So a good friend of mine is in NH today establishing residency, getting his driver's license, and applying for his CCW/CWP/CPP, whatever you folks call it out there so you can be licensed to carry a gun concealed.
He said he learned that, at least in Nashua, where he lives, the sheriff requires multiple in-person interviews before deciding whether to issue you a permit. Including one at your home. I don't let police into my house without a warrant! I don't let *anyone* into my house, really, I'm an antisocial little b*tch. I don't even give anyone my real address. The utility companies can have it, since they have to know where they are providing service, but nobody else gets it.
Isn't NH a "shall-issue" state? Why is it up to the sheriff whether or not to acknowledge my right to bear arms? What if he just doesn't like me? I mean, that's pretty likely. I'm really worried, now. I want to be legal, but I will fight the "interview you in your own home" thing if it comes up.
Does anyone know? Is this true? If it is, is it just Nashua? Is NH "shall-issue"?
In some places the police have tried to do more than they are allowed by law to do. It sounds like Nashua is one.
I got my one in nashua about 4 years ago, and just had to drop off the paperwork and $10....they didn't even contact the 3 refs. listed.....then pick it up about 10 days later...
Perhaps you could contact someone at Gun Owners Of NH
Quote from: 9thmoon on September 12, 2006, 02:59 PM NHFT
He said he learned that, at least in Nashua, where he lives, the sheriff requires multiple in-person interviews before deciding whether to issue you a permit.
Did he go to the sheriff for it ???
They are a county thing.....
I thought they did a check with the state police.....
He said that he had to go to the Sheriff for it.
So it's supposed to be issued by county?
I live in Washington State now and here they are issued by county - except when your city of residence has passed its own laws requiring them to be issued by the city. I had to get my current license from the city I live in. Maybe NH is the same?
Has anyone ever had to do the "interview in your own home"?
Lloyd, what is Gun Owners of NH? A forum? An interest group?
I thought sheriffs were fairly weak in NH, compared to western states.
Since everyone in NH effectively lives in a town or city, only those in really small towns without a PD would ever have to go to the sheriff for anything. It's not like western counties that have unincorporated areas bigger than all of NH, and the sheriff is the only law enforcement.
Kevin
Quote from: 9thmoon on September 12, 2006, 05:37 PM NHFT
He said that he had to go to the Sheriff for it.
So it's supposed to be issued by county?
No, your friend is an idiot.
Tell him to read this info really slow...or he can just look at the pictures.
Tell him to go fill out this form, you may have to help him:
http://www.wvpublicsafety.com/pistol_permit.pdf
and bring it to the Nashua PD with $10.
The address is 0 Panther Drive.
Here is a map: (http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?formtype=address&addtohistory=&address=%5b1%2d28%5d%20Panther%20Dr&city=Nashua&state=NH&zipcode=03062&country=US&location=4iv5SKoV1B6ma1Z8IeU%2fiRP8jWQzu58UcHn8S4jQBpitP30OcEe%2fbZaJplXY2u3kRZjSDSPQ1cfIu2pcD9gXqIqv89OnENoen26iFo7KnutJODrSaLGg8QPfahTFSn8ztqUBwAJE5enYSV7vq4UlQw%3d%3d&ambiguity=1)
(http://map.web.mapquest.com/?e=9&GetMapDataDirect=Gme5diw%2ca%3a9u12%3b%40%2451%2dt50072%26%3dtn%21w1w067%3a5%2da25abx%26y%40lgayg5%402x5y8%3a9uy2%3bu%24nu67%7c%26a7aq%40%24%3a%26%40rl%21zra167%3a%29z2%26qf1au6%24%3a%26ur2u%2da%7c%26yt29%40%24&rnd=8220)
This is what the building looks like:
(http://www.gonashua.com/images/Police/dept.jpg)
http://www.ci.nashua.nh.us/content/51/98/513/default.aspx
Quote
HOW MAY I RECEIVE A PISTOL PERMIT?
An application for a permit to carry concealed/loaded pistol/revolver may be obtained through the Records Division or directly from our web site for Nashua residents only. Complete the form in its entirety. For the purpose of proving residency, you will be asked to allow Records Division personnel to photocopy your New Hampshire Driver?s License. The copy of the license will be attached to the application. The process takes approximately 2 weeks, depending on the number of record checks required. The Records Division will not call you with the status of the permit. You will be asked to call the Records Division to check on the status. The fee for a pistol permit is $10.00 and will last for four years.
Gee, that was kind of rude but funny at the same time.
Don't forget informative ;)
Thank you, Money, for the information. You didn't really need to call my friend an idiot - I assure you, he's not. But thank you for the information, regardless. I'll share it with him.
Quote from: Money Dollars on September 12, 2006, 06:01 PM NHFT
The address is 0 Panther Drive.
How can an address be 0... asshats!
Quote from: 9thmoon on September 12, 2006, 06:34 PM NHFT
You didn't really need to call my friend an idiot
Think Napoleon Dynamite
(http://www.webundies.com/images/amnd0006bxza.jpg)
Quote from: Money Dollars on September 12, 2006, 05:02 PM NHFT
Did he go to the sheriff for it ???
They are a county thing.....
No. They are a town thing. The sheriff is not involved in it, only the local chief of police.
edit- Now I'm confused as in a later post you posted the correct info
And I highly,
HIGHLY doubt that the Nashua chief is doing anything like this. The police are well informed of the consequences of not following the laws in these cases, and let's say they are not pleasant.
The Nashua police will issue permits like any other town. Apply to the chief, wait a max of 14 days and go claim your permit or official denial, which is only issued in case of a prior felony or domestic violence conviction.
I repeat, I VERY MUCH DOUBT, almost the the point that I am convinced, that this is not the case.
Quote from: aries on September 12, 2006, 08:07 PM NHFT
The Nashua police will issue permits like any other town. Apply to the chief, wait a max of 14 days and go claim your permit or official denial, which is only issued in case of a prior felony or domestic violence conviction.
That is a "shall issue" status - meaning, unless they can find a reason to deny you, have they have to issue - right?
Oh and Lloyd I found GoNH. Thank you!
Quote from: aries on September 12, 2006, 08:07 PM NHFT
Quote from: Money Dollars on September 12, 2006, 05:02 PM NHFT
Did he go to the sheriff for it ???
They are a county thing.....
No. They are a town thing. The sheriff is not involved in it, only the local chief of police.
edit- Now I'm confused as in a later post you posted the correct info
They are a county thing, as in sheriffs are a county thing.
I wonder if the sheriff, or whoever he talked to thought he was asking about NFA weapons (full auto, supressors, short barrel rifles/shotguns)....you need to get chief law enforcement officer signoff, and that can be local chief of police, sheriff of the county, head of the State police, State or local district attorney or prosecutor.....
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XII/159/159-6.htm (http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XII/159/159-6.htm)
Quote159:6 License to Carry. ?
I. The selectmen of a town or the mayor or chief of police of a city or some full-time police officer designated by them respectively, upon application of any resident of such town or city, or the director of state police, or some person designated by such director, upon application of a nonresident, shall issue a license to such applicant authorizing the applicant to carry a loaded pistol or revolver in this state for not less than 4 years from the date of issue, if it appears that the applicant has good reason to fear injury to the applicant's person or property or has any proper purpose, and that the applicant is a suitable person to be licensed. Hunting, target shooting, or self-defense shall be considered a proper purpose. The license shall be valid for all allowable purposes regardless of the purpose for which it was originally issued. The license shall be in duplicate and shall bear the name, address, description, and signature of the licensee. The original shall be delivered to the licensee and the duplicate shall be preserved by the people issuing the same for 4 years. When required, license renewal shall take place within the month of the fourth anniversary of the license holder's date of birth following the date of issuance. The license shall be issued within 14 days after application, and, if such application is denied, the reason for such denial shall be stated in writing, the original of which such writing shall be delivered to the applicant, and a copy kept in the office of the person to whom the application was made. The fee for licenses issued to residents of the state shall be $10, which fee shall be for the use of the law enforcement department of the town granting said licenses; the fee for licenses granted to out-of-state residents shall be $20, which fee shall be for the use of the state. The director of state police is hereby authorized and directed to prepare forms for the licenses required under this chapter and forms for the application for such licenses and to supply the same to officials of the cities and towns authorized to issue the licenses. No other forms shall be used by officials of cities and towns. The cost of the forms shall be paid out of the fees received from nonresident licenses.
II. No photograph or fingerprint shall be required or used as a basis to grant, deny, or renew a license to carry for a resident or nonresident, unless requested by the applicant.
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XII/159/159-6-c.htm (http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XII/159/159-6-c.htm)
Quote159:6-c Appeal From Denial, Suspension, or Revocation. ? Any person whose application for a license to carry a loaded pistol or revolver has been denied pursuant to RSA 159:6 or whose license to carry a loaded pistol or revolver has been suspended or revoked pursuant to RSA 159:6-b may within 30 days thereafter, petition the district or municipal court in the jurisdiction in which such person resides to determine whether the petitioner is entitled to a license. The court shall conduct a hearing within 14 days after receipt of the petition. During this hearing the burden shall be upon the issuing authority to demonstrate by clear and convincing proof why any denial, suspension, or revocation was justified, failing which the court shall enter an order directing the issuing authority to grant or reinstate the petitioner's license. The court shall issue its decision not later than 14 days after the hearing on whether the petitioner is entitled to a license.
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XII/159/159-6-e.htm (http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XII/159/159-6-e.htm)
Quote159:6-e Violation. ? Any person aggrieved by a violation of the licensing sections of this chapter by a licensing entity may petition the superior court of the county in which the alleged violation occurred for injunctive relief. The court shall give proceedings under this chapter priority on the court calendar. Such a petitioner may appear with or without counsel. The petition shall be deemed sufficient if it states facts constituting a violation of the licensing sections of this chapter by the licensing entity, and may be filed by the petitioner or the petitioner's counsel with the clerk of court or the justice. The clerk of court or any justice shall order service by copy of the petition on the licensing entity or a person employed by the entity. If the justice finds that time is of the essence, the justice may order notice by any reasonable means, and shall have authority to issue an order ex parte when the justice reasonably deems such an order necessary to insure compliance with the provisions of this chapter.
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XII/159/159-6-f.htm (http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XII/159/159-6-f.htm)
Quote159:6-f Remedies. ?
I. If any licensing entity or employee or member of the city council or board of selectmen, in violation of the provisions of this chapter, refuses to comply with this chapter, such entity or person shall be liable for reasonable attorney's fees and costs incurred in a lawsuit under this chapter to enforce the terms of this chapter, provided that the court finds that such lawsuit was necessary in order to obtain compliance with this chapter by the licensing authority. Fees shall not be awarded unless the court finds that the entity or person knew or should have known that the conduct engaged in was a violation of this chapter or when the parties, by agreement, provide that no such fees shall be paid. In any case in which fees are awarded under this chapter, upon a finding that an employee, or other official of a licensing entity has acted in bad faith in refusing to comply with this chapter, the court may award such fees personally against such employee or other official.
II. The court may invalidate an action of a licensing entity taken in violation of the provisions of this chapter, if the circumstances justify such invalidation, and may require the licensing entity to issue a license or otherwise comply with the provisions of this chapter.
III. In addition to any other relief awarded pursuant to this chapter, the court may issue an order to enjoin future violations of this chapter.
It appears that the sheriff is not an issuing authority. I believe he is the senior law enforcement officer in most cases, but has no purview over concealed carry licenses. There is nothing in the law that gives anyone authority to enter your house or interview you as a condition of the issuance of the license. It appears from what you said that the officer is in violation of that law. There are a few things that you can do to remedy the situation. You can call the state attorney general's office and file a complaint. You can contact one of NH's gun rights organizations (like GONH) and let them know what is going on, and they will most likely get the issue resolved for you. The first time I applied for a concealed handgun license, the chief here in Somersworth tried some similar crap with me. At first I didn't know any better, and went along with it, but when I started getting suspicious, I started reading up on the laws, and found out that he was violating them. I brought copies of the laws to his office and pointed out to him that he was breaking the law. When he told me that he didn't care what the law said, and that I had to follow his rules, I contacted GO-NH and the state attorney general's office. I eventually got my licence. Later I had my wife apply for one, and he didn't give her the same run-around. The process is supposed to go like this: Get single page form from PD. Fill out form. Return form to PD. Within 14 days, collect your license and pay the $10 fee. The license should be for not less than 4 years. There are no other requirements.
Quote from: Pat K on September 12, 2006, 06:02 PM NHFT
Gee, that was kind of rude but funny at the same time.
Quote from: Money Dollars on September 12, 2006, 06:05 PM NHFT
Don't forget informative ;)
Rude and informative. That's why we appreciate MD!
;D
Quote from: 9thmoon on September 12, 2006, 08:13 PM NHFT
Quote from: aries on September 12, 2006, 08:07 PM NHFT
The Nashua police will issue permits like any other town. Apply to the chief, wait a max of 14 days and go claim your permit or official denial, which is only issued in case of a prior felony or domestic violence conviction.
That is a "shall issue" status - meaning, unless they can find a reason to deny you, have they have to issue - right?
Yes, NH is decidedly a shall-issue state. It's almost as easy as not even getting a permit... except in that case you'd save $10
It's a license, not a permit.
Is there a functional difference between a license and a permit? They both seem to serve the same purpose: to allow the government to control who can do what.
Error, consider these two phrases:
"Marriage Permit" - "Marriage License"
Notice the difference?
The word "permit" appears nowhere in New Hampshire's concealed-carry licensing statute, so it's not a "permit."
I'm on the Board of GO-NH, and we've been tracking various kinds of concealed-carry license issuance violations by issuing authorities, and assuming that this wasn't a mixup between the pistol/revolver license and the NFA license, that's some of the most outlandish illegal requirements so far.
Make sure you get a receipt when the application is dropped off, or send it certified with receipt, otherwise they may drag it out beyond the 14-day deadline to issue or deny and you won't be able to prove when you dropped it off when you sue them. Also, it's a deadline, but some authorities, such as Manchester, treat it like a waiting period.
Quote from: mvpel on September 13, 2006, 08:47 AM NHFT
mixup between the pistol/revolver license and the NFA license
I am almost sure that has to be the case. But I don't think there is such a thing as a NFA license....the BATF issues a "tax stamp" when you get approved.
For NFA stuff, the CLEO does not have any obligation to sign off on the NFA forms. But if you apply for it as a corporation, you don't need CLEO sign off. Also no fingerprints or photos need to be sent.
Quote from: Money Dollars on September 13, 2006, 09:03 AM NHFT
Quote from: mvpel on September 13, 2006, 08:47 AM NHFT
mixup between the pistol/revolver license and the NFA license
I am almost sure that has to be the case. But I don't think there is such a thing as a NFA license....the BATF issues a "tax stamp" when you get approved.
For NFA stuff, the CLEO does not have any obligation to sign off on the NFA forms. But if you apply for it as a corporation, you don't need CLEO sign off. Also no fingerprints or photos need to be sent.
Thus making incorporating the better option for getting past NFA
Quote from: Money Dollars on September 13, 2006, 09:03 AM NHFT
I am almost sure that has to be the case. But I don't think there is such a thing as a NFA license....the BATF issues a "tax stamp" when you get approved.
Good point - in much the same way there's no such thing as a New Hampshire concealed carry "permit." ;-)
If the Sherriff needs to interview potential CCW holders, then the people of that town need to do character reviews of police recruits.
Seriously, if they dont want crazy civilians owning guns, then we dont want crazy cops owning guns.
Quote from: Money Dollars on September 12, 2006, 04:34 PM NHFT
I got my one in nashua about 4 years ago, and just had to drop off the paperwork and $10....they didn't even contact the 3 refs. listed.....then pick it up about 10 days later...
They contacted my refs. but I didn't have any trouble.
Quote from: Armed_Tennesseean on October 18, 2006, 09:28 AM NHFT
If the Sherriff needs to interview potential CCW holders, then the people of that town need to do character reviews of police recruits.
No... this is completely wrong. The Sheriff is in no way involved in the CCW process. There are no interviews. You get your CCW license in two weeks or less. Period. The original poster may have gotten something mixed up, but I guess we never heard back from him to clear up the story for us.
QuoteYou get your CCW license in two weeks or less. Period.
You must have had some pretty good luck with CCW's. Ive heard multiple horror stories of it taking several months to clear.
Im not going to argue with the rest of your statement, because ive been doing some googling and I cant find anything about it. Im not too clear on the process because im two years from being legally able to carry in my state and im not going to worry about the criteria until it gets a little bit closer to that time. Could it be the Chief of Police? Because I have also heard several times from several different people that in some areas it does need to be cleared by the Chief of Police(which is what I meant by Sheriff).
It would actually do me some good to get that cleared up if ya dont mind.
Quote from: Armed_Tennesseean on October 18, 2006, 03:14 PM NHFTIm not too clear on the process because im two years from being legally able to carry in my state and im not going to worry about the criteria until it gets a little bit closer to that time.
Move to NH... I think the youngest recipient of a CCW on record was 12, if I recall correctly.
Quote from: Armed_Tennesseean on October 18, 2006, 03:14 PM NHFTCould it be the Chief of Police? Because I have also heard several times from several different people that in some areas it does need to be cleared by the Chief of Police(which is what I meant by Sheriff).
It would actually do me some good to get that cleared up if ya dont mind.
The Sheriff and the Chief of Police are two different things. The Chief of Police is involved in the CCW process (or, delegates it to a subordinate). The Sheriff and his deputies are not. The State Police issue non-resident CCW's
Joe
^^^^
I realize that. I didnt mean to type sheriff.
Its funny, I found out about this whole movement the other day on Digg and im pretty enchanted with it.
Quote from: Armed_Tennesseean on October 18, 2006, 05:30 PM NHFT
Its funny, I found out about this whole movement the other day on Digg and im pretty enchanted with it.
So when are you moving to NH? Sooner (http://freestateproject.org/first1000) or later (http://freestateproject.org/)? ;D
Quote from: Armed_Tennesseean on October 18, 2006, 05:30 PM NHFT
^^^^
I realize that. I didnt mean to type sheriff.
Its funny, I found out about this whole movement the other day on Digg and im pretty enchanted with it.
Welcome
Come on up and join us.
There are even some people on this board in TN.
Quote from: Dreepa on October 18, 2006, 07:44 PM NHFT
Quote from: Armed_Tennesseean on October 18, 2006, 05:30 PM NHFT
^^^^
I realize that. I didnt mean to type sheriff.
Its funny, I found out about this whole movement the other day on Digg and im pretty enchanted with it.
Welcome
Come on up and join us.
There are even some people on this board in TN.
Yeah but one of them is old and may not always remember he is in TN. :)
I was born and raised in Nashville. :)
Quote from: Armed_Tennesseean on October 18, 2006, 09:28 AM NHFT
If the Sherriff needs to interview potential CCW holders, then the people of that town need to do character reviews of police recruits.
Seriously, if they dont want crazy civilians owning guns, then we dont want crazy cops owning guns.
well put , AT
In TN, you pay $75-$125 and take an 8 hour class and a couple tests. You do this by contacting a gun store in your area or doing a search (web or phone book). If you can get the time off and pass the class, you take your stuff down to the DMV and wait in line for a couple hours. You will out some stuff, pay more fees and wait several months. I left out the part where you get finger printed, that took me another few hours.l Sadly, I am unable to carry my gun in most places in TN so I just leave it at home most of the time. Because of this, I don't really care to get real good with it right now, anyway.