutation.

But the result is still the same: a chain of DNA that results in a particular organism, with particular traits.

Direct manipulation allows for benefits (or mistakes) to be derived much more quickly than selective breeding.  Hence, it should be used with care, in the same way that driving requires more care than walking.

It makes no sense to "hate" GMO's, just like it makes no sense to "hate" wheels.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on August 06, 2014, 07:50 AM NHFT
I'll take door number 3.   I hate GMO wheels.  They just don't roll the same.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on August 08, 2014, 04:27 AM NHFT
Just make sure you use organic wheels, and you won't have to worry if they are GMOs.

I saw a poll recently that showed over 40% of medical marijuana patient want their weed to be organic. I get not wanting pesticides sprayed all over your food/weed, but I am not sure that plants care how they get nutrients.

I am going to take a class to see if they can show me the light.

http://www.mmcm-online.org/index.php/events
Quote
*Part 5: Organic Gardening
 
Learn why organically grown medicine is important and the only way
for some patients to use safely.
Our guest speaker will discuss the benefits & basics or growing
organically & how to amend soil.
There will be time allotted for questions relevant to the class
discussion. 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on August 08, 2014, 10:08 AM NHFT
^^^ Don't we need a license or something to say a product is "organic"  ?    ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on August 08, 2014, 01:39 PM NHFT
Certified. I wouldn't bother with that. It only applies to dispensaries in Maine.

I picked up some veganic nutrients at the grow store today.

http://www.maine.gov/dhhs/dlrs/mmm/documents/MMMP-Rules-144c122.pdf
Quote
1.26 Organic. Organic means certified by an accredited organic certifier in the State of Maine as being in compliance with the United States Department of Agriculture certification requirements applying to organic products.

...
2.7.4 Registered dispensary cultivation of marijuana. The registered dispensary that has been designated by a qualifying patient to cultivate marijuana for the patient's medical use must keep all plants in an enclosed, locked facility unless the plants or paraphernalia are being transported between the retail location of the registered dispensary and the dispensary’s cultivation site. For the purposes of this section only, the number of plants that may be cultivated in an enclosed outdoor area may not exceed thirty.
2.7.4.1 Access by registered cardholders. Access to the enclosed, locked facility is limited to a registered cardholder who is a principal officer, board member, or employee of a registered dispensary when acting in his or her official capacity.
2.7.4.2 RESERVED
2.7.4.3 Organic certification. Marijuana for medical use may not be labeled “organic” unless the marijuana plants and prepared marijuana are produced, processed, and certified to be consistent with national organic standards in compliance with the laws and regulations promulgated by the United States Department of Agriculture.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on August 08, 2014, 04:59 PM NHFT
^^^ Don't we need a license or something to say a product is "organic"  ?    ;D

Well, you need a license to say a product is OrGREENiC ™.  Too bad that there isn't anyone who can revoke that license, because their products are J-U-N-K!

(http://centsablecouponlady.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/orgreenic_thumb.png)

(http://www.joans5starreviews.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/orgreenic.png)

(http://www.scambook.com/file/proof/mid.Orgreenic-Complaint-Image-b1ddf1488805c6a9c7411d9d8594b83e.png)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on August 09, 2014, 01:11 PM NHFT
John Stossel did a spot on organic food. I seem to recall there are far more problems with people getting sick from eating fruits and veges with fecal matter on them than food with pesticides.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on August 09, 2014, 05:45 PM NHFT
On the topic of GMOs I think that selective breeding or implanting specific genes from the selected plants to speed up the process is one thing. Implanting genes from other species to impart traits like insecticidal properties etc. are potentially a little more problematic.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on August 09, 2014, 05:56 PM NHFT
 :hammer: .... Back on topic, people!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on August 10, 2014, 09:17 AM NHFT
John Stossel did a spot on organic food. I seem to recall there are far more problems with people getting sick from eating fruits and veges with fecal matter on them than food with pesticides.


   My Uncle smoked three packs a day and there's nothing wrong with his lung (singular) .

 

   
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on August 10, 2014, 09:48 AM NHFT
John Stossel did a spot on organic food. I seem to recall there are far more problems with people getting sick from eating fruits and veges with fecal matter on them than food with pesticides.


   My Uncle smoked three packs a day and there's nothing wrong with his lung (singular).

A Staff Sergeant once told me, "Anyone can quit smoking, it takes a man to face cancer!" He's probably dead now.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on August 10, 2014, 01:41 PM NHFT
A Staff Sargent once told me, "If you caught VD from a toilet seat, that was a hell of a place to take your girlfriend."
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on August 11, 2014, 06:37 PM NHFT
John Stossel did a spot on organic food. I seem to recall there are far more problems with people getting sick from eating fruits and veges with fecal matter on them than food with pesticides.
I can see that .... guess you have to wash everything :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on August 11, 2014, 06:38 PM NHFT
On the topic of GMOs I think that selective breeding or implanting specific genes from the selected plants to speed up the process is one thing. Implanting genes from other species to impart traits like insecticidal properties etc. are potentially a little more problematic.
that makes sense to me
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on August 11, 2014, 06:41 PM NHFT
John Stossel did a spot on organic food. I seem to recall there are far more problems with people getting sick from eating fruits and veges with fecal matter on them than food with pesticides.


   My Uncle smoked three packs a day and there's nothing wrong with his lung (singular).

A Staff Sergeant once told me, "Anyone can quit smoking, it takes a man to face cancer!" He's probably dead now.
is part of the training to make you obey even if nothing I say makes any sense?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on August 11, 2014, 06:43 PM NHFT
:hammer: .... Back on topic, people!
was that proposing conspiracies or making fun of conspiracies, or conspiring
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on August 11, 2014, 06:44 PM NHFT
John Stossel did a spot on organic food. I seem to recall there are far more problems with people getting sick from eating fruits and veges with fecal matter on them than food with pesticides.


   My Uncle smoked three packs a day and there's nothing wrong with his lung (singular) .

 

   
stop .... you are killing me
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 16, 2014, 11:13 PM NHFT
Just watched a documentary called "Mirage Men". It's about how the Air Force and other gooberment agencies fostered UFO conspiracy talk to discredit people discovering secret technology programs.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on September 17, 2014, 11:34 AM NHFT
So wait a minute, those little green men that abducted me were in the Air Force??

Fucking government!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on September 17, 2014, 12:28 PM NHFT
Just watched a documentary called "Mirage Men". It's about how the Air Force and other gooberment agencies fostered UFO conspiracy talk to discredit people discovering secret technology programs.

If you want to view it, it is available for $4.99 at mirageman.com.

The 3 minute trailer is also there, but it runs better on youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yn4jEiUHdZE

A late, great uncle of mine was an incidental character in the famous 1964 UFO sighting in Exeter, NH.  I never met him and only recently learned of his involvement.  That sighting is regarded as perhaps the best documented UFO sighting ever, since there were a few independent observations made from different vantage points by professionally reliable observers...  but because of the proximity to Pease Airbase, I still think it was just a military test of something
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 20, 2014, 04:23 PM NHFT
http://youtu.be/GfK5EvN7S94?t=1m50s
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 24, 2014, 11:37 PM NHFT
Just watched a documentary called "Mirage Men". It's about how the Air Force and other gooberment agencies fostered UFO conspiracy talk to discredit people discovering secret technology programs.
makes sense
I spent a weekend in Boron California in college and imagined what people thought of those B2 stealth bombers for the years that plane "didn't exist" officially.
When one of those buzzes you under the radar .... that my friend is a UFO
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 25, 2014, 10:16 AM NHFT
When one of those buzzes you under the radar .... that my friend is a UFO

One of my pet peeves is how "UFO" has become a lazy term for an alien spaceship. "Do you believe in UFOs?" is such a silly question. Do I believe in Unidentified Flying Objects? Has anyone ever seen something that was flying and not known what it was? I myself have seen flying objects and did not know what they were. So, yes. Of course I believe in UFOs.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 25, 2014, 01:30 PM NHFT
exactly
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on August 19, 2015, 06:41 PM NHFT
An Open Letter to Conspiracy Theorists (http://thedesertlynx.com/2015/08/19/an-open-letter-to-conspiracy-theorists/)
 JOËL VALENZUELA (http://thedesertlynx.com/author/the-desert-lynx/)

I liked his intro...  ;D

Quote
Dear Mr. Conspiracy Theorist,
You need help. No wait, that didn’t sound right. I apologize. What I meant to say is, you’re right about everything. Except you aren’t. About most things. But you still are… Argh, this isn’t working.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on August 20, 2015, 06:37 AM NHFT
An Open Letter to Conspiracy Theorists (http://thedesertlynx.com/2015/08/19/an-open-letter-to-conspiracy-theorists/)
 JOËL VALENZUELA (http://thedesertlynx.com/author/the-desert-lynx/)

I liked his intro...  ;D

Quote
Dear Mr. Conspiracy Theorist,
You need help. No wait, that didn’t sound right. I apologize. What I meant to say is, you’re right about everything. Except you aren’t. About most things. But you still are… Argh, this isn’t working.

So that's the real conspiracy?  It's not just individuals who are trying to sell you stuff.... it's 'The World Elite' that's trying to sell you stuff.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on August 20, 2015, 09:52 AM NHFT
I have fallen off the end of the flat earth recently. I am starting to believe almost every conspiracy theory.

Saw a good presentation about Sandy Hook from a nice lady. The good news is that they didn't have to kill any children to shove the anti-gun agenda down our throats this time. :)

Getting ready to watch one by a black guy who I think is going to tell me that noone died in that Church in the Charleston. Really bad acting by the fake families.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jaqeboy on August 20, 2015, 12:24 PM NHFT
Rusel, did you see this article? What do you think of this? I haven't read the full interview yet.

http://www.dcclothesline.com/2014/06/15/sandy-hook-redux-obama-officials-confirm-drill-children-died/
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on August 20, 2015, 03:52 PM NHFT
...One of my pet peeves is how "UFO" has become a lazy term for an alien spaceship. "Do you believe in UFOs?" is such a silly question. Do I believe in Unidentified Flying Objects? Has anyone ever seen something that was flying and not known what it was? I myself have seen flying objects and did not know what they were. So, yes. Of course I believe in UFOs.

From The Simpsons:

Pilot, seeing Bart's box kite hovering above the runway: "Unidentified flying object at 2 O'clock."

Co-pilot:  "I have a digital watch.  I don't know what that means."
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on August 21, 2015, 06:06 PM NHFT
An Open Letter to Conspiracy Theorists (http://thedesertlynx.com/2015/08/19/an-open-letter-to-conspiracy-theorists/)
 JOËL VALENZUELA (http://thedesertlynx.com/author/the-desert-lynx/)

I liked his intro...  ;D

Quote
Dear Mr. Conspiracy Theorist,
You need help. No wait, that didn’t sound right. I apologize. What I meant to say is, you’re right about everything. Except you aren’t. About most things. But you still are… Argh, this isn’t working.

"...alien globalist Rothschild Bilderberg New World Order Illuminati lizard Jews (did I miss one?)"

He wisely avoided naming the Schnergenbergers.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on August 21, 2015, 06:31 PM NHFT
An Open Letter to Conspiracy Theorists (http://thedesertlynx.com/2015/08/19/an-open-letter-to-conspiracy-theorists/)
 JOËL VALENZUELA (http://thedesertlynx.com/author/the-desert-lynx/)

I liked his intro...  ;D

Quote
Dear Mr. Conspiracy Theorist,
You need help. No wait, that didn’t sound right. I apologize. What I meant to say is, you’re right about everything. Except you aren’t. About most things. But you still are… Argh, this isn’t working.

"...alien globalist Rothschild Bilderberg New World Order Illuminati lizard Jews (did I miss one?)"

He wisely avoided naming the Schnergenbergers.

I can't believe you are taking that chance!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on August 22, 2015, 05:50 PM NHFT
Rusel, did you see this article? What do you think of this? I haven't read the full interview yet.

http://www.dcclothesline.com/2014/06/15/sandy-hook-redux-obama-officials-confirm-drill-children-died/
I will check it out.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 20, 2016, 02:31 PM NHFT
aha here is where we were talking such politically incorrect info such as the flat earth :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on June 20, 2016, 05:10 PM NHFT
Puritans are the ones who totally destroy a movement.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 20, 2016, 10:23 PM NHFT
what would you call modern day puritans?

I am watching the iss feed on tv. They are all standing funny with wires holding them. They can't turn around only turn side to side carefully.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on June 21, 2016, 07:47 AM NHFT
Puritans are the ones who totally destroy a movement.

 It's their hats isn't it? 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 21, 2016, 07:51 AM NHFT
or do Puritan Movements destroy other things?
or is it Puritans in a movement?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on June 21, 2016, 12:04 PM NHFT
Puritans are the ones who totally destroy a movement.

 It's their hats isn't it?

In Seinfeld, when George was trying to convert to Latvian Orthodox the Priest asked him what he liked about their religion, he said, "The hats, they're very pious."  ;D

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on June 21, 2016, 07:20 PM NHFT
The Puritans are the ones calling other members kooks and working actively to remove those members.

...and they don't wear identifying hats because they're not proud of what they do.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 21, 2016, 07:30 PM NHFT
I can see that.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 22, 2016, 10:24 AM NHFT
this has a bunch of the fake ISS footage in it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5e-RnKAN9qY
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on June 23, 2016, 07:51 AM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/HhL9h1v.gif)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on June 23, 2016, 08:48 AM NHFT
 ^^^  Wait a minute.  There's an "anti-Bob"  ?   I'm a little hurt.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on June 23, 2016, 09:15 AM NHFT
(http://www.subgenius.com/scatalog/art/MISC/bumpersticker/I'M_MAD_TOO_BOB.jpg)

Praise Bob... Everyone knows that Bob Dobbs is the one true way!

(https://41.media.tumblr.com/03e401c1862d73d95cff8af191ac950a/tumblr_nxk8npFDxo1s33x5zo1_500.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on June 23, 2016, 10:00 AM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/HhL9h1v.gif)

You'll notice how none of these are striking the root.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on June 23, 2016, 10:49 AM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/HhL9h1v.gif)

I thought you were the seven bladed wind breaker.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on June 23, 2016, 10:53 AM NHFT
Russell spreading chemtrails through America:

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/79/Diesel-smoke.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 23, 2016, 07:30 PM NHFT
if my truck looked like that, I would have to head to the shop
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 27, 2016, 12:04 AM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msY3xc8pVLE
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on June 27, 2016, 04:00 PM NHFT
http://www.atlanteanconspiracy.com
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on June 27, 2016, 04:13 PM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFcByg_1L5A
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 27, 2016, 05:46 PM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msY3xc8pVLE
every time I tried to put text with this last night it would crash
I like most of the ideas in this video :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 27, 2016, 05:49 PM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFcByg_1L5A
first thought
I can't take anything seriously from a smug longhaired cat :)

did they really not use the term Bermuda Triangle until 1964 that is surprising to me.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 27, 2016, 11:17 PM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9ksbh88OJs
Proving the Earth is not Flat - Part 1 - The Horizon
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 30, 2016, 11:27 AM NHFT
Do you agree with this guy
https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4338
that nobody has ever really thought the earth was flat?

I find most of these articles interesting ... even the guys who really disagree with me.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on June 30, 2016, 12:36 PM NHFT
"Biblical literalism and alternative science"
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on June 30, 2016, 04:06 PM NHFT
"Biblical literalism and alternative science"

Those were my twin majors!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 30, 2016, 11:21 PM NHFT
that phrase hit me too
he said this guy had a strange combination of those two
I find that every biblical literalist is always outside the mainstream on science also :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 01, 2016, 09:12 AM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/0z2F1um.png)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on July 01, 2016, 09:30 AM NHFT
 I think basketballs are flat.     No wait....it's just out of air.  Never mind.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 01, 2016, 01:50 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/0z2F1um.png)
good one
for me it only applies to the federal government .... I usually do the opposite of whatever agenda they are pushing this week.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 02, 2016, 01:48 AM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KwuIs40u60w

what is the flat earth myth?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 02, 2016, 03:34 PM NHFT
Russell, do you have any SHORT videos that explain your stuff?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 02, 2016, 04:34 PM NHFT
Russell, do you have any SHORT videos that explain your stuff?

Long and convoluted.... a necessity it is.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 02, 2016, 04:41 PM NHFT
DISCLAIMER: I haven't actually watched this yet but it's in my queue. Let me know if it's any good. If anyone can convert me to the ways of the Flat-Earthers, CC can!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XiSQUc1vG0I
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 02, 2016, 05:35 PM NHFT
DISCLAIMER: I haven't actually watched this yet but it's in my queue. Let me know if it's any good. If anyone can convert me to the ways of the Flat-Earthers, CC can!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XiSQUc1vG0I

Carol Channing?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 02, 2016, 05:56 PM NHFT
Russell, do you have any SHORT videos that explain your stuff?
oh
I had been purposely posting really long ones thinking some of you guys would like the long thorough thought out ones.
let me see....
oh explain what stuff?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 02, 2016, 06:11 PM NHFT
here is a flat earth video that contains nothing that I agree with ... but it is short and he has a funny accent
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-JYXRrPkFg
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 02, 2016, 06:40 PM NHFT
https://youtu.be/IJhgZBn-LHg?t=16m50s

about 2 minutes of how he thinks earth moves ... pretty cool. I think I have seen a longer version somewhere too.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 02, 2016, 06:52 PM NHFT
this is short .... just some pictures

do an image search of satellites and earth from space and you get some really funny stuff.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 02, 2016, 07:08 PM NHFT
short and loud
could ruin it for the rest of us
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TG60oV6JdqI
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 03, 2016, 01:45 AM NHFT
this is short .... just some pictures

do an image search of satellites and earth from space and you get some really funny stuff.

If the earth is flat... but there are camera floating in space, what does the underside of the earth look like?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jay on July 03, 2016, 08:28 AM NHFT
this is short .... just some pictures

do an image search of satellites and earth from space and you get some really funny stuff.

If the earth is flat... but there are camera floating in space, what does the underside of the earth look like?

Is there another side in 2D?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 03, 2016, 09:26 AM NHFT
this is short .... just some pictures

do an image search of satellites and earth from space and you get some really funny stuff.

If the earth is flat... but there are camera floating in space, what does the underside of the earth look like?

Is there another side in 2D?

Yeah, ya see how you ruined everything and now all the children of the Earth will perish?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on July 03, 2016, 10:03 AM NHFT
this is short .... just some pictures

do an image search of satellites and earth from space and you get some really funny stuff.

If the earth is flat... but there are camera floating in space, what does the underside of the earth look like?


 "That's a helluva question", Bob fired back.    (pun intended) (pitchfork and flame emoticon)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on July 03, 2016, 11:37 AM NHFT
There is a dome called the firmament that covers the flat earth. The sun and moon are around 3000 miles high on the inside of the dome. The stars are 100 miles above that, inside the dome.

But satellites can't go outside the dome, so they can't see the bottom.

And the people who control the satellites are in on the hoax.

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-kpO7Ne9XVz8/Vl83uLLkbSI/AAAAAAAAAg0/V9Rkb8FOoLw/s1600/firmament.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 03, 2016, 11:58 AM NHFT
There is a dome called the firmament that covers the flat earth. The sun and moon are around 3000 miles high on the inside of the dome. The stars are 100 miles above that, inside the dome.

But satellites can't go outside the dome, so they can't see the bottom.

And the people who control the satellites are in on the hoax.

You are killing the children, too.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 03, 2016, 12:48 PM NHFT
this is short .... just some pictures

do an image search of satellites and earth from space and you get some really funny stuff.

If the earth is flat... but there are camera floating in space, what does the underside of the earth look like?
yea I don't think there are any cameras that get above 120000 feet or so. I think all of those "earth from space" photos are cgi.
have you seen all the cool camera shots they have from guys sending up balloons and such lately?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 03, 2016, 02:12 PM NHFT
this is short .... just some pictures

do an image search of satellites and earth from space and you get some really funny stuff.

If the earth is flat... but there are camera floating in space, what does the underside of the earth look like?
yea I don't think there are any cameras that get above 120000 feet or so. I think all of those "earth from space" photos are cgi.
have you seen all the cool camera shots they have from guys sending up balloons and such lately?

What is the significants of 120,000 feet? blackie just claimed 16,368,000 feet.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on July 03, 2016, 02:42 PM NHFT
That is about how high a helium balloon can go.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 03, 2016, 04:16 PM NHFT
That is about how high a helium balloon can go.

You trust helium but rockets are a bunch of hoowee that couldn't go that high?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on July 03, 2016, 05:00 PM NHFT
I like rockets.

They can go higher than balloons. They can crash into the firmament, so I have heard.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IAcp3BFBYw4
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 03, 2016, 06:16 PM NHFT
Russell, blackies not help'en.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 03, 2016, 06:44 PM NHFT
it does seem like the rockets have a similar ceiling
I don't know about the height ... just going by the data I have seen so far
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 03, 2016, 07:38 PM NHFT
I finally finished the documentary Tom Sawyer referenced last year "Mirage Men"
it is so sad to see people who want to believe in something like UFOs so bad that they will believe lies from government workers
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 03, 2016, 07:44 PM NHFT
movie trailer
http://freemindfilms.com/films/shadowring/
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 03, 2016, 11:23 PM NHFT

(http://i.imgur.com/9c89K0r.png) (http://liberaldarkness.com/2015/07/04/gays-are-lacing-fireworks-with-homosexual-chemtrails/)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 03, 2016, 11:34 PM NHFT
OK... I'm officially done with thread unless someone says something completely stupid.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 04, 2016, 07:28 AM NHFT
Something completely stupid.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 04, 2016, 10:19 AM NHFT
Russell, blackies not help'en.
I agree with some of the stuff he is postin'
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 04, 2016, 10:20 AM NHFT
OK... I'm officially done with thread unless someone says something completely stupid.
does that mean that the conspiracy kooks are hurting the movement .... or that you agree with all the stuff in the thread?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 04, 2016, 10:28 AM NHFT
OK... I'm officially done with thread unless someone says something completely stupid.
does that mean that the conspiracy kooks are hurting the movement .... or that you agree with all the stuff in the thread?

no.... In the words of The Immortal Lloyd, "Damn-it, entertain me!"
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 04, 2016, 11:17 AM NHFT
did I say something stupid enough that you rejoined the thread? haha

nuts .... when I try to trap Johnson into choosing between two wrong answers .... he refuses

I bet you will not be voting for Hillary or Trump either
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 04, 2016, 01:40 PM NHFT
did I say something stupid enough that you rejoined the thread? haha

nuts .... when I try to trap Johnson into choosing between two wrong answers .... he refuses

I bet you will not be voting for Hillary or Trump either

Dalebert had the correct answer.

As for the upcoming Presidential race.... I see it as a choice between suicide, self-murder, or self-immolation.... so I'm leaning heavily towards abstention.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on July 04, 2016, 02:12 PM NHFT
There is a dome called the firmament that covers the flat earth. The sun and moon are around 3000 miles high on the inside of the dome. The stars are 100 miles above that, inside the dome.

But satellites can't go outside the dome, so they can't see the bottom.

And the people who control the satellites are in on the hoax.

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-kpO7Ne9XVz8/Vl83uLLkbSI/AAAAAAAAAg0/V9Rkb8FOoLw/s1600/firmament.jpg)

Oh, right! I've seen that documentary!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3gI9ms8Fdc
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 04, 2016, 02:14 PM NHFT
yes this election really is feeding us conspiracy kooks
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 04, 2016, 07:54 PM NHFT
Dalebert had the correct answer.

As usual.  :icon_farao:
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 04, 2016, 10:51 PM NHFT
Dalebert had the correct answer.

As usual.  :icon_farao:

Smiley Tut    ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 05, 2016, 12:10 AM NHFT
OK... I'm officially done with thread unless someone says something completely stupid.

How am I doing now?

(http://i.imgur.com/OodYDRZ.png) (https://atruthsoldier.com/2012/11/29/two-giant-underwater-crystal-pyramids-discovered-in-the-center-of-the-bermuda-triangle/)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 05, 2016, 08:21 AM NHFT
Facebook just reminded me of this post I made last year.

Most of what he says in this article will resonate perfectly with libertarians, but I can't resist the temptation to take this one quote out of context--"...rebellion for the sake of rebellion is as much a form of slavery as conformity. The magnet that pushes manipulates as much as the magnet that pulls—either way, an outside force is doing the moving."

We already know to question authority, but why don't we question everyone else? Liberty folk can be incredibly naive and gullible as long as the potentially outrageous claims are about governments or something touched by governments. If it's about 9/11 being an elaborate government conspiracy, vaccines causing autism, or juice boxes making us gay, many buy it without even investigating the validity or evidence of such claims.

(http://i.imgur.com/qUfqHOY.png) (http://www.vice.com/read/my-dad-gene-simmons-is-full-of-shit-and-so-are-you-628)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 05, 2016, 09:19 AM NHFT
you can watch the cartoon live
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Uayu5LvdTk
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on July 05, 2016, 05:27 PM NHFT
Facebook just reminded me of this post I made last year.

Oh, that must be why I saw it again today.


Quote
...juice boxes making us gay

I knew it!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 05, 2016, 05:46 PM NHFT
you going to stick with the SL Cardinals here in BoSoxs territory KB?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on July 08, 2016, 06:08 PM NHFT
you going to stick with the SL Cardinals here in BoSoxs territory KB?

I married a Cubs fan, so I'm used to it.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 08, 2016, 09:49 PM NHFT
ah that is messed up

for fun
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMnAElMk048
film of earth from beyond the moon .... according to nasa
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 11, 2016, 10:20 AM NHFT
I just watched Independence Day and they were on the moon so I know it's 4rlz.

Hey, I'm dying to hear some Pokemon GO conspiracies. It's been out for 3 days. That should be enough for some resourceful conspiracy engineers to come up with something fun.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 11, 2016, 12:53 PM NHFT
I just watched Independence Day and they were on the moon so I know it's 4rlz.

Hey, I'm dying to hear some Pokemon GO conspiracies. It's been out for 3 days. That should be enough for some resourceful conspiracy engineers to come up with something fun.

You mean like it's just the Government's way to get people looking everywhere and finding dead bodies and drug hideouts.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 11, 2016, 01:28 PM NHFT
You mean like it's just the Government's way to get people looking everywhere and finding dead bodies and drug hideouts.

I figured the more obvious one is they're able to log and track everyone's location almost all the time, trivially. Not sure how useful that is when the metadata is corrupted, i.e. they're going places specifically for the game which is kind of meaningless as far as potential "terrorist activity" (or activism).

Oddly enough, I think this game might actually make the streets safer, at least for a while. I felt safer than I've ever felt at night in my neighborhood. Friendly people were everywhere to witness and potentially intervene in any crime, and frankly just discouraging crime by making an environment that's not conducive to it.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 11, 2016, 04:51 PM NHFT
BAM! You're welcome.

http://blackbag.gawker.com/pokemon-go-is-a-government-surveillance-psyop-conspirac-1783461240
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 11, 2016, 09:28 PM NHFT
BAM! You're welcome.

http://blackbag.gawker.com/pokemon-go-is-a-government-surveillance-psyop-conspirac-1783461240

Quote
getting more data, particularly that off the street and inside buildings,

Interesting this...
At a Post Production house I worked at we duplicated for the CIA and other Defense entities videos that were shot at one frame per second going through every hallway and room in stadiums, down the roads leading into cities such as Mogadishu etc. They used this footage for training purposes and incase of the need to send troops etc to places.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 12, 2016, 11:27 AM NHFT
At a Post Production house I worked at we duplicated for the CIA and other Defense entities videos that were shot at one frame per second going through every hallway and room in stadiums, down the roads leading into cities such as Mogadishu etc. They used this footage for training purposes and incase of the need to send troops etc to places.

Tom's the fed!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 12, 2016, 11:34 AM NHFT
see we already have a thread talking about how the feds are hurting the liberty movement
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 12, 2016, 12:05 PM NHFT
At a Post Production house I worked at we duplicated for the CIA and other Defense entities videos that were shot at one frame per second going through every hallway and room in stadiums, down the roads leading into cities such as Mogadishu etc. They used this footage for training purposes and incase of the need to send troops etc to places.

Tom's the fed!

You were too, Nuke boy!    ;D

This was after I stopped working in Defense contracting. I thought, "Hey, video will be a better, less evil use of my technical skills." Boy I couldn't have been more wrong. Political ads, videos for the alphabet soup of agencies... I still feel dirty.  ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 12, 2016, 05:37 PM NHFT
tom keeps washing his hands
we can't talk about what dale does
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 12, 2016, 06:08 PM NHFT
Nukemen...

The Batmens, the Supermens and the Nukemens....
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 13, 2016, 10:18 AM NHFT
Nukemen...

The Batmens, the Supermens and the Nukemens....

I can't remember the jewish comedian that did a bit about the manger scene... In a heavy yiddish accent, "Ahhh, the Wisemens, they bring such crappy gifts... Frankincense and myrrh, what's myrh?" 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on July 13, 2016, 01:33 PM NHFT
My favorite Jewish superhero is Spidermann.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 13, 2016, 01:39 PM NHFT
again with the myrrrh


could it be Mel Brooks History of the World?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Becky Thatcher on July 13, 2016, 02:05 PM NHFT
Nukemen...

The Batmens, the Supermens and the Nukemens....

I can't remember the jewish comedian that did a bit about the manger scene... In a heavy yiddish accent, "Ahhh, the Wisemens, they bring such crappy gifts... Frankincense and myrrh, what's myrh?"

It was Cathy Ladman.  Haven't seen much of her lately, but she was pretty funny.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on July 13, 2016, 02:12 PM NHFT
I guess myrrr has been involved in a lot of comedy.  Remember that off-beat religious show, Insight?  In one episode where Martin Sheen plays Adam and Flip Wilson plays God, Adam is bored by Eden because everything is perfect and God explains that it has to be that way because everything he makes is perfect and Adam says, ""Oh yeah"  Well, what about myrrr?" and God says, "What about it", and Adam says, "Have you ever smelled it?"

From Just Before Eve.  Original air date May 1, 1978. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0611433/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_168

Unfortunately, very few of the 263 episodes of that cool show are available to the public.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on July 13, 2016, 06:01 PM NHFT
I can't remember the jewish comedian that did a bit about the manger scene... In a heavy yiddish accent, "Ahhh, the Wisemens, they bring such crappy gifts... Frankincense and myrrh, what's myrh?"

Here's a Southern Baptist take that's pretty funny. ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e36rOU7Zw-8
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 13, 2016, 10:52 PM NHFT
ahhh more recent
I like her
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 14, 2016, 02:37 PM NHFT
You were too, Nuke boy!    ;D

That title is not necessarily accurate! I can neither confirm nor deny whether I worked on nukes.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 14, 2016, 03:09 PM NHFT
You were too, Nuke boy!    ;D

That title is not necessarily accurate! I can neither confirm nor deny whether I worked on nukes.

Plausible Deniability... the hallmark of a spook!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 14, 2016, 11:59 PM NHFT
exactly

btw I love this guy
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC3XjdiuLcckJCFg7q-2Bvfg
he is funny on flat earth or hoax discussion shows
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 16, 2016, 05:51 PM NHFT
Hey, I'm dying to hear some Pokemon GO conspiracies.

BAM!
https://youtu.be/g1O8NQVAo6k
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 16, 2016, 07:37 PM NHFT
He has covered Catherine Bleish (of NH and Austin fame) before, but she popped up in the MN hoax shooting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qkWy9W2aSg

they use her footage here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uh1WxxhTbUc

I don't remember her from the FSP in NH, but maybe I met her.
https://www.facebook.com/catbleish?fref=ts

He points a finger at a couple other members of the FSP, I am not sure about all of them.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 17, 2016, 10:36 AM NHFT
crazy eastern european flat earthers experimenting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNEUOnlcIAQ
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 17, 2016, 12:15 PM NHFT
crazy eastern european flat earthers experimenting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNEUOnlcIAQ

Why would a flatearther believe lasers?  They come from the same people who brought them a round earth.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 17, 2016, 11:49 PM NHFT
did they make them curve :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 18, 2016, 01:47 AM NHFT
(https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/beliefs.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 18, 2016, 09:09 AM NHFT
wait til we get trump the kook
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 24, 2016, 11:39 PM NHFT
since I started laughing part way through this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFMA5-aObzo
does that make me a kook?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on July 25, 2016, 06:24 AM NHFT
The three-eyed fish was a little silly. I guess they were trying to make a Simpsons joke.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 25, 2016, 08:57 AM NHFT
they showed that as inevitable
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on July 26, 2016, 07:54 PM NHFT
since I started laughing part way through this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFMA5-aObzo
does that make me a kook?

Really?  Earth 2?
You don't know any other words?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 26, 2016, 09:34 PM NHFT
is that what they called it?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 02, 2016, 08:41 AM NHFT
You know "Earth" means "dirt", right?

http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/08/31/nasa-astronauts-just-spent-a-year-pretending-to-be-on-mars
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 02, 2016, 01:07 PM NHFT
it never ends
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 02, 2016, 02:05 PM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EapikNusv58

nice music
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 04, 2016, 11:14 AM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/OxDmD5b.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 04, 2016, 12:19 PM NHFT
it could happen
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 04, 2016, 09:19 PM NHFT
Who owns the Plutonium?
How much is it worth?
How dangerous is it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEXG7h6kBOQ
he discusses this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanford_Site
he worked here

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 06, 2016, 03:51 PM NHFT
Hillary really is very ill though. That's not a conspiracy theory even though she's trying to cover it up by saying so.

https://warhorn.net/events/adventurers-of-southern-new-hampshire/schedule/2016/09/07/sessions/139901
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on September 06, 2016, 03:56 PM NHFT
Who owns the Plutonium?
How much is it worth?
How dangerous is it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEXG7h6kBOQ
he discusses this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanford_Site
he worked here

If plutonium isn't dangerous, cancer radiation therapy can't be dangerous either.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on September 06, 2016, 07:27 PM NHFT

If plutonium isn't dangerous, cancer radiation therapy can't be dangerous either.

...or drying your hair in a microwave oven.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Erroneous_Logic on September 06, 2016, 07:35 PM NHFT
Unless you have glasses with metal in the frames, of course!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 06, 2016, 08:07 PM NHFT
Unless you have glasses with metal in the frames, of course!

Wow, this place is wealth of useful knowledge. I'm off to speed dry my hair in the microwave.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Erroneous_Logic on September 06, 2016, 08:09 PM NHFT
I wish I could do that, but alas, my glasses betray me!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 06, 2016, 10:15 PM NHFT
I wish I could do that, but alas, my glasses betray me!

Dang, it didn't work so well for me either.

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/be/52/7c/be527cef74805c034ad05d0ac9321677.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on September 06, 2016, 10:18 PM NHFT
I wish I could do that, but alas, my glasses betray me!

Dang, it didn't work so well for me either.

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/be/52/7c/be527cef74805c034ad05d0ac9321677.jpg)

You have to have hair first.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 06, 2016, 11:25 PM NHFT
I wish I could do that, but alas, my glasses betray me!

Dang, it didn't work so well for me either.

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/be/52/7c/be527cef74805c034ad05d0ac9321677.jpg)

You have to have hair first.

Does anyone else find this a little mean?

 ;D ;D ;D

Dang evil cracker!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on September 07, 2016, 09:05 AM NHFT

  ^^^ He went right for the jocular vein there.   Tee hee. 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 07, 2016, 09:40 AM NHFT
The 5 most horrible pseudo-scientific, tin-foil-hatty things ever.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jvwq5hIpG50
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 07, 2016, 09:13 PM NHFT
The 5 most horrible pseudo-scientific, tin-foil-hatty things ever.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jvwq5hIpG50
I already believe #1
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 07, 2016, 09:17 PM NHFT
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Duesberg
and to be really politically incorrect ... you are a "deny" their stuff
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HIV/AIDS_denialism
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 07, 2016, 09:23 PM NHFT
oh good he tells you to contact the authorities about child abuse at 7min in.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 07, 2016, 09:25 PM NHFT
he doesn't like the "like cures like" idea .... but he thinks immunizations work
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 07, 2016, 09:28 PM NHFT
I guess I think there are worse 5 things out there :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on September 07, 2016, 10:26 PM NHFT
I guess I think there are worse 5 things out there :)

....like Sawyer being bald.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 07, 2016, 11:04 PM NHFT
 
I guess I think there are worse 5 things out there :)

....like Sawyer being bald.

 :'( :'( :'(

Somebody had to be Larry, Moe!

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/82/86/22/828622357d87c74ef697e5faeb16cd0b.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 07, 2016, 11:23 PM NHFT
last time I saw him ... he had some hair .... stop pulling his hair out moe
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Becky Thatcher on September 08, 2016, 08:18 AM NHFT
I guess I think there are worse 5 things out there :)

....like Sawyer being bald.

Hey...he's not bald....those are solar panels for a sex machine!!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 08, 2016, 08:36 AM NHFT
oh yeah
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jay on September 08, 2016, 02:20 PM NHFT
Folks in the "liberty movement", which is wholly ignorant of how crazy they seem to 99% of people, are complaining about crazy hurting their chances?

Perspective.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Erroneous_Logic on September 08, 2016, 02:24 PM NHFT
I would say that anyone who's been pro liberty in an open way for more than two weeks has pretty much realized that everyone thinks they're crazy.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 08, 2016, 02:27 PM NHFT
The "liberty movement", which is wholly ignorant of how crazy they seem to 99% of people, are complaining about crazy hurting their chances?

Perspective.

Well, if going to insist of talking on topic!

I think that the parallel is that there are plenty of topics that aren't all the way out (or beyond) the edge to resonate with others on. Some folks want to spent all their social capitol talking about the shape shifting lizard people.  ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 08, 2016, 02:30 PM NHFT
I would say that anyone who's been pro liberty in an open way for more than two weeks has pretty much realized that everyone thinks they're crazy.

I've connected with many people by not talking about current political BS and not using the catch phrases that trigger them to think that you are the "other".

Partisan politics is the root of most of the in ability to have a reasoned conversation with most folks. I think it is by design... keep us calling each other names instead of realizing who the enemy really is.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Erroneous_Logic on September 08, 2016, 02:38 PM NHFT
I would say that anyone who's been pro liberty in an open way for more than two weeks has pretty much realized that everyone thinks they're crazy.

I've connected with many people by not talking about current political BS and not using the catch phrases that trigger them to think that you are the "other".

Partisan politics is the root of most of the in ability to have a reasoned conversation with most folks. I think it is by design... keep us calling each other names instead of realizing who the enemy really is.

I wouldn't say it's necessarily 'by design', but rather, partisan politics evolved as a system that's able to maintain itself very well by having a sort of immune system that automatically attacks non partisan intruders.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jay on September 09, 2016, 12:46 AM NHFT
I would say that anyone who's been pro liberty in an open way for more than two weeks has pretty much realized that everyone thinks they're crazy.

I've connected with many people by not talking about current political BS and not using the catch phrases that trigger them to think that you are the "other".

Partisan politics is the root of most of the in ability to have a reasoned conversation with most folks. I think it is by design... keep us calling each other names instead of realizing who the enemy really is.

I wouldn't say it's necessarily 'by design', but rather, partisan politics evolved as a system that's able to maintain itself very well by having a sort of immune system that automatically attacks non partisan intruders.

Taking that thread and running with it, I think that "conspiracy theories" can be used to take advantage of people with more open minds (for fun and profit - Alex Jones sold a lot of edible dirt). Which is why there seems to be a greater than average amount of "them extra crazies" among us. If I was in the propaganda department of a government, I would purposely create outlandish CT's to lure those people in to keep the real secrets looking benign.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Erroneous_Logic on September 09, 2016, 12:50 AM NHFT
I'm pretty sure there's a fairly solid conspiracy theory that the CIA coined the term 'conspiracy theory' to ridicule people who questioned the official story as presented.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on September 09, 2016, 08:01 AM NHFT
I guess I think there are worse 5 things out there :)

....like Sawyer being bald.

Hey...he's not bald....those are solar panels for a sex machine!!

 Honest...this has never happened before...it must be those damn clouds (smiley emoticon)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 09, 2016, 11:29 AM NHFT
I guess I think there are worse 5 things out there :)

....like Sawyer being bald.

Hey...he's not bald....those are solar panels for a sex machine!!

 Honest...this has never happened before...it must be those damn clouds (smiley emoticon)

Clearly this is part of the Johnson Smear, Defame and Propagate Disinformation campaign! The JSDPD will not hesitate to manipulate your opinions to prevent my righteous, radical agenda! Johnson is second only to Alex Jones, who suspiciously has refused to even mention my efforts!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on September 09, 2016, 11:40 AM NHFT
I guess I think there are worse 5 things out there :)

....like Sawyer being bald.

Hey...he's not bald....those are solar panels for a sex machine!!

 Honest...this has never happened before...it must be those damn clouds (smiley emoticon)

Clearly this is part of the Johnson Smear, Defame and Propagate Disinformation campaign! The JSDPD will not hesitate to manipulate your opinions to prevent my righteous, radical agenda! Johnson is second only to Alex Jones, who suspiciously has refused to even mention my efforts!
I'm not taking second place to Alex Jones... I'm never mentioning it again!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 09, 2016, 03:08 PM NHFT
I guess I think there are worse 5 things out there :)

....like Sawyer being bald.

Hey...he's not bald....those are solar panels for a sex machine!!

 Honest...this has never happened before...it must be those damn clouds (smiley emoticon)

Clearly this is part of the Johnson Smear, Defame and Propagate Disinformation campaign! The JSDPD will not hesitate to manipulate your opinions to prevent my righteous, radical agenda! Johnson is second only to Alex Jones, who suspiciously has refused to even mention my efforts!
I'm not taking second place to Alex Jones... I'm never mentioning it again!

Diabolical! Again I am outwitted by Johnson.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 09, 2016, 09:59 PM NHFT
Folks in the "liberty movement", which is wholly ignorant of how crazy they seem to 99% of people, are complaining about crazy hurting their chances?

Perspective.
that is crazy talk
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 09, 2016, 10:01 PM NHFT
I agree with everything Tom is saying.
also ... if Johnson is going to keep running textual rings around us ... I am going to have to start pronouncing his name the same way that Jerry Seinfeld says "Hello Newman"
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 10, 2016, 12:38 PM NHFT
I've connected with many people by not talking about current political BS and not using the catch phrases that trigger them to think that you are the "other".

OMG, this! I think it's a side effect of all moving to one space where we're generally surrounded by fellow libertarians but we start to talk in libertarianese. It's fine to talk about "rape cages" and say "at the point of a gun" when you're not actually talking about someone literally drawing their gun and pointing it at you and crap around each other. We get it. But dropping those phrases around the muggles I think has the opposite of its intended effect.

(http://i.imgur.com/9AFmGz2.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on September 10, 2016, 03:04 PM NHFT
I've connected with many people by not talking about current political BS and not using the catch phrases that trigger them to think that you are the "other".

OMG, this! I think it's a side effect of all moving to one space where we're generally surrounded by fellow libertarians but we start to talk in libertarianese. It's fine to talk about "rape cages" and say "at the point of a gun" when you're not actually talking about someone literally drawing their gun and pointing it at you and crap around each other. We get it. But dropping those phrases around the muggles I think has the opposite of its intended effect.

(http://i.imgur.com/9AFmGz2.jpg)

Are the 'mind control agents' a flammable liquid or a gas.... or are they a strong oxidizer..... or an acid? I've made up a theory where it's a device or a chemical or something that neutralizes reality... in effect making it disappear. It made all the structural steel disappear.
As small air particles, it makes part of your brain disappear. It's made from really pretty people, especially sexy ones, which is why brain work around them.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 10, 2016, 03:52 PM NHFT
I've connected with many people by not talking about current political BS and not using the catch phrases that trigger them to think that you are the "other".

OMG, this! I think it's a side effect of all moving to one space where we're generally surrounded by fellow libertarians but we start to talk in libertarianese. It's fine to talk about "rape cages" and say "at the point of a gun" when you're not actually talking about someone literally drawing their gun and pointing it at you and crap around each other. We get it. But dropping those phrases around the muggles I think has the opposite of its intended effect.

(http://i.imgur.com/9AFmGz2.jpg)

Are the 'mind control agents' a flammable liquid or a gas.... or are they a strong oxidizer..... or an acid? I've made up a theory where it's a device or a chemical or something that neutralizes reality... in effect making it disappear. It made all the structural steel disappear.
As small air particles, it makes part of your brain disappear. It's made from really pretty people, especially sexy ones, which is why brain work around them.

I'll produce your Youtube video and we are on our way! Book deals, speaking engagements... Conspiracy Theory Alchemists. We can turn BS into gold!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on September 10, 2016, 04:36 PM NHFT
I like gold.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 11, 2016, 10:25 AM NHFT
I like gold.

As all pirates do.

(http://politicalgraffiti.com/nhfree/images/Shire-Boarding-Party.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jerryswife on September 11, 2016, 02:38 PM NHFT
I've connected with many people by not talking about current political BS and not using the catch phrases that trigger them to think that you are the "other".

OMG, this! I think it's a side effect of all moving to one space where we're generally surrounded by fellow libertarians but we start to talk in libertarianese. It's fine to talk about "rape cages" and say "at the point of a gun" when you're not actually talking about someone literally drawing their gun and pointing it at you and crap around each other. We get it. But dropping those phrases around the muggles I think has the opposite of its intended effect.

(http://i.imgur.com/9AFmGz2.jpg)

Or maybe the "agents" were people and they spontaneously combusted....
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 11, 2016, 03:16 PM NHFT
I've connected with many people by not talking about current political BS and not using the catch phrases that trigger them to think that you are the "other".

OMG, this! I think it's a side effect of all moving to one space where we're generally surrounded by fellow libertarians but we start to talk in libertarianese. It's fine to talk about "rape cages" and say "at the point of a gun" when you're not actually talking about someone literally drawing their gun and pointing it at you and crap around each other. We get it. But dropping those phrases around the muggles I think has the opposite of its intended effect.

(http://i.imgur.com/9AFmGz2.jpg)

Or maybe the "agents" were people and they spontaneously combusted....

I like that one...
See, I think the more outrageous the theory the better traction it will get.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on September 11, 2016, 04:19 PM NHFT
  I'm pretty burnt right now, but it was hardly spontaneous.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 11, 2016, 06:12 PM NHFT
man I can't pack all this stuff into my head .... and that chemtrail container I was given last time I visited the Feds
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 12, 2016, 04:42 PM NHFT
  I'm pretty burnt right now, but it was hardly spontaneous.

Toasted is preferable to burnt.  ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on September 13, 2016, 02:00 AM NHFT
  I'm pretty burnt right now, but it was hardly spontaneous.

Toasted is preferable to burnt.  ;D

Or if you're in the South, "ruirnt".
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on September 13, 2016, 08:30 AM NHFT
So when seeking toasted, if you get to burnt, you ruirnt it ?  Dang!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on September 13, 2016, 09:46 AM NHFT
I like my toast extra burnt.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on September 13, 2016, 10:35 AM NHFT
I like my toast extra burnt.

  If you put the right kind of butter on it, you'll get ruirnt.  (That's my new favorite word now)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 13, 2016, 02:21 PM NHFT
I like my toast extra burnt.

Carbonized.

I carbonized franks and beans one time. Fell asleep on the coach, they were on low for a couple of hours. Perfectly carbonized, charcoal franks and beans.  ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 14, 2016, 09:32 AM NHFT
"asleep on the coach" is NSA code for
down in my underground communication tunnels
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 14, 2016, 09:33 AM NHFT
Here's some fuel for conspiracy theories.

http://digg.com/video/high-dynamic-nasa-rocket-booster?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=kw&kwp_0=196996
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 14, 2016, 09:48 AM NHFT
I have seen a lot of the footage from the side of a rocket that looks just plain goofy
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 14, 2016, 11:29 AM NHFT
"Was 9 Eleven An Inside Freaking Job?" by Creationist Cat

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52a-xR2HCA8

He mentions the Jew Illuminati. "Jewminati" needs to be a thing. Can we make that a thing?

(http://i.imgur.com/ZK9rVl2.png)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 15, 2016, 10:08 AM NHFT
Touche, Facebook.

(http://i.imgur.com/eQfuz75.png)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 16, 2016, 12:28 PM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1AIkuTU69qM
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on September 16, 2016, 05:48 PM NHFT
"Was 9 Eleven An Inside Freaking Job?" by Creationist Cat

7-11 was a part-time job.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 16, 2016, 07:16 PM NHFT
that is funny that they want you to relive your anti-FB memories
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on September 17, 2016, 05:26 AM NHFT
He mentions the Jew Illuminati. "Jewminati" needs to be a thing. Can we make that a thing?
Typically they are just called "Israeli".

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 18, 2016, 09:41 AM NHFT
I debunked the body double stuff. It was quite silly. I don't jump on any conspiracy bandwagons. I'm usually debunking them. I haven't heard any conspiracies to explain this one yet but I got nothin' for debunking that this is definitely a green-screened event. My guess is they're terrified of actually bringing her out into public because her health is so bad and they want to avoid another episode.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCP3HIhQgLI
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on September 18, 2016, 05:35 PM NHFT
I debunked the body double stuff. It was quite silly. I don't jump on any conspiracy bandwagons. I'm usually debunking them. I haven't heard any conspiracies to explain this one yet but I got nothin' for debunking that this is definitely a green-screened event. My guess is they're terrified of actually bringing her out into public because her health is so bad and they want to avoid another episode.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCP3HIhQgLI

Have you ever watched a baseball game on TV and tried to figure out the strike zone?

Telescopic compression from a zoom lens can make all sorts of things look distorted, and make angles appear to point in different directions.

I have on explanation for the first segment of that video; it looks very very odd. But the second segment, she's clearly waving to people off to the left, not directly at the flag.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 19, 2016, 10:26 PM NHFT
Yeah, I found out it's from a zoom lens. I forgot I had posted here about it.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 19, 2016, 11:35 PM NHFT
It sucks that people are spinning and lying from all directions. Some of the clips of Hillary are taken out of context and through the description via the narrative induce the audience to a false conclusion.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on September 20, 2016, 12:57 AM NHFT
It sucks that people are spinning and lying from all directions. Some of the clips of Hillary are taken out of context and through the description via the narrative induce the audience to a false conclusion.

There's enough truth to tell about Hillary (and Trump) without making shit up.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on September 20, 2016, 07:50 AM NHFT
The jewminati are at it again.

http://original.antiwar.com/smith-grant/2016/09/19/81-americans-oppose-38-billion-pledge-israel/

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jay on September 20, 2016, 07:00 PM NHFT
The jewminati are at it again.

http://original.antiwar.com/smith-grant/2016/09/19/81-americans-oppose-38-billion-pledge-israel/

Ain't even a conspiracy, though. When your friends in high places control the money supply through the Federal Reserve, you tend to do favors.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 21, 2016, 08:20 PM NHFT
it seems like some of their campaign events are partially faked ..... not the worst thing they will do this week
but
it
is
a
Conspiracy
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 22, 2016, 09:35 AM NHFT
It sucks that people are spinning and lying from all directions. Some of the clips of Hillary are taken out of context and through the description via the narrative induce the audience to a false conclusion.

Yes. In this case it seems like sincere confusion from people who are laymans when it comes to cameras. I was duped too until I understood what was going on.

That's the thing though. When I'm presented with the reasonable explanation, I don't cling to my villain-mongering. It's as KBCraig said, there's enough real stuff for villainizing that we don't need to make shit up and it just hurts our credibility if we can never admit when we were wrong.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 22, 2016, 01:44 PM NHFT
plus it can be dangerous to your health if you find fault with She who must not be named
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 24, 2016, 11:01 PM NHFT
these guys could be ruining it for the rest of the flat earthers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nlfBcYeLkU
Flat Earth News report 4 minutes
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jerryswife on September 28, 2016, 11:29 AM NHFT
From: Freeman's Perspective

A Conspiracy Theory About Conspiracy Theories

One of the funny things about conspiracy theories, including false flag attacks, is how often they are proven to be true. You have to wonder how long the shame-inducing slam, “That’s a conspiracy theory,” will keep working.

But that’s not my point for today. Today, I want to introduce a conspiracy theory of my own, a conspiracy theory about conspiracy theories. Here it is:

The powers that be – the elite, the deep state, whomever – want wild conspiracy theories to spread. Because after these wild theories set the “outrage meter” very high, they can get away with almost anything below that line.

In other words, wild theories ensure that the “I’ll act if I see that” trigger is never reached and Joe Average remains docile, even as he is progressively abused.

I hope I haven’t given any nefarious people ideas, but I think this is already happening. And in any event, I’m fairly certain it’s worth pointing out.
A Second Theory

There is a second reason for the lords of the status quo to love conspiracy theories, which is that such theories make it easy to discredit troublesome ideas.

For example, we now know – thank you again, Edward Snowden – that government agents are infiltrating websites to sow fear, uncertainty, and doubt, as well as to destroy reputations.

So, rather than just pulling out the usual manipulation to discredit a troublesome idea (“conspiracy theory!”), why not tie it to some really nasty racist crap?

Lots of people have avoided discussions of the Federal Reserve, for example, because trolls attached to the discussions demonize Jews. Disgusted by anti-Semitism, people turn away from the whole subject, and the central banking scam remains unquestioned.

There are reasons open comment boards are overrun with hate-spewing trolls, and it’s not that deeply deluded people make up that much of the general populace. (Though they do exist, and they do love to spew their filth.)

So, this is my second conspiracy theory:

Disgusting trolls are paid to promote certain ideas... ideas the elite want to eliminate.

And nowadays, paid trolls aren’t even needed; artificial intelligence bots can carry out the work quite well and can even respond to counter-posts.
Can I Prove This?

Not entirely, no. And I’m not going to spend hundreds of hours tracking down evidence. That’s not my job; I’m not an investigative journalist. (Neither is anyone else these days, but that’s a separate point.)

Still, the links I’ve inserted above prove a lot of what I’m writing, and the rest will have to remain my own personal theories… and I’m just fine with that. People can take them or leave them as they choose.
The Other Problem

Beyond everything covered above, the other problem with conspiracy theories is that they are far too hopeful. Yes, hopeful.

The implication buried in conspiracy theories is that the world is being controlled. Whether it’s controlled by the Illuminati, the Jews, the Masons, or whomever, there is a strange sort of comfort in the idea that the world is controllable.

The comforting thought goes like this:

The world is being controlled by evil people. So, if we can just get rid of them, control will revert to good people, and things will be great again.

This thought is false. The world is not controlled by any single group of people. Rather, it’s a large, chaotic mess. Yes, the deep staters, central bankers, and so on do manipulate a lot of things, but they struggle endlessly and very often fail. Consider just two recent examples:

    If they were that smart, these groups wouldn't have allowed the internet to jump onto the scene in the early 1990s.

    If they were that potent, they would have killed Bitcoin as soon as it appeared.

The truth is that they’re not that smart, and they’re not all-powerful. In fact, they have power only to the extent that they hoodwink people into serving them. And that’s not an iron-clad arrangement.
So…

Presuming that everything above is true, what do we do about it?

My first thought is that we should stick to facts, not imaginings. I suspect, for example, that Building 7 at the World Trade Center was purposely brought down, but I don’t know that. My suspicions don’t make it true. Furthermore, it isn’t worth obsessing over. There are dozens of more important things to invest with time and energy – like actually building a better world.

I can’t think of a single conspiracy theory that’s worth majoring upon. Aliens at Roswell or the Kennedy assassination may be fun speculations – and I’d love to know the God’s-honest truth about both – but they’re simply not that important.

Rather, we should be busy building a better world, bypassing the institutions of abuse that dominate life in the West.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on September 29, 2016, 08:51 AM NHFT
This page has a nice picture of Farrah Fawcett.

https://www.ncscooper.com/local-researcher-bend-oregon-doesnt-exist/ (https://www.ncscooper.com/local-researcher-bend-oregon-doesnt-exist/)

"North San Juan, CA — North San Juan resident, part-time chemtrail researcher and amateur ionizing radiation hobbyist Skyy Wolford announced to a somewhat disinterested crowd out in front of the Sierra Super Stop that Bend, Oregon is an elaborate hoax and does not exist. Mr. Wolford, who was recently in the news following his landmark Wi-Fi disability settlement, has been studying what he calls “the Bend anomaly” for the past 3 years.

“There’s this thing I learned on the Internet called the Bielefeld effect,” said a mood-elevated Mr. Wolford in a Scooper telephone interview. “It’s where there’s this illusion that some place actually exists. People talk about it. They even claim to know people there. But it’s all fake. They’re either part of the conspiracy to keep the hoax alive, or they’re delusional.”......
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on September 29, 2016, 09:03 AM NHFT
Somewhere at the bottom of a municipal landfill is my 1976 poster of Farrah.  And now I find out there is no place called Bend, Oregon ?   I don't think this is a coincidence.  Fucking government! 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on September 29, 2016, 09:11 AM NHFT
Somewhere at the bottom of a municipal landfill is my 1976 poster of Farrah. 

I'm sure it's still hanging in the teenage bedroom of your mind... mine still is.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 29, 2016, 09:13 AM NHFT
From: Freeman's Perspective

A Conspiracy Theory About Conspiracy Theories


Becky and I were covered some of the same points in a recent conversation.

I have thought that espionage novels have been used to both justify the clandestine operations and to soften the blow of governments spying on their own people. When the NSA program "Echelon" became publicly talked about, I was one saying "I've suspected that for 20 years"... so I had already accepted it.

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 29, 2016, 09:15 AM NHFT
Somewhere at the bottom of a municipal landfill is my 1976 poster of Farrah. 

I'm sure it's still hanging in the teenage bedroom of your mind... mine still is.

You two are obviously fallen under the Bielefeld effect. Those of us in the know, realize that Farrah was a mass fantasy created in your hormone effected young minds!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on September 29, 2016, 10:13 AM NHFT
Somewhere at the bottom of a municipal landfill is my 1976 poster of Farrah. 

I'm sure it's still hanging in the teenage bedroom of your mind... mine still is.

You two are obviously fallen under the Bielefeld effect. Those of us in the know, realize that Farrah was a mass fantasy created in your hormone effected young minds!

Your blasphemy probably may not be tolerated!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on September 29, 2016, 08:23 PM NHFT
You can believe everything or you can believe nothing. Either way you'll be fairly easily manipulated. Or you can try to evaluate the information available trying to avoid bias to come to a rational conclusion and you'll probably fall somewhere in the middle.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 29, 2016, 10:05 PM NHFT
I love the article Jerry's wife .... luckily you are not ruining the movement for the rest of us :)

Some conspiracies I find out about, don't matter that much to me, were already suspected, and or maybe don't change my behavior. But most of them do effect how people view or interact with the system ... so it seems good for me to try and expose them. As for effecting my behavior ... they really do :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on September 29, 2016, 10:08 PM NHFT
From: Freeman's Perspective

A Conspiracy Theory About Conspiracy Theories


Becky and I were covered some of the same points in a recent conversation.

I have thought that espionage novels have been used to both justify the clandestine operations and to soften the blow of governments spying on their own people. When the NSA program "Echelon" became publicly talked about, I was one saying "I've suspected that for 20 years"... so I had already accepted it.
so true
I am half way through a 16 part series on Hollywood and the CIA, where 2 guys and their guests discuss different movies that were openly or secretly produced by the CIA. They are very interesting. They talk about how the typical DOD movies are just rah rah Navy or similar. The CIA ones cover a bunch of different angles. They did an Animal Farm and a few "exposing" the CIA. Their main point is that the average CIA movie is about how evil some parts of the government are ... but they are rogue agents, or necessary evils to stop terrorism.
It also gets you used to the idea like you said Tom.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 29, 2016, 10:40 PM NHFT
From: Freeman's Perspective

A Conspiracy Theory About Conspiracy Theories


Becky and I were covered some of the same points in a recent conversation.

I have thought that espionage novels have been used to both justify the clandestine operations and to soften the blow of governments spying on their own people. When the NSA program "Echelon" became publicly talked about, I was one saying "I've suspected that for 20 years"... so I had already accepted it.
so true
I am half way through a 16 part series on Hollywood and the CIA, where 2 guys and their guests discuss different movies that were openly or secretly produced by the CIA. They are very interesting. They talk about how the typical DOD movies are just rah rah Navy or similar. The CIA ones cover a bunch of different angles. They did an Animal Farm and a few "exposing" the CIA. Their main point is that the average CIA movie is about how evil some parts of the government are ... but they are rogue agents, or necessary evils to stop terrorism.
It also gets you used to the idea like you said Tom.

What's the name of the series... sounds good.

It's funny to watch old Dragnet shows, they are such obvious PR propaganda for the LAPD. It's harder for people to see the current shows as propaganda. I thought about doing a documentary on the subject.

If you notice the current law dramas are mostly about the prosecution side. Back in the day the law dramas were more about the defense i.e.. Perry Mason etc.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on September 30, 2016, 04:19 AM NHFT
There must have been something good in the water at Auschwitz.

http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/news/2016/3/guinness-world-records-announces-holocaust-survivor-israel-kristal-as-worlds-old
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on September 30, 2016, 07:53 AM NHFT
Somewhere at the bottom of a municipal landfill is my 1976 poster of Farrah. 

I'm sure it's still hanging in the teenage bedroom of your mind... mine still is.

Right beside the Toulouse Lautrec posters, opposite the black lite. 

You made me recall the masking tape "border" my brother and I laid down on the carpet in our shared room to try to resolve our territorial disputes.  He later conceded me access to the clothing closet once he realized my side had the only door in and out.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on September 30, 2016, 09:52 AM NHFT
Somewhere at the bottom of a municipal landfill is my 1976 poster of Farrah. 

I'm sure it's still hanging in the teenage bedroom of your mind... mine still is.

Right beside the Toulouse Lautrec posters, opposite the black lite. 

You made me recall the masking tape "border" my brother and I laid down on the carpet in our shared room to try to resolve our territorial disputes.  He later conceded me access to the clothing closet once he realized my side had the only door in and out.

You see how the Illuminati screws with people, they are the builders and designers, they built that room so that you would have to..... wait.... this is more a 'Tragedy of the Commons' thing. Which the Illuminati designed!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on September 30, 2016, 11:24 AM NHFT
Somewhere at the bottom of a municipal landfill is my 1976 poster of Farrah. 

I'm sure it's still hanging in the teenage bedroom of your mind... mine still is.

Right beside the Toulouse Lautrec posters, opposite the black lite. 

You made me recall the masking tape "border" my brother and I laid down on the carpet in our shared room to try to resolve our territorial disputes.  He later conceded me access to the clothing closet once he realized my side had the only door in and out.

You see how the Illuminati screws with people, they are the builders and designers, they built that room so that you would have to..... wait.... this is more a 'Tragedy of the Commons' thing. Which the Illuminati designed!

One step short of the Illuminati are the Glitterati, people who glitter. I heard it from Kramer. He was up on the conspiracies...

Quote
Kramer:
I'm tellin' ya! The pigman is alive. The government's been experimenting with pigmen since the fifties.

Jerry:
Will you stop it. Just because a hospital gets a grant to study DNA doesn't mean they are creating a race of mutant pigmen.

Kramer:
Oh, Jerry. Would you wake up to reality! It's a military thing. They're probably creating a whole army of pig warriors.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: jerryswife on October 01, 2016, 09:25 AM NHFT
"Oh, Jerry. Would you wake up to reality! It's a military thing. They're probably creating a whole army of pig warriors."

So if you killed them in battle, could you eat them?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on October 01, 2016, 09:37 AM NHFT
"Oh, Jerry. Would you wake up to reality! It's a military thing. They're probably creating a whole army of pig warriors."

So if you killed them in battle, could you eat them?

 Snort.  That was funny.       
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on October 01, 2016, 11:55 AM NHFT
This guy's YouTube channel is good. His science is solid. Don't listen to his podcast though. It's a snore-fest.

http://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/911-conspiracies-aids-deniers-watch-11962887
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Erroneous_Logic on October 02, 2016, 02:59 AM NHFT
My voices told me he's a CIA plant.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on October 02, 2016, 09:05 PM NHFT
This link jumps to a fun rant about conspiracy theories, but you should rewind it and watch the whole thing. I'm 15 minutes in and loving it. I've watched all his other hour+ long reviews and they're always more entertaining than the actual movie he's reviewing.

https://youtu.be/miVRaoR_8xQ?t=15m18s
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on October 03, 2016, 07:21 PM NHFT

If you notice the current law dramas are mostly about the prosecution side. Back in the day the law dramas were more about the defense i.e.. Perry Mason etc.
so true
they are almost exclusive
Saw a sad billboard in Western Michigan today for a college:
"Training Detroit's Judges" or something similar.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLRmJGaZgDDwobtuhCaDNI8frbj9QL-hNx
CIA and Hollywood
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on October 03, 2016, 07:24 PM NHFT
yea some podcasts are insanely boring.
BTW one of the best ways for me to have fun and learn something is by podcasts that I listen to in the truck. Any suggestions to check out?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on October 03, 2016, 07:31 PM NHFT
This guy's YouTube channel is good. His science is solid. Don't listen to his podcast though. It's a snore-fest.

http://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/911-conspiracies-aids-deniers-watch-11962887
707 at 600 mph was the goal to withstand

have you noticed that a youtube video cannot have any footage from 9/11 unless it has a disclaimer or the video runs into trouble?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on October 04, 2016, 10:46 AM NHFT
My voices told me he's a CIA plant.

So we should dry him and smoke him?  (Free Lib gets out clippers and begins trimming)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Erroneous_Logic on October 04, 2016, 01:28 PM NHFT
I dunno, man. I'd be pretty hesitant to smoke anything from the CIA
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on October 04, 2016, 10:06 PM NHFT
life does get complicated
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on October 06, 2016, 02:07 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/undefined.jpg)

BTW one of the best ways for me to have fun and learn something is by podcasts that I listen to in the truck. Any suggestions to check out?

School Sucks Podcast is great. If you like sci-fi movies and comic books, listen to Only Stupid Answers. Also, everyone should listen to Puke and the Gang. You definitely will not learn anything though.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on October 07, 2016, 09:41 AM NHFT
thanks
I will have to look up the School Sucks one .... Kat was on that once.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on October 07, 2016, 09:43 AM NHFT
sorry to say there is not currently a good Flat Earth podcast that I know of.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on October 07, 2016, 03:50 PM NHFT
http://observer.com/2016/10/cnn-censors-third-party-supporters-as-undecided-in-focus-group/

sorry to say there is not currently a good Flat Earth podcast that I know of.

I think they're still building up their network of strings with cups attached.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on October 08, 2016, 08:00 PM NHFT
sorry to say there is not currently a good Flat Earth podcast that I know of.

I thought there were some, but they all seem to have fallen off the edge of the earth.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on October 10, 2016, 12:09 AM NHFT
it happens
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on October 25, 2016, 05:10 PM NHFT
http://liberaldarkness.com/2015/08/01/fire-ants-are-being-laced-with-homosexual-chemtrails-to-bite-christians-and-convert-them-to-homosexuality/

Photo evidence:
(http://i.imgur.com/LnC6aQG.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on October 26, 2016, 02:50 PM NHFT
That chart. Yikes!

http://reason.com/blog/2016/10/25/pollsters-made-up-a-conspiracy-theory-an
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on October 26, 2016, 03:28 PM NHFT
That chart. Yikes!

http://reason.com/blog/2016/10/25/pollsters-made-up-a-conspiracy-theory-an

So I'm guessing your one of those that don't believe the gooberment had any role in the  North Dakota Crash!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Erroneous_Logic on October 26, 2016, 03:44 PM NHFT
That chart. Yikes!

http://reason.com/blog/2016/10/25/pollsters-made-up-a-conspiracy-theory-an

So I'm guessing your one of those that don't believe the gooberment had any role in the  North Dakota Crash!

Pff. Listen to this nut. Everyone knows that the North Dakota Crash was entirely the fault of the aliens piloting the craft! The government had nothing to do with it! Go wear a tin foil hat, guy.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on October 26, 2016, 03:54 PM NHFT
That chart. Yikes!

http://reason.com/blog/2016/10/25/pollsters-made-up-a-conspiracy-theory-an

So I'm guessing your one of those that don't believe the gooberment had any role in the  North Dakota Crash!

Pff. Listen to this nut. Everyone knows that the North Dakota Crash was entirely the fault of the aliens piloting the craft! The government had nothing to do with it! Go wear a tin foil hat, guy.

Yeah? I suppose jet fuel burns alien metals too.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Erroneous_Logic on October 26, 2016, 04:03 PM NHFT
That chart. Yikes!

http://reason.com/blog/2016/10/25/pollsters-made-up-a-conspiracy-theory-an

So I'm guessing your one of those that don't believe the gooberment had any role in the  North Dakota Crash!

Pff. Listen to this nut. Everyone knows that the North Dakota Crash was entirely the fault of the aliens piloting the craft! The government had nothing to do with it! Go wear a tin foil hat, guy.

Yeah? I suppose jet fuel burns alien metals too.

Alright, listen, broski. You don't have to MELT alien metals for them to lose most of their structural strength. Simply heating them up a thousand degrees or so is sufficient for their load bearing ability to be reduced to almost zero. #makeamericagreatagain
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on October 26, 2016, 06:08 PM NHFT
That chart. Yikes!

http://reason.com/blog/2016/10/25/pollsters-made-up-a-conspiracy-theory-an

So I'm guessing your one of those that don't believe the gooberment had any role in the  North Dakota Crash!

Pff. Listen to this nut. Everyone knows that the North Dakota Crash was entirely the fault of the aliens piloting the craft! The government had nothing to do with it! Go wear a tin foil hat, guy.

Yeah? I suppose jet fuel burns alien metals too.

Alright, listen, broski. You don't have to MELT alien metals for them to lose most of their structural strength. Simply heating them up a thousand degrees or so is sufficient for their load bearing ability to be reduced to almost zero. #makeamericagreatagain

OMFG!  They've found nano-thermite in cattle feed as far away as Wisconson!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Erroneous_Logic on October 26, 2016, 07:19 PM NHFT
That chart. Yikes!

http://reason.com/blog/2016/10/25/pollsters-made-up-a-conspiracy-theory-an

So I'm guessing your one of those that don't believe the gooberment had any role in the  North Dakota Crash!

Pff. Listen to this nut. Everyone knows that the North Dakota Crash was entirely the fault of the aliens piloting the craft! The government had nothing to do with it! Go wear a tin foil hat, guy.

Yeah? I suppose jet fuel burns alien metals too.

Alright, listen, broski. You don't have to MELT alien metals for them to lose most of their structural strength. Simply heating them up a thousand degrees or so is sufficient for their load bearing ability to be reduced to almost zero. #makeamericagreatagain

OMFG!  They've found nano-thermite in cattle feed as far away as Wisconson!
of course they have! It's a common ingredient to help the cattle get their daily intake of nano-aluminum in digestible form!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on October 27, 2016, 08:11 AM NHFT
Bill Clinton's "black son" banned from YouTube.    Conspiracy ?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on October 27, 2016, 08:38 AM NHFT
Bill Clinton's "black son" banned from YouTube.    Conspiracy ?

Why not? Google, Facebook... to AT&T are all working for the wrong side of things.

Google Is Not What It Seems
by Julian Assange
 (https://wikileaks.org/google-is-not-what-it-seems/)

Google has a mission of changing the world. The worst abuses can come from people that feel they are doing good. Private entities have latitude to do things that the government is precluded from doing. The Government's big push for Total Information Awareness was politically defeated, then the private sector enticed the public to do it to themselves.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on October 30, 2016, 05:29 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/gxWjkvP.png)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on October 30, 2016, 05:55 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/gxWjkvP.png)

It was built millions of years ago by men who wanted to please the gods.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on November 02, 2016, 03:44 PM NHFT
Jack won't like this one because it implies that the 9/11 attacks were from Muslim terrorists instead of Bush.

Anonymous Release Bone-Chilling video of Huma Abedin every American Needs to See

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRu3U-nwyhw
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on November 02, 2016, 08:11 PM NHFT
how can I be one of the biggest conspiracy kooks .... I don't even know about any ND crash
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on November 03, 2016, 09:40 AM NHFT
how can I be one of the biggest conspiracy kooks .... I don't even know about any ND crash

 Maybe the flat earth thing inflated your numbers ?  (smiley emoticon)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on November 03, 2016, 09:59 PM NHFT
it is possible
but at least our crazy Flat Earth community has fun
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lv_dcW1WrMo
2 minutes long
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on November 06, 2016, 06:54 AM NHFT

 Is "day light savings time" a conspiracy ? 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on November 06, 2016, 07:24 AM NHFT

 Is "day light savings time" a conspiracy ? 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4EUTMPuvHo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4EUTMPuvHo)

"...it's not plural!"
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on November 06, 2016, 09:07 AM NHFT
       (smiley emoticon)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on November 07, 2016, 10:39 PM NHFT
I think some people conspired to pass it
might not fit CIA definition of "conspiracy theory"
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on November 07, 2016, 10:59 PM NHFT
I think it does meet the Etterretningstjenesten's definition of 'conspiracy theory'.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on November 09, 2016, 05:53 PM NHFT
oh this one is fun
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqovzNGqtqo

the scuba divers that help the space walks
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on December 05, 2016, 11:13 AM NHFT
8000 pounds seems like a pretty good deal when you think about the cost of setting of a massive fake moon setting and an illusion of the Earth in the sky.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/science/holidays-moon-possible-decade-ticket-9394296
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on December 11, 2016, 11:37 AM NHFT
So what did Carlin know about 9/11 and how did he find out? Hmm...

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/08/24/george-carlin-police-bit
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on December 11, 2016, 02:56 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/Ro501U2.png)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on December 12, 2016, 06:58 PM NHFT
8000 pounds seems like a pretty good deal when you think about the cost of setting of a massive fake moon setting and an illusion of the Earth in the sky.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/science/holidays-moon-possible-decade-ticket-9394296
so it will only cost 8000 to visit the moon? that would be cheap
I heard that the Chinese had been to the moon. I didn't hear about it at the time.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on December 17, 2016, 10:23 PM NHFT
Another lizard Jew!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdGb528-914
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on December 19, 2016, 03:58 PM NHFT
Uhm... I don't really understand anything about this but I feel compelled to post it here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgO1LUijb0k
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on December 19, 2016, 06:33 PM NHFT
 :duh:
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on December 23, 2016, 07:20 PM NHFT
is the fake assassination the funniest hoax yet?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 05, 2017, 06:20 PM NHFT
I couldn't find the freedom to travel thread so here is a funny video from snl about airport security

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbIXmB2ZLmA
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on February 06, 2017, 11:33 AM NHFT
I couldn't find the freedom to travel thread so here is a funny video from snl about airport security

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbIXmB2ZLmA

 ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 09, 2017, 10:16 AM NHFT
that one was really good
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 10, 2017, 08:12 AM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyFt0ECuTXc

overpopulation
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on February 20, 2017, 06:59 PM NHFT
(http://imgur.com/b9WAASv.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on February 23, 2017, 01:13 AM NHFT
(http://imgur.com/b9WAASv.jpg)

Life is cool in a Terry Pratchett novel.

We know that other celestial bodies are round, because we can see them. And yet somehow Earth, alone among all the natural objects flying through space, is somehow flat in defiance of all the laws of physics.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on February 23, 2017, 08:25 AM NHFT
I'm just glad that Dale is finally onboard with the flat earth theory.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on February 23, 2017, 11:08 AM NHFT
I guess I'm confused by the flat earth thing...is Australia still "down under" or they just "over there" ?

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on February 23, 2017, 12:32 PM NHFT
(http://imgur.com/b9WAASv.jpg)
You see how someone is tring to fool you by using camera angles and focal length?
This picture was taken from a position where you can see the tracks that the planets ride on as well as the main support structure that is connected to the Earth.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on February 23, 2017, 05:42 PM NHFT
(http://imgur.com/b9WAASv.jpg)
You see how someone is tring to fool you by using camera angles and focal length?
This picture was taken from a position where you can see the tracks that the planets ride on as well as the main support structure that is connected to the Earth.

Not only is Johnson smart... he makes the bestes tin foil hats around!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on February 23, 2017, 07:01 PM NHFT
As an aside, I've never really been comfortable saying Uranus.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 24, 2017, 03:00 PM NHFT
(http://imgur.com/b9WAASv.jpg)
alright now let's see I think you just have to shrink all of the rest of the stuff besides that nice flat blue one in the middle
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 24, 2017, 03:03 PM NHFT
oh yea
for me I don't see any circular or round objects except the sun and moon.
What do you see when you look at stars and planets through a telescope?
I never used to see anything but twinkling lights. People told me I was doing it wrong. Now piles of flat earthers are filming through their telescopes and getting pulsing lights when they point at planets and stars.
Also the sun seems to pinwheel during the day.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on February 25, 2017, 11:35 PM NHFT
As an aside, I've never really been comfortable saying Uranus.

"This just in, Sunoco has changed its name from 'SUN-uh-co' to 'suh-NO-co'!"

...old SNL Weekend Update bit.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 26, 2017, 10:19 PM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zni00B36f7E

neil degrasse tyson teaches us
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on February 26, 2017, 11:27 PM NHFT
My Earth Science teacher used to say YOUR' - uh -nus, with the accent on the first syllable.  She used to say GAY' - lax - ee, too.

(https://img.ifcdn.com/images/b930f4a405e28d4a268027c07af868272e34aef72721ff10a34abbe1399d5c59_1.jpg)

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CBZo7o3W8AAByrC.jpg)

The Girls Can Flirt And Other Queer Things Can Do.

Come Over Soon Dear.  Make Party Party.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on February 28, 2017, 08:40 AM NHFT
I'm just glad that Dale is finally onboard with the flat earth theory.

Excuse me. Theory? What are you? A heathen commie?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on February 28, 2017, 10:03 AM NHFT
I'm just glad that Dale is finally onboard with the flat earth theory.

Excuse me. Theory? What are you? A heathen commie?

I don't know about a flat earth, but if you knock back a few of theses you'd be flat on the earth.  ;D

(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/T1BGblPK4NA/maxresdefault.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 28, 2017, 10:29 AM NHFT
well did anyone enjoy the Neil Degrass Tyson Nasa splaining?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 03, 2017, 12:10 PM NHFT
well did anyone enjoy the Neil Degrass Tyson Nasa splaining?

I watched it. I didn't see what was supposed to be the point. I'm kinda with NDT on not arguing with people when you realize they believe in something religiously. Took me quite a number of years to realize what a waste of effort that usually is. I still do it occasionally either because it's hilarious and entertaining or for the benefit of an audience.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 04, 2017, 07:43 PM NHFT
It seems there is a religion of scientism that guys like that defend. I don't think he believes it. He is just an actor.
I have a new term I am working on
Flat Earth Denier

I accused my nephew of it today and he was only mildly amused.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 05, 2017, 02:51 PM NHFT
I accused my nephew of it today and he was only mildly amused.

If it makes you feel better, I am more than mildly amused.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 05, 2017, 04:01 PM NHFT
I accused my nephew of it today and he was only mildly amused.

If it makes you feel better, I am more than mildly amused.

Is there a scale? ...'cause I'm nonplussed and I don't know if that makes me better than Dale or not.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 05, 2017, 09:30 PM NHFT
yes
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 05, 2017, 10:57 PM NHFT
I accused my nephew of it today and he was only mildly amused.

If it makes you feel better, I am more than mildly amused.

Is there a scale? ...'cause I'm nonplussed and I don't know if that makes me better than Dale or not.

You think you're better than me?

Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum...

https://youtu.be/pcFSOnumgZA
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 06, 2017, 10:14 AM NHFT
This has me conspiralizing. This is some deep evil shit.

(http://i.imgur.com/DaqkAYc.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 06, 2017, 10:59 AM NHFT
yea no good way to take that
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 06, 2017, 11:01 AM NHFT
You think you're better than me?

Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum...

https://youtu.be/pcFSOnumgZA
It's GO time
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on March 07, 2017, 12:50 PM NHFT
I accused my nephew of it today and he was only mildly amused.

If it makes you feel better, I am more than mildly amused.

Is there a scale? ...'cause I'm nonplussed and I don't know if that makes me better than Dale or not.

You think you're better than me?

Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum...

https://youtu.be/pcFSOnumgZA


  That Seinfeld clip was pretty funny.     It was like a visit from the ghost of the not so distant future.   

   Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 07, 2017, 02:41 PM NHFT
I accused my nephew of it today and he was only mildly amused.

If it makes you feel better, I am more than mildly amused.

Is there a scale? ...'cause I'm nonplussed and I don't know if that makes me better than Dale or not.

You think you're better than me?

Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum...

https://youtu.be/pcFSOnumgZA


  That Seinfeld clip was pretty funny.     It was like a visit from the ghost of the not so distant future.   

   Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum, Mandelbaum.

What da ya mean by that? Ya think you're better than me!

Becky said, "Imagine a libertarian old age home..."    ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 08, 2017, 10:04 AM NHFT
We called it Grafton for a while
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 13, 2017, 02:11 PM NHFT
Their CGI budget's really up there.

https://www.facebook.com/DailyMail/videos/2063463830380021/
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on March 14, 2017, 08:20 AM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/jH8cZm5.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 14, 2017, 11:09 AM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/jH8cZm5.jpg)

Well, it's not "tin foil" it's aluminum foil. And the Smart Appliances are going to take over our lives!

(Voiced as Annoying Libertarian, know it all.)

Oh, it was a joke? I don't really get humor, my doctor said it's because of my position on the autism spectrum. But, I know it is because I am focused on the coming cyborg enhancements I'm going to get.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 14, 2017, 02:43 PM NHFT
hahaha
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 14, 2017, 03:26 PM NHFT
Their CGI budget's really up there.

https://www.facebook.com/DailyMail/videos/2063463830380021/
they seem to use 5 or 6 different techniques.
pool practice/filming
wires greenscreen
vomit comet
pure cgi ... or added to wires and greenscreen
photoshop scrubbing of scuba divers around pool practice

funny thing is that sometimes they play with water like it won't hurt the electronics and other times deathly afraid of any escaping the towel
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on March 15, 2017, 08:39 PM NHFT
funny thing is that sometimes they play with water like it won't hurt the electronics and other times deathly afraid of any escaping the towel

If moisture in the air was a problem, they'd all have to hold their breath.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on March 16, 2017, 01:11 AM NHFT
funny thing is that sometimes they play with water like it won't hurt the electronics and other times deathly afraid of any escaping the towel

If moisture in the air was a problem, they'd all have to hold their breath.

The electronics have been sealed ever since a leaking Apollo space suit pissed on one of the computers and shorted it out.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 16, 2017, 11:09 AM NHFT
I went to NASA soldering school that was created in response to early problems with poor quality control on early flights where they had everything from bad connections to tools lost moving around and getting into the wrong places.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on March 16, 2017, 06:08 PM NHFT
I went to NASA soldering school that was created in response to early problems with poor quality control on early flights where they had everything from bad connections to tools lost moving around and getting into the wrong places.

An engineer from that era told me that welding was deemed to be the most reliable, followed by "wire wrap" and then the punch down connections like those used in telephone blocks, or individually in those "Scotch Lock" connectors, and that soldering came in last.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 16, 2017, 07:16 PM NHFT
there are so many problems with their fake space hangout
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 16, 2017, 07:26 PM NHFT
imagine them breathing and the condensation that would build up on the walls
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on March 17, 2017, 12:15 PM NHFT
imagine them breathing and the condensation that would build up on the walls

Yeah, they have all the technology to fake everything, but haven't discovered air conditioning yet.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 17, 2017, 05:56 PM NHFT
much easier to make a movie
oh don't get me started on where they get the power for all the air conditioning they would need :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 29, 2017, 01:19 PM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vqf-zK3pno

3 minutes about a snapshot taken by pilot to prove curve

I used to think I saw a curve at the beach. I don't anymore.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on March 31, 2017, 11:15 PM NHFT
"But where is the plane that hit the Pentagon???"

Scattered all over the damn place, as rational skeptics have been pointing out all along.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 31, 2017, 11:28 PM NHFT
Just watched a little of a video on Youtube that claims Nukes aren't real and the attack on Hiroshima was a fire bombing not a single blast. Well... I tell ya the hoax sure is elaborate, they even got an old man in Japan, or room Papasan, to say he was blown down by the blast and spent two weeks in hospital.

Yeah, I guess all the engineers and scientists are in on the hoaxes as well. And all the competing governments, companies and individuals around the world have not outed the truth... even though there would be tremendous gains to showing your competitors to be liars.

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 01, 2017, 10:31 AM NHFT
they are all together under one power pyramid

you can be blown down by many different kinds of bombs

check out the hoax nuke blast films they are funny
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on April 01, 2017, 10:58 AM NHFT
When making extraordinary claims the burden is on that side to prove their case.

Eye witnesses say that one blast destroyed the city. No other device could have done that. Today they do have thermobaric/fuel-air bombs that are almost as powerful as a very small nuke. But the point is that a firebombing would not be confused with a one blast event.

So if within the first few minutes of someone's argument you can find errors or mistruths there really isn't a need to go further.

I notice the common denominator in most people believing these things is they aren't following critical thinking habits. If you are able to find errors they just jump to the next set of "facts". All it takes is one point that can't be explained any other way to dismantle a thousand "facts".


Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 01, 2017, 11:20 AM NHFT
the extraordinary claim is
that they invented a new bomb and blew up two cities in a different way than ever before or since
the evidence is that it was exactly the same as tokyo and dresden

people were walking the streets the next day and didn't die of strange diseases

I doubt those eye witnesses
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on April 01, 2017, 12:55 PM NHFT
Believe me there are plenty of Japanese that would have loved to discredit the one blast claim. I just related one man's telling of the event told to me. Many thousands of others have been able to freely share their experience of the event.

As to radiation's effects. Many have been overstated.

With the altitude of the explosion there would have been the flash of radiation and some fallout from the bombs material, but not all that much remaining radioactive material. Leukemia was especially higher and cancer rates were less significantly higher afterwards. I suppose the flash shadows created were also part of this elaborate hoax. Photos taken by Japanese people that had no reason to want to lie for the US.

Seismic reading of blasts were measured around the globe. The high altitude H-bomb test over the Pacific created an EMP pulse that knocked out electronics in Hawaii. Al things that are beyond the ability of anything previous to Nukes.

The thing about the scientific method is that others must be able to reproduced the results for it to be considered valid. Many others around the globe have studied and tested the underlying science with comparable results. The mathematics and physics have been tested and proven to be valid. Predictions base on these theories prove to actually work. These things are all interconnected and beyond the control of any government, much less all the governments to collude on.

Government is not the source of knowledge individuals are. Some guy posting on Youtube doesn't trump all the competing intellectual forces that would have to be subverted.

Many of the claims made in the documentary I watched are explained in readily available sources The fact that the person producing the "documentary" failed to acknowledge these explanations shows he probably didn't even do a preliminary study of the topic. He was engaged in "inductive reasoning" only search for things that confirmed his initial belief.

I could be convinced to question much of conventional views of a topic, but it takes someone that can do a better job of not making such silly errors.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 01, 2017, 08:47 PM NHFT
see the conspiracy kooks are ruining it
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on April 01, 2017, 09:03 PM NHFT
I agree with Russell... it's ruined.

"You're not one of us until you ruin it for the rest of us."
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 01, 2017, 10:05 PM NHFT
the nookular option
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on April 02, 2017, 03:04 PM NHFT
I could go for some nookie.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on April 02, 2017, 03:07 PM NHFT
I could go for some nookie.

I don't think Russell is offering "that" option.
("Not that there is anything wrong with that." Obligatory Seinfeld reference)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on April 04, 2017, 12:43 PM NHFT
I have the autograph of the guy who dropped the bomb on Hiroshima, Thomas Ferebee (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Ferebee). I was looking for a signed copy of Leonard Maltin's movie review book on eBay, and saw the Thomas Ferebee one for less than $20.

(http://bbbuds.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/bomber.jpg)

There was a huge firestorm after the bomb was dropped. The firestorm released 1000 times more energy than the bomb itself.

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/22/Firestorm_cloud_over_Hiroshima%2C_near_local_noon._Aug_6_1945.jpg)

Quote
For decades this "Hiroshima strike" photo was misidentified as the mushroom cloud of the bomb that formed at c. 08:16.[138][139] However, due to its much greater height, the scene was identified by a researcher in March 2016 as the firestorm-cloud that engulfed the city,[139] a fire that reached its peak intensity some three hours after the bomb.[140] The image with the incorrect description featured prominently in the Hiroshima Peace Museum up to 2016,[139] though not cited, it had much earlier, also been mis-attributed and presented to the public in 1955 by US artists, with the world-touring The Family of Man exhibition. Without knowledge of the photo the output of energy from the fuel in the city, necessary to loft a stratospheric firestorm-cloud, had been estimated as 1000 times the energy of the bomb.[140] Post March estimates using the height of this Hiroshima-cloud also point at the underlying firestorm releasing approximately 1000 times the energy of the bomb.[139]
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on April 04, 2017, 01:13 PM NHFT
I was stationed about 20 kilometers from Hiroshima. We were warned not to go there on the anniversary of the event.

Japanese people are the most civilized people I've encountered, but the bad ones are very bad. The communists and the Yakuza can be really vicous.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 04, 2017, 04:42 PM NHFT
I like this guy on many subjects.
Here he thinks us flat earth Christians are potentially ruining it for the rest of them

http://drmsh.com/christians-who-believe-the-earth-is-really-flat-does-it-get-any-dumber-than-this/

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on April 04, 2017, 07:01 PM NHFT
I'm guessing the guy that dropped the bomb on Hiroshima might not have heard of Stanley Milgram. 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on April 04, 2017, 07:47 PM NHFT
I like this guy on many subjects.
Here he thinks us flat earth Christians are potentially ruining it for the rest of them

http://drmsh.com/christians-who-believe-the-earth-is-really-flat-does-it-get-any-dumber-than-this/

There are those in every group for whom "ruining it for the rest of them" is their raison d'etre.

There is evidence that demands a verdict, and on the other hand there is the attitude that "if what I believe can't be proven, then believing fervently in nonsense must mean I have more faith!"
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 05, 2017, 02:12 PM NHFT
it is funny
now there are many shows or people who don't want to mention the words Flat Earth, because they will be flooded :) crazy
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on April 05, 2017, 04:00 PM NHFT
I don't know about flat...
But I do believe the earth isn't round.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on April 05, 2017, 10:25 PM NHFT
I don't know about flat...
But I do believe the earth isn't round.

Oblate spheroid?  ;D

I know it's not flat, because I can see Mount Washington.

There is obvious depth, because we can measure the Mariana Trench.

Since it's not a round disc existing in only two dimensions, it has depth. How much? Is it a cylinder? What's on the other side?

Or is it just turtles, all the way down?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on April 05, 2017, 11:53 PM NHFT
People always forget about the elephants.
It's a good thing that they never forget about you.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on April 06, 2017, 06:56 PM NHFT
I like this guy on many subjects.
Here he thinks us flat earth Christians are potentially ruining it for the rest of them

http://drmsh.com/christians-who-believe-the-earth-is-really-flat-does-it-get-any-dumber-than-this/

There are those in every group for whom "ruining it for the rest of them" is their raison d'etre.

There is evidence that demands a verdict, and on the other hand there is the attitude that "if what I believe can't be proven, then believing fervently in nonsense must mean I have more faith!"

That sounds like an argument a pompous Christian would use on another Christian.

If you can believe in an all powerful invisible being there is no obstruction to believing in angels or spirits or demons or an all encompassing evil. There certainly is no obstruction at that point to any other illogical belief.

There would be a few people saying that these beliefs are more than just a little absurd. Those people might also hawk a lot of science knowledge. In defense, a believer might start asking pointed questions about scientific theories while engaging in sophistry. At some point, there would have to be a complete negation of contemporary science replaced by anecdotal shreds of evidence.


Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on April 07, 2017, 01:17 AM NHFT
That sounds like an argument a pompous Christian would use on another Christian.

Or maybe it's a highly skeptical Christian's response to another who will believe anything that's unbelievable.

Maybe you should go talk to some atheists who believe 9/11 was an inside job.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on April 07, 2017, 08:02 AM NHFT
That sounds like an argument a pompous Christian would use on another Christian.

Or maybe it's a highly skeptical Christian's response to another who will believe anything that's unbelievable.

Maybe you should go talk to some atheists who believe 9/11 was an inside job.

Sure.... and what's he going to say to me, that he is a better non-believer because he believes?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on April 07, 2017, 10:46 PM NHFT
I don't know, but if he takes the position of humility and points out that he doesn't know it all, you probably shouldn't call it a pompous argument.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on April 08, 2017, 09:12 AM NHFT
I don't know, but if he takes the position of humility and points out that he doesn't know it all, you probably shouldn't call it a pompous argument.

'I'm doing (X) which makes me a better Christian than you' is not a position of humility.

...and it definitely qualifies as pompous.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 08, 2017, 02:42 PM NHFT
hey I think Johnson is talking about me :)

it is funny how I have gone from never looking at these crazy conspiracy theories to believing most of them :)

I am stuck on this flat earth one .... because it looks flat and nasa seems to fake everything. I can't see how I could go back on this one.
maybe some other ones hmm maybe

It is funny in this community of outside the system nutters that I have joined ..... most of them that are not Christians can't seem to figure out why these bad guys would do these elaborate centuries old lies. For me it is making sense that we have been tricked for about 6000 years. It just takes different forms, or cycles through.

If you guys don't mind talking about them every once in a while or when I visit you, that would be nice. Otherwise we can talk about other stuff. I might just want to bring up new levels of deception every once in a while. :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on April 08, 2017, 06:04 PM NHFT
I have never heard Russell say that he is a better Christian than anyone else.

I will concede that he is a betterChristian than me.

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on April 08, 2017, 07:38 PM NHFT
I don't know, but if he takes the position of humility and points out that he doesn't know it all, you probably shouldn't call it a pompous argument.

'I'm doing (X) which makes me a better Christian than you' is not a position of humility.

...and it definitely qualifies as pompous.

If you can point out where I did that, I'd appreciate it. I'd like to correct it.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on April 08, 2017, 08:32 PM NHFT
I don't know, but if he takes the position of humility and points out that he doesn't know it all, you probably shouldn't call it a pompous argument.

'I'm doing (X) which makes me a better Christian than you' is not a position of humility.

...and it definitely qualifies as pompous.

If you can point out where I did that, I'd appreciate it. I'd like to correct it.

I have never found you to be pompous.

My post stems from Reply #530 on: April 04, 2017, 07:47 PM NHFT that says...
"There is evidence that demands a verdict, and on the other hand there is the attitude that "if what I believe can't be proven, then believing fervently in nonsense must mean I have more faith!"

I was reacting to that statement.

In hindsight can see why you thought I did.

For what it's worth, I apologize.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on April 08, 2017, 10:14 PM NHFT


I am stuck on this flat earth one .... because it looks flat and nasa seems to fake everything. I can't see how I could go back on this one.
maybe some other ones hmm maybe.

From what I have looked into on this subject.... Most of the sincere people that believe the earth to be flat seemed to start at the not trusting NASA point.

First off long before NASA existed people had figured out the earth wasn't flat. Currently NASA is not the only source of information or knowledge.

Many of the arguments I see presented have the math wrong and when shown that the math is wrong they just keep repeating the same flawed numbers. Are they trolls? Or willfully ignorant?

Many of the arguments revolve around not having seen the evidence for themselves, but then they take at face value the arguments of the flat earth promoters.

Once invested in these ideas it becomes harder and harder psychologically to face the fact that the person has gone down the wrong path. In order to maintain/protect the position more and more outlandish explanations become accepted to fit the model. For example the argument to explain the earth's shadow on the moon was some here to fore unknown electromagnetic field disturbance.

Just like you told me once that you wouldn't play with a Ouji board because it might open you to dark forces. I think these theories open you up to people's errors, false beliefs or worse their manipulations.

Big, relatively easily refuted, lies is not the way the government lies. They do it with more subtle spin.

Many different fields of knowledge would have to be wrong for this to be true. Navigators from two hundred years ago had to understand these principles to accurately find their way across oceans. How come we don't see the Southern Cross in the Northern Hemisphere? The angle of these celestial bodies change depending on your latitude.

The list goes on and on.

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on April 09, 2017, 01:48 PM NHFT
it is funny how I have gone from never looking at these crazy conspiracy theories to believing most of them
Do you believe in any of the jewish conspiracy theories?

What do you think about The Protocols of the Elders of Zion?

What about "the jews killed jesus" thing?
https://theshalomcenter.org/content/talmud-death-jesus
Quote
Raising the issue is an article by Steven Bayme, the American Jewish Committee national director of Contemporary Jewish Life, which declares that Jews must face up to the fact that the Talmudic narrative clearly demonstrate ... fourth century rabbinic willingness to take responsibility for the execution of Jesus.

Jewish apologetics that could not have done it because of Roman sovereignty ring hollow when one examines the Talmudic account,Bayme said.

He contends that Jewish interfaith representatives are not being honest in dialogue if they ignore the explicit Talmudic references to Jesus.

His article was posted on the AJCommittee Web site last week, then removed after a Jewish Week reporter inquiry.

Ken Bandler, a spokesman for the AJCommittee, said the article was taken down to void confusion over whether it represented the organization official position. AJCommittee officials now refer to the article as an internal document.

Some Jewish scholars and interfaith officials were upset with the article, either questioning Bayme scholarship or his timing saying this was a particularly delicate time to call attention to Jews role in Jesus death, or both.

But Bayme was unswayed. Citing the continuing controversy over Gibson he Passion, which has reignited concern over Christianity ancient charge against Jews as christ killers, he wrote that it is also important hat Jews confront their own tradition and ask how Jewish sources treated the Jesus narrative.

Bayme cites a passage from the Talmud, Sanhedrin 43a, which relates the fate of a man called Jesus who is hanged on the eve of Passover for practicing sorcery and leading the people of Israel astray.

When no one comes forward to defend the accused sorcerer during a 40-day reprieve, Jewish authorities put him to death, despite Jesus connections with the government. The Talmud cites this incident during a discussion of due process and capital punishment in Jewish law.

Bayme acknowledges that that the passage was written by Talmudic scholars in Babylon, who lived about 400 years after Jesus.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 09, 2017, 09:15 PM NHFT
I agree with a bunch of your post Tom Sawyer.
But I have not noticed myself or too many people wanting to stay with the Flat Earth stuff because they have started down that path. I find almost everyone wishes they could just stay in the matrix and un see what they have seen. :)
It does help to think that NASA are deceivers :)

As far as I can tell. I think you can navigate oceans with a geocentric model and people have.
One interesting story is that when Captain Cook was going around Antarctica their charts would be off by around 29 miles per day. It seems that the maps get off the farther South you go, but spot in when you go North.


The North centric part of Flat Earth theory is very satisfying to me. I might cling to it just for that. :)

I have found the flat earth math to come out right on the lack of curvature. You probably are talking about something else.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 09, 2017, 09:21 PM NHFT
I believe many conspiracy theories that include Jews and those that call themselves Jews.

I haven't looked into that one lately.

I thought most Jews knew that the Jewish leadership of the day killed Jesus. I thought most thought it was the right thing to do.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 09, 2017, 09:50 PM NHFT
This lady makes many Flat Earth songs

https://youtu.be/bJ5HJiDp-lc

they are fun
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on April 09, 2017, 11:32 PM NHFT
I don't know, but if he takes the position of humility and points out that he doesn't know it all, you probably shouldn't call it a pompous argument.

'I'm doing (X) which makes me a better Christian than you' is not a position of humility.

...and it definitely qualifies as pompous.

If you can point out where I did that, I'd appreciate it. I'd like to correct it.

I have never found you to be pompous.

My post stems from Reply #530 on: April 04, 2017, 07:47 PM NHFT that says...
"There is evidence that demands a verdict, and on the other hand there is the attitude that "if what I believe can't be proven, then believing fervently in nonsense must mean I have more faith!"

I was reacting to that statement.

In hindsight can see why you thought I did.

For what it's worth, I apologize.

Thank you, and I apologize for not being clear enough, so that my intent could be mistaken.

I was really thinking of "conspiracy kooks" in the thread title, more than any particular religious beliefs. The two can be easily confused, given the religious fervor with which some people insist that lack of evidence is proof that the opposite is true.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on April 10, 2017, 09:42 AM NHFT
Ad hoc arguments, explanations that address one aspect but don't fit into a larger set of observations.

Inductive reasoning. Only considering things that support your initial hypothesis.

Millions of people involved in keeping a secret and/or actively perpatrating an elaborate hoax.

Best, most balanced, video I've found on the subject.
Is the earth Flat?
VSauce
https://youtu.be/VNqNnUJVcVs
 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 11, 2017, 12:43 AM NHFT
his crazy tipped elevator
he assumes he knows how gravity works Einstein said he didn't
he assumes flat earth has to be thin
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on April 11, 2017, 08:50 AM NHFT
 I've been enjoying following along on the flat earth back and forth and have a question.

 If the earth is flat, what does the underside look like and what holds it together?  Does it have an atmosphere?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 11, 2017, 10:45 AM NHFT
I think flat earthers would have many different ideas about that.

flat earth as a dielectric plane is where I am leaning for why up is up and heavy stuff goes down.
this idea explains the twisting of the air, how the sun and moon are lit, tides, magnetic field lines, and other things
many good ideas from the electric universe theory people (most are not flat earthers)
http://www.electricuniverse.info/Introduction



https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cj0gaHNVAAEHUFP.jpg
http://www.arl.army.mil/arlreports/2001/ARL-TR-2352.pdf


this I disagree with (http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/tiki/tiki-index.php?page=Gravity)

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 11, 2017, 10:58 AM NHFT
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_declination
I don't think these maps make a lot of sense on a globe. I think there is something else going on.

These tide maps don't make sense to me either.

http://www6.cityu.edu.hk/see_mer/images/amphidromic.gif
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 11, 2017, 03:20 PM NHFT
uh oh
us Christian Flat Earthers are ruining it for the rest of them decent 'scientists"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUwMKJ7owmQ
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on April 12, 2017, 09:59 AM NHFT
 

 If the earth is flat, could a jet fly over the edge at low altitude and be suspended over nothing ? 

 Could a jet fly over the edge and then fly over the "bottom" of the earth ? 

Does the bottom of the flat earth have an irregular surface and geological features similar to the top of the earth. mountains, oceans, etc.  , or is it barren ?  What keeps the bottom intact and prevents it from dropping chunks into space?



 

 
 
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on April 12, 2017, 10:44 AM NHFT
There is an ice wall. Jets can't go there. Too cold.

"The Twin Otter aircraft – the only type of plane in the world capable of flying in the -60C (-76F) temperatures of the polar midwinter"

Under the earth is hell, or I'm pretty sure thy said something like that in Church. The devil keeps hell intact.

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on April 12, 2017, 02:52 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/tH1UHW7.png)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on April 12, 2017, 03:54 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/tH1UHW7.png)

I'd guess that it's the same reason that I can walk to the front of the bus while it's going 60 mph.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on April 13, 2017, 12:15 AM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/tH1UHW7.png)

I'd guess that it's the same reason that I can walk to the front of the bus while it's going 60 mph.

Oh, sure... you and your privilege get to go to the front of the bus!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 13, 2017, 10:50 AM NHFT
yea Bob and I can only heckle from the back of the bus.

See how Johnson always slips those bus priviledges in crazy conspiracy talk

There seems to be some barrier from us going very far south.

Check out operation High Jump and Operation Fish Bowl.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 20, 2017, 08:59 PM NHFT
This is an interesting 6 minute video.

The original video and science demonstration is cool of the solar system to scale.

then my guy adds some flat earth thoughts

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSyj1EwYv78
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on April 23, 2017, 05:23 PM NHFT
I could swear that looks like curvature. Must be some of that high-tech trickeration.

http://mymodernmet.com/lost-weather-balloon-captures-grand-canyon-shot/
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on April 28, 2017, 03:04 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/u8N1y4o.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: blackie on April 29, 2017, 05:26 AM NHFT
I could swear that looks like curvature. Must be some of that high-tech trickeration.

http://mymodernmet.com/lost-weather-balloon-captures-grand-canyon-shot/
It's called lens distortion. I have a go pro, and it has a pretty wide angle lens that causes distortion. You can't always trust a camera  :icon_pirat:

https://photographylife.com/what-is-distortion/
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: WithoutAPaddle on April 29, 2017, 06:03 AM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/tH1UHW7.png)

(http://home.ku.edu.tr/ffisunoglu/public_html/coyote/wile066.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on April 29, 2017, 02:51 PM NHFT
I could swear that looks like curvature. Must be some of that high-tech trickeration.

http://mymodernmet.com/lost-weather-balloon-captures-grand-canyon-shot/
It's called lens distortion. I have a go pro, and it has a pretty wide angle lens that causes distortion. You can't always trust a camera  :icon_pirat:

https://photographylife.com/what-is-distortion/

Wasn't lens distortion looking out the cockpit windshield at 40,000 feet over the Pacific Ocean When I was flying to Guam. I saw the curvature. That is one big, lonely, hate to go down in a plane ocean.

I also recently did more personal research on the subject... On a boat on the Chesapeake Bay, I could almost believe to see the slight curvature when I scanned the horizon. But, I know for sure I could see the sandy beach that was a mile away and only could see the trees above the beach across the water 20 miles away.

Of course NASA probably dosed me to make me think I saw what I saw!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on April 29, 2017, 02:53 PM NHFT
(http://i.imgur.com/tH1UHW7.png)

(http://home.ku.edu.tr/ffisunoglu/public_html/coyote/wile066.jpg)

See Looney Tunes proves that gravity doesn't exist!
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on April 30, 2017, 01:33 AM NHFT
"If the earth was flat, cats would have knocked everything over the edge by now."

My 14yo.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Becky Thatcher on April 30, 2017, 10:59 AM NHFT
"If the earth was flat, cats would have knocked everything over the edge by now."

My 14yo.

 ;D :clap: That's hilarious...and I have to agree with him.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on May 02, 2017, 02:46 PM NHFT
too cold :)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on May 03, 2017, 12:27 PM NHFT
http://theoatmeal.com/comics/believe

Fortunately for us, libertarians are immune to this. We have special extra-smart brains.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on May 04, 2017, 11:48 AM NHFT
http://theoatmeal.com/comics/believe

Fortunately for us, libertarians are immune to this. We have special extra-smart brains.

That was good and on point with conversations I've had recently.

I've been presenting the idea to people that many problems I see in people's reasoning is what I call shortcut thinking. Shortcut thinking is understandable in the need to make your thought processes more efficient. The problem comes in that it is more of a reactionary way of thinking.

If you are talking to someone and they hear a phrase that the talking heads use they think they know your position...  "You must be a liberal!" Etc.

Libertarians are just as prone to this... Many are really contrarians, their short cut thinking means they can be manipulated. And they can take positions based merely as a reaction.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: KBCraig on May 04, 2017, 09:44 PM NHFT
Libertarians are just as prone to this... Many are really contrarians, their short cut thinking means they can be manipulated. And they can take positions based merely as a reaction.

"What are you rebelling against?"
"Whaddaya got?"
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on May 04, 2017, 09:50 PM NHFT
Libertarians are just as prone to this... Many are really contrarians, their short cut thinking means they can be manipulated. And they can take positions based merely as a reaction.

"What are you rebelling against?"
"Whaddaya got?"

I'm much more interested in what you're for, then what you're against.

I'm not interested in Communism, but the position of the anti-communist could mean they're fascist. And the Antifa may be against Fascism, but they are pro-communist.

The next problem when you are defined by your enemy is you can take on the tactics of your enemy. The cop blockers start thinking they should have the equipment of the cops. And try to intimidate them.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Free libertarian on May 05, 2017, 08:59 AM NHFT
Libertarians are just as prone to this... Many are really contrarians, their short cut thinking means they can be manipulated. And they can take positions based merely as a reaction.

"What are you rebelling against?"
"Whaddaya got?"

I'm much more interested in what you're for, then what you're against.

I'm not interested in Communism, but the position of the anti-communist could mean they're fascist. And the Antifa may be against Fascism, but they are pro-communist.

The next problem when you are defined by your enemy is you can take on the tactics of your enemy. The cop blockers start thinking they should have the equipment of the cops. And try to intimidate them.


Interesting points there, Mr Sawyer.     

Overcoming engrained false dichotomies is a big hurdle I run into when trying to discuss things with people.   
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on May 05, 2017, 04:10 PM NHFT
Have you come across this Banksy related movie?
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1587707/?ref_=nv_sr_1

also listening to a podcast about the CIA and hollywood
latest one was about American Ultra
I guess they did an interesting ad campaign at comic con in San Diego involving free medicinal weed
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on May 06, 2017, 09:43 AM NHFT
I have seen that Banksy film.  8)

Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on May 06, 2017, 11:49 AM NHFT
was it good?
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on May 07, 2017, 11:28 AM NHFT
was it good?

It's more about the guy who tried to make a film about street art and Bansky. He shoot thousands of hours of footage and came up with this weird pretty unwatchable film, so Banksy told him he should stop filmmaking and actually do some street art... Banksy didn't want to tell him how bad his film was. So the guy, went all in and created a art personae "Mister Brainwash", MBW and started a studio getting employees to create the art he thought up. He ended up cashing in on the LA art scene. Pretty manic crazy dude.  ;D
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on May 07, 2017, 01:58 PM NHFT
funny
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Jim Johnson on May 07, 2017, 03:51 PM NHFT
It's all funny until someone loses an eye.
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Tom Sawyer on May 07, 2017, 06:45 PM NHFT
Listen to what Moe says boys and girls...

(http://arafwchnawr.com/images/Stooges-LOGO-1.jpg)
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on May 07, 2017, 11:54 PM NHFT
yikes
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: dalebert on June 02, 2017, 08:54 AM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=No6gBqauUMg
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 02, 2017, 09:20 AM NHFT
I have found a kindred spirit in the Fakeologist show up in Toronto love that guy and his guests

http://fakeologist.com/
Title: Re: Are conspiracy kooks hurting the liberty movement?
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 02, 2017, 09:21 AM NHFT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=No6gBqauUMg
see we went to Mars .... I saw it
the extras that populated the room when they fake landed a rover on Mars were not as good of actors