The libertarian movement often seems to be made up of a lot of Chicken Littles.
I had a friend that has a long time involvement with the movement and he helped me to be less pessimistic by telling me "... I see a bright and shining future." He then laid out all the positive progress he has seen and showed future likely scenarios . I appreciate him helping break me from the "death cult" of doom view.
Here is a place to count some blessings.
Union Leader of New Hampshire Endorses Gary Johnson Over Donald Trump
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/15/us/politics/gary-johnson-union-leader-endorsement.html?_r=0
I'm pretty sure the sky is falling. While, on the plus side, we're definitely not getting another clinton presidency, we -are- going to end up, most likely, with a trump presidency, all the while the economy is getting ready to take a massive dump of historical proportions.
Looking at the small bumps up and down on the curve is not a good indicator of the bigger trends.
My friend pointed out in the late 60s they couldn't gather 10 "libertarians" in one place. Sorry you're not happy in the desert. But, unlike the past there are more options... make it happen. :)
I would love to make it happen. Pretty sure my best case scenario is going to involve driving 2600 miles through a region suffering from the biggest economic struggle in recorded history since the collapse of the british empire. Much fun.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 15, 2016, 12:53 PM NHFT
I would love to make it happen. Pretty sure my best case scenario is going to involve driving 2600 miles through a region suffering from the biggest economic struggle in recorded history since the collapse of the british empire. Much fun.
Indians aren't going to attack you. ;D You aren't going to be walking beside your wagon.
As to the economic conditions...
Like my buddy Johnson says "I'm not worried till I see the skinny people."
We are freer in many ways than when when we freer. Back in the day we would not be having this conversation. You couldn't use bit coin to buy pot online. The list goes on.
It is a product of the folks selling others on how bad things are, that they are , but we do too much of the "Oh no! Another abuse by the gooberment."
As to the Presidential political circus...
I say good. The republican party is imploding and the democrats aren't far behind. Whoever "wins" the election is going to face a lot of bickering and gridlock.
It's got to get bad to get better.
Nature doesn't create straight lines, lots of curves and unexpecteds ahead. Some will be bad, but like the Berlin Wall coming down, marijuana being legalized some are good. In the long run it won't be the Orwellian "a boot stomping on a human face for ever."
I'm not worried about indians attacking me in my covered wagon, I'm worried about cash strapped cops attacking me in my busted ass taurus right before the engine falls out in the middle of nowhere.
And as far as the economic conditions and skinny people. . .
http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/09/new-survey-shows-teen-girls-are-trading-sex-work-for-food.html (http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/09/new-survey-shows-teen-girls-are-trading-sex-work-for-food.html)
And as for the presidential thing, yeah, I'm not worried too much about it, beyond the standard "oh we're getting a new one who's going to be just as bad as the last one" sense. But that's not really a -good- thing, ya know
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 15, 2016, 01:10 PM NHFT
And as far as the economic conditions and skinny people. . .
http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/09/new-survey-shows-teen-girls-are-trading-sex-work-for-food.html (http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/09/new-survey-shows-teen-girls-are-trading-sex-work-for-food.html)
That's nothing new.... there's a reason it's called the oldest profession.
Not the sex work. the idea that more and more of them are doing it for -food-. not for money to buy food. Just for -food-. that's new.
Anyway, we have different perspectives, and we probably aren't going to back and forth each other out of them. So let's just say, wait until the end of the month :P
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 15, 2016, 02:14 PM NHFT
Not the sex work. the idea that more and more of them are doing it for -food-. not for money to buy food. Just for -food-. that's new.
Anyway, we have different perspectives, and we probably aren't going to back and forth each other out of them. So let's just say, wait until the end of the month :P
If I do wait until the end of the month, what happens at the end of next month?
The highway robbers are a threat. The fact that you are aware is one step closer to safe.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 15, 2016, 03:27 PM NHFT
The highway robbers are a threat. The fact that you are aware is one step closer to safe.
Being aware that a bullet is traveling towards you at over 2000 feet per second does not help you stop it from popping your head.
Quote from: Jim Johnson on September 15, 2016, 03:25 PM NHFT
If I do wait until the end of the month, what happens at the end of next month?
The end of this month will be quite unmemorable. Good news, at that point, we'll be close to the fed no longer mattering.
I have all of this from a very reliable Time Monk whom I trust very much
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 15, 2016, 03:50 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 15, 2016, 03:27 PM NHFT
The highway robbers are a threat. The fact that you are aware is one step closer to safe.
Being aware that a bullet is traveling towards you at over 2000 feet per second does not help you stop it from popping your head.
Not knowing that someone might shoot at you is worse than knowing there is a threat and figuring out your best strategy for limiting the threat.
I've driven over 300,000 miles without a license. I am well aware of the threats. :)
Daytime travel, pick a holiday weekend. Odds are in your favor.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 15, 2016, 04:21 PM NHFT
Not knowing that someone might shoot at you is worse than knowing there is a threat and figuring out your best strategy for limiting the threat.
I've driven over 300,000 miles without a license. I am well aware of the threats. :)
Daytime travel, pick a holiday weekend. Odds are in your favor.
Be careful with that advice. Make sure you mention to avoid the popular drinking holidays like new years and 4th of july.
Not worried about sobriety checkpoints during daylight hours on the interstate. :)
Of course the border patrol checkpoints in your area suck. We even have that up towards the Canadian border. I have my secret route to miss it. Get to cross a covered bridge and take in the scenery.
This is the Polly Anna, upbeat, there is always a way thread. Lots of people have gone through a lot worse situations then we have to deal with. They should give us courage to face the smaller threats we deal with.
I know. That's why I'm here. I have lots of difficulty being upbeat and sometimes I trick myself into thinking that being around upbeat people will help. And keep in mind that I'm not worried about cops pulling me over -today-, (actually I am because no insurance), I'm concerned about cops pulling me over during rough times when they're looking for cash or anything else they can steal, not because they feel entitled, but because they're at the point where they actually -need- it in a very real way.
Johnson thinks Lorne Greene sold Allepo dog food. Sorry folks, but countless millions are dead because we, or at least, the US Supreme Court and Ralph Nader, elected a flunkie who didn't even know there was any such thing as Shiites and Sunnis. It is disgraceful that a political party - if the Libertarian Party even deserves that status with a capital L and P - offers a candidate for the Presidency who doesn't have the brains to at least get a brief tutorial on foreign policy.
This may backfire on the Libertarian Party. A lot of people see Trump as the last, best hope to "blow it all up and start over again". We already did that in Iraq, Egypt and Libya, and now in Syria. If you think that simply taking down the system paves the way for a new and better system, forget about it. The only benefit that Russians get from the end of the old Soviet Union is that they are now free to leave it.
Fortunately, Johnson can draw enough votes away from Trump so that he loses in the general election (I hope). I will be voting this November for the second worst Presidential candidate ever to have represented one of the two major political parties in the United States history. After that, I will surely be supportive of efforts of Congress to do things that she will oppose, if it can muster the will to do so, and then hope for a better primary process in 2019 and 2020.
Nah. It's a 98% bet that trump will win. But really, the president won't matter. It's all coming tumbling down soon. My Time Monk friend's words are sometimes confusing and difficult to interpret, but on this it's pretty straightforward.
Who wins the election is of little matter to me.
Trump has torn apart the R's, Hillary has alienated many from the D's. Neither one will be able to get much done because of the horrible partisan divide.
I watched Gary Johnson on The View...Gary Johnson goes on The View (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlDgh6WM-Cc)
I was greatly encouraged by the dynamic he can seize upon. The Aleppo stumble is one of the better things to happen for his campaign. Watch how the two dinosaurs, Whoopie and Joy, can't figure out why he is appealing to the younger hosts. Partisan politics is the problem and the solution is a guy like him. He's not going to win the election, but his percentage proves the appeal of this new (to most people) direction.
I heard an interview with him on NPR. Many of the things that a lot of libertarians are bitching about his watered down version of libertarianism is his asset. Does anyone think that policy wonks and purity people are the way the presidential race is run? ;D
The young black woman on The View was all smiles and said he was kind of like Bernie. That's a good thing. Anti-intervention, pro-pot, and anti-corporatism... with a side of limited government please. In the sound bite world of television you don't have a hour to explain the more fringe (from mainstream) details of libertarianism.
We could attack someone that is getting some traction and moving toward the goals, or we could be all gloomy and teardown the good for the dream of the perfect.
A bright and shining future... after a turbulent wild ride. What else has history ever given people. Remember the Berlin Wall? Before we realized it was over... It was knocked down and then Roger Waters had an awesome concert where a bunch of counter culture artists performed "The Wall". It's not our parents world, it's our world... if we have the balls to seize the opportunities. Unless we are stupid enough to only see the short term and ask for the lesser of two evils.
In the cannabis movement the old guard were willing to beg for crumbs... "We'll never see pot sold in stores." 3 years later it was happening in multiple states. I even bitch about that it's not enough because of the tax and regulate model... But, damn let's push for more instead of "It will never work, we're doomed!" We should not be the obstacle. Have enough faith and hope that someone else starts hoping too. I've done it a few times and 30 years later got to see that some of the young ones we fostered effected real change.
Sunny day on the mountain today... life is too short to give up on my son's future.
They sky fell a long time ago.
Good luck trying to fix the world.
Quote from: blackie on September 15, 2016, 08:40 PM NHFT
They sky fell a long time ago.
Good luck trying to fix the world.
I'm not fixing the world.
I'm just saying we are not necessarily doomed.
As you grow cannabis legally for a living... in 1987 you would have never imagined such a thing possible in that relatively short time frame.
Even if the sky WAS falling, why worry? It's only made of air. Now nuclear fallout and debris, well, that's a little different.
Quote from: Free libertarian on September 16, 2016, 06:08 AM NHFT
Even if the sky WAS falling, why worry? It's only made of air. Now nuclear fallout and debris, well, that's a little different.
Nice to live upwind of NYC.
Fall is the best time of year weather wise for me, I feel 47 again. (trying to positive here)
Quote from: Free libertarian on September 16, 2016, 06:23 AM NHFT
Fall is the best time of year weather wise for me, I feel 47 again. (trying to positive here)
Ahhh, to be 47 again. ;D
It is my favorite time of year as well. Pleasant weather, no bugs, ya don't sweat. Looks like another beautiful day.
Quote from: blackie on September 15, 2016, 08:40 PM NHFT
They sky fell a long time ago.
Good luck trying to fix the world.
I'm sure you mean 1916, during an actual plague.... or the 1903's, during an actual economic crisis.
Even the 1970's can laugh at what's currently happening.
Quote from: Jim Johnson on September 16, 2016, 11:08 AM NHFT
Quote from: blackie on September 15, 2016, 08:40 PM NHFT
They sky fell a long time ago.
Good luck trying to fix the world.
I'm sure you mean 1916, during an actual plague.... or the 1903's, during an actual economic crisis.
Even the 1970's can laugh at what's currently happening.
Heh. There hasn't been such economic imbalance as the U.S. is experiencing right now in recorded history. This is because, until the last few hundred years, humanity lacked the
technology to effect such an imbalance in the first place. Before the advent of automobiles, it was very difficult to effectively extend economic control more than a day's travel outside a city. Now, if someone is engaging in 'improper' commerce, perhaps violating a granted monopoly, enforcers can be there in minutes or hours. Before the invention of modern communications technology, it could take days or weeks for economic information to travel from one city to another. Now, the actions of the fed can have very immediate ripple effects on the other side of the world, within hours or even minutes.
So, when this all falls down, it's gonna be interesting.
Fortunately, human beings tend not to just lie down and starve to death in the absence of their normal source of income and nutrition, and people will start actively searching for ways to sustain themselves reasonably quickly once that happens. :)
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 16, 2016, 12:00 PM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on September 16, 2016, 11:08 AM NHFT
Quote from: blackie on September 15, 2016, 08:40 PM NHFT
They sky fell a long time ago.
Good luck trying to fix the world.
I'm sure you mean 1916, during an actual plague.... or the 1903's, during an actual economic crisis.
Even the 1970's can laugh at what's currently happening.
Heh. There hasn't been such economic imbalance as the U.S. is experiencing right now in recorded history. This is because, until the last few hundred years, humanity lacked the technology to effect such an imbalance in the first place. Before the advent of automobiles, it was very difficult to effectively extend economic control more than a day's travel outside a city. Now, if someone is engaging in 'improper' commerce, perhaps violating a granted monopoly, enforcers can be there in minutes or hours. Before the invention of modern communications technology, it could take days or weeks for economic information to travel from one city to another. Now, the actions of the fed can have very immediate ripple effects on the other side of the world, within hours or even minutes.
So, when this all falls down, it's gonna be interesting.
Fortunately, human beings tend not to just lie down and starve to death in the absence of their normal source of income and nutrition, and people will start actively searching for ways to sustain themselves reasonably quickly once that happens. :)
Thank you for the reminder. I gotta get some Cannibal repellant.
some good cannibal repellant brands are 7.62 mm and .45 cal
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 15, 2016, 10:38 AM NHFT
The libertarian movement often seems to be made up of a lot of Chicken Littles.
Indeed. Some just think they're Johnny rebels ("Whattaya got?") -- whatever is winning is what they're against. The same people griping about Johnson/Weld would be bitching if the ticket were Harry Browne and Ron Paul. I think the real source of their anger is their cognitive dissonance: they have decided that there is some perfect balance between minarchism and anarchism, and they're going to stand astride a fulcrum that doesn't actually exist and shake their fists at everyone who is a nanometer to either side.
Pragmatism is inexcusable as a substitute for philosophy, but even the purist philosophy requires a pragmatic way to get from here, to there. If it doesn't, it's just an excuse to complain that we're not there yet.
I'm an anarchist because I don't believe that government is necessary. I'm a libertarian because I believe that it's inevitable.
Quote from: KBCraig on September 16, 2016, 04:46 PM NHFT
I'm an anarchist because I don't believe that government is necessary. I'm a libertarian because I believe that it's inevitable.
That's a rather gloomy outlook.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 16, 2016, 06:02 PM NHFT
Quote from: KBCraig on September 16, 2016, 04:46 PM NHFT
I'm an anarchist because I don't believe that government is necessary. I'm a libertarian because I believe that it's inevitable.
That's a rather gloomy outlook.
It's even gloomier than you can probably even conceive of right now.
But I can say I'm much happier after accepting reality for what it is.
That doesn't mean I give up, that just means I'm through with thinking changing anything about government is going to make a difference. Palliative care is for the dying.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 16, 2016, 04:06 PM NHFT
some good cannibal repellant brands are 7.62 mm and .45 cal
But are they organic ?
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 15, 2016, 10:38 AM NHFT
The libertarian movement often seems to be made up of a lot of Chicken Littles.
I had a friend that has a long time involvement with the movement and he helped me to be less pessimistic by telling me "... I see a bright and shining future." He then laid out all the positive progress he has seen and showed future likely scenarios . I appreciate him helping break me from the "death cult" of doom view.
Here is a place to count some blessings.
after all that .... the best you can do is "maybe the sky isn't falling"? wow what a Polyanna
btw didn't we have a thread or section of the forum for that ?
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 15, 2016, 03:27 PM NHFT
The highway robbers are a threat. The fact that you are aware is one step closer to safe.
I survived 2 inspections the last 2 days
whew
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 15, 2016, 04:21 PM NHFT
I've driven over 300,000 miles without a license. I am well aware of the threats. :)
Daytime travel, pick a holiday weekend. Odds are in your favor.
the DOT stations are often closed on weekends and at night
during holidays they seem to give up on us and go after the drunk drivers
Quote from: KBCraig on September 16, 2016, 04:46 PM NHFT
Indeed. Some just think they're Johnny rebels ("Whattaya got?") -- whatever is winning is what they're against. The same people griping about Johnson/Weld would be bitching if the ticket were Harry Browne and Ron Paul. I think the real source of their anger is their cognitive dissonance: they have decided that there is some perfect balance between minarchism and anarchism, and they're going to stand astride a fulcrum that doesn't actually exist and shake their fists at everyone who is a nanometer to either side.
I can see that
I feel like I should clarify. I'm not worried about police so much right now at this moment. I'm worried about them in the near future, when the treasury market goes nuts and the dollar pukes its guts all over the place and everything gets weird and difficult for average people, financially speaking.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 21, 2016, 07:27 PM NHFT
I feel like I should clarify. I'm not worried about police so much right now at this moment. I'm worried about them in the near future, when the treasury market goes nuts and the dollar pukes its guts all over the place and everything gets weird and difficult for average people, financially speaking.
Hurry up and get here then. ;D
I think there is a lot more wealth for them to inflate away.
Government is a parasite... a good parasite don't kill the host.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 21, 2016, 07:45 PM NHFT
Hurry up and get here then. ;D
I think there is a lot more wealth for them to inflate away.
Government is a parasite... a good parasite don't kill the host.
who said the government is a GOOD parasite? They're just as bad as viruses.
And you can think all you want, bonds are about to drop, while the yields go through the roof. Fed's going to freak out, panic, try at
least three ridiculous 'solutions', and at that point, I think there won't be anyone left who
cares what the fed does any more.
and i'm
really trying. Pretty much everything I've got saved up is going into a new vehicle(that's a prerequisite, no way I'm trusting my hunk of junk that far), and at that point, I'm going to have a few dribs and drabs left over. So, let me know when you want to donate :P
never forget
"Maybe the sky ain't fallin"
Maybe. I have yet to see any supporting evidence, though :P
So, who's excited to watch the markets go nutso tomorrow? :)
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 26, 2016, 04:47 PM NHFT
So, who's excited to watch the markets go nutso tomorrow? :)
Why are the markets going nuts tomorrow?
Quote from: Jim Johnson on September 26, 2016, 04:55 PM NHFT
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 26, 2016, 04:47 PM NHFT
So, who's excited to watch the markets go nutso tomorrow? :)
Why are the markets going nuts tomorrow?
Inquiring minds want to know.
When Erroneous_Logic talks people listen.
And other trademarked tag lines. :D
Because they've been winding up for it for the last fifty years, obviously. :)
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 26, 2016, 07:34 PM NHFT
Because they've been winding up for it for the last fifty years, obviously. :)
What's been happening since 1966?
"winding up for it"... is that a baseball thing or clock thing?
Who are "they"?
As an aside, but nearly relevant...Why do people say "meteoric rising" ? Don't meteors descend and crash to the ground ?
I'd also like to know if a falling asteroid qualifies as "the sky is falling" ? I need some help here, can I get a ruling on this?
A falling asteroid does indeed qualifies as "the sky is falling".
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 26, 2016, 09:26 PM NHFT
A falling asteroid does indeed qualifies as "the sky is falling".
Dear Judge Sawyer,
The phrase 'The Sky is Falling' refers to an absurdity, in which harm can come from nothingness.
Meteors fall out the sky.... they are not part of the sky.
.....and the phrase 'Meteoric Rise' refers to the likeness of a meteor to a firework.
:raspberry:
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 26, 2016, 09:26 PM NHFT
A falling asteroid does indeed qualifies as "the sky is falling".
"Scuse me while I kiss the asteroid" - Jimi Hendrix takes a fatal lyric wrong turn and remains obscure
Johnson is like the Shell Answer Man. Either that or he is Mr. Google.
I really wish Solar Bob could refrain from revealing Jimi's private life.
Ugh. When people make posts like that on Facebook, it's called Vaguebooking. I don't know what it's called here but it's just as annoying.
Okay, I'll bite. What is it about tomorrow specifically that marks the end of this 50 year amp up to insanity?
Well, today now. It was tomorrow yesterday. hey, anyone notice how Deutsche Bank is down 10%?
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 27, 2016, 12:03 PM NHFT
Well, today now. It was tomorrow yesterday. hey, anyone notice how Deutsche Bank is down 10%?
That's not new.
What was supposed to happen today?
It's new that it's down ten percent in the last two days. But anyway, let's see how all the treasury auctions go today. supposed to be nearly $100 billion :)
So is this connected to the two idiots in the debates?
Well, it could be. The appearance of Hillary doing well in the presidential race would cause treasury prices to rise while yields fall, because people will believe she would(of course) continue the trend of near zero interest rates. Conversely, if people believe Donny, who has given indications of -not- maintaining that trend, is coming out on top, prices would likely go down while yields rise.
Mostly, I think the bubbles just about ready to hug the cactus of reality.
(https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14519768_1624923951133602_3660963881816209698_n.jpg?oh=06b84543d9c2839da6d7b692b995e53e&oe=58AD6497)
Clinton wins debate? How about Neither wins debate. ;D
Things are going our way. By that I mean the two major parties are imploding.
Exactly. And since the interest rates are entirely a political thing at the moment, dual party implosions will confuse the hell out of them and they won't know which way to jump.
if the german bank goes down .... is that a vote of confidence for Brexit
meteoric rise ..... so true
I wouldn't say it's so much a vote of confidence for Brexit as it is a vote of 'haha see that's what HAPPENS you silly keynesians trololol'
well ya know what they say
maybe the sky isn't falling
Perhaps. Short term treasuries are showing indications that the market is preparing for an interest rate hike.
do you want the stock market to go up or down?
I want the stock market to disconnect itself from politics and central banks.
One way to avoid a falling sky, would be to legislatively rename the action of a falling sky, then it never happened, it just becomes something else.
"The only thing sure thing in life is death and taxes and umm, pieces of the atmosphere descending..everybody knows that" - A generic Politician
They make their living by telling you the sky is falling, that it is the other sides fault and only they can prevent it.
Everything is a matter of your perception.
From the sky's perspective, it is ground that's rising up.
Uh oh spaghetti-o, opec agreed to limit oil production and now all the short term treasuries are sliding down. Everyone get on the slide :P
oh my. It's all gearing up to go splat.
From http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/saudi-arabia-ways-hit-back-911-lawsuit-effort-42419542 (http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/saudi-arabia-ways-hit-back-911-lawsuit-effort-42419542)
QuoteSaudi Arabia and its allies are warning that U.S. legislation allowing the kingdom to be sued for the 9/11 attacks will have negative repercussions.
The kingdom maintains an arsenal of tools to retaliate with, including curtailing official contacts, pulling billions of dollars from the U.S. economy, and persuading its close allies in the Gulf Cooperation Council to scale back counterterrorism cooperation, investments and U.S. access to important regional air bases.
"This should be clear to America and to the rest of the world: When one GCC state is targeted unfairly, the others stand around it," said Abdulkhaleq Abdullah, an Emirati Gulf specialist and professor of political science at United Arab Emirates University.
"All the states will stand by Saudi Arabia in every way possible," he said.
That, plus the fact that there's probably going to be a huge exit from the USD when the Chinese Yuan gets added to the SDR basket on friday, as well as the signals that the U.S. treasuries market is spitting out spells bad things, both for the U.S. gov and the U.S. economy.
I really sincerely hope that everyone has their rice and beans tucked away somewhere.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 28, 2016, 06:27 PM NHFT
oh my. It's all gearing up to go splat.
From http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/saudi-arabia-ways-hit-back-911-lawsuit-effort-42419542 (http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/saudi-arabia-ways-hit-back-911-lawsuit-effort-42419542)
QuoteSaudi Arabia and its allies are warning that U.S. legislation allowing the kingdom to be sued for the 9/11 attacks will have negative repercussions.
The kingdom maintains an arsenal of tools to retaliate with, including curtailing official contacts, pulling billions of dollars from the U.S. economy, and persuading its close allies in the Gulf Cooperation Council to scale back counterterrorism cooperation, investments and U.S. access to important regional air bases.
"This should be clear to America and to the rest of the world: When one GCC state is targeted unfairly, the others stand around it," said Abdulkhaleq Abdullah, an Emirati Gulf specialist and professor of political science at United Arab Emirates University.
"All the states will stand by Saudi Arabia in every way possible," he said.
That, plus the fact that there's probably going to be a huge exit from the USD when the Chinese Yuan gets added to the SDR basket on friday, as well as the signals that the U.S. treasuries market is spitting out spells bad things, both for the U.S. gov and the U.S. economy.
I really sincerely hope that everyone has their rice and beans tucked away somewhere.
I guess I'm just glad that aren't going to cut our heads off. Great bunch.
Kissing their asses in the past was a big mistake... all so the oil companies could benefit. I guess oil production in the USA will be coming back up online soon.
QuoteObama had vetoed the Justice Against Sponsors of Terrorism Act, or JASTA, arguing that allowing U.S. courts to waive foreign sovereign immunity could lead other foreign governments to act "reciprocally" by giving their courts the right to exercise jurisdiction over the U.S. and its employees for overseas actions. These could include deadly U.S. drone strikes and abuses committed by U.S.-trained police units or U.S.-backed militias.
Probably as it should be. Maybe Dubyah can be tried for his war crimes. ;D Right next to Obama.
You know that's never going to happen unless we, as a society, reach a point where it won't matter any more.
The point is, though, grab your socks because soon they'll be $100 a pair.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 28, 2016, 07:40 PM NHFT
You know that's never going to happen unless we, as a society, reach a point where it won't matter any more.
The point is, though, grab your socks because soon they'll be $100 a pair.
So are you going to invest in socks? Seems like a great opportunity.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 27, 2016, 02:08 PM NHFT
So is this connected to the two idiots in the debates?
(https://media.giphy.com/media/l0HlFSmOQqi2uUp56/giphy.gif)
Nah. I'm putting my money into bitcoin and beans and new car funds.
And the treasuries thing right now might be mildly related to the two idiots being idiotic at each other, one being in favor of continuing the current fed policy(treasuries go up) and the other being in favor of some mystical policy that causes rates to both go down and up at the same time(treasuries instantaneously blip into an alternate dimension and start breeding with mutant rabbits), but when the saudi's start dumping treasuries in retribution for being sued over 9/11, that's what's going to really tip the boat over.
The United States is the Saudis biggest benefactor. Their selling off US Treasuries would be shooting themselves. They'll have to suck it up like anyone else caught in the US "Justice System".
lol. no they don't. they have half of the middle east at their back, and the u.s. is starting to become more and more obvious about their ability to kick ass on the other side of the world as long as you're not a rich country with actual military power. Plus, even odds that russia backs them just to poke us in the eye. And even if we -did- glass parking lot the entire place, it would be too late, cause the economic damage would be done already.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 28, 2016, 11:29 PM NHFT
lol. no they don't. they have half of the middle east at their back, and the u.s. is starting to become more and more obvious about their ability to kick ass on the other side of the world as long as you're not a rich country with actual military power. Plus, even odds that russia backs them just to poke us in the eye. And even if we -did- glass parking lot the entire place, it would be too late, cause the economic damage would be done already.
Not being critical of you here, but when you say "we" above, ("even if we -did- glass parking lot" etc.) I bet you really mean "they".
I make a conscious effort to correct my own conditioned uses of words and sometimes catch myself using the wrong terms too. For instance they aren't "my taxes", they are "their taxes" . It's funny the looks you get from people when you use the proper terms, but it can sometimes create interesting conversations too.
You got the meaning that I was conveying, which is the most important part and the point of words existing. :)
and "They" made you do it :)
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 29, 2016, 10:34 AM NHFT
You got the meaning that I was conveying, which is the most important part and the point of words existing. :)
Sure, I agree with you, your word sin doesn't deserve a severe beating. So I put away my wet noodle.
My point was more an observation of how an intelligent person like you, and sometimes many of us (me included) are trained to use words the way they want us to, which is to say, inaccurately.
"They" intend the meanings of words can shift based on who is doing something, rather than being based on the action being done. For instance, if you or I do it, it's murder, if "they" do it, it's collateral damage.
If you or I do it, it's theft, if they take without permission it's called something else etc.
When they / we do this repetitively it gets ingrained in the common lexicon and it helps them build illogical, but commonly believed bridges to creating a false normal. I may not be normal, and part of that is because I reject commonly used but false meanings. Until more people examine and talk about that, "we" remain fucked, so to speak.
We reject the cliche that a citizen who chooses a principled third-party candidate is squandering his or her vote.
— Chicago Tribune Editorial Board
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-gary-johnson-president-endorsement-edit-1002-20160930-story.html
While the media piles on Johnson for another Aleppo moment. Another large mainstream newspaper endorses the Libertarian candidate.
What's the Ghandi quote... first they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they attack you, then you win. Libertarian ideas are making great gains into the mainstream market of ideas. Johnson isn't the one. But, he is carrying the ball down the field.
All the criticism is gaining a larger audience that is now exposed to the idea/option of libertarianism.
The smug, sneering, Lefty commentators realize he is popular with the younger audience. And is a threat to Hillary. So all the right wing leaning libertarian hand wringing over the left leaning libertarians... the left leaning ones steal votes from the left, which is a good thing.
If you allow the media manipulators to create the context of what they report you come away with the narrative they want to establish. For example, "Johnson is an idiot that doesn't know some detail." But, observing without the bias, you get the message that he is the only candidate that recognizes and acknowledges that we armed ISIS and the current mess with our desire to have "regime change in Syria".
Our ideas are making progress into the wider world. Lots of reasons to be optimistic. In fact it's necessary to seize upon the opportunities being created.
Quote from: Free libertarian on September 30, 2016, 06:45 AM NHFT
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 29, 2016, 10:34 AM NHFT
You got the meaning that I was conveying, which is the most important part and the point of words existing. :)
Sure, I agree with you, your word sin doesn't deserve a severe beating. So I put away my wet noodle.
My point was more an observation of how an intelligent person like you, and sometimes many of us (me included) are trained to use words the way they want us to, which is to say, inaccurately.
"They" intend the meanings of words can shift based on who is doing something, rather than being based on the action being done. For instance, if you or I do it, it's murder, if "they" do it, it's collateral damage.
If you or I do it, it's theft, if they take without permission it's called something else etc.
When they / we do this repetitively it gets ingrained in the common lexicon and it helps them build illogical, but commonly believed bridges to creating a false normal. I may not be normal, and part of that is because I reject commonly used but false meanings. Until more people examine and talk about that, "we" remain fucked, so to speak.
Many (most) people are limited in their thinking by their limitations in vocabulary and inability to conceive of ideas they don't have words for.
Quote from: jerryswife on October 01, 2016, 08:30 AM NHFT
Quote from: Free libertarian on September 30, 2016, 06:45 AM NHFT
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 29, 2016, 10:34 AM NHFT
You got the meaning that I was conveying, which is the most important part and the point of words existing. :)
Sure, I agree with you, your word sin doesn't deserve a severe beating. So I put away my wet noodle.
My point was more an observation of how an intelligent person like you, and sometimes many of us (me included) are trained to use words the way they want us to, which is to say, inaccurately.
"They" intend the meanings of words can shift based on who is doing something, rather than being based on the action being done. For instance, if you or I do it, it's murder, if "they" do it, it's collateral damage.
If you or I do it, it's theft, if they take without permission it's called something else etc.
When they / we do this repetitively it gets ingrained in the common lexicon and it helps them build illogical, but commonly believed bridges to creating a false normal. I may not be normal, and part of that is because I reject commonly used but false meanings. Until more people examine and talk about that, "we" remain fucked, so to speak.
Many (most) people are limited in their thinking by their limitations in vocabulary and inability to conceive of ideas they don't have words for.
Good point. That's why we need more wordologists to create the words and take back the words that have been stolen.
Worda Claus ? My 4th personality?
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 15, 2016, 03:50 PM NHFT
The end of this month will be quite unmemorable. Good news, at that point, we'll be close to the fed no longer mattering.
OMG, he was right!
https://cointelegraph.com/news/moneros-bubble-pops-price-plummets-as-currency-loses-top-five-ranking
Quote from: dalebert on October 01, 2016, 12:43 PM NHFT
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on September 15, 2016, 03:50 PM NHFT
The end of this month will be quite unmemorable. Good news, at that point, we'll be close to the fed no longer mattering.
OMG, he was right!
https://cointelegraph.com/news/moneros-bubble-pops-price-plummets-as-currency-loses-top-five-ranking
I almost jumped out a window. Dang that was close.
The sun will rise tomorrow and I will smile.
Goodness. It would take something a bit more meaningful than treasury yields to affect whether or not the sun rises.
I'm not too worried about the monero thing. It's just the hype bubble. It happens to lots of currencies. Happened to bitcoin the first time it halved. It'll dip, and then rediscover the proper price and continue on like nothing happened. oh btw bitcoin jumped up about $10-15 since friday, very very suddenly.
reading this thread helped talk me off the ledge
we are spending the night in a sleepy little Amish town in NE Indiana. They said last weekend was their biggest for tourists. Now we can hear the clop clop clop of the tall sleek horses. :)
We pick up Dollar General fixtures in the morning.
(http://i2.wp.com/freekeene.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/13256097_1751503995063182_393613851935002922_n1.jpg)
The Sky is Falling!
Chicken Little for President
A couple of minor points...
If Johnson/Weld are elected I probably will think of it as a victory and totally celebrate like it's 1999!
Of course that is slightly more likely to happen than Darryl walking down the street waving in his Inaugural Parade.
Tomorrow, I'm going to eat a Banana Split in Keene.
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 03, 2016, 07:32 PM NHFT
Tomorrow, I'm going to eat a Banana Split in Keene.
Jim is playing fiddle while Rome burns!
If you replace the fiddle with a banana split.. and the Roman Empire with the US Empire.
How can you do happy things like noshing on ice cream when there is so much to worry about?
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 03, 2016, 08:27 PM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 03, 2016, 07:32 PM NHFT
Tomorrow, I'm going to eat a Banana Split in Keene.
Jim is playing fiddle while Rome burns!
If you replace the fiddle with a banana split.. and the Roman Empire with the US Empire.
How can you do happy things like noshing on ice cream when there is so much to worry about?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeMFqkcPYcg
You'll find what you look for in life.
so true
if we get anyone but Hillary I am pleasantly surprised
if we get those 2 I would be happy and intrigued
these LP guys take themselves way to seriously .... leave that to those of us that tilt at windmills
oh btw I support Perry for President of New NH
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 03, 2016, 08:55 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 03, 2016, 08:27 PM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 03, 2016, 07:32 PM NHFT
Tomorrow, I'm going to eat a Banana Split in Keene.
Jim is playing fiddle while Rome burns!
If you replace the fiddle with a banana split.. and the Roman Empire with the US Empire.
How can you do happy things like noshing on ice cream when there is so much to worry about?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeMFqkcPYcg
You'll find what you look for in life.
Everybody looking for something... indeed.
So Jimmy do you want to be abused by Annie Lennox? I would have probably gone along back in the day. ;D
I got to video her at Williams College graduation. I'm sure she doesn't remember me. ;D
Reason writes...
Does the Road to the White House Run Through Gary Johnson's New Mexico? (http://reason.com/blog/2016/10/02/does-the-road-to-the-white-house-run-thr)
QuoteThe idea of Johnson winning New Mexico and the two major-party candidates stalling out short of 270 is of course incredibly unlikely. But it is worth thinking about, especially for those of us who stubbornly refuse to buy into the false "binary choice" narrative being pushed by both Republicans and Democrats. Change needs to be seen as possible before it takes place, right? Sometimes change comes in big, revolutionary waves. Other times, it comes from a small but steady rivulet of water that hollows out seemingly impregnable structures. However awful the 21st century has been so far to many of us, it is far worse for established ideologies and political parties, who are really taking it on the chin. The question is, what's the smallest victory it will take to show just how weak and foundering our political duopoly really is?
;D ;D ;D
(https://scontent-mia1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/p480x480/14563505_1399400293421624_7042757176943298339_n.jpg?oh=6a7df85fc6c2e35455e02b62fd52b16d&oe=587A3180)
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 03, 2016, 09:57 PM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 03, 2016, 08:55 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 03, 2016, 08:27 PM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 03, 2016, 07:32 PM NHFT
Tomorrow, I'm going to eat a Banana Split in Keene.
Jim is playing fiddle while Rome burns!
If you replace the fiddle with a banana split.. and the Roman Empire with the US Empire.
How can you do happy things like noshing on ice cream when there is so much to worry about?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeMFqkcPYcg
You'll find what you look for in life.
Everybody looking for something... indeed.
So Jimmy do you want to be abused by Annie Lennox? I would have probably gone along back in the day. ;D
I got to video her at Williams College graduation. I'm sure she doesn't remember me. ;D
The cows make more sense now.
I'm down to my last couple of votes...ever...honest. I need a little help deciding though.
Vermin Supreme again or Darryl ?
While I sorta like Gary Johnson as being less evil and understand any attention he gets might ultimately help some people to become "real Libertarians" and an even smaller amount to become "real libertarians" I can't make myself vote for him.
I even used my 2008 Ron Paul billboards to shore up my chicken coop, so maybe I'm like a reformed smoker who takes a drag off somebody else's cigarette from time to time.
I think a banana split is a good idea too, so there's always that.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 03, 2016, 08:27 PM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 03, 2016, 07:32 PM NHFT
Tomorrow, I'm going to eat a Banana Split in Keene.
Jim is playing fiddle while Rome burns!
If you replace the fiddle with a banana split.. and the Roman Empire with the US Empire.
How can you do happy things like noshing on ice cream when there is so much to worry about?
But if you replace the fiddle with ice cream how will the sound come out ?
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 04, 2016, 10:06 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 03, 2016, 08:27 PM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 03, 2016, 07:32 PM NHFT
Tomorrow, I'm going to eat a Banana Split in Keene.
Jim is playing fiddle while Rome burns!
If you replace the fiddle with a banana split.. and the Roman Empire with the US Empire.
How can you do happy things like noshing on ice cream when there is so much to worry about?
But if you replace the fiddle with ice cream how will the sound come out ?
Nom, nom, nom, nom... of course. ;D
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 04, 2016, 09:59 AM NHFT
I'm down to my last couple of votes...ever...honest. I need a little help deciding though.
Vermin Supreme again or Darryl ?
While I sorta like Gary Johnson as being less evil and understand any attention he gets might ultimately help some people to become "real Libertarians" and an even smaller amount to become "real libertarians" I can't make myself vote for him.
I even used my 2008 Ron Paul billboards to shore up my chicken coop, so maybe I'm like a reformed smoker who takes a drag off somebody else's cigarette from time to time.
I think a banana split is a good idea too, so there's always that.
I've never voted in a political election... Well, if you don't count William's race for President of the New Hampshire Underground.
I have done work in support of campaigns I thought might bring more people on board.
And of course there is the whoring myself out in DC for lots of truly evil Ds and Rs. Just another day in the video brothel. I even told a few clients, "I'll fuck ya, but I won't kiss ya."
When I went from building electronic warfare widgets to video post production I thought I was going to a cleaner use of technology and my energies. Boy, I couldn't have been more wrong. Weapons fight the wars... the video work/propaganda was helping start the wars.
Still trying to cleanse my karma. ;D
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 04, 2016, 10:10 AM NHFT
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 04, 2016, 10:06 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 03, 2016, 08:27 PM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 03, 2016, 07:32 PM NHFT
Tomorrow, I'm going to eat a Banana Split in Keene.
Jim is playing fiddle while Rome burns!
If you replace the fiddle with a banana split.. and the Roman Empire with the US Empire.
How can you do happy things like noshing on ice cream when there is so much to worry about?
But if you replace the fiddle with ice cream how will the sound come out ?
Nom, nom, nom, nom... of course. ;D
I can see it now, Jim doing his best Charlie Daniels rendition of "the Devil went down to Georgia" until the sun melts his fiddle.
I had a banana split the other day. And another one for breakfast this morning.
Enjoy your banana splits while you can! Another banana apocalypse is inevitable, given that they're propagated entirely by cuttings with no genetic variation! Soon, disease will destroy the banana industry once again, and we shall lack our delicious dildo shaped fruit toppings
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on October 04, 2016, 12:47 PM NHFT
Enjoy your banana splits while you can!
That is the point.
Enjoy life while you can, because it will end some day. Worrying doesn't change the outcome, so you might as well enjoy what you can., while you can.
And also you could try to develop a strain of bananas that -do- have seeds that are, perhaps, not super intrusive to the eating of the fruit, like butternut squash, perhaps.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on October 04, 2016, 12:47 PM NHFT
Enjoy your banana splits while you can! Another banana apocalypse is inevitable, given that they're propagated entirely by cuttings with no genetic variation! Soon, disease will destroy the banana industry once again, and we shall lack our delicious dildo shaped fruit toppings
Interesting note... I had heard that. However the Polly Anna view I have is that there is one heck of an incentive to come up with a different cultivar through genetic engineering.
I don't subscribe to that whole Rachel Carson "Silent Spring" we are doomed view. Because we were supposed to be poisoned already, when in fact the air is cleaner than when she wrote that book. Until man sees the consequences of actions there is not the incentive to change course.
Many people sell fear by charting a straight line... If we stay on this path look at the doom it leads to. When in fact there are no straight lines anywhere in our history or in nature.
I mean, true, true, but it happened like fifty years ago, and we turned around and did the exact same thing with a new strain of bananas that tasted different. that's why bananas don't taste like banana flavoring. The variety that banana flavoring tastes like is no more.
SOME PRINCIPLES OF HISTORY
99. Think of history as being the sum of two components: an erratic
component that consists of unpredictable events that follow no
discernible pattern, and a regular component that consists of
long-term historical trends. Here we are concerned with the long-term
trends.
100. FIRST PRINCIPLE. If a SMALL change is made that affects a
long-term historical trend, then the effect of that change will almost
always be transitory - the trend will soon revert to its original
state. (Example: A reform movement designed to clean up political
corruption in a society rarely has more than a short-term effect;
sooner or later the reformers relax and corruption creeps back in. The
level of political corruption in a given society tends to remain
constant, or to change only slowly with the evolution of the society.
Normally, a political cleanup will be permanent only if accompanied by
widespread social changes; a SMALL change in the society won't be
enough.) If a small change in a long-term historical trend appears to
be permanent, it is only because the change acts in the direction in
which the trend is already moving, so that the trend is not altered
but only pushed a step ahead.
101. The first principle is almost a tautology. If a trend were not
stable with respect to small changes, it would wander at random rather
than following a definite direction; in other words it would not be a
long-term trend at all.
102. SECOND PRINCIPLE. If a change is made that is sufficiently large
to alter permanently a long-term historical trend, than it will alter
the society as a whole. In other words, a society is a system in which
all parts are interrelated, and you can't permanently change any
important part without change all the other parts as well.
103. THIRD PRINCIPLE. If a change is made that is large enough to
alter permanently a long-term trend, then the consequences for the
society as a whole cannot be predicted in advance. (Unless various
other societies have passed through the same change and have all
experienced the same consequences, in which case one can predict on
empirical grounds that another society that passes through the same
change will be like to experience similar consequences.)
104. FOURTH PRINCIPLE. A new kind of society cannot be designed on
paper. That is, you cannot plan out a new form of society in advance,
then set it up and expect it to function as it was designed to.
105. The third and fourth principles result from the complexity of
human societies. A change in human behavior will affect the economy of
a society and its physical environment; the economy will affect the
environment and vice versa, and the changes in the economy and the
environment will affect human behavior in complex, unpredictable ways;
and so forth. The network of causes and effects is far too complex to
be untangled and understood.
106. FIFTH PRINCIPLE. People do not consciously and rationally choose
the form of their society. Societies develop through processes of
social evolution that are not under rational human control.
107. The fifth principle is a consequence of the other four.
108. To illustrate: By the first principle, generally speaking an
attempt at social reform either acts in the direction in which the
society is developing anyway (so that it merely accelerates a change
that would have occurred in any case) or else it only has a transitory
effect, so that the society soon slips back into its old groove. To
make a lasting change in the direction of development of any important
aspect of a society, reform is insufficient and revolution is
required. (A revolution does not necessarily involve an armed uprising
or the overthrow of a government.) By the second principle, a
revolution never changes only one aspect of a society; and by the
third principle changes occur that were never expected or desired by
the revolutionaries. By the fourth principle, when revolutionaries or
utopians set up a new kind of society, it never works out as planned.
109. The American Revolution does not provide a counterexample. The
American "Revolution" was not a revolution in our sense of the word,
but a war of independence followed by a rather far-reaching political
reform. The Founding Fathers did not change the direction of
development of American society, nor did they aspire to do so. They
only freed the development of American society from the retarding
effect of British rule. Their political reform did not change any
basic trend, but only pushed American political culture along its
natural direction of development. British society, of which American
society was an off-shoot, had been moving for a long time in the
direction of representative democracy. And prior to the War of
Independence the Americans were already practicing a significant
degree of representative democracy in the colonial assemblies. The
political system established by the Constitution was modeled on the
British system and on the colonial assemblies. With major alteration,
to be sure - there is no doubt that the Founding Fathers took a very
important step. But it was a step along the road the English-speaking
world was already traveling. The proof is that Britain and all of its
colonies that were populated predominantly by people of British
descent ended up with systems of representative democracy essentially
similar to that of the United States. If the Founding Fathers had lost
their nerve and declined to sign the Declaration of Independence, our
way of life today would not have been significantly different. Maybe
we would have had somewhat closer ties to Britain, and would have had
a Parliament and Prime Minister instead of a Congress and President.
No big deal. Thus the American Revolution provides not a
counterexample to our principles but a good illustration of them.
110. Still, one has to use common sense in applying the principles.
They are expressed in imprecise language that allows latitude for
interpretation, and exceptions to them can be found. So we present
these principles not as inviolable laws but as rules of thumb, or
guides to thinking, that may provide a partial antidote to naive ideas
about the future of society. The principles should be borne constantly
in mind, and whenever one reaches a conclusion that conflicts with
them one should carefully reexamine one's thinking and retain the
conclusion only if one has good, solid reasons for doing so.
INDUSTRIAL-TECHNOLOGICAL SOCIETY CANNOT BE REFORMED
111. The foregoing principles help to show how hopelessly difficult it
would be to reform the industrial system in such a way as to prevent
it from progressively narrowing our sphere of freedom. There has been
a consistent tendency, going back at least to the Industrial
Revolution for technology to strengthen the system at a high cost in
individual freedom and local autonomy. Hence any change designed to
protect freedom from technology would be contrary to a fundamental
trend in the development of our society.
Consequently, such a change either would be a transitory one -- soon
swamped by the tide of history -- or, if large enough to be permanent
would alter the nature of our whole society. This by the first and
second principles. Moreover, since society would be altered in a way
that could not be predicted in advance (third principle) there would
be great risk. Changes large enough to make a lasting difference in
favor of freedom would not be initiated because it would realized that
they would gravely disrupt the system. So any attempts at reform would
be too timid to be effective. Even if changes large enough to make a
lasting difference were initiated, they would be retracted when their
disruptive effects became apparent. Thus, permanent changes in favor
of freedom could be brought about only by persons prepared to accept
radical, dangerous and unpredictable alteration of the entire system.
In other words, by revolutionaries, not reformers.
112. People anxious to rescue freedom without sacrificing the supposed
benefits of technology will suggest naive schemes for some new form of
society that would reconcile freedom with technology. Apart from the
fact that people who make suggestions seldom propose any practical
means by which the new form of society could be set up in the first
place, it follows from the fourth principle that even if the new form
of society could be once established, it either would collapse or
would give results very different from those expected.
113. So even on very general grounds it seems highly improbably that
any way of changing society could be found that would reconcile
freedom with modern technology. In the next few sections we will give
more specific reasons for concluding that freedom and technological
progress are incompatible.
RESTRICTION OF FREEDOM IS UNAVOIDABLE IN INDUSTRIAL SOCIETY
114. As explained in paragraph 65-67, 70-73, modern man is strapped
down by a network of rules and regulations, and his fate depends on
the actions of persons remote from him whose decisions he cannot
influence. This is not accidental or a result of the arbitrariness of
arrogant bureaucrats. It is necessary and inevitable in any
technologically advanced society. The system HAS TO regulate human
behavior closely in order to function. At work, people have to do what
they are told to do, otherwise production would be thrown into chaos.
Bureaucracies HAVE TO be run according to rigid rules. To allow any
substantial personal discretion to lower-level bureaucrats would
disrupt the system and lead to charges of unfairness due to
differences in the way individual bureaucrats exercised their
discretion. It is true that some restrictions on our freedom could be
eliminated, but GENERALLY SPEAKING the regulation of our lives by
large organizations is necessary for the functioning of
industrial-technological society. The result is a sense of
powerlessness on the part of the average person. It may be, however,
that formal regulations will tend increasingly to be replaced by
psychological tools that make us want to do what the system requires
of us. (Propaganda [14], educational techniques, "mental health"
programs, etc.)
115. The system HAS TO force people to behave in ways that are
increasingly remote from the natural pattern of human behavior. For
example, the system needs scientists, mathematicians and engineers. It
can't function without them. So heavy pressure is put on children to
excel in these fields. It isn't natural for an adolescent human being
to spend the bulk of his time sitting at a desk absorbed in study. A
normal adolescent wants to spend his time in active contact with the
real world. Among primitive peoples the things that children are
trained to do are in natural harmony with natural human impulses.
Among the American Indians, for example, boys were trained in active
outdoor pursuits -- just the sort of things that boys like. But in our
society children are pushed into studying technical subjects, which
most do grudgingly.
116. Because of the constant pressure that the system exerts to modify
human behavior, there is a gradual increase in the number of people
who cannot or will not adjust to society's requirements: welfare
leeches, youth-gang members, cultists, anti-government rebels, radical
environmentalist saboteurs, dropouts and resisters of various kinds.
117. In any technologically advanced society the individual's fate
MUST depend on decisions that he personally cannot influence to any
great extent. A technological society cannot be broken down into
small, autonomous communities, because production depends on the
cooperation of very large numbers of people and machines. Such a
society MUST be highly organized and decisions HAVE TO be made that
affect very large numbers of people. When a decision affects, say, a
million people, then each of the affected individuals has, on the
average, only a one-millionth share in making the decision. What
usually happens in practice is that decisions are made by public
officials or corporation executives, or by technical specialists, but
even when the public votes on a decision the number of voters
ordinarily is too large for the vote of any one individual to be
significant. [17] Thus most individuals are unable to influence
measurably the major decisions that affect their lives. Their is no
conceivable way to remedy this in a technologically advanced society.
The system tries to "solve" this problem by using propaganda to make
people WANT the decisions that have been made for them, but even if
this "solution" were completely successful in making people feel
better, it would be demeaning.
118 Conservatives and some others advocate more "local autonomy."
Local communities once did have autonomy, but such autonomy becomes
less and less possible as local communities become more enmeshed with
and dependent on large-scale systems like public utilities, computer
networks, highway systems, the mass communications media, the modern
health care system. Also operating against autonomy is the fact that
technology applied in one location often affects people at other
locations far away. Thus pesticide or chemical use near a creek may
contaminate the water supply hundreds of miles downstream, and the
greenhouse effect affects the whole world.
119. The system does not and cannot exist to satisfy human needs.
Instead, it is human behavior that has to be modified to fit the needs
of the system. This has nothing to do with the political or social
ideology that may pretend to guide the technological system. It is the
fault of technology, because the system is guided not by ideology but
by technical necessity. [18] Of course the system does satisfy many
human needs, but generally speaking it does this only to the extent
that it is to the advantage of the system to do it. It is the needs of
the system that are paramount, not those of the human being. For
example, the system provides people with food because the system
couldn't function if everyone starved; it attends to people's
psychological needs whenever it can CONVENIENTLY do so, because it
couldn't function if too many people became depressed or rebellious.
But the system, for good, solid, practical reasons, must exert
constant pressure on people to mold their behavior to the needs of the
system. Too much waste accumulating? The government, the media, the
educational system, environmentalists, everyone inundates us with a
mass of propaganda about recycling. Need more technical personnel? A
chorus of voices exhorts kids to study science. No one stops to ask
whether it is inhumane to force adolescents to spend the bulk of their
time studying subjects most of them hate. When skilled workers are put
out of a job by technical advances and have to undergo "retraining,"
no one asks whether it is humiliating for them to be pushed around in
this way. It is simply taken for granted that everyone must bow to
technical necessity and for good reason: If human needs were put
before technical necessity there would be economic problems,
unemployment, shortages or worse. The concept of "mental health" in
our society is defined largely by the extent to which an individual
behaves in accord with the needs of the system and does so without
showing signs of stress.
120. Efforts to make room for a sense of purpose and for autonomy
within the system are no better than a joke. For example, one company,
instead of having each of its employees assemble only one section of a
catalogue, had each assemble a whole catalogue, and this was supposed
to give them a sense of purpose and achievement. Some companies have
tried to give their employees more autonomy in their work, but for
practical reasons this usually can be done only to a very limited
extent, and in any case employees are never given autonomy as to
ultimate goals -- their "autonomous" efforts can never be directed
toward goals that they select personally, but only toward their
employer's goals, such as the survival and growth of the company. Any
company would soon go out of business if it permitted its employees to
act otherwise. Similarly, in any enterprise within a socialist system,
workers must direct their efforts toward the goals of the enterprise,
otherwise the enterprise will not serve its purpose as part of the
system. Once again, for purely technical reasons it is not possible
for most individuals or small groups to have much autonomy in
industrial society. Even the small-business owner commonly has only
limited autonomy. Apart from the necessity of government regulation,
he is restricted by the fact that he must fit into the economic system
and conform to its requirements. For instance, when someone develops a
new technology, the small-business person often has to use that
technology whether he wants to or not, in order to remain competitive.
THE 'BAD' PARTS OF TECHNOLOGY CANNOT BE SEPARATED FROM THE 'GOOD' PARTS
121. A further reason why industrial society cannot be reformed in
favor of freedom is that modern technology is a unified system in
which all parts are dependent on one another. You can't get rid of the
"bad" parts of technology and retain only the "good" parts. Take
modern medicine, for example. Progress in medical science depends on
progress in chemistry, physics, biology, computer science and other
fields. Advanced medical treatments require expensive, high-tech
equipment that can be made available only by a technologically
progressive, economically rich society. Clearly you can't have much
progress in medicine without the whole technological system and
everything that goes with it.
122. Even if medical progress could be maintained without the rest of
the technological system, it would by itself bring certain evils.
Suppose for example that a cure for diabetes is discovered. People
with a genetic tendency to diabetes will then be able to survive and
reproduce as well as anyone else. Natural selection against genes for
diabetes will cease and such genes will spread throughout the
population. (This may be occurring to some extent already, since
diabetes, while not curable, can be controlled through the use of
insulin.) The same thing will happen with many other diseases
susceptibility to which is affected by genetic degradation of the
population. The only solution will be some sort of eugenics program or
extensive genetic engineering of human beings, so that man in the
future will no longer be a creation of nature, or of chance, or of God
(depending on your religious or philosophical opinions), but a
manufactured product.
123. If you think that big government interferes in your life too much
NOW, just wait till the government starts regulating the genetic
constitution of your children. Such regulation will inevitably follow
the introduction of genetic engineering of human beings, because the
consequences of unregulated genetic engineering would be disastrous.
[19]
124. The usual response to such concerns is to talk about "medical
ethics." But a code of ethics would not serve to protect freedom in
the face of medical progress; it would only make matters worse. A code
of ethics applicable to genetic engineering would be in effect a means
of regulating the genetic constitution of human beings. Somebody
(probably the upper-middle class, mostly) would decide that such and
such applications of genetic engineering were "ethical" and others
were not, so that in effect they would be imposing their own values on
the genetic constitution of the population at large. Even if a code of
ethics were chosen on a completely democratic basis, the majority
would be imposing their own values on any minorities who might have a
different idea of what constituted an "ethical" use of genetic
engineering. The only code of ethics that would truly protect freedom
would be one that prohibited ANY genetic engineering of human beings,
and you can be sure that no such code will ever be applied in a
technological society. No code that reduced genetic engineering to a
minor role could stand up for long, because the temptation presented
by the immense power of biotechnology would be irresistible,
especially since to the majority of people many of its applications
will seem obviously and unequivocally good (eliminating physical and
mental diseases, giving people the abilities they need to get along in
today's world). Inevitably, genetic engineering will be used
extensively, but only in ways consistent with the needs of the
industrial-technological system. [20]
TECHNOLOGY IS A MORE POWERFUL SOCIAL FORCE THAN THE ASPIRATION FOR FREEDOM
125. It is not possible to make a LASTING compromise between
technology and freedom, because technology is by far the more powerful
social force and continually encroaches on freedom through REPEATED
compromises. Imagine the case of two neighbors, each of whom at the
outset owns the same amount of land, but one of whom is more powerful
than the other. The powerful one demands a piece of the other's land.
The weak one refuses. The powerful one says, "OK, let's compromise.
Give me half of what I asked." The weak one has little choice but to
give in. Some time later the powerful neighbor demands another piece
of land, again there is a compromise, and so forth. By forcing a long
series of compromises on the weaker man, the powerful one eventually
gets all of his land. So it goes in the conflict between technology
and freedom.
126. Let us explain why technology is a more powerful social force
than the aspiration for freedom.
127. A technological advance that appears not to threaten freedom
often turns out to threaten freedom often turns out to threaten it
very seriously later on. For example, consider motorized transport. A
walking man formerly could go where he pleased, go at his own pace
without observing any traffic regulations, and was independent of
technological support-systems. When motor vehicles were introduced
they appeared to increase man's freedom. They took no freedom away
from the walking man, no one had to have an automobile if he didn't
want one, and anyone who did choose to buy an automobile could travel
much faster than the walking man. But the introduction of motorized
transport soon changed society in such a way as to restrict greatly
man's freedom of locomotion. When automobiles became numerous, it
became necessary to regulate their use extensively. In a car,
especially in densely populated areas, one cannot just go where one
likes at one's own pace one's movement is governed by the flow of
traffic and by various traffic laws. One is tied down by various
obligations: license requirements, driver test, renewing registration,
insurance, maintenance required for safety, monthly payments on
purchase price. Moreover, the use of motorized transport is no longer
optional. Since the introduction of motorized transport the
arrangement of our cities has changed in such a way that the majority
of people no longer live within walking distance of their place of
employment, shopping areas and recreational opportunities, so that
they HAVE TO depend on the automobile for transportation. Or else they
must use public transportation, in which case they have even less
control over their own movement than when driving a car. Even the
walker's freedom is now greatly restricted. In the city he continually
has to stop and wait for traffic lights that are designed mainly to
serve auto traffic. In the country, motor traffic makes it dangerous
and unpleasant to walk along the highway. (Note the important point we
have illustrated with the case of motorized transport: When a new item
of technology is introduced as an option that an individual can accept
or not as he chooses, it does not necessarily REMAIN optional. In many
cases the new technology changes society in such a way that people
eventually find themselves FORCED to use it.)
128. While technological progress AS A WHOLE continually narrows our
sphere of freedom, each new technical advance CONSIDERED BY ITSELF
appears to be desirable. Electricity, indoor plumbing, rapid
long-distance communications . . . how could one argue against any of
these things, or against any other of the innumerable technical
advances that have made modern society? It would have been absurd to
resist the introduction of the telephone, for example. It offered many
advantages and no disadvantages. Yet as we explained in paragraphs
59-76, all these technical advances taken together have created world
in which the average man's fate is no longer in his own hands or in
the hands of his neighbors and friends, but in those of politicians,
corporation executives and remote, anonymous technicians and
bureaucrats whom he as an individual has no power to influence. [21]
The same process will continue in the future. Take genetic
engineering, for example. Few people will resist the introduction of a
genetic technique that eliminates a hereditary disease It does no
apparent harm and prevents much suffering. Yet a large number of
genetic improvements taken together will make the human being into an
engineered product rather than a free creation of chance (or of God,
or whatever, depending on your religious beliefs).
129 Another reason why technology is such a powerful social force is
that, within the context of a given society, technological progress
marches in only one direction; it can never be reversed. Once a
technical innovation has been introduced, people usually become
dependent on it, unless it is replaced by some still more advanced
innovation. Not only do people become dependent as individuals on a
new item of technology, but, even more, the system as a whole becomes
dependent on it. (Imagine what would happen to the system today if
computers, for example, were eliminated.) Thus the system can move in
only one direction, toward greater technologization. Technology
repeatedly forces freedom to take a step back -- short of the
overthrow of the whole technological system.
130. Technology advances with great rapidity and threatens freedom at
many different points at the same time (crowding, rules and
regulations, increasing dependence of individuals on large
organizations, propaganda and other psychological techniques, genetic
engineering, invasion of privacy through surveillance devices and
computers, etc.) To hold back any ONE of the threats to freedom would
require a long different social struggle. Those who want to protect
freedom are overwhelmed by the sheer number of new attacks and the
rapidity with which they develop, hence they become pathetic and no
longer resist. To fight each of the threats separately would be
futile. Success can be hoped for only by fighting the technological
system as a whole; but that is revolution not reform.
131. Technicians (we use this term in its broad sense to describe all
those who perform a specialized task that requires training) tend to
be so involved in their work (their surrogate activity) that when a
conflict arises between their technical work and freedom, they almost
always decide in favor of their technical work. This is obvious in the
case of scientists, but it also appears elsewhere: Educators,
humanitarian groups, conservation organizations do not hesitate to use
propaganda or other psychological techniques to help them achieve
their laudable ends. Corporations and government agencies, when they
find it useful, do not hesitate to collect information about
individuals without regard to their privacy. Law enforcement agencies
are frequently inconvenienced by the constitutional rights of suspects
and often of completely innocent persons, and they do whatever they
can do legally (or sometimes illegally) to restrict or circumvent
those rights. Most of these educators, government officials and law
officers believe in freedom, privacy and constitutional rights, but
when these conflict with their work, they usually feel that their work
is more important.
132. It is well known that people generally work better and more
persistently when striving for a reward than when attempting to avoid
a punishment or negative outcome. Scientists and other technicians are
motivated mainly by the rewards they get through their work. But those
who oppose technilogiccal invasions of freedom are working to avoid a
negative outcome, consequently there are a few who work persistently
and well at this discouraging task. If reformers ever achieved a
signal victory that seemed to set up a solid barrier against further
erosion of freedom through technological progress, most would tend to
relax and turn their attention to more agreeable pursuits. But the
scientists would remain busy in their laboratories, and technology as
it progresses would find ways, in spite of any barriers, to exert more
and more control over individuals and make them always more dependent
on the system.
133. No social arrangements, whether laws, institutions, customs or
ethical codes, can provide permanent protection against technology.
History shows that all social arrangements are transitory; they all
change or break down eventually. But technological advances are
permanent within the context of a given civilization. Suppose for
example that it were possible to arrive at some social arrangements
that would prevent genetic engineering from being applied to human
beings, or prevent it from being applied in such a ways as to threaten
freedom and dignity. Still, the technology would remain waiting.
Sooner or later the social arrangement would break down. Probably
sooner, given that pace of change in our society. Then genetic
engineering would begin to invade our sphere of freedom, and this
invasion would be irreversible (short of a breakdown of technological
civilization itself). Any illusions about achieving anything permanent
through social arrangements should be dispelled by what is currently
happening with environmental legislation. A few years ago it seemed
that there were secure legal barriers preventing at least SOME of the
worst forms of environmental degradation. A change in the political
wind, and those barriers begin to crumble.
134. For all of the foregoing reasons, technology is a more powerful
social force than the aspiration for freedom. But this statement
requires an important qualification. It appears that during the next
several decades the industrial-technological system will be undergoing
severe stresses due to economic and environmental problems, and
especially due to problems of human behavior (alienation, rebellion,
hostility, a variety of social and psychological difficulties). We
hope that the stresses through which the system is likely to pass will
cause it to break down, or at least weaken it sufficiently so that a
revolution occurs and is successful, then at that particular moment
the aspiration for freedom will have proved more powerful than
technology.
135. In paragraph 125 we used an analogy of a weak neighbor who is
left destitute by a strong neighbor who takes all his land by forcing
on him a series of compromises. But suppose now that the strong
neighbor gets sick, so that he is unable to defend himself. The weak
neighbor can force the strong one to give him his land back, or he can
kill him. If he lets the strong man survive and only forces him to
give his land back, he is a fool, because when the strong man gets
well he will again take all the land for himself. The only sensible
alternative for the weaker man is to kill the strong one while he has
the chance. In the same way, while the industrial system is sick we
must destroy it. If we compromise with it and let it recover from its
sickness, it will eventually wipe out all of our freedom.
I didn't read the entire post (wall o' text).
Interesting though. Where did you get it from?
What is your take on the article?
Industrial Society and Its Future
by Theodore J. Kaczynski
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/225468.Industrial_Society_and_Its_Future
AKA, unabomber's manifesto
http://cyber.eserver.org/unabom.txt
I agree with most of it.
Quote from: blackie on October 04, 2016, 05:16 PM NHFT
Industrial Society and Its Future
by Theodore J. Kaczynski
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/225468.Industrial_Society_and_Its_Future
AKA, unabomber's manifesto
http://cyber.eserver.org/unabom.txt
I agree with most of it.
;D 8)
Ya got me with that one.
Although I remember when that was published in the news and had to agree with much of it. It often comes down to what we should do about the situation. His approach didn't change anything.
Along those lines...
I took an oath when I entered the military to "Defend the Constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic." So by their own oath they required me to swear to, I should be storming the Capitol or something, right? But, long ago I had to realize that those paths not only are suicide, but they lead to making things much worse.
Poor Ted, got all dark and isolated and forfeited his life with no positive result.
Things could be much worse than they are and positivity is the only path to any meaningful change.
I have often said that, "Libertarians are often one of the biggest obstacles in the way of their own cause." Spend too much time dwelling on how fucked up the gooberment has made things can end up turning the movement into a death cult... i.e.. "We're doom!" And more importantly missing the opportunities that present the chance to influence change.
Oh, the government -is- horrible. I always keep that firmly in mind, and use it as a sort of map for what to do next. Basically, I'm plotting my steps forward based on a loose recitation of the fall of the roman empire.
glass half full
There is a tv on in the room I am typing from ... there is a debate on ABC .... but good news, it is the vice-presidents debating
So no Hillary or Trump yay
Quote from: Russell Kanning on October 04, 2016, 09:05 PM NHFT
glass half full
There is a tv on in the room I am typing from ... there is a debate on ABC .... but good news, it is the vice-presidents debating
So no Hillary or Trump yay
I was driving last night and that was the only thing my radio could pick up, so I listened to some of it. It was like taking a multiple choice test in school, where you knew all of the answers could be challenged because the question was misleading and formed wrong from the get go.
so true
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 03, 2016, 10:40 PM NHFT
;D ;D ;D
(https://scontent-mia1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/p480x480/14563505_1399400293421624_7042757176943298339_n.jpg?oh=6a7df85fc6c2e35455e02b62fd52b16d&oe=587A3180)
That's the biggest truth of this campaign season.
I haven't been hearing to much Libertarian on Libertarian hate speech out here on the road.
see ... not falling this week
[/quote]
I was driving last night and that was the only thing my radio could pick up, so I listened to some of it. It was like taking a multiple choice test in school, where you knew all of the answers could be challenged because the question was misleading and formed wrong from the get go.
[/quote]
I always hated multiple choice questions, especially on IQ and psychological tests. On both, it was always obvious what the "right" answer was but often the real right answer wasn't an option, sort of a metaphor for life.
This is an interesting thread, particularly in its wild swings from tentative optimism to soul-crushing pessimism.
We might be headed to where the sky is falling soon
either flashlights from PA or generators from MA down to FL
Only Star Trek fans will understand. ;D
(https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14600861_1628800117412652_9014899101306856719_n.jpg?oh=86a4dc09e81a32483f02649a48cb2e53&oe=5869B410)
we all are potential victims
maybe we need to have Kirk ripe and shirt and take one for the team
Quote from: Russell Kanning on October 07, 2016, 08:40 AM NHFT
we all are potential victims
maybe we need to have Kirk ripe and shirt and take one for the team
Good idea. Wasn't it Capt. Kirk who kicked butt on some kind of leader of the Lizard People in one the episodes? I mean that Lizard guy had sharp teeth and who knows how bad is breath was ?
I think we should all thank Capt. Kirk for his service. (smiley emoticon)
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/XJ-ATwRq5KY/hqdefault.jpg)
Where are the incriminating files!
No one will keep me from office!
Due to her Parkinson's Hillary is having difficulty maintaining her shape shifting cloak. Her Lizard People identity is revealed.
I wonder what the lizardfolks are going to do about the dollar crash? Bitcoin up to 615+ and real estate, treasuries, and stocks are playing a fun and wild up and down game. Beans and rice ftw.
Here is a video that crosses paths between my "tentative optimism" and Señor Logic's "fun and wild up and down game".
Opportunity indeed.
Trump vs Clinton - The Window of Opportunity
https://youtu.be/CWK4PMcQeR8
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 07, 2016, 09:19 PM NHFT
Here is a video that crosses paths between my "tentative optimism" and Señor Logic's "fun and wild up and down game".
Opportunity indeed.
Trump vs Clinton - The Window of Opportunity
https://youtu.be/CWK4PMcQeR8
(I am officially channeling Saint Lloyd in this post)
" ...thought the stumbling drunk guy at the beer store in the video was Zim (from the mancave). But then realized, he drinks hardstuff and the stumbling guy had beer".
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 08, 2016, 08:34 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 07, 2016, 09:19 PM NHFT
Here is a video that crosses paths between my "tentative optimism" and Señor Logic's "fun and wild up and down game".
Opportunity indeed.
Trump vs Clinton - The Window of Opportunity
https://youtu.be/CWK4PMcQeR8
(I am officially channeling Saint Lloyd in this post)
" ...thought the stumbling drunk guy at the beer store in the video was Zim (from the mancave). But then realized, he drinks hardstuff and the stumbling guy had beer".
First off... We miss Lloyd.
Amazing determination to get more beer. Most would just pass out already. ;D
Some have given in and given up, drinking and drugging their way through the "doom" they see. Our side has done a great job of showing all that is wrong... And granted there is a lot that has gone wrong. But, we need to see the opportunities. The rest of the culture is starting to catch up and see what we have already figured out.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 08, 2016, 09:30 AM NHFT
The rest of the culture is starting to catch up and see what we have already figured out.
Yup. But the problem is, people wake up at different speeds. and most people are waking up slowly. My concern is that we'll get enough 'change' that most people will be happy and go back to sleep, and then it's just another long slow march into history cycle n+1.
I also worry about getting shot.
One of the two idiots could start WW3 as well.
If we survive, and we have to plan like we will. ;D People need to hear of a positive alternative to the way it has been. For that reason libertarians need to propagate the idea of a "bright and shining future" that we can, and I think will, have.
Got a mouse in your pocket?
Why do you think people are "waking up", and what is your plan to fix the world?
Less this
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/6c/b8/6d/6cb86d912c119c99b15d52616def4206.jpg)
More of this
(http://67.media.tumblr.com/60d4c6b2575a6681a87dfcb82be415c1/tumblr_mll1mgleYJ1so65tpo1_500.jpg)
I don't have to have a plan to fix the world it will spontaneously improve once it is allowed to.
For those who are having trouble seeing the positive you might consider working on your amygdala... ;D
Our Brain's Negative Bias (https://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/200306/our-brains-negative-bias)
QuoteWhy do insults once hurled at us stick inside our skull, sometimes for decades? Why do some people have to work extra hard to ward off depression?
The answer is, for the same reason political smear campaigns outpull positive ones. Nastiness just makes a bigger impact on our brains.
And that is due to the brain's "negativity bias": Your brain is simply built with a greater sensitivity to unpleasant news. The bias is so automatic that it can be detected at the earliest stage of the brain's information processing.
How Happy Brains Respond to Negative Things (https://lakesideconnect.com/intervention-and-prevention/how-happy-brains-respond-to-negative-things/)
QuoteHumans have a negativity bias, a tendency to focus on threats. But this research suggests that people may be able to compensate for it by consciously trying to focus more on the positive. As the authors put it in their paper, "while people do automatically attend to negative stimuli, given the proper ability and motivation, they can show the same sensitivity to positive stimuli."
I don't see doom and gloom for myself. I have it pretty good. All I have to do is grow dope, and spend time with my family. Life couldn't be better. :)
But as far as overall trend in the world, things seem to be getting worse, not better.
Quote from: blackie on October 09, 2016, 07:24 AM NHFT
I don't see doom and gloom for myself. I have it pretty good. All I have to do is grow dope, and spend time with my family. Life couldn't be better. :)
But as far as overall trend in the world, things seem to be getting worse, not better.
Except the profit you make from growing dope is a false profit, due to a free market being disallowed by false prophets.
Say that fast 3 times in a row eh ?
Quote from: blackie on October 09, 2016, 07:24 AM NHFT
I don't see doom and gloom for myself. I have it pretty good. All I have to do is grow dope, and spend time with my family. Life couldn't be better. :)
But as far as overall trend in the world, things seem to be getting worse, not better.
Oh, indeed they are getting worse... my point is that the opportunity to influence the corrections that are to follow the mess should be put to best use.
Glad you and yours are doing well. :) 8)
Quote from: blackie on October 09, 2016, 07:24 AM NHFT
I don't see doom and gloom for myself. I have it pretty good. All I have to do is grow dope, and spend time with my family. Life couldn't be better. :)
But as far as overall trend in the world, things seem to be getting worse, not better.
On second thought, that does sound pretty good. I reread my previous comment and guess it sounded funnier in my head than written done. Please excuse any hint of douchiness on my part, it wasn't my intention. I shoulda said something like what Tom Sawyer said and left it at that.
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 09, 2016, 08:46 PM NHFT
Quote from: blackie on October 09, 2016, 07:24 AM NHFT
I don't see doom and gloom for myself. I have it pretty good. All I have to do is grow dope, and spend time with my family. Life couldn't be better. :)
But as far as overall trend in the world, things seem to be getting worse, not better.
On second thought, that does sound pretty good. I reread my previous comment and guess it sounded funnier in my head than written done. Please excuse any hint of douchiness on my part, it wasn't my intention. I shoulda said something like what Tom Sawyer said and left it at that.
Ahhhh Jeez, we can't both play good cop... somebody has to be bad cop. ;D
I feel better already
I've used up my annual apology, and there's still a couple of months to go. I'm living on the edge now.
German Police Say Syrian Planning Attack Was Nabbed By Fellow Refugees (http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/10/10/497386085/german-police-say-syrian-planning-attack-was-nabbed-by-fellow-refugees)
QuoteSome media reports suggest that al-Bakr approached fellow Syrian refugees in Leipzig and asked if he could spend the night with them. The other Syrians, recognizing him, told him he could stay and then tied him up and alerted police.
Decent folks stopping violence. Kind of goes counter to the whole hating the immigrant angle.
Donald Trump's Duet with Hillary Clinton ;D ;D ;D
https://www.facebook.com/presidentgaryjohnson/videos/1630493023910028/
see we can all just get along
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 10, 2016, 05:40 AM NHFT
I've used up my annual apology, and there's still a couple of months to go. I'm living on the edge now.
Now you have to wait for the Airing of Grievances.
Quote from: KBCraig on October 11, 2016, 01:12 AM NHFT
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 10, 2016, 05:40 AM NHFT
I've used up my annual apology, and there's still a couple of months to go. I'm living on the edge now.
Now you have to wait for the Airing of Grievances.
That's during Festivus. ;D
Until then...
http://www.rigged2016.com
https://www.facebook.com/rigged2016movie/
Really well produced documentary. Drew Carey, Krist Novoselic (of Nirvana), Nick Gillespie (Reason), Glenn Beck etc.
I would ask that people share this in the Facebook realm, especially to have it as an outreach to those outside of our little sphere.
Quote from: KBCraig on October 11, 2016, 01:12 AM NHFT
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 10, 2016, 05:40 AM NHFT
I've used up my annual apology, and there's still a couple of months to go. I'm living on the edge now.
Now you have to wait for the Airing of Grievances.
Should I put on clean underwear just in case ?
We are down here in Florida waiting to deliver water somewhere .... and the sky stopped falling on Saturday
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 13, 2016, 10:51 AM NHFT
http://www.rigged2016.com
https://www.facebook.com/rigged2016movie/
Really well produced documentary. Drew Carey, Krist Novoselic (of Nirvana), Nick Gillespie (Reason), Glenn Beck etc.
I would ask that people share this in the Facebook realm, especially to have it as an outreach to those outside of our little sphere.
It's all over Facebook already. You'll get your copy in the mail. ;)
Quote from: KBCraig on October 13, 2016, 09:25 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 13, 2016, 10:51 AM NHFT
http://www.rigged2016.com
https://www.facebook.com/rigged2016movie/
Really well produced documentary. Drew Carey, Krist Novoselic (of Nirvana), Nick Gillespie (Reason), Glenn Beck etc.
I would ask that people share this in the Facebook realm, especially to have it as an outreach to those outside of our little sphere.
It's all over Facebook already. You'll get your copy in the mail. ;)
;D
I didn't see it posted by anyone I checked..
This cycle is the most significant I've seen since I've been paying attention from the libertarian perspective.
Never seen major newspapers endorse the candidate.
This documentary is the best one that's been produced. Sure is a lot better than that crap Harry Browne's campaign paid a 100 grand of campaign funds to make. Unlike that piece Overstock CEO Patrick Byrne spent 1 million of his own money. As someone that has produced and tried to distribute my work to a larger audience it's frustrating that most people are merely consumers and aren't active in helping spread the work in front of potential audiences. A feature length documentary is one of the more powerful ways to evangelize our message. But, again I am frustrated by many libertarians lack of interest in crafting a message that will convince the new audience. Their too busy talking to the echo chamber.
The fact that there are two of the least appealing candidates in american history. It could be the perfect storm... a real opportunity to make significant progress. Meanwhile most libertarians are too busy grousing about purity and not recognizing opportunity when it comes knocking. I don't even vote, but I see the chance to put in front of the larger audience that there is another direction to go.
Ol' Gary ain't "The One", but he is moving the ball down the field.
that clip was good
https://fee.org/articles/statists-got-you-down-how-to-stay-resilient-as-freedom-declines/
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 14, 2016, 07:23 AM NHFT
This cycle is the most significant I've seen since I've been paying attention from the libertarian perspective.
Never seen major newspapers endorse the candidate.
What about a 25 year old with a $2,500 campaign fund polling well against an entrenched incumbent in a solidly gerrymandered district? He even gets serious coverage in statewide news.
http://www.wiseye.org/Video-Archive/Event-Detail/evhdid/11039
Yeah, that's my kid. ;D
Quote from: jerryswife on October 14, 2016, 02:55 PM NHFT
https://fee.org/articles/statists-got-you-down-how-to-stay-resilient-as-freedom-declines/
Good article. I was reading Fee's magazine recently, I really liked it I need to support that organization.
QuoteGallagher explains psychology's "negative bias theory." Simply, "we pay more attention to unpleasant feelings such as fear, or anger and sadness because they're simply more powerful than the agreeable sort."
The primitive, reptilian, survival mode function of our brain.
Quote from: KBCraig on October 14, 2016, 11:27 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 14, 2016, 07:23 AM NHFT
This cycle is the most significant I've seen since I've been paying attention from the libertarian perspective.
Never seen major newspapers endorse the candidate.
What about a 25 year old with a $2,500 campaign fund polling well against an entrenched incumbent in a solidly gerrymandered district? He even gets serious coverage in statewide news.
http://www.wiseye.org/Video-Archive/Event-Detail/evhdid/11039
Yeah, that's my kid. ;D
More good news... I love it. Congrats Dad. As I say, "The nut doesn't fall far from the tree.
I was involved with a campaign for Lt. Governor of Virginia. They called it the Reams Reeferendum. In Virginia the Lt Governor has no real power and people aren't worried about who is Lt Governor. A friend of mine decided to create a campaign based around Cannabis law reform. Strictly a one issue campaign. He got Gary Reams to run. All he talked about was changing the Cannabis laws... he didn't even offer specific policies or laws. It was just a chance for people to show they supported change on the issue. He had almost no money for his campaign, but after I lined them up with some activists in Charlottesville he spoke at the University of Virginia. In that district he got 12% of the vote based on that one appearance.
There was fighting with in the LP circles over what the thrust of race should be. Many thought that he should have a gun rights campaign. Clearly they weren't thinking that the Republican candidate, who had an actual chance of winning, would be how people interested in the guns rights issue would vote.
Winning isn't the likely obtainable goal at this stage in most of these contests. Brand recognition and the first steps in making people realize that there is another direction are where we are at.
It's sometimes hard to have a conversation with people if what you are talking about is beyond the scope of their present reality, but within the scope of something that IS real, (as in demonstrably provable) but not commonly known or recognized as being accurate.
Cognitive dissonance is the opiate substitute of the masses.
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 15, 2016, 01:55 PM NHFT
It's sometimes hard to have a conversation with people if what you are talking about is beyond the scope of their present reality, but within the scope of something that IS real, (as in demonstrably provable) but not commonly known or recognized as being accurate.
Cognitive dissonance is the opiate substitute of the masses.
You're freakin' me out man!
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 15, 2016, 02:48 PM NHFT
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 15, 2016, 01:55 PM NHFT
It's sometimes hard to have a conversation with people if what you are talking about is beyond the scope of their present reality, but within the scope of something that IS real, (as in demonstrably provable) but not commonly known or recognized as being accurate.
Cognitive dissonance is the opiate substitute of the masses.
You're freakin' me out man!
I almost said "the methadone of the masses" but then the quote would have gotten methy. Wait a minute, did I just lisp?
;D
I've had people do a full on meltdown, freak out on me. It's hard to take someone showing you that up is down and white is black.
I was right, but they couldn't accept the message.
I've since learned to be happy with creating one little crack that let's a little bit of light in. Later on I've had some tell me they found out I was right. Then they turn toward you for more answers.
I've also learned to not get caught up in changing the dinosaurs mind. Their children's generation is the target.
that happens when I tell some people that NASA faked the moon landing (ducks and runs for shelter)
Quote from: Russell Kanning on October 15, 2016, 04:57 PM NHFT
that happens when I tell some people that NASA faked the moon landing (ducks and runs for shelter)
Well that's a relief.
I've been wanting to throw out that half used jar of TANG I've been hauling around for the last 40 years...and now I can do it guilt free.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 15, 2016, 04:19 PM NHFT
;D
I've had people do a full on meltdown, freak out on me. It's hard to take someone showing you that up is down and white is black.
I was right, but they couldn't accept the message.
I've since learned to be happy with creating one little crack that let's a little bit of light in. Later on I've had some tell me they found out I was right. Then they turn toward you for more answers.
I've also learned to not get caught up in changing the dinosaurs mind. Their children's generation is the target.
Good advice.
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 15, 2016, 05:20 PM NHFT
Well that's a relief.
I've been wanting to throw out that half used jar of TANG I've been hauling around for the last 40 years...and now I can do it guilt free.
probably for the best
Johnson-Weld and NH: Not so long a shot now
EDITORIAL (http://www.unionleader.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=%2F20161016%2FOPINION01%2F161019455&template=mobileart)
Union Leader continues to support the Libertarian candidate. Of even more interest to me is the nasty attack comments from right and left wingers. ;D The Cognitive Dissonance is at fevered pitch and they are feeling the pressure. 8)
Many think it's about if a libertarian can win. I'd say they already have. More attention and brand recognition than every.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 17, 2016, 08:25 AM NHFT
Johnson-Weld and NH: Not so long a shot now
EDITORIAL (http://www.unionleader.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=%2F20161016%2FOPINION01%2F161019455&template=mobileart)
Union Leader continues to support the Libertarian candidate. Of even more interest to me is the nasty attack comments from right and left wingers. ;D The Cognitive Dissonance is at fevered pitch and they are feeling the pressure. 8)
Many think it's about if a libertarian can win. I'd say they already have. More attention and brand recognition than every.
Cognitive dissonance is a dreadful disease.
This onetime (at band camp) I was accused of being a selfish libertarian. I offered the standard explanation that a libertarian world would accept people being socialists as long as the socialists confined it to people who individually agreed to be socialist etc.
The socialist replied, "it doesn't work that way" . I said, yes, I know and gave my best ironical smile.
Damn you Kaiser Wilhelm!
so true
I can see an editorial page wanting to be on record with their trepidation over a trump or clinton administration .... eeeekkk
(http://arafwchnawr.com/images/DSC02522%20copy%202.jpg)
...runs out of green, calls it a fall painting.
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 17, 2016, 03:12 PM NHFT
...runs out of green, calls it a fall painting.
;D
Part of the Sky Watch System.
The SWS is designed to monitor and report
the Chicken Little Index.
A relative scale 1-10
Sky Falling Potential Indicators
that are evaluated and tallied.
Today's SWS CLI
3
looks like a lot of yellow has fallen
Rigging the Election - Video I: Clinton Campaign and DNC Incite Violence at Trump Rallies (https://youtu.be/5IuJGHuIkzY)
The good news is that there was a time that these tactics wouldn't have come to the light of day. When Killary gets elected her presidency will be plagued by scandal. More people will come to realize that the whole thing is a scam.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 18, 2016, 07:24 AM NHFT
Rigging the Election - Video I: Clinton Campaign and DNC Incite Violence at Trump Rallies (https://youtu.be/5IuJGHuIkzY)
These people are total lite weights compared to Lincoln's time.
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 18, 2016, 08:15 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 18, 2016, 07:24 AM NHFT
Rigging the Election - Video I: Clinton Campaign and DNC Incite Violence at Trump Rallies (https://youtu.be/5IuJGHuIkzY)
These people are total lite weights compared to Lincoln's time.
Of course the whole moral realism angle just numbs us to the latest transgressions.
Lincoln... he only started a war that killed 2% of the U.S. population. WW2 killed 3% of the world population. I'm sure Killary or Tronald Dump can beat that.
I mean, that would only be like 3 or 4 million people. Small change compared to some of the classic democides of the last hundred years. All they need to do is get a real good, solid internal enemy to point the enforcers at, and we could get double that within a single four year term, no problem. If trump wins, it would probably be mexicans and muslims. Basically, brown people. If hillary wins, well, harder to say, it would probably be more of an ideological demographic. perhaps something akin to mccarthey's communist hunts.
the sky hasn't fallen here for days
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 18, 2016, 08:15 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 18, 2016, 07:24 AM NHFT
Rigging the Election - Video I: Clinton Campaign and DNC Incite Violence at Trump Rallies (https://youtu.be/5IuJGHuIkzY)
These people are total lite weights compared to Lincoln's time.
yea and we won't know how good Hillary's team was until they start erecting statues of her 100 years from now
Quote from: Russell Kanning on October 18, 2016, 04:50 PM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 18, 2016, 08:15 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 18, 2016, 07:24 AM NHFT
Rigging the Election - Video I: Clinton Campaign and DNC Incite Violence at Trump Rallies (https://youtu.be/5IuJGHuIkzY)
These people are total lite weights compared to Lincoln's time.
yea and we won't know how good Hillary's team was until they start erecting statues of her 100 years from now
This just gave me a really cool idea for a lovely twist on the classic party game 'pin the tail on the donkey'
(http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.2834967.1476798354!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_1200/statue19n-5-web.jpg)
SEE IT: Naked statue of Hillary Clinton in downtown Manhattan causes fight during morning commute (http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/naked-statue-hillary-clinton-sparks-fight-manhattan-article-1.2834970)
...Clinton with hoofed feet and a Wall Street banker resting his head on her bare breasts.
Dammit I'm at work now, come on :P
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on October 18, 2016, 06:27 PM NHFT
Dammit I'm at work now, come on :P
She is sexy, isn't she? Sorry to get ya going. ;D
I watched the video of the lady taking exception to the Hoofed Hillary art. Amusing.
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 19, 2016, 10:07 AM NHFT
I watched the video of the lady taking exception to the Hoofed Hillary art. Amusing.
She works for an art museum... you think that she could handle seeing art. ;D
She was also using her "female privilege" in attacking someone's property. Kind of like Carrie Nation.
(http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1284200.1362882924!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_750/justice10n-3b-web.jpg)
I have an urge to go back in time and kill her.
Quote from: Pat K on October 19, 2016, 04:15 PM NHFT
I have an urge to go back in time and kill her.
Listen could you make a stop at around 2009 and tell me to keep track of that bitcoin wallet?
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on October 19, 2016, 04:58 PM NHFT
Quote from: Pat K on October 19, 2016, 04:15 PM NHFT
I have an urge to go back in time and kill her.
Listen could you make a stop at around 2009 and tell me to keep track of that bitcoin wallet?
.....also 1975, 'cause I didn't need to join the ARMY.
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 19, 2016, 05:21 PM NHFT
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on October 19, 2016, 04:58 PM NHFT
Quote from: Pat K on October 19, 2016, 04:15 PM NHFT
I have an urge to go back in time and kill her.
Listen could you make a stop at around 2009 and tell me to keep track of that bitcoin wallet?
.....also 1975, 'cause I didn't need to join the ARMY.
On the one hand, I hated being in the army. On the -other- hand, I often wonder if I would have somehow self steered towards liberty and such if I'd had a comfy life and gotten a real job instead.
Thank you all for your service.
Not you Pat... I've heard the things you did!
;D ;D ;D
Nothing will make ya more anti-gov. then being owned by them.
Than being -openly- owned by them and actually having people literally tell you that you're government property. Because really, government owns everyone, by their own reckoning. They're just a lot more open about it in the military.
Is anyone stopping by 1975? WTF?
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 20, 2016, 07:17 AM NHFT
Thank you all for your service.
Not you Pat... I've heard the things you did!
;D ;D ;D
Nothing will make ya more anti-gov. then being owned by them.
Hey none of the communist hordes overran any of the Bars of the western pacific on my watch.
Your Fucking Welcome.
I got accused of "creating an international incident". It was all the fault of the admin idiots, but they needed someone to blame and I was convenient. Oh course I had a serious short timers attitude by then and decided to play chicken with the Command Sergeant Major and the Commanding Officer. I actually made the Sergeant Major turn pale when I told him I had nothing to lose, but he had a career to think of. ;D
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 20, 2016, 12:07 PM NHFT
Is anyone stopping by 1975? WTF?
I stopped by, but regret to inform you I was skipping high school algebra class at the time and working the magic of a fake i.d. at a nearby college pub. Cheers!
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 21, 2016, 07:51 AM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 20, 2016, 12:07 PM NHFT
Is anyone stopping by 1975? WTF?
I stopped by, but regret to inform you I was skipping high school algebra class at the time and working the magic of a fake i.d. at a nearby college pub. Cheers!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voNEgCKzves (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voNEgCKzves)
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 21, 2016, 09:17 AM NHFT
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 21, 2016, 07:51 AM NHFT
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 20, 2016, 12:07 PM NHFT
Is anyone stopping by 1975? WTF?
I stopped by, but regret to inform you I was skipping high school algebra class at the time and working the magic of a fake i.d. at a nearby college pub. Cheers!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voNEgCKzves (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voNEgCKzves)
I wouldn't have known who did that song, but it sure did take me back.
Today I'm feeling a little bit nostalgic. Or maybe like a man that is a bit past his time. A little less optimistic, at least for my personal future.
Speaking of nostalgia, remember back in the day when bitcoin was spiking up to over $1000?
QuoteAssange told an online audience that he's "a big admirer of Ron Paul and Rand Paul for their very principled positions in the U.S. Congress on a number of issues" and insisted that the libertarian wing the Republican Party represented the "only hope" for reform in American politics.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/tomwatson/2013/08/17/assanges-politics-rand-paul-and-libertarian-wing-of-gop-represent-only-hope-in-u-s/#53b846b457b5
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 22, 2016, 10:20 PM NHFT
QuoteAssange told an online audience that he's "a big admirer of Ron Paul and Rand Paul for their very principled positions in the U.S. Congress on a number of issues" and insisted that the libertarian wing the Republican Party represented the "only hope" for reform in American politics.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/tomwatson/2013/08/17/assanges-politics-rand-paul-and-libertarian-wing-of-gop-represent-only-hope-in-u-s/#53b846b457b5
My large Ron Paul sign (circa 2007 or 08) found itself cut into pieces and put into use as a wind blocker between the rafters of my chicken coop. By the time Rand surfaced, I could honestly say I had chickened out of political solutions.
Quote from: Free libertarian on October 23, 2016, 07:10 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 22, 2016, 10:20 PM NHFT
QuoteAssange told an online audience that he's "a big admirer of Ron Paul and Rand Paul for their very principled positions in the U.S. Congress on a number of issues" and insisted that the libertarian wing the Republican Party represented the "only hope" for reform in American politics.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/tomwatson/2013/08/17/assanges-politics-rand-paul-and-libertarian-wing-of-gop-represent-only-hope-in-u-s/#53b846b457b5
My large Ron Paul sign (circa 2007 or 08) found itself cut into pieces and put into use as a wind blocker between the rafters of my chicken coop. By the time Rand surfaced, I could honestly say I had chickened out of political solutions.
;D
I don't really have a lot of hope for political solutions. At least not any time soon. But, I am encouraged that Assange and Snowden both have publicly expressed their libertarian support. It is the slow, yet steady, growth of the brand/ideology. Some young people just now coming up will be the ones to move this further forward. It might not be "Liberty in our Lifetime", but that is the direction that is growing, while the dinosaurs will be scrambling to try and suppress the changes. They will be in the reacting mode. trying to contain it.
People's enthusiasm for Ron Paul's efforts led to many folks moving to the Shire, that just a few years earlier weren't "libertarian". I think a lot of disenfranchised Bernie supporters will divide the left and even come to our side of things over time as well. The children of the lefties aren't too likely to become Republicans, they are more likely to come to our side of things as well.
More people inside Leviathan will question what is happening and be the next Snowden etc. More information has come to light from the hacked e-mails than since something like the Pentagon Papers. That eventually helped end the war in Vietnam.
The pessimistic naysayers will still look to the majority of the public that is being manipulated and fooled as proof that these things won't make a difference. It is always the case that the majority is blind to these things. But, years later what was on the fringe becomes the norm for the masses. I remember when I was a kid my parents saying "that's not music that's screaming". Years later my 80 year old mother had a Joe Cocker CD. ;D I see similar behavior in other tastes, what was once weird foreign cuisine is now being consumed in the most conservative backwaters.
What's that Ghandi quote about "Your efforts will probably have little effect, but you must do them." All the little ripples we make in the culture have an effect, it's just not something that can be predicted which efforts will really resonant. Even bringing two more people into the fold means you have created geometric growth, that's a pretty good growth curve.
Mike Rowe "libertarian"?
(http://d2vrsup6vl2y4n.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/Screen-Shot-2016-08-26-at-11.41.03-AM.png)
24 Hours After Last Nights Debate, Mike Rowe Makes A Huge Confession On What He Sees Wrong With This Election (http://qpolitical.com/24-hours-after-last-nights-debate-mike-rowe-makes-a-huge-confession-on-what-he-see-wrong-with-this-election/)
Quote"In the meantime, dig into Economics in One Lesson, by Henry Hazlitt. It sounds like a snooze but it really is a page turner, and you can download it for free.
– Mike Rowe
I wanted to say hello. This is the current thread here to say hello on. So hello from Carroll County.
Positive things in life:
I never joined the military.
I planted lettuce and spinach and kale.
My dog ate my baby pumpkins.
I finished reading the book The Godfather.
Halloween is the best time of the year because I am a pagan bastard.
Pumpkin fest was moved to Laconia , obviously to get closer to me. (I heard a rumor)
I saw a meteor and haven't been vaporized.
My neighbors are off the grid types.
Someone around here has got a 50cal. I do not know who yet.
I am pleased to be in NH, freedom-wise life is better than western Wa. (GROUND 0) I don't live between 2 primary nuclear targets anymore.
:)
Modern day Warrior, is that what you mean by maybe the sky isn't falling?
Quote from: Mark D. Jacobsen on October 25, 2016, 03:50 AM NHFT
I wanted to say hello. This is the current thread here to say hello on. So hello from Carroll County.
Positive things in life:
I never joined the military.
I planted lettuce and spinach and kale.
My dog ate my baby pumpkins.
I finished reading the book The Godfather.
Halloween is the best time of the year because I am a pagan bastard.
Pumpkin fest was moved to Laconia , obviously to get closer to me. (I heard a rumor)
I saw a meteor and haven't been vaporized.
My neighbors are off the grid types.
Someone around here has got a 50cal. I do not know who yet.
I am pleased to be in NH, freedom-wise life is better than western Wa. (GROUND 0) I don't live between 2 primary nuclear targets anymore.
:)
Modern day Warrior, is that what you mean by maybe the sky isn't falling?
Just what I needed to hear... some good news. 8)
Glad ya'll are enjoying your new environs. It's good not to be vaporized, well some kinds of vaporized are good... but not in a mushroom cloud... wait a minute even that could have a good connotation. ;D (Sorry if I used up all your potential material here, Free Libertarian.)
Speaking of GROUND 0... When I lived in DC. One night I woke up to the loudest
BOOM!!!!. I sat upright in bed to see the dog illuminated by a blinding light that was coming through the window shades. For an instant I thought, well this is it... Butch and I are done... shock wave to follow.
Turned out to be lightening had struck the power transformer in front of my house and lit the tree tops on fire. We spent the rest of the night on the front porch watching the fire department and electric company crews working. Some drunk guy came wondering down the street among sparking wires, with everyone yelling at him to get out of there. It's apparently true that god does take care of drunks and fools. Since I wasn't the drunk... well, you know which one I must be. ;D
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 25, 2016, 04:40 AM NHFT
Quote from: Mark D. Jacobsen on October 25, 2016, 03:50 AM NHFT
I wanted to say hello. This is the current thread here to say hello on. So hello from Carroll County.
Positive things in life:
I never joined the military.
I planted lettuce and spinach and kale.
My dog ate my baby pumpkins.
I finished reading the book The Godfather.
Halloween is the best time of the year because I am a pagan bastard.
Pumpkin fest was moved to Laconia , obviously to get closer to me. (I heard a rumor)
I saw a meteor and haven't been vaporized.
My neighbors are off the grid types.
Someone around here has got a 50cal. I do not know who yet.
I am pleased to be in NH, freedom-wise life is better than western Wa. (GROUND 0) I don't live between 2 primary nuclear targets anymore.
:)
Modern day Warrior, is that what you mean by maybe the sky isn't falling?
Just what I needed to hear... some good news. 8)
Glad ya'll are enjoying your new environs. It's good not to be vaporized, well some kinds of vaporized are good... but not in a mushroom cloud... wait a minute even that could have a good connotation. ;D (Sorry if I used up all your potential material here, Free Libertarian.)
Speaking of GROUND 0... When I lived in DC. One night I woke up to the loudest BOOM!!!!. I sat upright in bed to see the dog illuminated by a blinding light that was coming through the window shades. For an instant I thought, well this is it... Butch and I are done... shock wave to follow.
Turned out to be lightening had struck the power transformer in front of my house and lit the tree tops on fire. We spent the rest of the night on the front porch watching the fire department and electric company crews working. Some drunk guy came wondering down the street among sparking wires, with everyone yelling at him to get out of there. It's apparently true that god does take care of drunks and fools. Since I wasn't the drunk... well, you know which one I must be. ;D
Interesting story. I'm just gonna say from personal experience, that it's possible a person could be both a drunk and a fool though.
I have a sort of similar story, albeit it's a little racy.
Many years ago, in a little one bedroom apartment my brother and I lived in, we made a rule, whoever got home first got the bedroom and the other guy got the couch. I was erm "engaged within" in the bedroom with a local lass, when the building next door caught on fire and there was quite a fuss just a few feet away, sirens blaring, firemen gesticulating etc. Being a drunken, (horny) fool at the time, I did not abandon my post until the job was done, not even when they wetted down the exterior wall of the building I was in as a precautionary measure. Eventually after everyone had put their hoses away, the evening quiet resumed.
I hope everyone's getting their bitcoins before it blasts off for real. :)
Democrats should ask Hillary Clinton to step aside (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/kass/ct-hillary-clinton-emails-kass-1030-20161028-column.html)
Chicago TribuneThe Chicago Tribune also endorsed Gary Johnson (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-gary-johnson-president-endorsement-edit-1002-20160930-story.html)'s campaign. Other endorsements here. (https://www.johnsonweld.com/endorsements)
Quote"The best thing would be for Democrats to ask her to step down now. It would be the most responsible thing to do, if the nation were more important to them than power. And the American news media — fairly or not firmly identified in the public mind as Mrs. Clinton's political action committee — should begin demanding it."
Unprecedented, in my lifetime... ;D
So when the bitch gets into office she is going to have to weather one controversy after another. I can only hope that the Dem's overreach and arrogance will be an example of 'winning the battle and losing the war'.
Michael Crichton has a brilliant take on speculation, which is what the news has become as opposed to rational analysis. I think I will unsubscribe to most of the news feeds that fill my inbox. :)
http://needtoknow.news/archives/articles-from-ntk/why-speculate-crichton-2016-10-26/
Quote from: jerryswife on October 29, 2016, 03:12 PM NHFT
Michael Crichton has a brilliant take on speculation, which is what the news has become as opposed to rational analysis. I think I will unsubscribe to most of the news feeds that fill my inbox. :)
http://needtoknow.news/archives/articles-from-ntk/why-speculate-crichton-2016-10-26/
I'm not a fan of any of his novels after Andromeda Strain, but this was witty. :)
Gary Johnson: Voting for Trump or Clinton Is Voting for Tyranny (http://time.com/4501438/gary-johnson-common-sense/)
Time.com
QuoteAnd now that we're getting down to the end, people are even angrier and more dissatisfied. Why? Because while we have a multiplicity of choices in other spheres of life, our freedom and liberty are being limited by a system that has reduced our political choices to two: Republican or Democrat.
Why military voters pick Gary Johnson over Hillary Clinton (http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?action=post;topic=27840.195;last_msg=362785)
Christian Science Monitor
QuoteThe poll found that officers are also less likely to vote for Trump than enlisted personnel, with only 26 percent pledging support to the Republican candidate. Among this group, Johnson and Clinton are neck-and-neck, both carrying around 31 percent of the voting bloc.
While the support for Johnson seems staggering, military voters aren't the only ones moving toward the Libertarian. A Quinnipiac University poll conducted in mid-September found that 29 percent of voters between the ages of 18 and 34 favored the third-party candidate.
Unprecedented support for a libertarian candidate. Most extensive mainstream coverage ever... these are signs of things going in the right direction.
I wish I felt like we were headed in the right direction. Seems more like the highway to hell.
Quote from: blackie on October 31, 2016, 03:02 AM NHFT
I wish I felt like we were headed in the right direction. Seems more like the highway to hell.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_gtGfAail4
Quote from: Jim Johnson on October 31, 2016, 06:53 AM NHFT
Quote from: blackie on October 31, 2016, 03:02 AM NHFT
I wish I felt like we were headed in the right direction. Seems more like the highway to hell.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_gtGfAail4
You crazy head banging' umpahpah people!
Quote from: blackie on October 31, 2016, 03:02 AM NHFT
I wish I felt like we were headed in the right direction. Seems more like the highway to hell.
I feel ya. Short term I am concerned for the same thing. But, if Killary doesn't start WW3 and we don't get nuked... (and that's a pretty big if)... more people than ever have been exposed to the option of a libertarian direction. The ideas win even when the political effort doesn't.
As an aside my spell checker corrected my error when I typed libertarian, so it's a common term. When I first started using the term libertarian, probably 1977, not many people had heard the term. Now the candidate has been endorsed by major newspapers. Progress. It's a matter of not just looking at the things that are going badly.
Best opportunity for growth ever.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 31, 2016, 09:06 AM NHFT
Quote from: blackie on October 31, 2016, 03:02 AM NHFT
I wish I felt like we were headed in the right direction. Seems more like the highway to hell.
I feel ya. Short term I am concerned for the same thing. But, if Killary doesn't start WW3 and we don't get nuked... (and that's a pretty big if)... more people than ever have been exposed to the option of a libertarian direction. The ideas win even when the political effort doesn't.
As an aside my spell checker corrected my error when I typed libertarian, so it's a common term. When I first started using the term libertarian, probably 1977, not many people had heard the term. Now the candidate has been endorsed by major newspapers. Progress. It's a matter of not just looking at the things that are going badly.
Best opportunity for growth ever.
But to hear the purists talk, it's time to abandon the party for not being 'principled'.
Quote from: KBCraig on October 31, 2016, 10:44 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 31, 2016, 09:06 AM NHFT
Quote from: blackie on October 31, 2016, 03:02 AM NHFT
I wish I felt like we were headed in the right direction. Seems more like the highway to hell.
I feel ya. Short term I am concerned for the same thing. But, if Killary doesn't start WW3 and we don't get nuked... (and that's a pretty big if)... more people than ever have been exposed to the option of a libertarian direction. The ideas win even when the political effort doesn't.
As an aside my spell checker corrected my error when I typed libertarian, so it's a common term. When I first started using the term libertarian, probably 1977, not many people had heard the term. Now the candidate has been endorsed by major newspapers. Progress. It's a matter of not just looking at the things that are going badly.
Best opportunity for growth ever.
But to hear the purists talk, it's time to abandon the party for not being 'principled'.
Anarchist for President. Kind of an oxymoron isn't it? ;D
Minarchist is what a libertarian presidential candidate is.
In addition this is the wave to ride right now. Or you can paddle out and wait 4-8 years for the next/perfect wave.
There is a reason it is referred to as a two party system. And it's rigged.
Ross Perot got 19% of the popular vote in 1992, but no electoral votes.
and Perot is a Roosevelt/Bush anyway :)
if some guys in the military want to vote for a anti-war candidate .... there must be some progress :)
The alternative has left the building. The time for a political solution is past.
How does it go?
Fool me once shame on you.
Fool me four times shame on me.
Commentary: The unbearable smugness of the press (http://www.cbsnews.com/news/commentary-the-unbearable-smugness-of-the-press-presidential-election-2016/)
The mainstream media takes it on the chin from this election cycle. The obvious bias, I think, contributed to people voting for what they were told not to vote for.
QuoteWe go into assignments too certain that what we find will serve to justify our biases. The public's estimation of the press declines even further -- fewer than one-in-three Americans trust the press, per Gallup -- which starts the cycle anew.
Creative destruction, baby. The old has to fall before the new can rise to replace it. Only the dinosaurs are still getting their "news" from newspapers and TV. ;D Sure we read what they are spouting, but we weigh it against other sources of information and don't take it at face value.
it is surprising that some people still get their info from the old news
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on November 12, 2016, 06:16 PM NHFT
Commentary: The unbearable smugness of the press (http://www.cbsnews.com/news/commentary-the-unbearable-smugness-of-the-press-presidential-election-2016/)
The mainstream media takes it on the chin from this election cycle. The obvious bias, I think, contributed to people voting for what they were told not to vote for.
QuoteWe go into assignments too certain that what we find will serve to justify our biases. The public's estimation of the press declines even further -- fewer than one-in-three Americans trust the press, per Gallup -- which starts the cycle anew.
Creative destruction, baby. The old has to fall before the new can rise to replace it. Only the dinosaurs are still getting their "news" from newspapers and TV. ;D Sure we read what they are spouting, but we weigh it against other sources of information and don't take it at face value.
This is a very long piece, but it's in segments that don't feel long. It's a good read where a Vox writer calls out smugness.
http://www.vox.com/2016/4/21/11451378/smug-american-liberalism
the sky might not be falling .... but trump is president
Quote from: Russell Kanning on November 13, 2016, 06:45 PM NHFT
the sky might not be falling .... but trump is president
Yeah, but you could say the same thing about the last, I don't know, how many presidents? ;D
He is like the rodeo clown president.
I came to be more afraid of Killary, that evil bitch would have gotten away with so much cuz she could play the "First Woman President" card. Just like Obama played the "First Black President" card.
I mean Trump is a want to be junior varsity Mussolini, but it could have some real comedy potential.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on November 13, 2016, 07:39 PM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on November 13, 2016, 06:45 PM NHFT
the sky might not be falling .... but trump is president
Yeah, but you could say the same thing about the last, I don't know, how many presidents? ;D
He is like the rodeo clown president.
I came to be more afraid of Killary, that evil bitch would have gotten away with so much cuz she could play the "First Woman President" card. Just like Obama played the "First Black President" card.
I mean Trump is a want to be junior varsity Mussolini, but it could have some real comedy potential.
Sometimes a blind squirrel President finds a nut...sometimes.
Ultimately property rights and personal rights are the same thing - Calvin Coolidge
Snowden, probably one of the bigger heroes of my lifetime.
Snowden (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3774114/)
Just watched a very well done film by Oliver Stone. Now 10's of millions will likely be touched by the dramatic film.
The dark person's view of the film would be, "How awful, we're screwed." The bright view is that a person of conscience did the right thing at tremendous personal cost.
The "powers that be"will have a lot of difficulty with all the wild cards that can be played against their plans of controlling our future's path.
I agree with you
(for another thread ... the snowden story is fake, they already did it once in the 60s)
yea trump is a rodeo clown
it is crazy to think what it would be like if Hillary could say we had validated everything Obama did and wanted more, plus her crazy stuff
whew!
On another note, the demonetization of the higher denomination notes in India has started pushing PMs and crypto. So, yay, the end is nigh, regardless of what trump does! :P
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on December 07, 2016, 02:19 PM NHFT
On another note, the demonetization of the higher denomination notes in India has started pushing PMs and crypto. So, yay, the end is nigh, regardless of what trump does! :P
India was a mess already. Maybe more of the smart ones will either leave or like you say promote crypto-currency. The Soviets couldn't even crush their
black markets real markets.
Ugh, that would strain the already groaning global economy. Can you imagine, hundreds of millions of people suddenly relocating to the rest of the planet? I'm assuming we're talking less than 50% of the population.
Anyway, why would they want to leave? They have one of the most thriving black markets on the planet. The only reason I wouldn't move to india is the climate.
wow things always look down in your world view
I don't follow? I said they had one of the most vibrant black markets in the world, and I would totally live there if not for the climate.
Rand Paul: Why I Will Vote to Repeal Obamacare (http://time.com/4596673/rand-paul-repeal-obamacare/)
Time.com
Quote"I am taking this stand — I will not vote for any budget that doesn't have a plan to balance, regardless of what is attached to it and I'm calling on other conservatives in the Senate to take the same stand. Let's repeal Obamacare, and let's do it with a budget that leads us to balance in the near term."
If the R's can't accomplish this it will show them as the hypocrites that they often are.
Interesting times...
Watched a documentary on Chaos Theory last night. Inspiring to think that small inputs can create big differences in outcome.
tell us more of this documentary Tom
btw the sky is falling here in Arkansas ... in the form of snow .... the south is in a panic.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on January 03, 2017, 04:20 PM NHFT
Rand Paul: Why I Will Vote to Repeal Obamacare (http://time.com/4596673/rand-paul-repeal-obamacare/)
Time.com
Quote"I am taking this stand — I will not vote for any budget that doesn't have a plan to balance, regardless of what is attached to it and I'm calling on other conservatives in the Senate to take the same stand. Let's repeal Obamacare, and let's do it with a budget that leads us to balance in the near term."
If the R's can't accomplish this it will show them as the hypocrites that they often are.
The best thing I've seen from Rand:
What should we replace Obamacare with? Perhaps we should try freedom:
1. The freedom to choose inexpensive insurance free of government dictates.
2. The freedom to save unlimited amounts in a health savings account.
3. The freedom to buy insurance across state lines.
4. The freedom for all individuals to join together in voluntary associations to gain the leverage of being part of a large insurance pool.
Quote from: KBCraig on January 07, 2017, 10:22 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on January 03, 2017, 04:20 PM NHFT
Rand Paul: Why I Will Vote to Repeal Obamacare (http://time.com/4596673/rand-paul-repeal-obamacare/)
Time.com
Quote"I am taking this stand — I will not vote for any budget that doesn't have a plan to balance, regardless of what is attached to it and I'm calling on other conservatives in the Senate to take the same stand. Let's repeal Obamacare, and let's do it with a budget that leads us to balance in the near term."
If the R's can't accomplish this it will show them as the hypocrites that they often are.
The best thing I've seen from Rand:
What should we replace Obamacare with? Perhaps we should try freedom:
1. The freedom to choose inexpensive insurance free of government dictates.
2. The freedom to save unlimited amounts in a health savings account.
3. The freedom to buy insurance across state lines.
4. The freedom for all individuals to join together in voluntary associations to gain the leverage of being part of a large insurance pool.
Amen.
Gooberment involvement in insurance pushed it's affordability out of our reach.
Making stuff generally unaffordable for everyone is a tried and tested method for the government to expand its power and reach to new areas of every day life.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 09, 2017, 10:35 AM NHFT
Making stuff generally unaffordable for everyone is a tried and tested method for the government to expand its power and reach to new areas of every day life.
I do believe that was part of the Obama/Hillary/Marxist plan. They would fix Obamacare by going to a "single payer"/government "final solution".
Uh oh. That sounds like something a RUSSIAN SPY would say!!!
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 09, 2017, 10:35 AM NHFT
Making stuff generally unaffordable for everyone is a tried and tested method for the government to expand its power and reach to new areas of every day life.
Yep.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 09, 2017, 03:59 PM NHFT
Uh oh. That sounds like something a RUSSIAN SPY would say!!!
Maybe that "dang" aw shucks country boy wisdom is just a Tom Sawyer ploy then ? Crafty.
Quote from: Free libertarian on January 10, 2017, 05:09 PM NHFT
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 09, 2017, 03:59 PM NHFT
Uh oh. That sounds like something a RUSSIAN SPY would say!!!
Maybe that "dang" aw shucks country boy wisdom is just a Tom Sawyer ploy then ? Crafty.
I bet Putin himself trained him!
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 10, 2017, 05:28 PM NHFT
Quote from: Free libertarian on January 10, 2017, 05:09 PM NHFT
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 09, 2017, 03:59 PM NHFT
Uh oh. That sounds like something a RUSSIAN SPY would say!!!
Maybe that "dang" aw shucks country boy wisdom is just a Tom Sawyer ploy then ? Crafty.
I bet Putin himself trained him!
He's even teaching his kid how to use spy drones and stuff!
Dah Comrade... I mean, That's right ya'll!
see the sky is falling
but on the plus side, the housing market is about to follow the sky, and that'll be great for lower income home buyers.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 11, 2017, 10:32 AM NHFT
but on the plus side, the housing market is about to follow the sky, and that'll be great for lower income home buyers.
With what savings are they going to use for a down payment?
Doomed, I tell ya... we are all DOOMED!
Quote from: Jay on January 11, 2017, 11:14 AM NHFT
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 11, 2017, 10:32 AM NHFT
but on the plus side, the housing market is about to follow the sky, and that'll be great for lower income home buyers.
With what savings are they going to use for a down payment?
The ones that they have, hopefully, been putting away in silver and bitcoin. obviously, not all of them will have been doing this, which is unfortunate. But I see a not too distant future where bitcoin, and perhaps silver or some other high value commodity, will be more ubiquitous than is currently the case.
Mostly, I look to the future to be a time where you can just work, and get paid, and buy things, without all the silliness we deal with now to stop you.
You realize that's probably 100k-200k people in the entire US, right? And people that can put away Bitcoin and precious metals are already more financially well off than most.
Silver, yeah. Silver gets expensive, and there are usually minimum buy ins.
Bitcoin? You can buy some bitcoin for a dollar. It's one of the things you can buy on the scale of emptying out your change jar every now and then.
why is the housing market going to go down? everywhere? in what areas?
Generally all over the place. We've reached a point where people aren't going for the funny money any more, and I don't mean hard headed austrian economists, I'm talking about foreign governments and corporations. Big holders are starting to dump US treasuries, and it's starting to show in the bond markets, prices wiggling down and yields going up. That's why the fed gave the 'interest rate' a little nudge upwards. The circumstances we're in are starting to ACTUALLY match up with what all the doomsayers have been saying is coming for the last 20 years. Treasuries are struggling, we have a president and congress that are going to -start- dismantling a lot of the democratic stuff that's been put up in the last 8 years, but probably start arguing about how to replace it with their own version that benefits them, and things are going to start going sideways.
The real estate market wasn't permitted to collapse properly in 2008, they just shoved more money up its ass and puppeted it along, but over the last 8 years, they've lost a LOT of public support for that and it's starting to show in the politicians that are getting elected. And keep in mind, if ol' donny really gets his fingers into it, he's ALL about real estate. He would LOVE to see the market fall on its face to grab some easy buys for his next hotel or whatever. So I highly doubt he's going to commit political suicide to continue the prop-up program when he could just make a massive killing instead.
And bla bla bla I could go on for a long time about this, but basically, every single thing that they negative nancies have said is 'the next step that's about to happen" for the last few decades is suddenly happening, all at once. And that's good, because we need to clean our laundry. The longer you just keep spraying air freshener on it, the worse it gets, and it's been quite some time.
So, definitely a good time to buy in say, 3-6 months.
Oh, and if you don't have one, get some kind of bitcoin debit card. That way you can just put all your money that you aren't using to buy silver into bitcoins.
actually that sounds like the same thing I have heard many times before
Yeah. It DOES sound like the same thing you've heard before. That's because, with one small exception, it's exactly the same thing you've heard before. Except, instead of saying "thing x is happening, so thing y will be next!", it's "Damn it's about time ok finally y is happening, here comes z"
But listen, I'm a crazy hermit who talks to himself all the time. So, you know. Grain of salt and all that.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 13, 2017, 10:41 AM NHFT
Yeah. It DOES sound like the same thing you've heard before. That's because, with one small exception, it's exactly the same thing you've heard before. Except, instead of saying "thing x is happening, so thing y will be next!", it's "Damn it's about time ok finally y is happening, here comes z"
But listen, I'm a crazy hermit who talks to himself all the time. So, you know. Grain of salt and all that.
Dang it. I was hoping you had a crystal ball that we all could get rich by you prognosticating for us!
No no, I mostly rely on predictive linguistic analysis.
Don't worry, the government will have to keep expanding it's socialism. Not much is going to fail.
They soon won't be able to keep expanding it. Unless they're willing to play games with hyperinflation. For the last 4 presidents, the national deficit has been about doubling every 8 years. And during that time, they've been ever increasing the amount of people who rely on the government for financial assistance in everyday things, such as food. Not to mention, there's been a growing movement of discontent, both with big government, and government at all. This recent 'fake news' play has really opened the government media outlets to a lot of critical examination, especially after they fell on their faces so hard with the clinton campaign. The facade is crumbling, and even if it wasn't, they're creating a larger and larger population of people who simply CAN'T continue on as they are.
I don't wish the evils of financial collapse on anyone, and I wish it wasn't going to happen, but I honestly don't see it playing out any other way at this point. This time next year, I suspect we're all going to be living in a wildly different world.
Dude, it's been going on since at least the New Deal. The reality is that everything continues to operate. Nothing is going to change, 99% of the people are zombies to the fiat illusion.
I have been reading about the above scenarios since 1978.
So far, not so much.
I think it comes down to the fact that there is a lot of wealth to destroy.
Pretty much all the governments of the world are sucking on the necks of their people. The competitive advantage means that if you drain them at a similar rate it ends up being a relatively level playing field.
They are pretty much stealing the inheritance of the next generation.
I'm wondering when cash becomes extinct and how it will manifest. It makes sense to do that, from "their" perspective.
It gets even funner when you think about how people will demand the "right" to advanced technology in order to be able to continue to live.
In a few decades, the world will be in a very strange economic situation.
I think we are already there.
Probably, but we haven't figured out how to reasonably deal with it quite yet. Besides inflation, that nobody seems to really care about anyway.
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/01/26/andrew-napolitano-trump-has-committed-most-revolutionary-act-ive-seen-in-45-years.html
Andrew Napolitano: Trump has committed the most revolutionary act I've seen in 45 years
One of the better things Trump is doing.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on January 26, 2017, 09:58 AM NHFT
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/01/26/andrew-napolitano-trump-has-committed-most-revolutionary-act-ive-seen-in-45-years.html
Andrew Napolitano: Trump has committed the most revolutionary act I've seen in 45 years
One of the better things Trump is doing.
Compelling a person to purchase a "service" and then still trying to call it a service seems blatantly illogical to me.
I'm curious if they (The Trumpites) will apply the same logic to government schools.
Quote from: Free libertarian on January 27, 2017, 09:47 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on January 26, 2017, 09:58 AM NHFT
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/01/26/andrew-napolitano-trump-has-committed-most-revolutionary-act-ive-seen-in-45-years.html
Andrew Napolitano: Trump has committed the most revolutionary act I've seen in 45 years
One of the better things Trump is doing.
Compelling a person to purchase a "service" and then still trying to call it a service seems blatantly illogical to me.
I'm curious if they (The Trumpites) will apply the same logic to government schools.
(http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/952/994/c3f.gif)
^^^ Tee hee hee
half the truck drivers out here are convinced trump is going to fix everything
see the sky may not be falling
Trump's meddling may give us another decade or two of "stability" while the world falls down around us.
My issue with people who point to the 'good' things that Trump has and proposes to do, and yes, some of the things he does have an immediate beneficial effect, but the thing is, people either forget, or don't realize that what's happening is, essentially, a changing of the guard. Not a changing of the system or the ideas. Simply a changing of the status quo of who's in charge.
Yes, Trump is, to a very large extent, engaging in a coup de etat against the old crowd of politicians, ousting them from their comfortable positions, threatening the money of their followers and clients, etc.
The trick is to realize that he's NOT doing this because he rejects that system. He's doing this because he IS draining the swamp, just not the swamp that everyone THOUGHT he was going to drain, and not for the REASONS they thought he was going to do it.
He's removing his most dangerous opposition, disarming them, curtailing their political and economic power. And one of the weapons he's utilizing for that purpose is popular support. He's playing the mob and using them as a power base to oppose the entrenched politics that are arrayed against him.
I see no reason not to believe that, once he's comfortable in his new position, comfortable with the diminished state of his opponents in government, and confident in his control and power of the political system, he will, as has happened in pretty much every recorded instance in history where one 'revolutionary' government has supplanted an older one, he will simply resume the old status quo under a new banner.
But people are always very eager to tell me I'm simply a pessimist, so who knows. Maybe I'm just wrong.
Junior Varsity Populist/Fascist
Happy to have Hillary not in office. But wondering how much of Trumps stuff is rhetoric to feed his base.
The up side of the election is the media took a licking and the two parties as well. Interesting times.
There are downsides and possible upsides to it, I just get twitchy when people start defending trump against the left. That's how you accidentally trick yourself into being a republican.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 30, 2017, 12:55 PM NHFT
There are downsides and possible upsides to it, I just get twitchy when people start defending trump against the left. That's how you accidentally trick yourself into being a republican.
Good point, but for me anyway, Free republican doesn't have nearly the panache as Free libertarian. I'm very attached to my panache.
Panache? Is that like a kind of pancake?
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 30, 2017, 02:17 PM NHFT
Panache? Is that like a kind of pancake?
I have low attachment to pancakes and besides I don't know how to say "pancake" in French.
Where's Maine Shark when you need him ?
I'll have the Lingonberry pancakes
(http://www.iamnotastalker.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/ScreenShot1528.jpg)
.....you and your nine toed girlfriend.
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/27/21/ed/2721edb963376825090187b8d89fff76.jpg)
Although they are more your countrymen than mine. ;D
So vat.... Vee ggreally doon't kaa.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on January 30, 2017, 11:01 AM NHFT
Happy to have Hillary not in office. But wondering how much of Trumps stuff is rhetoric to feed his base.
I'm not happy that Trump is in office, but I'm thrilled that Hillary is not. While his impulsiveness might accidentally start a war, Hillary had every intention of starting more wars.
Quote from: Erroneous_Logic on January 30, 2017, 02:17 PM NHFT
Panache? Is that like a kind of pancake?
Naw, Panache makes bread and has restaurants.
Quote from: Free libertarian on January 30, 2017, 04:43 PM NHFT
Where's Maine Shark when you need him ?
On Facebook. He broke down and joined the dark side. ;)
Becky inspired this one...
Memes Away! ;D
(http://arafwchnawr.com/images/Chiilin-n%20Grillin%201.jpg)
so true
at the lunch counter there are always plenty of trump supporters watching fox news
I have to make sure I say I want to throw all the bums out
solar power bob has more panache in his little finger than obama in his entire strangly shaped head
Instead of watching the idiots that want to be our overlords, I like watching the amazingly beautiful things humans are capable of...
Van Gogh on Dark Water
https://youtu.be/4dKy7HNU4vk
Starry night ink on wate: Ebru art water marbling
yea the news will make you think our sky is falling ... or overheated
Libertarians are flexing their political muscle (http://rare.us/rare-politics/rare-liberty/libertarians-are-flexing-their-political-muscle/)
QuoteThe American Health Care Act—the "ObamaCare-lite" legislation championed by most Republicans including President Trump and Speaker Paul Ryan—is dead.
I wouldn't call those guys libertarians, but I guess that is what a libertarian is nowadays.
Quote from: blackie on March 25, 2017, 07:10 AM NHFT
I wouldn't call those guys libertarians, but I guess that is what a libertarian is nowadays.
Amash and Massie are much more so than Rand, but even Rand is... well, practically "Rand" compared to the rest of the Senate.
btw the sky was falling for me this morning
84 in Vegas yesterday. 3 inches of snow on my truck this morning at 6400 feet in Ely.
In one large valley the clouds were below me. The sky had fallen.
btw Jim I saw people swimming ..... in a pool in Vegas.
:fryingpan:
Quote from: blackie on March 25, 2017, 07:10 AM NHFT
I wouldn't call those guys libertarians, but I guess that is what a libertarian is nowadays.
These are the first guys to not only stand up to this kind stuff in my lifetime... they are in the Senate. Before there was one Representative, now there is a coalition in the US Senate.
The Socialists accumulated small victories under the Democrat banner until they had most of the Socialist agenda imposed. The Libertarian ideals will have to follow a similar path.
Most Libertarians seem to want an Anarchist Candidate... ;D ;D ;D That's an oxymoron for ya, right there.
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 25, 2017, 11:45 AM NHFT
btw the sky was falling for me this morning
84 in Vegas yesterday. 3 inches of snow on my truck this morning at 6400 feet in Ely.
In one large valley the clouds were below me. The sky had fallen.
btw Jim I saw people swimming ..... in a pool in Vegas.
We walked on the Glacier up above Ely and saw Bristle Cone Pines that were old when Jesus was walking around.
yea kinda crazy around there with big valleys and rows of mountains
Do Muslims Commit Most U.S. Terrorist Attacks? (https://reason.com/archives/2017/03/24/do-muslims-commit-most-us-terrorist-atta)
QuoteFor those five years, the researchers found, Muslims carried out only 11 out of the 89 attacks, yet those attacks received 44 percent of the media coverage. (Meanwhile, 18 attacks actually targeted Muslims in America.
Steve Bannon Hates Libertarians Because *We're* Not Living in the Real World?
"Economic nationalist" Trump adviser blasts people foolish enough to believe in "Free Minds and Free Markets." (http://steve%20bannon%20hates%20libertarians%20because%20*we're*%20Not%20Living%20in%20the%20Real%20World?%3Cbr%20/%3E"Economic%20nationalist"%20Trump%20adviser%20blasts%20people%20foolish%20enough%20to%20believe%20in%20"Free%20Minds%20and%20Free%20Markets.")
Quote ...the Republicans, it's all this theoretical Cato Institute, Austrian economics, limited government — which just doesn't have any depth to it. They're not living in the real world."
I remember when the CATO Institute built their glass and steel headquarters right in the belly of the beast. Many Libertarians have accused them of not being libertarian enough. Well, we now see the effect of organizations like them and the Mercatus Center have had by working to educate the mainstream politicians. When working for the Mercatus Center we were told not to use the "L" word in front of the political "students" at the lunch time educational sessions in the Capitol. ;D It was funny how when they had left the room we would do the equivalent of our secret hand shake with the economist etc.
Much more effective than standing on the fringe and yelling about someone's lack of purity.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 28, 2017, 09:29 AM NHFT
Much more effective than standing on the fringe and yelling about someone's lack of purity.
Statist!
Quote from: KBCraig on March 28, 2017, 12:05 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 28, 2017, 09:29 AM NHFT
Much more effective than standing on the fringe and yelling about someone's lack of purity.
Statist!
;D Results trump academic debate. Well except in some debatatarian/contrarian circle (jerks). ;D
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 28, 2017, 12:12 PM NHFT
Quote from: KBCraig on March 28, 2017, 12:05 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 28, 2017, 09:29 AM NHFT
Much more effective than standing on the fringe and yelling about someone's lack of purity.
Statist!
;D Results trump academic debate. Well except in some debatatarian/contrarian circle (jerks). ;D
Pragmatist!
Quote from: Jim Johnson on March 28, 2017, 04:49 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 28, 2017, 12:12 PM NHFT
Quote from: KBCraig on March 28, 2017, 12:05 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 28, 2017, 09:29 AM NHFT
Much more effective than standing on the fringe and yelling about someone's lack of purity.
Statist!
;D Results trump academic debate. Well except in some debatatarian/contrarian circle (jerks). ;D
Pragmatist!
Tough crowd. ;D
A friend, who considers himself a libertarian, laughs at the hardcore that can't seem to get 10 people to show up at the Sizzler, thinking they are going to have an impact.
When did Austrian Economics become "cool"? I was an Economics major when it was already 100 years old, and I was so certain that I had never heard of Austrian Economics that I bought a copy of the 1970 edition of Paul Samuelson's Economics for a few bucks on eBay to look it up but and it isn't in the index. The only mention of Menger is that his first name initial and last name is in a footnote list of half a dozen economists from five countries who had alluded to the notion of a General Equilibrium.
Quote from: WithoutAPaddle on March 28, 2017, 08:25 PM NHFT
When did Austrian Economics become "cool"? I was an Economics major when it was already 100 years old, and I was so certain that I had never heard of Austrian Economics that I bought a copy of the 1970 edition of Paul Samuelson's Economics for a few bucks on eBay to look it up but and it isn't in the index. The only mention of Menger is that his first name initial and last name is in a footnote list of half a dozen economists from five countries who had alluded to the notion of a General Equilibrium.
The Mercatus Center at George Mason University and the CATO Institute I think are the main avenues that the DC crowd has been educated.
Do they want to cut taxes for rich people? Lots of think tanks get lots of money to espouse that "thought".
Are the economists of the Josiah Bartlet Center "Austrians"? I read they get their money from the Koch brothers.
Quote from: WithoutAPaddle on March 28, 2017, 11:48 PM NHFT
Do they want to cut taxes for rich people? Lots of think tanks get lots of money to espouse that "thought".
Are the economists of the Josiah Bartlet Center "Austrians"? I read they get their money from the Koch brothers.
I don't know a lot about it other than having worked for Mercatus and CATO when I lived down there.
I think the left has branded the Koch brothers as evil rich guys. I don't think I buy into that class struggle/envy stuff. Seems kind of hypocritical for the left to be funded by Soros and then to hate Koch. I've made money off both Koch and Soros, indirectly. It's all green. ;D
if some guys in DC are complaining about us ..... excellent
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 29, 2017, 05:04 AM NHFT
Quote from: WithoutAPaddle on March 28, 2017, 11:48 PM NHFT
Do they want to cut taxes for rich people? Lots of think tanks get lots of money to espouse that "thought".
Are the economists of the Josiah Bartlet Center "Austrians"? I read they get their money from the Koch brothers.
I don't know a lot about it other than having worked for Mercatus and CATO ...
You worked for Cato?
(http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1163907!/img/httpImage/image.jpg)
(http://lasvegas.informermg.com/images/lasvegas/stories/Society/Kato_Kaelin/KatoKaelin_064E.jpg)
No... not that Kato.
This Kato!
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e2/Kato_%28Bruce_Lee%29.png)
unrelated but fun
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtBrs03PV8c
any scotts on this thread?
Can Shire Folk say "Mass residents are cool?" or similar
It doesn't roll off my tongue but the sky might still not be falling
There was a Simpsons episode where Lisa was dreaming about her having been Joan of Arc, and the dream dialog was spoken in French, with English subtitles, except for the word victory. and she asked, "Why did you say 'victory' in English?" and was told, "Because there is no French word for victory".
hahaha
;D ;D ;D
hey I didn't think you French-Canadians living along the Maine border had a sense of humor
Since they don't have many black people in Maine, the KKK had to hate on the French Canadians back in the day.
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 30, 2017, 11:05 AM NHFT
unrelated but fun
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtBrs03PV8c
any scotts on this thread?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FFRoYhTJQQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mv3exCOkJNo
Quote from: KBCraig on March 31, 2017, 04:00 PM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 30, 2017, 11:05 AM NHFT
unrelated but fun
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtBrs03PV8c
any scotts on this thread?
that was funny
remain calm
aye we already said that
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FFRoYhTJQQ
FEE's Jeffrey Tucker on Libertarian Outreach, 'The Young Pope' & More.
https://youtu.be/f1_Jt93-seE
QuoteIn the 1940's libertarianism was a little known concept. But thanks to the Foundation of Economic Education (FEE) regularly featuring works by noted scholars like Ludwig von Mises, Milton Friedman, Henry Hazlitt, and George Stigler, the ideas of human liberty and freedom became more accessible and familiar to a larger audience. Today, we need to learn how popular culture can be used by libertarians to spread their ideas to a mainstream audience.
One thing I've noticed among the newer/younger activists is no knowledge or appreciation of the tough road that the pioneers of the modern libertarian movement encountered. Many, other than Ron Paul's recent campaign, only know of the new batch of celebratarians that seem to try to out edgy and take the most controversial positions, there by narrowing their reach down to the echo chamber of fellow kool-aid drinkers.
Rand Paul is becoming the go to counter balance these days. He has also emboldened others in the Senate.
When angry old man John McCain is saying "He Doesn't Have Any Real Influence" well... it means he is obviously having an influence.
A friend that is experienced with dealing with PTSD vets said he recognized the symptoms and behavior in McCain. He goes into the "fight or flight" mode easily. Crazy dang dinosaur.
So anyway the point of this post is that even though the missiles might be flying... The silver lining view is it differentiates the libertarian or constitutionalist position.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on April 08, 2017, 10:38 AM NHFT
Rand Paul is becoming the go to counter balance these days. He has also emboldened others in the Senate.
When angry old man John McCain is saying "He Doesn't Have Any Real Influence" well... it means he is obviously having an influence.
A friend that is experienced with dealing with PTSD vets said he recognized the symptoms and behavior in McCain. He goes into the "fight or flight" mode easily. Crazy dang dinosaur.
So anyway the point of this post is that even though the missiles might be flying... The silver lining view is it differentiates the libertarian or constitutionalist position.
Please don't insult the dang dinosaurs. - Graffy
yea I happened upon the Mises institute a few years ago. I said "I knew other people thought like I did". I didn't know about the thread of people going back in history.
Tolstoy showed how the history of non-violence in the face of evil was covered up throughout the years.
I think decent libertarian thinkers will be buried by the media, their books will be banned and burned and each generation will have to uncover this stuff.
Maybe the old timers in our movement can keep connections with the younger ones and pass it along. :)
Maybe the sky is falling... on Syrians.
Looks like schools are paying an economic price for allowing and even encouraging radical lefty activities...
Colleges struggle over defending or curbing free speech (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/09/01/colleges-struggle-over-defending-or-curbing-free-speech.html)
QuoteBoth the University of Missouri and Evergreen State College have been rocked by left-wing demonstrations, some of which administrators in both schools allowed. Now both have had to deal with falling enrollment and a decline in funds - and there are fears the situation could spread to other schools.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 01, 2017, 09:34 PM NHFT
Looks like schools are paying an economic price for allowing and even encouraging radical lefty activities...
Colleges struggle over defending or curbing free speech (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/09/01/colleges-struggle-over-defending-or-curbing-free-speech.html)
QuoteBoth the University of Missouri and Evergreen State College have been rocked by left-wing demonstrations, some of which administrators in both schools allowed. Now both have had to deal with falling enrollment and a decline in funds - and there are fears the situation could spread to other schools.
People don't want to be emotionally and physically abused just for being straight and white. Who the hell would choose to go to such schools if they were fully aware of how much they promoted this "reverse" racism?
can't imagine being a white guy at some of these places
If nothing else the current state of affairs in the US is comic gold...
Antifa leader, teacher Yvonne Felarca arrested at 'empathy tent' Berkeley brawl (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/09/28/antifa-leader-teacher-yvonne-felarca-arrested-at-empathy-tent-berkeley-brawl.html)
I say we sell pay per view tickets to the Fascist vs. Commie matches... Cantwell vs. this middle school teacher!
Sometimes you can just see the crazy in the eyes.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on September 28, 2017, 10:04 PM NHFT
If nothing else the current state of affairs in the US is comic gold...
Antifa leader, teacher Yvonne Felarca arrested at 'empathy tent' Berkeley brawl (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/09/28/antifa-leader-teacher-yvonne-felarca-arrested-at-empathy-tent-berkeley-brawl.html)
I say we sell pay per view tickets to the Fascist vs. Commie matches... Cantwell vs. this middle school teacher!
Molyneux has a great voice for the play-by-play.
can you imagine visiting a college commons area these days?
How to green the world's deserts and reverse climate change | Allan Savory
https://youtu.be/vpTHi7O66pI
More of an issue of "Climate Change" is desertification caused by lack of grazing animals. The opposite of what we have been told.
I once read a study where they analyzed how many cows per acre was optimal ... I think this was Montana .... and the point of it was that we were overgrazing, but they were shocked to find that many more cows worked up the soil, planted seeds and spread out the nutrients. :)
The world needs more bullshit. I'm just say'n...
Quote from: Jim Johnson on January 14, 2019, 03:45 PM NHFT
The world needs more bullshit. I'm just say'n...
I've been doing my part for decades!
Dang dung humor.
sky falling in the bay area ... and these people act like it is hard times
https://joebiden.info
Parody website is ranking better than the really one.
Creepy Old Uncle Joe.
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on May 04, 2019, 06:13 PM NHFT
https://joebiden.info
Parody website is ranking better than the really one.
Creepy Old Uncle Joe.
Pretty dang funny website Mr. Sawyer.
this guy can almost make trump look normal .... well
Stossel: The Rise Of Citizen Journalists
https://youtu.be/7wo4-hp1pwQ
About Tim Pool...
These kind of folks are why the deplatforming on YouTube, Facebook etc. is happening. The Legacy Media is losing market share. CNN, Vox etc. are laying people off. The Legacy Media no long controls the narrative and they are pissed off and on the attack.
Tim Pool
Joe Rogan
Count Dankula
StyxHexenHammer666
Are some of the folks I've been following on YouTube. It's a weird and wonderful world of commentary.
Count Dankula? I'll have to check that out.
Quote from: Free libertarian on May 08, 2019, 05:51 AM NHFT
Count Dankula? I'll have to check that out.
You might have heard about the guy in Scotland who got arrested for teaching his girlfriends dog to do the heil Hitler... it was a joke, but the court would not consider the context. It made his little YouTube channel blow up.
He is now running for Member of the European Parliament. Funny guy with an interesting perspective. Thick accent.
they are mad that we can talk to each other outside of their control in some ways :)
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on May 08, 2019, 03:47 AM NHFTThe Legacy Media no long controls the narrative and they are pissed off and on the attack.
They're Dirty, Dirty Smear Merchants.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=dirty+dirty+smear+merchants&t=ffsb&ia=web (https://duckduckgo.com/?q=dirty+dirty+smear+merchants&t=ffsb&ia=web)
Check out Luke Rudkowski for Journalism from a stateless perspective:
https://www.youtube.com/user/wearechange/videos (https://www.youtube.com/user/wearechange/videos)
PewDiePie did nothing wrong!