New Hampshire Underground

New Hampshire Underground => General Discussion => Topic started by: Dave Ridley on February 09, 2005, 04:21 PM NHFT

Title: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Dave Ridley on February 09, 2005, 04:21 PM NHFT
We're about to have a problem which is, as they say, the kind of problem you want to have...because only successful web forums have it.

Sooner or later as this site gets more popular it will, like all web forums, start attracting a lot of trolls, i.e. people who are here to destroy the environment of our little web community.  Some will make personal attacks or start flame wars, others will resort to sexual references.  Still others will simply try to eat up your time with debate. They'd rather see you debating them than taking action for liberty.  The important thing is not to give them what they want. 

Every troll has a slightly different motivation but most of them want one or more of the folllowing:

1) Attention, hateful or otherwise.

2) To drive away people from the forum by making it a less friendly place

3) To force moderators to delete their posts so they can accuse someone of violating their free speech

The important thing is generally to not give them what they want.   Don't respond to them, don't leave the forum because of them and (in the case of moderators) don't delete their posts unless it's really necessary and deletion appears to be supported by the other participants.

Take trolls for what they are:  A sign of success and a test of your will.  Pass the test by sticking with us and giving the bad guys no aid and comfort. 
 






 
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: intergraph19 on February 11, 2005, 05:28 PM NHFT
I wish people would stop useing the "free speech" scream so incorrectly.  Only the government is forbidden from violating that. 

I personally like a fair amount of debate.  Lack of new ideas and discussion can quickly stagnate a group.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on February 18, 2005, 07:13 AM NHFT
OK, I am a "troll" because I am a NH resident paying attention to libertarians/cooks/republicans/rinos.

I like cooks....mmmmm!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 18, 2005, 08:12 AM NHFT
And you all plan to rag all over NH residents that don't kiss your ass? Again, good luck with that.
My plan is to work with the good NH residents and crush all opposition....I don't need anyone to kiss my butt to be successful. :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 18, 2005, 08:14 AM NHFT
OK, I am a "troll" because I am a NH resident paying attention to libertarians/cooks/republicans/rinos.
So now you are calling more than half the NH population cooks?
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Rodinia on February 18, 2005, 09:30 AM NHFT
I am a cook but I prefer to be called a chef. Anyone can slap a grilled cheese sandwich together but how many can make a  " Fire grilled ciabatta with asiago, sundried tomatoes and basil aioli" ?  >:D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 18, 2005, 09:51 AM NHFT
Man our "cooks" are feeding the trolls 8)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: AlanM on February 18, 2005, 09:56 AM NHFT
Maybe give them a few recipes and they can feed themselves. Of course their correctness masters would be out of a job.  :-\
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 18, 2005, 09:59 AM NHFT
For example, mikey lorrey was a registered republican just last year. Now he has a position in the NHLP. That is the type of republican I mean. You know, the transhumanist type that wants to clone themselves. Not really the typical republican.
So you actually have a problem with a small part of the NH population.....me too. :) I have a problem with the small groups that want to tell the rest of us what to do.
If Mikey Lorrey wants to clone himself...I don't mind. As long as he isn't hurting anyone...he can do what he wants. :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: davemincin on February 18, 2005, 10:26 AM NHFT
I'm going to have to pass on the cloning, thinking one of me is quite enough,
however should you ever get this plan rolling, I know several lovely ladies that!
 ;D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: AlanM on February 18, 2005, 10:34 AM NHFT
I'm going to have to pass on the cloning, thinking one of me is quite enough,
however should you ever get this plan rolling, I know several lovely ladies that!
 ;D

But Dave, with two of you we could have "la" in stereo.  ;D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on February 18, 2005, 11:30 AM NHFT
I am a cook but I prefer to be called a chef. Anyone can slap a grilled cheese sandwich together but how many can make a? " Fire grilled ciabatta with asiago, sundried tomatoes and basil aioli" ?? >:D

Can't even pronounce it!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on February 18, 2005, 01:07 PM NHFT
I am a cook but I prefer to be called a chef. Anyone can slap a grilled cheese sandwich together but how many can make a  " Fire grilled ciabatta with asiago, sundried tomatoes and basil aioli" ?  >:D

Mmmm....When's the party at Rodinia's? ;)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: John on February 18, 2005, 02:32 PM NHFT
Man our "cooks" are feeding the trolls 8)

I was thinking the same thing!
Dada will be very disappointed.



Maybe this was just bait?

Are you sure you're not the one from that other forum? . . . couldn't be.
Maybe you're his little brother or sister?
Maybe you wish you were his clone?   :o
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Margot Keyes on March 01, 2005, 03:59 PM NHFT
 :(Boy if only all these people wasting time crabbing  would get busy doing something ACTIVE instead of crabbing and complaining.

Well, we who communicate with them are probably just as guilty, feeding into their lack of self-esteem by giving them the attention they want. Oh well. Back to my kiddos...

Think happy thoughts people; no one is here in NH to take over anything or BE taken over by anything. If that is what native think we are about, then come on out Saturday to my house and see the truth. Good people working with more good people here or moved here from elsewhere against heavy legislation and taxation, not their own neighbors.

Happy Day,
Margot
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Scott Roth on March 02, 2005, 04:58 PM NHFT
I've lived here for 30 years and Lori is a native.  I can say matter-of-factly that we are GLAD to have you here! 8)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: AlanM on March 02, 2005, 10:46 PM NHFT
I am a native as well, and believe me the natives are restless for LIBERTY.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: John on March 03, 2005, 10:03 AM NHFT
Here boy.
Here's some nice feed for ya.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 04, 2005, 08:24 AM NHFT
Boy I thought I was here to "take over"... didn't we have that planned for this summer?
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: GT on March 04, 2005, 08:45 AM NHFT
Complaining that people are not who they appear to be. That's odd....

For <freedumb@yahoo.com>, Site yahoo.com (64.156.215.7) said data: 554 delivery error: dd This user doesn't have a yahoo.com account (freedumb@yahoo.com) [-5] - mta260.mail.scd.yahoo.com

Just in case your spelling was incorrect I tried this one to

For <freedumbinnh@yahoo.com>, Site yahoo.com (67.28.114.36) said data: 554 delivery error: dd This user doesn't have a yahoo.com account (freedumbinnh@yahoo.com)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: CNHT on March 04, 2005, 08:48 AM NHFT
Oh, Mr.Ridley. You are so smart when it comes to "trolls". OK, I am a "troll" because I am a NH resident paying attention to libertarians/cooks/republicans/rinos.

And what may I ask, do you have against 'cooks'?

ROTFLMAO!!

Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 04, 2005, 09:31 AM NHFT
I know I think I am everything in that list...except a "cook"...depending on who you ask 8)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on March 04, 2005, 09:33 AM NHFT
You really get around  :o

I'd never call you a cook, though.  :P
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on March 04, 2005, 12:46 PM NHFT
You're a smart pooch!  Man's best friend.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on June 22, 2005, 10:21 PM NHFT
With the recent rise in troll activity, I'd like to remind people to please not respond to them.   I'd hate to see the underground forum decend to pointless debate with folks who just want to cause trouble.   Plus, it's so hard to catch up on days worth of posts when there's all that junk!  :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 21, 2005, 08:39 AM NHFT
But some trolls are fun.? Aren't they? ::)
Oh no Scott has become a troll :o ;)

So .... how have you been?
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: president on August 04, 2005, 12:31 PM NHFT
What's for lunch?
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on August 04, 2005, 04:32 PM NHFT
When I saw that you posted in this area today, I thought, "What does President eat?":)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: John on August 12, 2005, 02:41 AM NHFT
What's for lunch?



I'm having fisher cat.   :o
Dude, how about you? 
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on August 12, 2005, 02:43 AM NHFT
Ew.  That doesn't sound too appetizing.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: John on August 12, 2005, 03:24 AM NHFT
It isn't.  But, fishercats are the porcupines only natual enemy, so something has to be done . . .
 >:D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: president on August 12, 2005, 09:45 PM NHFT
It isn't.  But, fishercats are the porcupines only natual enemy, so something has to be done . . .
 >:D
  :D

The fisher (Martes pennanti) is a premier example of a generalized predator - one that eats any animal it is able to catch and overpower with its speed, agility, and strength. Perhaps the most impressive display of the fisher's prowess as a hunter is its ability to regularly kill porcupines, something that few other animals are able to do.

The fisher is uniquely adapted to preying on the porcupine. When a fisher catches a porcupine out in the open, away from the safety of a tree or its den, it begins a circling attack. Fishers are the same height as porcupines and can fight face to face. As the porcupine tries to waddle to safety, the fisher heads it off, darting in to claw at the unprotected face with unsheathed claws. Quickness, agility and effective biting help the fisher to avoid a porcupine's back and tail and concentrate on rapidly striking the unprotected face. After about half an hour, the porcupine collapses, and the fisher settles down to a nutritious meal.

A Fisher will begin eating somewhere on the unprotected belly. The heart, liver and lungs are eaten first and then the rest being eaten from the inside out. It can then enter a semi-hibernation state of up to 3 weeks as a porcupine meal is very healthy.

The porcupine has some interesting ways of defending itself from attacks by the fisher. It hides its head from the fisher by sticking it into a hole in the ground. This protects its face from attack and sets up a wall of quills, which the fisher cannot attack. When hiding in a tree den or under a rocky crevice, the porcupine is safe from attack.

The porcupine also defends itself by climbing trees and positioning itself so that its quills are facing the fisher. This seldom works because the fisher is a terrific tree climber. It has specially designed claws and feet that make it an expert in tree climbing. It can climb down a tree with its face pointing downward and attack the porcupine from above.



Porcupines are rodents. The third largest rodent.

Early settlers found the porcupine good to eat.

The porcupine is a pest - it kills trees by eating the bark. Logging companies do not like porcupines because they eat the bark of trees and this can kill trees. In some forests, fishers have been reintroduced to try to control porcupine populations. This biological control method has been successful at least for short-term population reductions; it is currently unknown how well it works for long-term porcupine population control.

Porcupines are very short-sighted. This animal has poor eyesight and moves slowly. They are often killed as they cross highways. Cars and trucks kill more porcupines than all other enemies put together.

One of the stranger aspects of the male porcupines courting strategy begins with a love dance done while waddling on his back legs. For his grand finale, the male anoints his intended mate in a shower of urine. Witnesses to this bizarre ritual claim that powerful bursts may travel over six feet! If the female is sexually receptive, being sprayed with urine acts as a stimulant. If not, she will simply walk away.

The porcupine is the perfect mascot for the FSP.  8)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: SethCohn on August 12, 2005, 11:41 PM NHFT
One of the stranger aspects of the male porcupines courting strategy begins with a love dance done while waddling on his back legs. For his grand finale, the male anoints his intended mate in a shower of urine. Witnesses to this bizarre ritual claim that powerful bursts may travel over six feet! If the female is sexually receptive, being sprayed with urine acts as a stimulant. If not, she will simply walk away.

You'll find the same is true of Fisher's mom.  When she's sprayed with urine when she's horny., she gets more excited too.  Nothing like our porcupine courting, is there?

Oops, not supposed to feed them, right?
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: AlanM on August 12, 2005, 11:53 PM NHFT
Troll alert! Troll activity is picking up. Secure your feed bags!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: John on August 13, 2005, 01:05 AM NHFT
Thanks for the "refresher" info president . . .  ;D
I recall that your info is OK.  Agree or disagree your info seems to be spot on - although (as far as I know) the re introduction of fishers has not happened in NH.   :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: John on August 13, 2005, 01:49 AM NHFT
One of the stranger aspects of the male porcupines courting strategy begins with a love dance done while waddling on his back legs. For his grand finale, the male anoints his intended mate in a shower of urine. Witnesses to this bizarre ritual claim that powerful bursts may travel over six feet! If the female is sexually receptive, being sprayed with urine acts as a stimulant. If not, she will simply walk away.

You'll find the same is true of Fisher's mom.? When she's sprayed with urine when she's horny., she gets more excited too.? Nothing like our porcupine courting, is there?

Oops, not supposed to feed them, right?






Dude, take it easy!  Don't attack the guy's mother!  Our "friend" has not done anything here to deserve that sort of abuse.

Seth, you are better than that.  I hope all of my friends are.
It seems to me that "president" has some legitiment issues with individuals who have conducted themselves badly in NH . . . The "issues" may have more to do with how ideas are presented than the issues themselves . . .

Regardless, "president" is concerned enough to stay tuned.  As far as I know, president/fisher has never been personaly abusive of any of us . . .

If we have "issues" let's address them.

My daughter is not "one of us" but, she was able to spend time at the PorcFest without any abuse.  We should treat everyone as well.   8)

Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on August 13, 2005, 06:32 AM NHFT
I hear that fishers (who are weasels, no?  :) ) hunt cats, too!  :o  :o
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: president on August 13, 2005, 09:00 AM NHFT
Seth, you are better than that.
No, he's not. If he was he wouldn't do it. It's not the first time.
Hopefully, some day, Seth will grow as a person.

I hear that fishers (who are weasels, no?? :) ) hunt cats, too!? :o? :o

The fisher is a large member of the Mustelidae (weasel) family.

http://www.nhfishandwildlife.com/weasels.htm
Quote
FISHER, often nicknamed "fishercats" in New Hampshire, are one of the most common land predators in the state -- and one of the least well understood. Fisher are a mammal of great mystique here; probably more folklore abounds for this species than any other in the state.

...

"Fishercats" are blamed for dozens of missing cats each year. Do they eat cats? Sure, as do foxes, coyotes, owls and -- more likely -- a local SUV. It is the nature of a housecat injured on a highway to seek a hiding place to die, but you can bet a "fishercat" will be blamed for its disappearance. In 1979 and 1980, Fish and Game collected more than 1,000 fisher and checked their stomach contents to determine what they had been feeding on. Cat hair was found in exactly...one! Housecats are not part of their regular diet, but, like the other predators, fishers are opportunists.

Agree or disagree your info seems to be spot on - although (as far as I know) the re introduction of fishers has not happened in NH.? ?:)

I don't think the fisher has ever needed to be re-introduced to NH. Fisher from NH have be used to re-establish the populations in other states.

http://www.nhfishandwildlife.com/weasels.htm
Quote
Fisher live-trapped in New Hampshire have been translocated to three other states to help re-establish populations. In 1975, 25 were transferred to West Virginia in exchange for 25 wild turkeys. In the early 1980s, about 30 were transferred to Connecticut; and in the mid 1990s, 175 were shipped to Pennsylvania to re-establish an extirpated population there.


Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on August 13, 2005, 11:58 AM NHFT
Whew, that's a relief.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on August 13, 2005, 12:14 PM NHFT
even trolls need to eat
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat McCotter on August 13, 2005, 12:49 PM NHFT
Fearing rabies, Londonderry police shoot two animals
http://www.unionleader.com/Articles_show.html?article=58855&archive=1

By RUSS CHOMA
Union Leader Correspondent
 
 

LONDONDERRY ? Two animals showing signs of rabies were shot and killed over the weekend, including a fisher cat.

The first call came Saturday around 10 a.m. to 14 Mill Road. Londonderry police Officer Mark Morrison said when he approached the fisher, it "had a noticeable sway from side to side." After the animal attacked a broom stick, Morrison shot it four times, then disposed of the body in a plastic garbage bag at the police station.

"The animal was clearly sick and displayed signs of rabies," Morrison said in his report.

Londonderry police Capt. William Hart said that if the suspicious animal hasn't had contact with a person or pets, his department does not typically send them for testing.

The second call involved a skunk and came Sunday around 6:30 p.m. from 59 Pillsbury Road.

Joyce Rosenberg, who lives at the address, said her husband and sons were in their back yard when they spotted a skunk.

"They were out in the yard playing, and all of a sudden they saw the skunk and he kept walking around our pool," Rosenberg said. "And he kept falling over and he had flies around him."

Her husband called the police, who killed the animal and took it away, Rosenberg said.

Dennis Slate, national rabies management coordinator for the U.S. Department of Agriculture, who is based in Concord, said raccoon rabies is endemic to the southern two-thirds of New Hampshire. Fishers, a member of the weasel family, are not considered a big source of rabies, he said.

"Fisher densities are generally quite low, so the fisher is not considered a reservoir (for rabies,)" Slate said.

Rob Calvert, a wildlife biologist with New Hampshire Fish and Game, agreed that fishers are not usually known for carrying rabies.

"A fisher will occasionally attack a raccoon for food, typically when food supplies are scarce," Calvert said. "But their interaction is not usually one that puts them in close proximity to other animals."

Calvert said raccoons, skunks and woodchucks are the most common carriers of rabies, though bats and foxes are also known to have their own strains.

Slate said that according to numbers given to him by the state's public health office, until May 31 there were only three confirmed reports of rabid animals in the state ? one in Goffstown and two in Piermont.

Slate said it is possible the fisher in Londonderry had rabies, but it is impossible to determine without testing, which he said is rather expensive.

"You cannot tell rabies by the clinical signs alone ? only in the laboratory, by testing," Slate said.

Rabies is a virus that infects warm-blooded mammals and can cause them to act disoriented or aggressive. One of the most common symptoms is weaving or circling. Animals may also act unusually calm or withdrawn.

Slate said animals can exhibit similar symptoms if they are infected with canine distemper or have ingested toxins such as anti-freeze.

Calvert warned anyone who spots an animal that may be sick to be cautious. Larger animals may seem more dangerous than a small, sickly looking rodent, he said, but it's not always the case.

"A lot of people are concerned about seeing a bear. I'm concerned about the raccoon that wanders through the urban environment," he said. "People, and kids in particular, need to avoid that kind of animal."

Any animal that seems overly friendly or out in the open should be treated with suspicion, Calvert said.

"Animals that are approachable are probably not healthy animals," he said.

He also warned homeowners against feeding wildlife.

"The more you congregate wildlife like that, the more chance a disease springs out of that," he said.


Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: YeahItsMeJP on September 01, 2005, 04:24 PM NHFT
For those interested in more trolls to ignore, I believe BarryD just asked to be ignored....

JP
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: John on September 04, 2005, 05:14 AM NHFT
Barry Who?  Never heard of him . . .  ;)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Dreepa on October 03, 2005, 08:43 AM NHFT
Maybe we should all think about this again.

Greenbacks is turning this into a debate (yawn) better left on the FSP forum.

Let the threads >:D die.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: rima on October 05, 2005, 08:25 PM NHFT
Hello,

I am a newly registered member.  I am NOT a troll, but I do like to debate and weigh value per value in rational and polite discussion.  I don't know what "Karma" means or what the accompanying number signifies.  Can you advise me, please?  ???

My prime (libertarian) interests are advocating for home schooling and charter schools, and protesting against the recent Supreme Court "Eminent Domain" decision  re: Kelo.  I would have joined in the Souter-House protest if I had known about it at the time.

Thanks, from Rima (Hillsborough county NH resident)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: KBCraig on October 05, 2005, 08:38 PM NHFT
Hello,

I am a newly registered member.  I am NOT a troll, but I do like to debate and weigh value per value in rational and polite discussion.  I don't know what "Karma" means or what the accompanying number signifies.  Can you advise me, please?  ???

Welcome, Rima!

The "Karma" is mostly just a fun/silly/useless way of seeing who's contributed positively to the forum, and who's been negative. You can applaud or smite other users, which will increment their karma up or down by one.

Most of us don't pay too much attention to it unless someone mentions it. And now that you mention it, I see mine has gotten quite a boost, but I don't what I said to earn it.


Quote
My prime (libertarian) interests are advocating for home schooling and charter schools, and protesting against the recent Supreme Court "Eminent Domain" decision  re: Kelo.  I would have joined in the Souter-House protest if I had known about it at the time.

Those are pretty lively topics here. Join right in!

Kevin
-- still stuck in Texas, but heading for NH someday!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: rima on October 07, 2005, 04:01 PM NHFT
Thanks for the welcome.  I won't worry about my "Karma" factor then. 

If I rant against Souter, will I be deemed a "troll"?   Souter has property less remote than his "homestead" in Weare.  The property is near the VT border near Lebonon - is there a Plainfield or something like that up there?

from Rima
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: BillG on October 07, 2005, 04:10 PM NHFT
Thanks for the welcome.? I won't worry about my "Karma" factor then.?

If I rant against Souter, will I be deemed a "troll"?? ?Souter has property less remote than his "homestead" in Weare.? The property is near the VT border near Lebonon - is there a Plainfield or something like that up there?

from Rima


I believe that is Justice Breyer
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on October 07, 2005, 04:37 PM NHFT
If I rant against Souter, will I be deemed a "troll"?   

No.  Rant away.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on October 07, 2005, 05:57 PM NHFT
Just don't rant about 'Economic Rent' ;D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on October 07, 2005, 06:39 PM NHFT
Don't even say, "Economic rent!"   >:(
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Dreepa on October 07, 2005, 07:57 PM NHFT
'Economic Rant'
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Ron Helwig on October 08, 2005, 12:19 PM NHFT
Don't even say, "Economic rent!"   >:(

At least not without explaining what you mean.  :D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: BillG on October 10, 2005, 12:19 PM NHFT
Don't even say, "Economic rent!"   >:(

At least not without explaining what you mean.  :D

they obviously don't know what they mean...
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on October 10, 2005, 12:52 PM NHFT
I obviously don't give a crap and don't want to know.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: CNHT on October 12, 2005, 12:42 AM NHFT
Thanks for the welcome.? I won't worry about my "Karma" factor then.?

If I rant against Souter, will I be deemed a "troll"?? ?Souter has property less remote than his "homestead" in Weare.? The property is near the VT border near Lebonon - is there a Plainfield or something like that up there?

from Rima


Justice Breyer lives in Plainfield and is about to have his home repossessed as well.  >:D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: d_goddard on October 13, 2005, 10:28 AM NHFT
I'd like to kill several birds with one stone here. *

In this, my first post(!) ever to NHUnderground, I will demonstrate what could be interpreted as a "Troll",
for the benefit of Rima (welcome aboard, Rima!) though it may quite likely come at cost to my own Karma.

Here we go:

Kevin
-- still stuck in Texas, but heading for NH someday!
<TROLL severity="low">
Kevin, when exactly is "someday"? What's it going to take to get you out here ASAP?
What are you afraid of, cold winters? Trust me, you'll learn to love January in NH.
C'mon, man, make an action plan, with definite milestones ("find job", "find place to live") and start checking 'em off... we'll help, give us details!
</TROLL>

Note that this sort of a "low-severity Troll", as it is intended to create a positive result rather than
a destructive or defamatory one. Nonetheless, it is possible to interpret this in a kind of clubby,
holier-than-thou fashion, despite that emphatically not being the intent.

Also note that if this were a proper Troll, it would not include a sincere offer of help.
I could not resist adding that, however, as I really do want more folks like Kevin out here!

By the way: sooner or later, everyone posts something that is stupid, Trollish, insensitive, mis-spelled,
or (even worse) gramatically incorrect. Try as best you can not to; learn from your mistake when you do.

-Denis


* - Just a figure of speech! In Real Life, I'm a nutcake vegetarian animal-lover that volunteered here (http://www.wcsv.org/) when I lived in CA
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on October 13, 2005, 10:33 AM NHFT
Welcome, Denis :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: d_goddard on October 13, 2005, 10:37 AM NHFT
If I rant against Souter, will I be deemed a "troll"?

As far as I'm concerned, if you rant against Souter, I don't care if you intentionally tattoo "Fully-Grown Mountain Troll" on your forehead; you're on the right side of history, my friend!
Now, turn those idle Rants into real Actions. Put your rant into an opinon letter and mail it to your local newspaper. Call a talk radio station and discuss your opinion with the host. Do it Right Now, yes, today!

-Denis
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: KBCraig on October 13, 2005, 10:58 AM NHFT
I'd like to kill several birds with one stone here. *

In this, my first post(!) ever to NHUnderground, I will demonstrate what could be interpreted as a "Troll",
for the benefit of Rima (welcome aboard, Rima!) though it may quite likely come at cost to my own Karma.

Here we go:

Kevin
-- still stuck in Texas, but heading for NH someday!
<TROLL severity="low">
Kevin, when exactly is "someday"? What's it going to take to get you out here ASAP?
What are you afraid of, cold winters? Trust me, you'll learn to love January in NH.
C'mon, man, make an action plan, with definite milestones ("find job", "find place to live") and start checking 'em off... we'll help, give us details!
</TROLL>

Naw, that's not a troll. Real trolls study the audience carefully to learn their hot buttons. For instance, a real troll would know that I've got a job, got a plan, got a timeline. :)

But welcome aboard, and thanks for wanting "folks like me" to be in NH as  soon as possible. :)

Kevin
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Rhiannon McKinnon on October 13, 2005, 10:59 AM NHFT
The trolls finally got to be a bit much on the other forum....we've put off registering on this one since we're not quite in NH yet, but the attitude here towards action vs. endless (and often meaningless) debating and personal attacks has finally proved too much to resist....hopefully we'll get to visit some of you guys when we come up for our first round of house-hunting in the spring!

Rhiannon McKinnon
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: JonM on October 13, 2005, 11:12 AM NHFT
I haven't seen TOO much trolling over there since Green went away . . .  or activity for that matter.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: BillG on October 13, 2005, 11:15 AM NHFT
I haven't seen TOO much trolling over there since Green went away . . .  or activity for that matter.

nor from me here...
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on October 13, 2005, 11:24 AM NHFT
Welcome Rhiannon!  If you come by Keene in the spring, we can give you a little tour :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on October 13, 2005, 12:30 PM NHFT
....hopefully we'll get to visit some of you guys when we come up for our first round of house-hunting in the spring!

Rhiannon McKinnon

Let the Keene-Dover ... Russell-DaveMincin tug-o-war begin. :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on October 13, 2005, 02:08 PM NHFT
Keene just had their 100 year storm, so, thats over with.  Dover hasn't had theirs, plus, you know,  when the ocean rises due to global warming and all,   Dover will be under water!

Keene wins!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Ron Helwig on October 13, 2005, 04:35 PM NHFT
Just a figure of speech! In Real Life, I'm a nutcake vegetarian animal-lover that volunteered here (http://www.wcsv.org/) when I lived in CA

Always glad to have another vegetarian here. Gets kinda lonesome sometimes  :)

(Never really been hassled by libertarian types about my choice. A little light-hearted ribbing ocassionally, but for the most part freedom lovers are a tolerant bunch)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Michael Fisher on October 13, 2005, 04:48 PM NHFT
Welcome, Denis and Rhiannon!  :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on October 14, 2005, 01:49 PM NHFT
Yes, Welcome!
Rhiannon

Welsh, right?

I once met a Rhonwen and  an Arianwen on the same day. Of course they were mother and daughter!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: president on October 14, 2005, 02:01 PM NHFT
Always glad to have another vegetarian here. Gets kinda lonesome sometimes  :)

(Never really been hassled by libertarian types about my choice. A little light-hearted ribbing ocassionally, but for the most part freedom lovers are a tolerant bunch)
I'm vegan. Are you glad to have me here?


http://www.lewrockwell.com/cuthbert/cuthbert11.html
Quote
Confessions of a Vegan Libertarian

by Cathy Cuthbert 

I lead a double life.

By day, I shop for organic produce in local health food stores and farmers? markets. I talk with people about what?s in season, new vegan recipes, the next fermented food craze, and how to displaced cooked, junk foods ? excuse the redundancy ? in our families? diets. I meet many people who are trying to reverse the hardship and disease that our modern food and medical industries have wrought. These are thoughtful people, open minded and willing to make huge changes in their lives. They are taking responsibility for their own health.

By night, I socialize with freedom lovers. I feel a true sense of relief that I can comment against taxes, inflation, government schools, in fact all manner of regulation and coercion. These people agree with me and show admiration for my choices in life. They are a fellowship of honest, moral and wise people. Libertarianism is a club in which I am proud to have membership.

Now, here?s the rub. I cannot without derision expose myself as a vegan to libertarians. Similarly, I cannot reveal my libertarian politics to vegans and escape with my life. What?s a vegan libertarian to do?

Whenever I go to a vegan potluck, I?m forced to listen to stories of greedy capitalists committing horrors that only tougher government regulation can dispel. I have to keep my mouth full of kale and carrots for fear that a libertarian sentiment may escape my lips. Only my favorite soup ? an amazingly flavorful tomato avocado chowder that I invented myself, email for recipe ? prevented the murder of Terry when she said, "I like paying taxes. The more I pay, the more money I get back." And mango lime pie was all that stood in the way of Vivian?s demise the day she patiently explained to me that licensing is essential for keeping the riff raff out. "Not just anyone can sell insurance?" Would that celery up the nose could have done her in.

The frustration is different although equally acute with my libertarian friends. When they comment on my habit of eating salad for dinner, I hide behind the excuse of having to watch my weight, adding, "Wow, that steak looks great." I suffer in silence as they hoot and laugh at the crazy "granola crunchers" who are so stupid to think that organic matters. And I?m itching to break it to them that wisecracks about coffee enemas do not demonstrate even the slightest comedic genius. If only I had the courage to wear my "Thomas Jefferson was a vegetarian" sweatshirt ? but alas, I don?t.

I?ve been living a lie.

I know one thing I absolutely can?t do, and that is approach vegans for understanding. To confess my libertarianism would be tantamount to proclaiming myself the devil incarnate. I would no doubt be subjected to emotional, ad hominem, socialist tirades from which it would be impossible to recover a cordial relationship. I would be pilloried with invectives such as "capitalist" and sneered at for having no heart.

Yet, I can no longer live this life of dishonesty, not 24/7 anyway. Mainly because libertarians eschew the initiation of force, I?ve chosen to come out of the closet to the libertarian brotherhood and throw myself on your mercy.

I am a vegan. I am, in fact, the worst kind of vegan, the raw food kind. That?s right, not only do I eat exclusively fruits and vegetables, I refuse to cook ?em, too.

On this very website, Brad Edmonds recently said, "[Y]ou tend to find more paleolibertarians among carnivores than among vegans." Is the converse true as well? Are there more carnivores than vegans among paleolibertarians? Or are there many vegan libertarians hiding their orientation as I do, constantly in fear of being outed and branded quasi-antivivisectionist Marxists? (Or is that neo-antivivisectionists?)

I make my confession with the intention of slaying my own personal demons, yes. But I have a higher purpose, as well. I aim to free my fellow oppressed vegan libertarians and bring unity to the movement. My sacrifice can mark the beginning of a new era of peace and understanding among carnivore and vegan libertarians. We have more in common than you may think. The forces of fascism are destroying both the food and medical industries. Surely, there can be agreement on that. And I have yet to meet a hawkish vegan, so if we discount the fringe pro-war Objectivists ? please ? here is more common ground.

Libertarians of the world unite. Let us drop the snide comments across the dinner table and pursue the struggle against our true enemy; call a culinary truce so that we may defend our homes and refrigerators. Let us shop, eat and fight for freedom in dietary harmony.

And please, pass the kelp?

October 19, 2004

Cathy Cuthbert is a wife and homeschooling mother, who does not cook fruit and vegetables somewhere on the Central Coast of ? where else? ? California. She is the editor of the email newsletter of the Alliance for the Separation of School and State, The School Liberator.

Copyright ? 2004 Cathy Cuthbert

Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: d_goddard on October 14, 2005, 02:40 PM NHFT
I'm vegan. Are you glad to have me here?

No! You damn extremists!!!

-Denis

P.S. We've got to consider our common enemy: the Judean People's Front (http://www.mwscomp.com/movies/brian/brian-07.htm)!

Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on October 14, 2005, 03:20 PM NHFT
Why would being a vegan be a problem?

Now the real problem is the Peoples Liberation Front of Judea or was that the nhla? ;)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: d_goddard on October 14, 2005, 05:44 PM NHFT
Why would being a vegan be a problem?

It isn't, I was attempting humor. Doesn't always translate well to ASCII text.

Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Rhiannon McKinnon on October 15, 2005, 12:49 AM NHFT
Thanks for the greetings!

"If you come by Keene in the spring, we can give you a little tour"

TYVM....we'll certainly be taking you up on that, as Keene is one of the areas we're considering, our female half likes what we've heard about the place so far.....

"Let the Keene-Dover ... Russell-DaveMincin tug-o-war begin."

Yes, we're also considering other areas, too.....seacoast, Manchester, possibly Concord or the lakes area.....it's all going to be a compromise between finding a suitable property and location for our businesses, being close to "civilization" and "culture" (I know, I know, many of you are trying to get away from that), finding a good radio location, and making the numbers add up....

"Welsh, right?"

Yes, after the Goddess.....but of course, this is only a screen name.....

Looking forward to working with you guys in the future!

Yours Truly,
Rhiannon McKinnon
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Ron Helwig on October 15, 2005, 09:53 AM NHFT
I'm vegan. Are you glad to have me here?
Whether or not I'm glad to have you here has nothing to do with being a vegan  :)

Quote
Now, here?s the rub. I cannot without derision expose myself as a vegan to libertarians. Similarly, I cannot reveal my libertarian politics to vegans and escape with my life. What?s a vegan libertarian to do?
ummm, maybe Cathy should try it?  :D

I've been very open about both to both groups, and haven't had any problems.

I was in a vegetarian singles group in the mid 90s, and they all saw me buying "Atlas Shrugged" and we often discussed the ZAP. Sure there was also lots of talk about "greedy capitalists" and such, but I always saw that as an opportunity. Later, from about 2002 until I made the move, I was part of the vegetarian meetup crowd in the Twin Cities. At the first meetup I attended there were 4 of us: me, a libertarian who had just moved from Arizona, a small-"L" libertarian, and one other person. Don't dismiss all vegetarians as hopeless socialists - they're hearts are in the right place (non-violence generally), most just need to think things through. Most haven't heard of ZAP.

As far as libertarians go, to this day I have not met one that was angry at me for not touching their food.  :D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on October 15, 2005, 09:59 AM NHFT
Can't see how it's anyone's business but your own, what you choose to eat.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on October 15, 2005, 10:33 AM NHFT
Amen......er....Ditto!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on October 16, 2005, 03:11 PM NHFT
It's a bad sign when the forum admin starts trolling.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat K on October 16, 2005, 08:57 PM NHFT
I really wanna try some Moose Meat.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: AlanM on October 16, 2005, 08:58 PM NHFT
I really wanna try some Moose Meat.

Good stuff. Nothing like mouse meat. Or chicken.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on October 16, 2005, 09:01 PM NHFT
Watch out Mickey!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat K on October 16, 2005, 09:05 PM NHFT
Minnie always says to Mickey= Hey your mouse meat is sticking out, I guess your happy to see me.  :o
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: AlanM on October 16, 2005, 09:08 PM NHFT
Oops! What have I unleashed?  ???
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat K on October 16, 2005, 10:49 PM NHFT
I'D starve myself as penence but it would take to long.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on January 03, 2006, 10:47 AM NHFT
The best technique seems to be having your forum trolls fight one another.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on January 03, 2006, 11:01 AM NHFT
 ;D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: president on January 03, 2006, 11:05 AM NHFT
The best technique seems to be having your forum trolls fight one another.
Nah, the best technique is to turn the place into http://forumNazis.com  ;)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on January 03, 2006, 06:02 PM NHFT
I couldn't help it ..... I had to read the message.

I am already registered at forumnazis.com ! :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Eli on January 25, 2006, 04:50 PM NHFT
Wow scott! Your sig is getting downright huge.  That being said; illwillpress is hilarious.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Eli on February 06, 2006, 09:54 AM NHFT
Absolutely!  Foamy Rulz!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat McCotter on February 19, 2006, 02:18 PM NHFT
Yep. You might want to run for office one day. All those posts the prez saves will come back to haunt you. >:D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: amybrat on February 20, 2006, 02:23 AM NHFT
 
 this is sound advise for anyone who trying to achieve change through a public internet.
we are all here to discuss how to effictivly bring about the renewal of our baisic constitutional rights. the fsp in new hamshire has sprung it's shoots through the ability to form a coehisive group of citizens who dare to charish freedom more than anything.
  as we take our stands in our choosen communities, it is important to choose our fights wisely. by doing this we can effect the areas which oppress us the most.
  when we speak, we must have our foundation prepared ahead of time, so that when we set forth our argument it can not be dispelled or ignored.
  with so much other things to learn, can anyone of us afford to allow ourselves to be distracted by those who would wish to not allow us to use our time effectively when able to talk together?
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Dreepa on March 31, 2006, 02:41 PM NHFT
Bump.

We all need to be reminded of the title of this thread.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on March 31, 2006, 02:44 PM NHFT
/nod
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: KBCraig on March 31, 2006, 05:32 PM NHFT
What troll?  ;D

"ignore"-ance is bliss.  ;D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Tunga on March 31, 2006, 09:31 PM NHFT
I still love you Kevin. I won't won't let you go. Can't you see? Oh why oh why can't you just HEAR me out! Please, I beg you. Come back to me! I won't even mention flags or ESP or ask you questions you just can't answer.
 
 :-*
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: KBCraig on March 31, 2006, 09:40 PM NHFT
Tunga, don't flatter yourself. I wasn't speaking of you. You're not a troll. Or, if you are, you're not a very good one. You're a nutjob, but I don't think you're a troll.

I only have one person on ignore.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: d_goddard on May 04, 2006, 01:41 PM NHFT
I only have one person on ignore.
I have never put anyone on ignore, nor will I.
I can be amused by almost anyone, most especially when I choose to ignore them myself (and not rely on a web filter to do so)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: KBCraig on May 04, 2006, 04:42 PM NHFT
I only have one person on ignore.
I have never put anyone on ignore, nor will I.
I can be amused by almost anyone, most especially when I choose to ignore them myself (and not rely on a web filter to do so)

I tend to read the forum by reading the posts before seeing who wrote them. I put one person on ignore for my own sanity, because I would start reading, and by the time I saw who it was from, my blood pressure was already up.

Kevin
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: CNHT on May 04, 2006, 04:49 PM NHFT
I tend to read the forum by reading the posts before seeing who wrote them. I put one person on ignore for my own sanity, because I would start reading, and by the time I saw who it was from, my blood pressure was already up.

If I feel they are anti-liberty and enabling the NWO and such by suggesting collectivism and such, I don't read it because I feel that they are just undermining the movement and I don't need to hear wha they have to say. I just know I need to count them out.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: ravelkinbow on May 17, 2006, 01:34 AM NHFT
keep your friends close but your enemies even closer  >:D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: John on May 17, 2006, 07:35 AM NHFT
Ignore what? . . . Oops now I'm back on this tread . . .
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: TEBON on December 16, 2006, 10:45 PM NHFT
I don't mean to sound like a dink or anything, I'm sure some of you will think I am. . .and that's quite fine with me.

I agree, crabbing and the like doesn't really do anything.  But when I joined this, and FSP a month or so ago. . . my contact didn't really have anything that I could do myself.  There are no meetings, there isn't much discussion.  I don't know what else I can do to get people to understand how to truly live free, especially when I'm still a friggin MA resident.

I've been looking for direction, I've been looking for ways to get people who think like me to get their butts into NH and make a living among those who aren't going to care what you do in the privacy of your home.  I found it, and then I got a message saying that I should patrol the forums, finding things to do that make a difference. 

Where are the ideas?  Throwing copies of the 9/11 report into Boston Harbor?  I just don't get it.  I'm not one for the protests, I'm rather one to give information. . . to those who think that life sucks where they live. . . they watn to own a gun, have a neighborhood without pedophiles, be able to smoke a bone, and want to not give money to a government that is just going to give that money to people that don't deserve it.  Any moron can see that other states have much corruption caused by the amount of money they take from their subjects.

Someone told me earlier this week that I wasn't being a "very good neighbor" to my state of Massachusetts.  When the people of Massachusetts decide to wake up and take back their rights given to them by state and Federal constitutions . then they'll get my respect.  Instead, I have a state that hates me because it's run by the blue and run by people from Cambridge and Hyannis.   

But what can someone like me do besides talk to people.  Let me know.


:(Boy if only all these people wasting time crabbing  would get busy doing something ACTIVE instead of crabbing and complaining.

Well, we who communicate with them are probably just as guilty, feeding into their lack of self-esteem by giving them the attention they want. Oh well. Back to my kiddos...

Think happy thoughts people; no one is here in NH to take over anything or BE taken over by anything. If that is what native think we are about, then come on out Saturday to my house and see the truth. Good people working with more good people here or moved here from elsewhere against heavy legislation and taxation, not their own neighbors.

Happy Day,
Margot

Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Dreepa on December 17, 2006, 12:13 AM NHFT
I don't mean to sound like a dink or anything, I'm sure some of you will think I am. . .and that's quite fine with me.
Doesn't sound like a dink.

There are lots of things you can do esp in MA.

Hand out FTL flyers at concerts.
Hand out FSP flyers at LP meeting, (or other freedom oriented events).
Write an LTE saying that because of issue X you are leaving MA and moving to NH because of the FSP  etc etc.
Hand out flyers at protests.

None of these things are protests but action.
If you want something more NH centric.... you can start reading the new bills that are going before the house.
NHLA is always looking for volunteers.
(you could join the NHLA)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Braddogg on December 17, 2006, 02:09 AM NHFT
I don't mean to sound like a dink or anything, I'm sure some of you will think I am. . .and that's quite fine with me.
None of these things are protests but action.
If you want something more NH centric.... you can start reading the new bills that are going before the house.
NHLA is always looking for volunteers.
(you could join the NHLA)

Yep.  I've got another year to spend in Boston.  I joined the NHLA and will be doing bill triage over the winter semester break.  I bought some NHLA and FSP shirts, and I talk about the FSP with my friends.  They're good conversation starters (enders?).
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: TEBON on December 17, 2006, 09:14 AM NHFT
Thanks for the info, I think I'll head over there and check it out. . .

as for the conversation starter (ender), with my friends, they know how bad MA is. . . but they are the "pot smoking" types. . . but we come to a head again. .  there is no unity.  You have one pro-marijuana group, who is liberal, and will go into talking about Bush and Iraq, you have the people that think kids should smoke weed by law by the time they're 3. . . you have the group that wants decriminalization, the group that wants legalization, and they all fight each other. . . . a little unity speaks more than 40 groups having a similar goal, but the small groups have that ability to piss off every stereotype every political party. . . I just get frustrated when I see so many groups doing the same thing. . .  usually me talking about Free State is a conversation ENDER. . . no matter how hard I try

I do appreciate these ideas, because I have that burning in my stomach that I'm not doing enough, and now I have some things that I can do.  But I'm pretty fed up with the people of my state. . . I'm giving up on them. . . it seems that most are a lost cause. . . and even if they seem interested. . . if I don't know them well enough it won't work. . . because they'll hear me say "no income or sales tax". . . and they'll come to NH. . . but then they'll want to be non-self sufficient and want their curbside pickup and to remove all guns from society (except for those that can get them illegally).

but thanks again all.

I don't mean to sound like a dink or anything, I'm sure some of you will think I am. . .and that's quite fine with me.
None of these things are protests but action.
If you want something more NH centric.... you can start reading the new bills that are going before the house.
NHLA is always looking for volunteers.
(you could join the NHLA)

Yep.  I've got another year to spend in Boston.  I joined the NHLA and will be doing bill triage over the winter semester break.  I bought some NHLA and FSP shirts, and I talk about the FSP with my friends.  They're good conversation starters (enders?).
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Dreepa on December 17, 2006, 10:42 AM NHFT
Tebon I hear that.
Sometimes I feel that the FSPers are like that.
Come on up to NH fast.
www.pledgebank.com/first1000
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Rosie the Riveter on December 23, 2006, 07:56 PM NHFT
Sometimes I wonder if I am crazy and then I realize I'm reading a troll post.... :BangHead:

Why do they just say the same damn thing over and over and over and over?







Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on December 24, 2006, 07:59 AM NHFT
There is an "ignore" button.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: error on December 24, 2006, 10:47 AM NHFT
There is an "ignore" button.

That ignore button works real good, too!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on December 24, 2006, 10:56 AM NHFT
Did error say something?   :o
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Rosie the Riveter on December 24, 2006, 11:17 AM NHFT
Did error say something?   :o

LOL
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kevin Bean on December 24, 2006, 11:29 AM NHFT
Sometimes I wonder if I am crazy and then I realize I'm reading a troll post.... :BangHead:

Why do they just say the same damn thing over and over and over and over?

Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: error on December 24, 2006, 11:30 AM NHFT
Did error say something?   :o

Oh, nothing important. You can just ignore it. :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Rosie the Riveter on December 25, 2006, 12:49 AM NHFT
Sometimes I wonder if I am crazy and then I realize I'm reading a troll post.... :BangHead:

Why do they just say the same damn thing over and over and over and over?

Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent,Economic Rent

  :Bolt:
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: outlaw4freedom on December 31, 2006, 04:29 PM NHFT
Sometimes I wonder if I am crazy and then I realize I'm reading a troll post.... :BangHead:

Why do they just say the same damn thing over and over and over and over?

Man, we all seem to do it. All it takes is reading one message that makes you go "whoa" and rattle your cage. Then all it takes is momentum...

There is an "ignore" button.

Unfortunatly when you respect that person's opinion and disagree on few... don't want to ignore them. Its all about self-control :)

Besides, you can still be you without defending yourself on here. Its easy to want the forum thread to end with your opinion, but it just doesn't work that way.

"The fastest way to succeed is to look as if you're playing by somebody else's rules, while quietly playing by your own."-Michael Konda
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: TEBON on December 31, 2006, 10:55 PM NHFT
Sometimes I wonder if I am crazy and then I realize I'm reading a troll post.... :BangHead:

Why do they just say the same damn thing over and over and over and over?

Man, we all seem to do it. All it takes is reading one message that makes you go "whoa" and rattle your cage. Then all it takes is momentum...

There is an "ignore" button.

Unfortunatly when you respect that person's opinion and disagree on few... don't want to ignore them. Its all about self-control :)

Besides, you can still be you without defending yourself on here. Its easy to want the forum thread to end with your opinion, but it just doesn't work that way.

"The fastest way to succeed is to look as if you're playing by somebody else's rules, while quietly playing by your own." Tell a Friend-Michael Konda
:hello2: :hello2: :hello2: :hello2: :hello2: :hello2: :hello2: :hello2:
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on January 19, 2007, 07:02 PM NHFT
Please people, don't reply to the trolls.  It just makes the spam worse.  The ignore button works great.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Rosie the Riveter on January 19, 2007, 09:26 PM NHFT
Please people, don't reply to the trolls.  It just makes the spam worse.  The ignore button works great.

I have been getting better at this lately-- It has taken me a while to get to the point where I don't HAVE to argue, but I'm there now and it feels great! I can read entire enraging threads and say nothing -- It has been a good life lesson  :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: CNHT on January 19, 2007, 09:32 PM NHFT
Please people, don't reply to the trolls.  It just makes the spam worse.  The ignore button works great.

Yes but I guess when someone is talking about being 'willing to kill' like that Paul guy continues to do, I get a little worried... LOL

Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: samrodwetrat on March 25, 2007, 07:03 PM NHFT
Doesn't all devolve?
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: nonya on June 22, 2007, 02:52 PM NHFT
Im in Ohio, and really looking for a place to move.  Does NH have a market for IT people?  Avaya and network/pc specialist?
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: jwilliams on July 21, 2007, 01:08 AM NHFT
 ;D
This looked like a good place to introduce myself.  I am John, I saw a news story in the LA Times in Reference to the Browns and have been doing some searching of news articles, which in turn brought me here.  I have searched for an place for new users and this seems to be it.  So it seems there is a lot going on in NH, which I find compelling.  A little bit of Civil Disobedience  >:D, the Fun Stuff.  I am will be visiting here more to read what is going on and maybe engage in some conversation.  Thanks for allowing me to be a member.

John

Oh, and I will not feed any trolls.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: error on July 21, 2007, 01:11 AM NHFT
Welcome to the Underground! Hopefully you'll enjoy yourself and we'll see you in the Free State soon!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: jwilliams on July 21, 2007, 01:16 AM NHFT
Thanks for the welcome Error.  Just reading the posts here.  Seems like a lot is going on.  I read about the prostitution sting, a little on the Browns and the DMV.  Sounds like a POLICE STATE to me.  I will continue to read and gain knowledge of your current movement.  Again thanks for the welcome.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: KBCraig on July 21, 2007, 03:39 AM NHFT
Thanks for the welcome Error.  Just reading the posts here.  Seems like a lot is going on.  I read about the prostitution sting, a little on the Browns and the DMV.  Sounds like a POLICE STATE to me.  I will continue to read and gain knowledge of your current movement.  Again thanks for the welcome.

Don't forget, those items are newsworthy because they're an outrage to the NH spirit of freedom. In many other states, the prostitution stings wouldn't have just resulted in cars being inventoried before being towed -- the cars would have been seized and either used by or auctioned off by the department in charge.

All of the gripes about how things are in NH are actually evidence of a spirit of liberty. In NH, we stand a chance of changing things. In other states, there's no use griping, because you can't do anything about it.

And welcome to the Underground!

Kevin
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: ChristianAnarchist on September 18, 2007, 12:13 PM NHFT
Thank you for your anti-troll policy.  I am a long-time member and frequent poster at freetalklive.com and have had to call them a lost cause after nearly 3 years at that board.  The trolls post the most disgusting crap just to kill a thread they don't like.  Intelligent discussion of any topic is completely impossible there...
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Ogre on September 18, 2007, 12:30 PM NHFT
Christian Anarchist... I like that idea... :)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: sticky on November 01, 2007, 10:15 AM NHFT
bump
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Sheep Fuzzy Wool on November 01, 2007, 10:37 AM NHFT
bump


LOL! Thanks for the bump!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: armlaw on December 19, 2007, 06:01 PM NHFT
Im in Ohio, and really looking for a place to move.  Does NH have a market for IT people?  Avaya and network/pc specialist?




Here is a start of a search...
   
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Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: watershed on January 25, 2008, 01:03 PM NHFT
Boy I thought I was here to "take over"... didn't we have that planned for this summer?

sorry you can't take over, liberty was founded here, your soul has just returned to the Garden of Eden..........watch out for the snakes!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: sgtusmc on May 30, 2008, 02:18 PM NHFT
because of what I write am I a troll
Peter Macdonald Sgt USMC Sempre Fi
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: David on May 30, 2008, 02:29 PM NHFT
That is not true.  We know the gov't runs over people like potholes, that for political expidiancy they have routinely hurt people and destroyed lives.  We can empathise with you.  I realize what you write is very important to you, but to repeat it over and over numbs others to the issue.  No person has an infinite well of compassion.  To be reminded from time to time how hurtful gov't is to people is important, but not everyday about the same issue. 
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on May 30, 2008, 05:59 PM NHFT
because of what I write am I a troll
Peter Macdonald Sgt USMC Sempre Fi

Hmm...has anyone seen SgtUSMC out in the sun?  ;) :D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: kola on May 30, 2008, 06:47 PM NHFT
Hows about getting Sarge on Ians radio show?

...and maybe "Shame" Maxfield on at the same time!


LIVE FROM NH ITS:
The Ian Springer Show!

Kola
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat K on May 30, 2008, 06:51 PM NHFT
because of what I write am I a troll
Peter Macdonald Sgt USMC Sempre Fi

Hmm...has anyone seen SgtUSMC out in the sun?  ;) :D

Hey!! You won't see my pale self out in the direct Sun either.
 But I am not Trollish, Well OK if ya gave me a club and I was
not smiling I look a little troll like, but I am really a nice...
well maybe not nice,but OK person.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on May 30, 2008, 07:28 PM NHFT
Oh my...PatK is a troll in real life!  :o
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat K on May 30, 2008, 08:12 PM NHFT
Oh my...PatK is a troll in real life!  :o

Am not!!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on May 30, 2008, 08:58 PM NHFT
See....argumentative.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat K on May 30, 2008, 09:19 PM NHFT
 ;D

Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on May 31, 2008, 12:51 PM NHFT
Uh-oh, now he's showing his teeth!  :o
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: sgtusmc on May 31, 2008, 02:39 PM NHFT
I try to be nice.  I realize people like to make fun of some one that they can dominat.  It is in good humor and that is the way that I take it.  I am not one to just be laying out in the sun.  I realize that what I do may not be preceived as nice all the time.  May be none of the time.  I can ID the post with the bad language as some thing that does not belong at least in my eyes.  May be I do not belong either.   ::) ::) ;D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat K on May 31, 2008, 02:44 PM NHFT
Uh-oh, now he's showing his teeth!  :o

 :angry4:
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: sgtusmc on July 19, 2008, 11:41 AM NHFT
At one time you called me a troll.  Let the people talk, ignore those that you do not like. Free speech is just that free speech.  someone elses free speech may not be what you want to hear, that does not make is less,
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Porcupine_in_MA on October 24, 2008, 09:30 AM NHFT
Oh my...PatK is a troll in real life!  :o

Am not!!

PatK?

(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/185/417899046_c392c63ca9.jpg)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on October 25, 2008, 04:30 AM NHFT
Oh my...PatK is a troll in real life!  :o

Am not!!

PatK?

(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/185/417899046_c392c63ca9.jpg)

Awww!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat K on October 25, 2008, 05:23 AM NHFT
More like this.

(http://spellforce.jowood.com/images/races/titans/troll_cyclops.gif)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Riddler on November 25, 2008, 06:55 PM NHFT
At one time you called me a troll.  Let the people talk, ignore those that you do not like. Free speech is just that free speech.  someone elses free speech may not be what you want to hear, that does not make is less,


sarge. trust me.
it's the ultimate in "cliquey' here.
high-school level.
check out free talk live.
lot more tolerant, jovial,.... unrefined, to the point of frat-house juvenile, even. but lot's of fun.
serious discussions do actuall y take place there, as well.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Jim Bob on March 27, 2009, 08:38 AM NHFT
At one time you called me a troll.  Let the people talk, ignore those that you do not like. Free speech is just that free speech.  someone elses free speech may not be what you want to hear, that does not make is less,


sarge. trust me.
it's the ultimate in "cliquey' here.
high-school level.
check out free talk live.
lot more tolerant, jovial,.... unrefined, to the point of frat-house juvenile, even. but lot's of fun.
serious discussions do actuall y take place there, as well.

Hell yeah man, that there freetalklive is sure somethin else.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: bouncer on April 13, 2009, 06:17 PM NHFT
Pat that photo looks like me except I got four eyes. Are you my Long lost twin ? LOL  ;D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: marknh on July 01, 2009, 07:48 PM NHFT
every large forum or blog has the trolls.
simple to handle give 1 warning. if than don't work then ban for life.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat McCotter on July 02, 2009, 03:37 AM NHFT
There is also an ignore button for individual use.

We don't have a large troll problem here as you can see by the date of the post before yours (04/13/2009) and the sparseness of posts in this thread.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Tom Sawyer on July 02, 2009, 09:29 AM NHFT
We don't have a large troll problem here

Well except for this McCotter character... ;D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Pat McCotter on July 02, 2009, 09:31 AM NHFT
We don't have a large troll problem here

Well except for this McCotter character... ;D

I resemble that remark!!!! ;D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Kat Kanning on July 02, 2009, 04:26 PM NHFT
The McPat Troll  :o
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Riddler on July 26, 2009, 11:43 AM NHFT
i'm still here
i prefer the term ''lurker''
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: PattyLee loves dogs on November 27, 2009, 08:20 PM NHFT

I would agree w most of first post although I am trollish enough to want to debate. Hope to take the high road and do this with respect by discussing ideas not people. Discussion of ideas is a way to test ideas to see if said ideas are worthwhile. I like to see disagreement in ideas, is this not another exercise in free thought? :lurk: :lurk: :lurk:
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: jimramos11 on December 14, 2009, 09:27 AM NHFT
Trolls are everywhere.  I prefer to be a lurker than be banned for flaming.  >:D
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: RizingFire on September 23, 2011, 08:49 PM NHFT
There is no reason why everyone can't keep it respectful, even in heated debates...I like this forum so far! Great job guys...
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Riddler on October 22, 2011, 03:45 PM NHFT
so........
 do i get some sort of award for the highest (lowest?) negative karma, or what?
some record must have been established........
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Alex Libman on October 23, 2011, 11:57 AM NHFT
I have a new zero tolerance policy for thought-terminating clichés.

Anyone who calls me a "troll" or alleges that I was ever insincere in my intentions for FSP makes my shit-list!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: littlehawk on October 23, 2011, 10:35 PM NHFT
Troll!
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Jim Johnson on October 24, 2011, 12:07 AM NHFT
People who have a 'shit list' are usually vindictive, childish assholes.
Can you start a thread on the 'Childish Board, TMI' titled 'People who think Alex Libman is a "troll" or say that he was never sincere in his intentions for FSP' or you know maybe 'Libman's Shit List'.  That way some of us can wiggle our fingers in the air and say, "Ooooo, I'm on Libman's shit list.  I wonder what he is going to do; Troll me some more?"
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Alex Libman on October 24, 2011, 11:22 AM NHFT
I don't "troll" anyone.

I have a well-documented (in spite of some people's attempts to burn books) 5-year history of libertarian critical thinking and philosophical debate.  Do you honestly think I'm some commie masquerading as a libertarian, expressing pro-libertarian views on dozens of forums, chat-rooms, and blogs, at times 8-10 hours a day?!  Why?!  I've donated thousands of dollars to libertarian causes.  I use my real name and personally identifiable information on the Internet forheckssake!  I threw away my career to be able to do this!

Yes, there has been much satire and cultural experimentation, much of which went over people's heads, but only the shallowest of people would ostracize a person over some sincere philosophical differences (all clearly within the AnCap spectrum) and a few bad jokes.  Yes, I have anger issues - under the circumstances I wouldn't be human if I didn't.  I've been knocked down many times over the past few years, and it were "my fellow libertarians" who stomped on me while I was down!  My greatest struggle is not against violent ignorance of state, but against my own despair...

I've spent a lot of time trying to reconcile with people and get them to understand, but without compromising my personal philosophical beliefs, which took me years of full-time study to achieve.  But people refuse to reasonable, they are driven by a herd instinct to stomp on anything that is different.  I struggle to roll the rock of libertarian philosophy up toward the mountaintop, and they spit at me and pierce my flesh to make the rock roll down again!

Evil tongues on libertarian forums are the reason I've stayed away from the FSP people in real life.  Here we have a "problem of the seen and the unseen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frédéric_Bastiat)" - no one will know what has been lost as the result of me being bullied out of hands-on participation in the Free State Project...  Oh, how I wish I could believe in rational objective Judgment and in Hell, and that no one who has ever called me a "troll" shall enter Heaven!  But, no, there is no rational objective Judgment, and all Truth can be thrown down the memory hole and disappear forever...

I cannot give up my rationalist / capitalist / libertarian beliefs, even if apparently I have to stand completely alone.  Completely alone...

I don't have the strength to do this, but I have no alternative.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on October 24, 2011, 04:33 PM NHFT
long-winded troll
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Alex Libman on October 24, 2011, 05:44 PM NHFT
If you think I'm long-winded, you should actually read some of the Christian Anarchist heroes you pretend to admire...

If you think I'm a troll, then you are a closed-minded ignoramus, and all of your high-profile civ-dis accomplishments are hollow.
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on April 27, 2012, 07:33 PM NHFT
interesting logic
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Riddler on October 14, 2012, 04:32 PM NHFT
Whatsup people?
Miss me?
Of course u did......now that its getting chilli,  us trolls look for nice warm forums to infest...
Hoo-ahh
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on November 03, 2012, 09:49 AM NHFT
It isn't troll behavior to say hi and ask questions:-)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Riddler on November 04, 2012, 04:00 PM NHFT
You know...I really must say, no matter our differences, you really go out of your way to remain cordial. .....very nice.
My previously favourite forum ftl has become an unbearable ghost town inhabitted by cretinous hypocrites
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Russell Kanning on November 04, 2012, 08:15 PM NHFT
Hey don't ruin my rep for abusing forum posters:-)
Title: Re: For those new to web forums: Don't feed the trolls
Post by: Dave Ridley on August 03, 2016, 03:56 AM NHFT
My LTE to Laconia Citizen about next NHexit-related demonstration Aug 8:
See also https://www.facebook.com/events/152527761846400/

Citizen article sparks demonstration by Thanks But No Tanks

Dear Editor:

The Citizen reports our Federal overlords are attempting to arm every Laconia police officer with a rifle.  While most of us might personally like the NH cops we know...and while most could agree that police in the "free state" tend to be some of the most benign in the U.S., there is a reason for that. And it's not militarization or Feds. 

They're more benign because we still have some Mayberry left and because the people at least *try* to peaceably keep their powers and capabilities limited. Toward this end, activists from Thanks But No Tanks and NHexit.com have called a demonstration to occur at 6 p.m., before the public hearing at Laconia City Hall.  Details are at NHexit.com.

Why exactly *does* Washington need to be involved in Laconia affairs, especially when this particular involvement isn't aimed at curbing police abuses?  Safety against crime...comes from armed and vigilant citizens, not central governments who torture people.  Safety against such faroff governments comes from a more independent New Hampshire.  We have a chance to demonstrate that independence on a personal level Monday...by expressing our opposition to this escalation and thus help deter the next one.   

Dave Ridley
Founder
NHexit.com
Bedford, NH