New Hampshire Underground

What do you guys think of the idea of NH not going along with Eastern Time?
I was thinking it would separate us from the silly US daylight savings time thing.

How about daylight savings time all year?

We could be 1:05pm when EDT is 1:00pm.

We are already 5 minutes ahead!

I dunno, all those farm children need to be able to get their chores done before their school bus arrives.  ;)

They have come a long way with those flashlights you strap to your forehead

Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on April 02, 2006, 07:55 AM NHFT
How about daylight savings time all year?

Do you think that would work out better?
We could call it NH time.
I like the idea of not switching and being different from other places. Caleb said the USA today headline for Indiana caving was "Uniformity at Last" or something. It would be fun for us to be the opposite. :)

Russell... I am sure that you can submit a bill to the house. ;)

Even if it doesn't pass, I will be observing the free state time zone.

You say of some people that they're in their own little world....Russell will be in his own little time zone.

I grew up in Indiana and I couldn't believe it when they switched.  I talked to a friend there yesterday and he and I had serious trouble talking about what time it was, as he kept referring to EST as "Quote Real time". So I'm pretty sure that most of the Proles are against it. 

Anyway I would definitely like our own time zone, but you need the annual average of sunup and then make that say 7am even if it is 730am (ALL of India, for example, is +5.5 from GMT http://worldatlas.com/aatlas/infopage/timezonz.htm (http://worldatlas.com/aatlas/infopage/timezonz.htm))

I'm not particularly excited about the idea of dawn at 3:30am in the summertime.

Quote from: mvpel on April 03, 2006, 06:54 PM NHFT
I'm not particularly excited about the idea of dawn at 3:30am in the summertime.

What time does Dawn excite you? And does Bill know? Or Caryn?

;D >:D

You know, "My man Mitch" actually campaigned on switching to daylight savings time.  What's funny is that no one in Indiana wanted to switch, that I know of, and yet somehow all the polls were saying that people were demanding it.

Mitch said that people think of Hoosiers as "hicks" because we don't switch our clocks.  But its a stupid idea anyway, and I really don't think Hoosiers are thought of as "hicks" because they didn't switch their clocks.

Caleb

Hawaii doesn't
Arizona doesn't

and some people in NH don't.

NHST Russell start putting that in your byline on KFP.  People will ask and you can slowly turn them. ;D

Quote from: mvpel on April 03, 2006, 06:54 PM NHFT
I'm not particularly excited about the idea of dawn at 3:30am in the summertime.

If we stuck to DST as it is now, how would we get dawn at 3:30 am?  Dawn does not occur that early during the summer.

So how does everyone vote?
.... do you like the term NHST NH standard time?
.... do we like Lloyd's idea of matching Eastern Time in the summer  :icon_motor: :fishing: and then not changing in the winter? :nono:

I kinda like both and can go with it. Other people can join me or not :ahoy: .... it is a free country :plotting: ..... or at least it will be.  :crazy3: :independence:

I'm going with 'Lloyd Time', at least untill I miss too many important meetings or appointments.

But will the trains run on time? >:D

Actually, yes, just as much as they did before congress passed a law about what time it would be (http://aa.usno.navy.mil/faq/docs/daylight_time.html).

And MVPel the sun wouldn't come up at 3:30am on NHRT (New Hampshire Real Time) The earliest it would come up is 4:30 am in the summer.  This, of course, is all based on the sunrise time in Concord, when we should be using Laconia or someplace closer to the weighted geographical center of the state (Same area north and south). Basically I think you should set the clocks forward 20mins when you aren't on DST and just leave them be forever after.

NHRT has a certain (non-governmental) ring to it.

20 minutes?

Franco at an old job I had told me the standard joke from his childhood back in Italy under Mussilini.

"Yes the trains were always on time under facism ..... you just didn't have permission to go anywhere."

From that article .... the government keeps changing its mind, so we can do no worse. They are even going to change it again in 2007 after this years Indiana change.

I like the idea of doing our own thing and calling it something without "standard" or "uniform" in the name. :)
I like "real".
Does GMT or UCT change with "daylight savings"? (I can't believe the UK follows our silly stuff) If not we could reference our real time by it .... such as NHRT (GMT -6). Or we could us Internet time BMT? or something else as a reference. To me it makes sense to just us any number that doesn't change. :) And then give it a cool name.

Don't make it something easy like 20 minutes. Go for 22 minutes and 47 seconds. Weed out those who aren't true believers.  ;D

Quote from: sandm000 on April 04, 2006, 11:56 AM NHFTAnd MVPel the sun wouldn't come up at 3:30am on NHRT (New Hampshire Real Time) The earliest it would come up is 4:30 am in the summer.

Civil twilight begins on June 1, 2006 at 4:34am Eastern Daylight Time in Concord.

Without DST, that time would be 3:34am, with sunrise at 4:09am.

http://aa.usno.navy.mil/cgi-bin/aa_pap.pl

Sunset on June 1, 2006 in Concord will be 8:30pm, which would be 7:30pm without DST.

Quote from: russellkanning on April 04, 2006, 12:23 PM NHFT
NHRT has a certain (non-governmental) ring to it.

20 minutes?

The 20 minute number is based on the average sun rise of 5:39 am, so you could add 21minutes if you wanted. And where did the 5:39 am come from? I have an XLS spreadsheet you can look at if you want, but that is 5:39 without DST mucking about in the sunrise (in concord). So I arbitrarily decided on a 6:00am sunrise average, so add ~20mins to the clocks.

Further MVPel you said "I'm not particularly excited about the idea of dawn at 3:30am in the summertime." Emphasis mine.  Dawn and civil twilight are not the same thing.  Twilight is the time when the sun has not crested the horizon and light is visible, and dawn is the time when the sun crests the horizon.

In addition to which I am suggesting adding 20 mins which would make Dawn on June 1, 2006 4:30 am which is when your civil twilight begins.

If you want to see the spreadsheet just let me know.

Quote from: KBCraig on April 04, 2006, 01:11 PM NHFT
Don't make it something easy like 20 minutes. Go for 22 minutes and 47 seconds. Weed out those who aren't true believers.  ;D

:violent5: :bow:
I was dying from laughter over that one.

I haven't heard the term "civil twilight". In the military, it was BMNT and EENT: beginning morning nautical twilight and ending evening nautical twilight. Same thing, though. It was light enough to see and work, which is not the same as sunset and sunrise.

Kevin

Quote from: KBCraig on April 04, 2006, 01:11 PM NHFT
Don't make it something easy like 20 minutes. Go for 22 minutes and 47 seconds. Weed out those who aren't true believers.  ;D

You can go ahead and add 22min and 47sec if you want. Me, I'll just say I'll be at the bar around 10 or around 10:30. I don't think I ever in my life said I will be there at exactly 10:13 and 12 seconds, If I am late, you must consider me to be dead or abandoned in a ditch somewhere, and
hey don't mock my sincere calculations!
I'mserious.
20 minutes is a scientifically easy number for we in the know to use, while at the same time being simple enough for those euphamistically refered to as 'Sheeple' to hear, understand, and obey.

I don't like it when the sun goes down early, I support daylight savings all year round. I also support just not having a government mandated time.

Quote from: sandm000 on April 04, 2006, 01:36 PM NHFTFurther MVPel you said "I'm not particularly excited about the idea of dawn at 3:30am in the summertime." Emphasis mine.  Dawn and civil twilight are not the same thing.  Twilight is the time when the sun has not crested the horizon and light is visible, and dawn is the time when the sun crests the horizon.

The Merriam-Webster definition for dawn as an intransitive verb is:

1 : to begin to grow light as the sun rises

... and the noun is defined as:

1 : the first appearance of light in the morning followed by sunrise

That's the sense in which I was using the word.

Main Entry: pe?dan?tic
Pronunciation: pi-'dan-tik
Function: adjective
1 : of, relating to, or being a pedant
2 : narrowly, stodgily, and often ostentatiously learned
3 : UNIMAGINATIVE, PEDESTRIAN
- pe?dan?ti?cal?ly /-'dan-ti-k(&-)lE/ adverb

Quote from: KBCraig on April 04, 2006, 01:41 PM NHFT
I haven't heard the term "civil twilight". In the military, it was BMNT and EENT: beginning morning nautical twilight and ending evening nautical twilight. Same thing, though. It was light enough to see and work, which is not the same as sunset and sunrise.

Kevin

When I was in the military I knew when it was morning and night by the phrases "Get your ass outta that rack, now!" and "Lights out!"

I remember at times when the first seemed to follow the second almost immediately ;D

Quote from: burnthebeautiful on April 04, 2006, 02:48 PM NHFT
I don't like it when the sun goes down early, I support daylight savings all year round. I also support just not having a government mandated time.

Yea I like it. I will start NH time right now with no change to our clocks. I think it is (UTC -4). :)
So what should we call it? Or do we all have our favorite names?

I still support New Hampshire Real Time or what about Real Time Act, of course without any actual act having been passed.

I am leaning towards that one too.

I like NHRT

How about NHFT?

NH FREE TIME

Why not just use GMT/UTC? They're just numbers.

Why does "midnight" have to be 0? Why does noon have to be 12? Why can't noon be 16?

I think timezones are just as stupid as daylight manipulation time.

I am tempted to just use UTC for the exact same reasons as you.
I just think it would be fun for us to have our own way of doing stuff. :)

It would be the 'IN' thing to do to say that it's 3:20pm New Hampshire Real Time, people will look at their watches and be slightly cornfused.  They may even say,"It's more tomfoolery from those FSPers (read: Fispers)"

I really just needed an excuse to use the word 'Tomfoolery'.

How about "Freedom Time" ?

4:32 NHFT

I take it you have gone for the 47 second advance

Only the astute notice.....the rest live in the past.

Thanks.....I think....

Everybodys worried about time
but I just keep that shit off my mind
People living on twenty four hour clocks
but we're on a ride that never stops.

-Dragonfly
-Dave & Ziggy Marley

Quote from: Lloyd 'Posterboy' Danforth on April 02, 2006, 07:55 AM NHFT
How about daylight savings time all year?

Now that the gubmint is forcing daylight saving on us earlier (and creating a mini-Y2K style computer glitch (http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,2100064,00.asp)) I say enough is enough. I support NHFT. I like Lloyd's idea, but I think we should add another 30 minutes onto that. That would put us in the same time zone as southeastern Labrador and Newfoundland.

Later sunrise and sunset times. :icon_sunny:

Can the official forum time be changed to NHFT?  :icon_pirat:

1:45 AM (UTC ? 3:30)

that would be funny

Eh? My computer got an update for the upcoming DST change in 2005!! If you have a glitch it's Microsoft's fault.

I hadn't patched my server for a while... turns out that the timezone files in debian are stored in the libc package.

I figured, better safe than sorry, and rebooted the thing after the update completed.

Took me all of 15 minutes.

For a completely unnecessary reboot and for running debian on a server. :)

Quote from: error on March 05, 2007, 11:48 PM NHFT
For a completely unnecessary reboot and for running debian on a server. :)

Ouch!

What's your poison of choice?

My server and the FTL server are running CentOS.

I use Fedora at home.

If you want to determine if a system with Perl is ready for the change, use the command:

/usr/bin/perl  -e '$ENV{TZ} = "US/Eastern";print scalar(localtime(1173614400))'

If it shows 08:00:00, it's ready for the change, but if it shows 07:00:00, it needs a patch.

Apparently the latest Solaris 8 patch broke the old-style specification of time zones - EST5EDT does not cope with the new timezone shift date.

I'm kind of amazed, though, that it took Microsoft until February to do a final release of this patch - they've had two years to deal with it.

Quote from: Hollywood on March 05, 2007, 11:15 PM NHFT
Can the official forum time be changed to NHFT?  :icon_pirat:

It is possible to change your individual time display on the forum. Click on the Profile tab. In the Modify Profile list, click on Look and Layout Preferences. I entered 1.5 in the Time Offset field and clicked the Change profile button. Voila, my very own time zone ;D

I added an Approval Voting poll. You can vote for more than one option. Also, you can change your vote(s) by removing them and re-voting.

Is there a way to pronounce NHFT as one word?
Is there a funny acronym for the statist version? (eg Adjusted Solar Standard, Daylight Use Might Burn)

Quote from: sandm000 on March 06, 2007, 01:28 PM NHFT
Is there a way to pronounce NHFT as one word?

Nifty?

I do like the fun of nhft or nifty ... if just for never changing the clocks.
... in The Shire ... the small folks don't have much use for watches.

If we chose a time, some of could change it on this forum and know what time it is just by visiting here. We could even have the feds have trouble tracking us with our own special time. :)

Quote from: sandm000 on March 06, 2007, 01:28 PM NHFT
Is there a way to pronounce NHFT as one word?

"Nuft", as in, "I've had a Nuft, and I'm moving to New Hampshire!"

    I vote for Eastern Standard Time + 30 minutes.  Daylight Savings Time is
silly.  OK, we dont want our children to walk to schooling in the dark, so
lets impose on every civilized human being within a three hundred mile radius
twice a year instead of changing the time school begins...brilliant idea.  :BangHead:

Quote from: Nicholas Gilman on March 07, 2007, 11:56 PM NHFT
    I vote for Eastern Standard Time + 30 minutes.  Daylight Savings Time is
silly.  OK, we dont want our children to walk to schooling in the dark, so
lets impose on every civilized human being within a three hundred mile radius
twice a year instead of changing the time school begins...brilliant idea.  :BangHead:

Ah, you have hit upon the real root of DST: "jobs" and "schools", especially as controlled by the state.

Farming is driven by the sun. Nobody pays attention to the clock when there's work to do. Free entrepreneurs work, and sleep when they're not working, and if they're successful they have time for recreation. Students who are "learners" can just substitute "learn" for "work" in the previous sentence.

Humanity survived just fine on the "sunup to sundown" schedule for millennia. People adjusted their schedules logically, based on the daylight available. But when standardized, government-restricted "work weeks" or "school weeks" come into play, the big hand and little hand became tyrants. Jobs revolved around the clock, not the work. Education revolved around the school day, not learning. People started going to work (or school) in the dark, because the government dictated that they had to work consistent schedules.

I propose returning to a business model of "open when we're here, closed when we're not". And keep the gummint's nose out of it.

Kevin

I live by that business model. Then again, I'm open 24 hours a day, and nobody has yet figured out exactly when I sleep.

don't you sleep in second life?

I have been thinking lately that Shire time should be some odd offset from the "official" clock. :)

The artificial regiment that the clock brings to life is very stressful on people. The natural rhythms of the day, and the season are much healthier. Get up when you wake up, work until you are tired... we are not machines.

It does make sense to just set a time ... and then don't change it seasonally. We each can decide what 6am NHFT means. I have noticed that many of my friends in NH don't wear watches. :)

I kinda like all the ideas including an odd offset one.

I normally feel tired and go to sleep sometime between 1 and 2am... and I normally feel like getting up sometime after 10am.

Works for me as long as I don't have to bow to the clock.  ;)

I haven't worn a watch for years.

The center of the Eastern Time zone is at 75 degrees west. The center of New Hampshire is at 71 degrees, 34 minutes west. (The whole state is from 70*37' to 72*37'.) So we are roughly 3.5 degrees east of the center. Time zones are 15 degrees apart (360/24). So...

NHFT (nifty time) should be 14 minutes ahead of EST (3.5/15*60).

You might be able to suggest 15 minutes to me; it's actually correct for how far east we live.

I hate the whole am/pm thing. I've switched to 24 hour time ever since I moved to NH. Life is so much simpler this way. I feel like the whole am/pm thing was invented cus people couldn't count past 12 but I can and don't want to constantly have to clarify if it's PM or AM. Anyways...

One change that would be interesting is making the day start (sunrise?) at 0 and end at around 16, with 16-24 being night.

Quote from: toowm on March 08, 2007, 10:27 AM NHFT
The center of the Eastern Time zone is at 75 degrees west. The center of New Hampshire is at 71 degrees, 34 minutes west. (The whole state is from 70*37' to 72*37'.) So we are roughly 3.5 degrees east of the center. Time zones are 15 degrees apart (360/24). So...

NHFT (nifty time) should be 14 minutes ahead of EST (3.5/15*60).

You might be able to suggest 15 minutes to me; it's actually correct for how far east we live.

I like it. It has reason and purpose. 14 or 15 ahead
I could go for est+14 all year .... dumping the edt .... or edt+14 all year

and 24 hours ... I love it.
I wouldn't mind posting both times for events and such.

This just appeals to the geeks in the movement too much to pass up. The great thing is that we don't have to force this on anyone and let anyone join us that wants to. I wouldn't want to change the forum clock, but some of us could change something to keep track of it.

How about we go with a general consensus of this thread after a short amount of rangling and discussion?
BTW ... I voted for all of the above. :)

   The nice thing about getting rid of DST is that many people have
to convert times in their head.  Airline pilots and some mil
pilots use whats called Zulu time, which is based on Universal
Coordinated Time (UTC).  UTC is based on Greenwich Mean Time
(GMT) which is a time zone in England.  UTC is used for international
servers, satellite coordination, and other purposes. 
BTW if you call the AT&T operator, they can give you the
time and date of any city in the world.  Thats important if you
have to call Riga, Latvia and want to make sure its not 3AM!

  So far it looks like DST is over according to the poll. :)

I vote for EST - 15 minutes, no daylight savings time, 24 hour (non-military) clock.

"The nifty time at the tone is now 12:06 NHFT." BEEP!

NHFT sometimes referred to as Shire Time is 15 minutes ahead of the death star known as Washington, DC.

We have the tactical advantage of 15 minutes ahead of the OverLords.

Plus, what a great conversation starter.  :D

(This is my preference)

Quote from: Lex Berezhny on March 08, 2007, 10:52 AM NHFT
One change that would be interesting is making the day start (sunrise?) at 0 and end at around 16, with 16-24 being night.

Some people use a calendar on which the day starts at sunset.

Quote from: toowm on March 08, 2007, 11:57 AM NHFT
I vote for EST - 15 minutes, no daylight savings time, 24 hour (non-military) clock.

"The nifty time at the tone is now 12:06 NHFT." BEEP!

that would be 8) with me

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 08, 2007, 12:09 PM NHFT
NHFT sometimes referred to as Shire Time is 15 minutes ahead of the death star known as Washington, DC.

We have the tactical advantage of 15 minutes ahead of the OverLords.

Plus, what a great conversation starter.  :D

(This is my preference)

I like it. We are very "progressive" here in The Shire. We are always 15 minutes ahead of the feds and our money keeps going up in value compared to the USD.

Quote from: KBCraig on March 08, 2007, 01:58 AM NHFT
I propose returning to a business model of "open when we're here, closed when we're not". And keep the gummint's nose out of it.

Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 08, 2007, 04:30 AM NHFT
It does make sense to just set a time ... and then don't change it seasonally.

Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 08, 2007, 11:04 AM NHFT
How about we go with a general consensus of this thread after a short amount of rangling and discussion?

The quotes above characterize what I was going for by posting the poll. I'm glad folks have put in their 2 cents. :) I'd say there is consensus for NHFT to be a year-round thing with no more changing clocks twice a year. I suppose the strong showing for EST reflects that sentiment.

Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 08, 2007, 02:15 PM NHFT

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 08, 2007, 12:09 PM NHFT
NHFT sometimes referred to as Shire Time is 15 minutes ahead of the death star known as Washington, DC.

We have the tactical advantage of 15 minutes ahead of the OverLords.

Plus, what a great conversation starter.  :D

(This is my preference)

I like it. We are very "progressive" here in The Shire. We are always 15 minutes ahead of the feds and our money keeps going up in value compared to the USD.

I like Tom Sawyer's idea. However, if NHFT is EST+15, The Shire would be 45 minutes behind DC during Daylight Stupid Time. I added two more options to the poll, EST+15 and EST+1hr 15min. The latter choice keeps The Shire at least 15 minutes ahead of DC year-round. :)

Sticking with EST year-round solves the clock-changing problem, but it doesn't stick it to the man enough, IMO.

I could go either way. We could be behind them sometimes ... we could think of different jokes. :)

During DST, DC is leading the charge of stupid statist tricks.  ;)

Speaking of which, if you aren't on NHFT yet, you should set your clocks forward this weekend, and take special care to update your computer beforehand (http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2007/03/08/daylight-saving-time-begins-this-weekend/).

Of course, daylight saving time is stupid (http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/04/03/daylight-stupid-time/).

I'm not sure which is more stupid, the fact that we "have to" change our clocks based on some power tripper's fiat, or the arguments which arise between people who say "Daylight Savings Time" and "Daylight Saving Time."  (I haven't observed it here, but I've observed it other places.... :P)

It's "daylight stupid time" around here. :)

I'm hardly useful when I'm enslaved to a clock... some of my best work is done long after the sun has gone down when I have far fewer distractions tugging at my brain.

Quote from: James A. Pyrich on March 08, 2007, 10:57 PM NHFT
I'm hardly useful when I'm enslaved to a clock... some of my best work is done long after the sun has gone down when I have far fewer distractions tugging at my brain.

So stop looking at the clock.

I've done my share of all-night coding marathons. Not so many these days, since I'm old...

Quote from: James A. Pyrich on March 08, 2007, 10:46 PM NHFT
the fact that we "have to" change our clocks based on some power tripper's fiat

actually .... we don't have to.

I forgot that the government was doing this change. So I guess some of us could switch to NHFT or the even more relaxed Shire Time really soon. :) Shire time leaks over to Maine and VT some .... in fact it can be observed by anyone who wants to join The Shire. :)

my forum profile adjusted by +.25

[attachment deleted by admin]

Quote from: error on March 08, 2007, 01:46 PM NHFT

Quote from: Lex Berezhny on March 08, 2007, 10:52 AM NHFT
One change that would be interesting is making the day start (sunrise?) at 0 and end at around 16, with 16-24 being night.

Some people use a calendar on which the day starts at sunset.

Yeah, Undead Peole

Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 09, 2007, 06:35 AM NHFT
my forum profile adjusted by +.25

The option to display 24-hour time is available too. :)

OK, I could go along with EST+15.

EST is still way ahead and keeps getting more votes, but is all but absent from the discussion. ???

Quote from: Hollywood on March 09, 2007, 09:42 AM NHFT
The option to display 24-hour time is available too. :)

I have pretty much everything set to the 24 hour clock. The only time i ever deal with pm/am nowadays is when I'm speaking with people. Otherwise my computer, all my software, websites, email, my watch, etc. all use 24 hour clock. After almost a year I'm actually starting to think in terms of 24 instead of pm/am and so I have to convert am/pm to 24h to internalize it. In hindsight I'm glad I switched to the 24h clock. Besides it makes me think more because i have to convert the times on a regular basis when i'm talking to people.

   24HR time is great when you work rotating shifts, its also handy for folks
who stay awake for more than 24 hours like me. :coffee:

Quote from: Hollywood on March 09, 2007, 09:42 AM NHFT
EST is still way ahead and keeps getting more votes, but is all but absent from the discussion. ???

That's called the "silent majority." :)

or the people who voted before the nifty +15 minute thing came up :)

I have been running on nhft of est+15 for a day now ... I think my quality of life has gone up. Maybe we should sell the concept and have infomercials.

So... the silent majority has spoken?

:-X

Quote from: error on March 08, 2007, 01:46 PM NHFT

Quote from: Lex Berezhny on March 08, 2007, 10:52 AM NHFT
One change that would be interesting is making the day start (sunrise?) at 0 and end at around 16, with 16-24 being night.

Some people use a calendar on which the day starts at sunset.

Yep, because the Bible defines it as such.

"And there was evening, and there was morning?the first day."
"And there was evening, and there was morning?the second day."
"And there was evening, and there was morning?the third day."
"And there was evening, and there was morning?the fourth day."
"And there was evening, and there was morning?the fifth day."
"And there was evening, and there was morning?the sixth day."

Quote from: error on March 09, 2007, 02:43 PM NHFT

Quote from: Hollywood on March 09, 2007, 09:42 AM NHFT
EST is still way ahead and keeps getting more votes, but is all but absent from the discussion. ???

That's called the "silent majority." :)

Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 09, 2007, 05:10 PM NHFT
or the people who voted before the nifty +15 minute thing came up :)

I have been running on nhft of est+15 for a day now ... I think my quality of life has gone up. Maybe we should sell the concept and have infomercials.

Yeah, I shouldn't be so impatient. It's the impending arrival of the new and improved DST that has me so worked up. :blush:

I'm selling the concept in my sig. :)

A graphic to display the current Shire Time would be nice. I haven't found one that will allow for UTC -x.75 hours, if such an offset becomes the consensus.

Who needs consensus... Hollywood's edict works for me. ;D

Quote from: Pat McCotter on March 10, 2007, 09:18 AM NHFT
Yep, because the Bible defines it as such.

Nitpick: it was most probably common practice before it was written anywhere.  :)

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 10, 2007, 09:54 AM NHFT
Who needs consensus... Hollywood's edict works for me. ;D

Yeah, democracy isn't producing the desired result. ;D

Everytime the gov fucks with the time I find myself singing this to myself.


Chicago - Does Anybody Really Know What Time It Is? Lyrics

As I was walking down the street one day

A man came up to me and asked me what the time was that was

on my watch, yeah

And I said

Does anybody really know what time it is

I don't

Does anybody really care

care

If so I can't imagine why

about time

We've all got time enough to cry

Oh no, no

And I was walking down the street one day

A pretty lady looked at me and said her diamond watch had

stopped cold dead

And I said

Does anybody really know what time it is

I don't

Does anybody really care

care

If so I can't imagine why

about time

We've all got time enough to cry

Oh no, no

And I was walking down the street one day

Being pushed and shoved by people trying to beat the clock,

oh, so I just don't know,

I just don't know

And I said, yes I said

Background Vocal:

People runnin' everywhere

Don't know the way to go

Don't know where I am

Can't see past the next step

Don't have to think past the last mile

Have no time to look around

Just run around, run around and think why

Does anybody really know what time it is

I don't

Does anybody really care

care

If so I can't imagine why

about time

We've all got time enough to die

Oh no, no

Quote from: Lloyd  Danforth on March 10, 2007, 10:01 AM NHFT
Everytime the gov fucks with the time I find myself singing this to myself.


Chicago - Does Anybody Really Know What Time It Is? Lyrics

I was thinking of that song yesterday while posting in this thread. Now I have that cool horn arrangement in my head. :) Of course, lots of early Chicago songs produce that effect.

I'm also reminded that Chicago shortened its name from Chicago Transit Authority after the namesake municipal corporation threatened legal action. ::)

How does this look. I guess I could put any text there.

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It's horribly confusing.

   NHFT is really nice..I hope it catches on in a big way in the shire.

doesn't it seem that George Bush is following Augustus Caesar and is starting to change the calendar or something?

We shouldn't have to keep changing "shire time" NHFT, since we will have no emperor. If some people want to observe EST all year long they will be within 15min of us all the time ... no big deal. :)

Quote from: error on March 11, 2007, 07:29 AM NHFT
It's horribly confusing.

suggestions?

Use the government numbers.  Call it FST.

So far, I think this clock-changing thing is one of Ben Franklin's worst ideas.

Generally, I like Franklin.  But, even a correct clock is wrong if one keeps changing it.

I blame Mr. Franklin for this.

Now (because of Ben Franklin) governments think they can even CONTROL TIME.

(What my schedule ain't frantic enough?  Give me a F---ing break already.)!

I'm glad to see the forum running on New Hampshire Free Time. Nifty! 8)

Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 11, 2007, 10:35 AM NHFT

Quote from: error on March 11, 2007, 07:29 AM NHFT
It's horribly confusing.

suggestions?

I liked the wording, but having just the time and date is good too. Maybe try the 24-hour format like Lex suggested?

Maybe I'm pushing for too much, too fast. ;)

Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 11, 2007, 10:35 AM NHFT

Quote from: error on March 11, 2007, 07:29 AM NHFT
It's horribly confusing.

suggestions?

Do what you will; I'll just change the offset in my own profile so I don't get confused.

I'm lovin' this "shire time"... more time to party in the evenings.

W wants us to get to work early... he's like some kind of pimp... slappin' us around "This all the money you got for me b***h."

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 11, 2007, 11:02 PM NHFT
I'm lovin' this "shire time"... more time to party in the evenings.

Yep, still Sunday in The Shire for another couple of minutes. Monday in DC.

Quote from: John on March 11, 2007, 11:17 AM NHFT
So far, I think this clock-changing thing is one of Ben Franklin's worst ideas.

Generally, I like Franklin.  But, even a correct clock is wrong if one keeps changing it.

I blame Mr. Franklin for this.

Now (because of Ben Franklin) governments think they can even CONTROL TIME.

(What my schedule ain't frantic enough?  Give me a F---ing break already.)!

I agree with you about government-dictated time changing. However, Ben Franklin didn't suggest changing clocks. The blame lies, strangely enough, with golfers in government:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daylight_savings_time
Saving daylight was first mentioned in 1784 by Benjamin Franklin in a humorous letter urging Parisians to save money by getting up earlier to use morning sunlight, thereby burning fewer candles in the evening. Franklin did not mention daylight saving time?he did not propose that clock time be changed. His letter was in the spirit of his earlier proverb "Early to bed and early to rise / Makes a man healthy, wealthy, and wise."

DST was first proposed in 1907 by William Willett (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Willett). An avid golfer, he disliked cutting short his round at dusk. The proposal attracted many eminent supporters, including Balfour, Churchill, Lloyd George, and MacDonald. Edward VII also favored DST and had already been using it at Sandringham. However, Prime Minister Asquith opposed the proposal and after many hearings it was narrowly defeated in a Parliament committee vote in 1909. Willett's allies introduced new DST bills every year from 1911 through 1914, to no avail.

DST was first enacted by a national government by Germany during World War I, starting April 30, 1916. The United Kingdom soon followed suit, first observing it on May 21, 1916. On June 17, 1917, Newfoundland became the first North American jurisdiction to adopt DST with the Daylight Saving Act of 1917. On March 19, 1918, the U.S. Congress established DST from the last Sunday in March to the last Sunday in October. The wartime measure, however, proved unpopular among farmers, and Congress repealed it in 1919. Woodrow Wilson, another avid golfer, vetoed the repeal twice but his second veto was overridden.

There's a Real Men of Genius spot in here somewhere. "Mr. Daylight Saving Time Inventor!" :P

Quote from: Hollywood on March 11, 2007, 09:45 PM NHFT
I'm glad to see the forum running on New Hampshire Free Time. Nifty! 8)
I liked the wording, but having just the time and date is good too. Maybe try the 24-hour format like Lex suggested?

I have to figure out how to do it.

   I like the time in NHFT in the upper right corner.  It'll catch on when we start using it for events and meetings.

Betcha not

Quote from: Nicholas Gilman on March 12, 2007, 05:14 PM NHFT
   I like the time in NHFT in the upper right corner.

Now with 24-hour time goodness (thanks Russell). ;D

This has caused a stir, so I posted how to personalize the time display (http://forum.soulawakenings.com/index.php?topic=7669.msg135976#msg135976) on another thread. NHFT is a voluntary standard, but not on the forum unless you read certain threads. ;)

Commonly known as: 'Military Time'

I changed it, but I guess you can thank Russell if you want.

neener neener neener

Quote from: Kat Kanning on March 13, 2007, 04:59 PM NHFT
I changed it, but I guess you can thank Russell if you want.

Oh. I PM'ed him some PHP code so I thought he made the change. Thank you Kat. :)

I'm lovin this NHFT ... stickin it to the man

Using the Man's 'Military Time'

24 hours were around for a hell of a lot longer than any military.

Quote from: Lloyd  Danforth on March 13, 2007, 10:04 PM NHFT
Using the Man's 'Military Time'

You can tell I use military time as I walk around town?

The man owns you compared to my freedom baby.

I notice we're not using Military Time anymore

I don't use it in real life ... I think most other people don't either. :)

 ;D

I'm glad this topic came back to life. I bookmarked this thread when I found this site last autumn because I thought it was great that people started talking about not obeying daylight savings time. I hoped there would be resistance to the government expanding it. I don't like DST because it is artificial and the standard time zones are already far off from solar time in most areas. I like how NHFT is closer to the real New Hampshire solar time than EST.

I am in high school and started getting interested in time and astronomy last year. I have found some other time zones that are offset fifteen minutes.

UTC +12:45 is Chatham Islands Standard Time in New Zealand
Nepal is UTC +5:45
UTC +8:45 sounds like an interesting place http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UTC%2B8:45

24-hour time is also known as railway time. If you don't like that it sounds militaristic, you could just say "nineteen o clock" instead of "nineteen hundred hours." Just a thought.

For now, I'm in the land of Pacific Daylight Time. :(

I hope you keep on sticking it to The Man!

Thomas from CA

Welcome to nhfree, Thomas.

Start making your plans to attend college in NH and you can stick it to the Man, too.

~Kate

Quote from: outatime on March 14, 2007, 11:45 PM NHFT
For now, I'm in the land of Pacific Daylight Time. :(

We're going back ... to the future!

I'm lovin' this Shire Time .... government time stinks.

Quote from: Rosie the Riveter on March 15, 2007, 12:12 AM NHFT
Welcome to nhfree, Thomas.

Start making your plans to attend college in NH and you can stick it to the Man, too.

~Kate

Thank you for the welcome Kate. New Hampshire seems like an interesting place to be. I'm not sure if I'll go to college. I would rather work and earn some $.

Yeah error, my user name is obviously from the Back To The Future. I saw the trilogy again last year and it got me thinking about the concepts surrounding time and related subjects. NHFT reminds me of the first movie's early scene in Doc Brown's garage when all the clocks are synchronized 25 minutes behind PDT ;D Cue Huey Lewis...

A related piece of BTTF trivia is that the weekend the movie is set in October 1985 is the one daylight savings time switched back to standard time. OK I'm a nerd, what can I say.

Back To The Future was my favorite movie in the '80s and I think it has stood the test of time (no pun intended).

In spite of this weekend's snow storm, Spring will arrive in The Shire on Tuesday March 20 at 7:22 PM NHFT. :icon_flower:

Quote from: outatime on March 16, 2007, 09:29 PM NHFT

Quote from: Rosie the Riveter on March 15, 2007, 12:12 AM NHFT
Welcome to nhfree, Thomas.

Start making your plans to attend college in NH and you can stick it to the Man, too.

~Kate

Thank you for the welcome Kate. New Hampshire seems like an interesting place to be. I'm not sure if I'll go to college. I would rather work and earn some $.

Alright -- as long as you plan to come to NH to work! You can learn anything you need to any way with a mentor, a library card, amazon.com and google.

Oh yea -- and nhfree.com

Quote from: Rosie the Riveter on March 18, 2007, 12:25 AM NHFT
Alright -- as long as you plan to come to NH to work! You can learn anything you need to any way with a mentor, a library card, amazon.com and google.

Oh yea -- and nhfree.com

Working without paying state income tax would be nice. nhfree.com certainly is a great resource with lots of varied topics and nice people. :)

Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 13, 2007, 09:21 PM NHFT
I'm lovin this NHFT ... stickin it to the man

I'm happy to see that Russell is spreading the word about NHFT (http://www.strike-the-root.com/cgi-local/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=root_strikers;action=display;num=1170081088). :icon_thumleft:

Quote from: Hollywood on March 17, 2007, 11:18 PM NHFT
In spite of this weekend's snow storm, Spring will arrive in The Shire on Tuesday March 20 at 7:22 PM NHFT.

Autumn will arrive in The Shire on Sunday September 23 at 5:06 AM NHFT (5:51 AM EDT).

Daylight Stupid Time ends on Sunday November 4 at 1:15 AM NHFT (1:00 AM EST, one minute after 1:59 AM EDT).

ah the joys of NHFTy time ... I can look at my watch at noon and know that the sun will be right overhead ... at least in a minute or 2 since I am usually on the west side of The Shire. And when others moan about the government time change those of us who don't wear watches or use Shire time will not notice. :)

welcome back to sun time, those of you recent escapees from daylight savings time 8)

maybe you will like it and stay a while

Welcome to The Shire .... enjoy the view

Quote from: Russell Kanning on October 28, 2007, 09:20 AM NHFT
welcome back to sun time, those of you recent escapees from daylight savings time 8)

Um, no, that's next weekend.  By government order.

welcome back now .... sun time works for me.

Quote from: Russell Kanning on April 02, 2006, 07:49 AM NHFT
... the silly US daylight savings time thing.

It was Ben Franklin who came up with the idea of changing/messing with the clocks while he was living in France.
Mr. Franklin was right on many things . . . this was not one of them. 

We know that ... but the US government pushes it on people. I adjust my activities (and their times) to the sunshine ... not changing the clock. :)

Maybe the official symbol of the Shire will have to be the turkey to use one of his ideas. :) There sure are alot of them.

I agree that it sucks that the government pushes this BS: but that is what governments do.  They are always pushing more BS.  Biggest BS pusher there is, as far as I can tell.

Quote from: Russell Kanning on December 08, 2007, 08:23 AM NHFTofficial symbol

:o :o :o :o :o :o
;D ;)

so ... is anyone else using Shire Time?

If I am the only one ... I am going to change it to my vote .... EST all the time

Zombie thread. Wow.
I love NHFT.
I long to be on NHFT.
Regardless of what it is.
If and when I get to stop interacting with people who follow DST (ie paycheck writers) I will convert to NHFT, if you go with EST all year, I may have to get a new timezone Central New Hampshire Free Time (C-NHFT), I don't know maybe +15mins depending on how I feel, or just to be contrarty.

well ... the current version is not perfectly correct for you or me ... so if I changed NHFT ... it would make sense for you to go with an actual sunbased one :)

Obeying any clock is conformism, I bet even sociopaths even indulge in it.

Quote from: sandm000 on March 27, 2009, 10:50 AM NHFT
Obeying any clock is conformism, I bet even sociopaths even indulge in it.

I would say anyone following a Shire Time clock are a little less conformist and more free :)

So ... I will change the time on my watch and this forum.