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New Hampshire Underground => Underground Projects => Topic started by: Dave Ridley on December 07, 2006, 04:23 PM NHFT

Title: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Dave Ridley on December 07, 2006, 04:23 PM NHFT
It is kind of hard to define what we are against in less than ten words.  This probably hampers us in debate and facilitates misunderstanding.  I think we need to create a word which  describes the thing we all oppose.

So here's a rough go at it:


sprag [rhyming with brag] (verb):

1) To initiate force against an adult who has not clearly harmed or endangered others, or who has done so only with their informed consent.
2) To delegate such an initiation of force, usually to a government

Suggested alternate forms:  spraggery (noun), spragging (adverb) spragged (past), spragger, spraggart

Thoughts?  Suggested improvements?   I like the word sprag because it is short and rhymes with fragg, thus having some of the same negative connotations.

Once we get this refined we can submit it to the wiktionary and the wikipedia, then we can just go out and start using it.


Title: Re: Let's create a word for force-initation-against-adults-who-haven't-harmed-others
Post by: Rocketman on December 07, 2006, 04:32 PM NHFT
Spraggadelic spraggialadocious!   ;D

Seriously Dada, we can't make up words -- the English language was handed down by God to Noah Webster on stone tablets.   >:D

(Um, would saying "Go sprag yourself!" be considered an initiation of force?)
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force-initation-against-adults-who-haven't-harmed-others
Post by: Jason Rand on December 07, 2006, 04:47 PM NHFT
Dada, do you really think we need another word for initiation of force, or are you just trying to create some wikibait for viral marketing?
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force-initation-against-adults-who-haven't-harmed-others
Post by: Tom Sawyer on December 07, 2006, 05:01 PM NHFT
Dedicated to the spraggers of the world...
Sprag off!!!

Sorry Russell  :D
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force-initation-against-adults-who-haven't-harmed-others
Post by: cathleeninnh on December 07, 2006, 05:09 PM NHFT
It is obviously something children do to each other.

Cathleen
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force-initation-against-adults-who-haven't-harmed-others
Post by: Dave Ridley on December 07, 2006, 05:11 PM NHFT
currently there is no word for initiation of force, only the phrase.  and in any case the phrase "initiation of force" doesn't really cover all the bases anyway.

Can anyone think of a better word for it than sprag?  This is your big chance guys; not often you get to create a word.  

Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Kat Kanning on December 07, 2006, 05:11 PM NHFT
Edited-your-subject-line-because-long-words-in-title-screw-up-the-forum-layout-for-some-people.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Brock on December 07, 2006, 05:37 PM NHFT
Aggress doesn't cut it?

Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.0.1)
ag?gress /??gr?s/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[uh-gres]   
?verb (used without object)
1.   to commit the first act of hostility or offense; attack first.
2.   to begin to quarrel.
?verb (used with object)
3.   to behave aggressively toward; attack (often fol. by upon): wild animals aggressing their prey.
[Origin: 1565?75; < L aggressus (ptp. of aggred? to attack), equiv. to ag- ag- + gred- (see grade) + -tus ptp. suffix]

American Heritage Dictionary
ag?gress   (?-gr?s')     
intr.v.   ag?gressed, ag?gress?ing, ag?gress?es
To initiate an attack, war, quarrel, or fight: "America . . . guaranteed that no EC state would aggress against another" (John J. Mearsheimer).
[French agresser, from Latin aggred?, aggress-, to attack : ad-, ad- + grad?, to go; see ghredh- in Indo-European roots.]
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Rocketman on December 07, 2006, 06:43 PM NHFT
Sprag not, lest ye be spragged.   ;D

I think "aggress" means the same thing; it's rarely used, but resuscitating a seldom-used form of a common word is a lot easier than creating a new one.  Also, I fear that if free staters start going around saying "sprag" all the time, we will contribute to the already-somewhat-popular notion that we're a bunch of space cadets.

Plus, "aggress" connects directly with "aggression," the word used in ZAP/NAP (not to mention Brian Wright's SNAP, or "Sacred NonAggression Principle").
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: toowm on December 07, 2006, 06:57 PM NHFT
thuggery?
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Tom Sawyer on December 07, 2006, 07:18 PM NHFT
...the already-somewhat-popular notion that we're a bunch of space cadets.

You should know of such things. ;)
 
Rocketman

She packed my bags last night pre-flight
Zero hour nine a.m.
And I'm gonna be high as a kite by then
I miss the earth so much I miss my wife
It's lonely out in space
On such a timeless flight

And I think it's gonna be a long long time
Till touch down brings me round again to find
I'm not the man they think I am at home
Oh no no no I'm a rocket man
Rocket man burning out his fuse up here alone


Mars ain't the kind of place to raise your kids
In fact it's cold as hell
And there's no one there to raise them if you did
And all this science I don't understand
It's just my job five days a week
A rocket man, a rocket man


And I think it's gonna be a long long time...
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Rocketman on December 07, 2006, 07:45 PM NHFT
Good tune, Roger, but my screen name is actually an obscure literary reference.  It has nothing to do with Sir Elton, everything to do with Thomas Pynchon's Gravity's Rainbow.

The book is virtually unreadable for at least 99% of the population, and you'd have to wade through over half of the 900+ pages to get to the part where Lt. Tyrone Slothrop becomes "Rocketman," so the reference is hardly worth chasing down unless you're a total masochist.   ;D
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: aries on December 07, 2006, 07:47 PM NHFT
sprag (spr?g)
n.
A piece of wood or metal wedged beneath a wheel or between spokes to keep a vehicle from rolling.
A pointed stake lowered at an angle into the ground from a vehicle to prevent movement.
A prop to support a mine roof.

Already a word.

Could become a secondary definition
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Caleb on December 07, 2006, 09:35 PM NHFT
"Killing is bad ... and wrong.  There should be a new, stronger word for killing like ... badwrong ... or ... badong.  YES!  Killing is badong!"  ;D
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: error on December 07, 2006, 09:53 PM NHFT
+1 for Dave. You've hit on exactly the problem: People don't understand what the hell we're talking about most of the time.

I don't know if making up a word is going to solve the problem, though at the moment I haven't fully formulated a better idea.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: David on December 07, 2006, 11:29 PM NHFT
Spraggadelic spraggialadocious!   ;D


(Um, would saying "Go sprag yourself!" be considered an initiation of force?)

um, more like a nonviolent 'invitation'.   ;D

+1 for Dave. You've hit on exactly the problem: People don't understand what the hell we're talking about most of the time.

I don't know if making up a word is going to solve the problem, though at the moment I haven't fully formulated a better idea.

Agreed.  Most see what they do or vote for in moral terms.  Calling them thugs or refering to them as agressors never registers to them. 
Lately I've called them 'cheerleaders' of force. 
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: John on December 08, 2006, 12:09 AM NHFT
force
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: error on December 08, 2006, 12:27 AM NHFT
Perhaps "state-sponsored terrorism" would be the best way to describe it.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: David on December 08, 2006, 10:35 PM NHFT
Clair Wolfe uses the phrase government supremists.  I like it. 
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Rosie the Riveter on December 08, 2006, 10:48 PM NHFT
Thomas Pynchon's Gravity's Rainbow.

The book is virtually unreadable for at least 99% of the population,

My favorite kind ;D

I'll get a copy, but only from the library... just in case, I have to return it unread.

I'll smite you later for it.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Rocketman on December 09, 2006, 10:37 AM NHFT
Thomas Pynchon's Gravity's Rainbow.

The book is virtually unreadable for at least 99% of the population,

My favorite kind ;D

I'll get a copy, but only from the library... just in case, I have to return it unread.

I'll smite you later for it.

Best of luck to you, Kate.  Pynchon also wrote what I consider to be the great American novel, Mason and Dixon, which is only unreadable by about 96% of the population.

It's written in the style of an 18th Century novel, and imaginatively chronicles the travails of Charles Mason, the Royal Society astronomer, and Jeremiah Dixon, the Quaker surveyor, on their line-drawing adventures in the New World.  I think the best scene is where they smoke dope with George Washington -- Martha walks in, smells the smoke, and says "I suppose you'll be wanting these tarts, then."

If anybody's heard Mark Knopfler's "Sailing to Philadelphia" (great tune, duet with James Taylor), it was inspired by Pynchon's Mason and Dixon.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Rosie the Riveter on December 09, 2006, 11:34 AM NHFT
Thomas Pynchon's Gravity's Rainbow.

The book is virtually unreadable for at least 99% of the population,

My favorite kind ;D

I'll get a copy, but only from the library... just in case, I have to return it unread.

I'll smite you later for it.

Best of luck to you, Kate.  Pynchon also wrote what I consider to be the great American novel, Mason and Dixon, which is only unreadable by about 96% of the population.

It's written in the style of an 18th Century novel, and imaginatively chronicles the travails of Charles Mason, the Royal Society astronomer, and Jeremiah Dixon, the Quaker surveyor, on their line-drawing adventures in the New World.  I think the best scene is where they smoke dope with George Washington -- Martha walks in, smells the smoke, and says "I suppose you'll be wanting these tarts, then."

If anybody's heard Mark Knopfler's "Sailing to Philadelphia" (great tune, duet with James Taylor), it was inspired by Pynchon's Mason and Dixon.

Cool -- I love that song. 

I'll start with Mason and Dixon to warm me up to Pynchon and then read  Gravity's Rainbow. I'll look forward to having a critical analysis discussion with you when I'm done --though you're not allowed to grade me on my comprehension, Professor ;)
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Rocketman on December 09, 2006, 11:49 AM NHFT
Sure thing.  No grades for Rosie the Riveter.   ;D

Grades, in many cases, constitute a form of spragging (back on topic).
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Dave Ridley on December 09, 2006, 03:23 PM NHFT
here's another quick go at it with a refined definition.   However I'm sure we can come up with a better word.   

chagg [rhyming with brag] (verb):

1) To initiate force against an adult who isn't harming or threatening others, or who is doing so only at their request.
2) To delegate such an initiation of force, usually to a government or policeman.

I've mulled over the word aggress and I tend to think it does not quite do the job for reasons I'll try to explain later...
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Dave Ridley on December 09, 2006, 03:48 PM NHFT
OK here are my problems with the existing available words.

"aggress" or "aggression" tend to be interpereted as meaning angry violence, screaming, physically assaulting....

It's hard to pin accusations of "aggression" on stony bureaucrats because the type of force they use is so controlled and invisible.

As for "initiation of force"  that term is a problem because few of us can really say we are against initiation of force in all circumstances.  Most of us are ok with the initiation of force against children by their parents.   I personally would be okay with the initiation of force against a con man or a crazy guy breeding smallpox in his basement. 

But I don't think any of us would be okay with people "chagging," as defined above,  under any circumstances.   

So, its introduction as a word would give us the ability to say in six syllables the entirity of our message....

Us:  "we are against chagging"

Them:  "what is chagging?"

Us:  "Initating force against an adult who isn't harming or threatening others, or who is endangering only other adults with their approval.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Dave Ridley on December 09, 2006, 03:54 PM NHFT
Another refinement in part 1)

chagg [rhyming with brag] (verb):

1) To initiate force against an adult who isn't harming or threatening others, or who endangers only consenting adults
2) To delegate such an initiation of force, usually to a government or policeman.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Sweet Mercury on December 09, 2006, 06:32 PM NHFT
"Violence" doesn't cut the muster?
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: David on December 09, 2006, 09:36 PM NHFT
Here's three I came up with back in august:
voters-forcimus maximus
polititions-forcius or forcimus maximus
police-forcimus thuggerus
 ;D
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Dave Ridley on December 10, 2006, 01:16 AM NHFT
<<"Violence" doesn't cut the muster?>>

no, because most of us agree that violence against criminals can be justified if it's in self defense.  and most state coercion does not involve violence, but is still evil.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: AmerTownCrier on December 10, 2006, 03:00 AM NHFT
A new word isn't an entirely bad idea...for now the best I can come up with isn't new...INNOCENT is what should work.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: error on December 10, 2006, 03:15 AM NHFT
A new word isn't an entirely bad idea...for now the best I can come up with isn't new...INNOCENT is what should work.

The alternate form of this, for use in certain government buildings, is "Not Guilty." ;D
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Sweet Mercury on December 10, 2006, 02:05 PM NHFT
<<"Violence" doesn't cut the muster?>>

no, because most of us agree that violence against criminals can be justified if it's in self defense.  and most state coercion does not involve violence, but is still evil.


Ahh, I guess I've been using my own connotations for the word for so long that I haven't explained it. I generally distinguish between force and violence in this way:

"Force" can be described as physical action, or the use of physical action to exert one's will over another. "Violence" is specifically theinitiation of force with the intent of violating an individual's rights. In that sense, all violence is force, but not all force is violence.

In that sense, the force that a criminal uses to steal, assault, murder, etc., is violence, but the actions, even physical actions used to prevent him or catch him after the fact, are force.

State coercion doesn't often involve force (or what I would call violence), but the threat of it, which in my mind is a crime of equal degree.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Atlas on December 10, 2006, 03:07 PM NHFT
How about 'Parasite.' Somone who leeches off others is a force initiator.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Michael Fisher on December 10, 2006, 04:41 PM NHFT
Latin:

initi coerci innoce adultus

initicoercinnociadultus

one who initiates coercion against an innocent adult


Hebrew:

begin: H
khaw-lal'

force: H
ed-raw'

hurt: H
rah, raw-aw'

against: H
min, min-nee', min-nay'

innocent: H
naw-kee', naw-kee'

grown: (adult) H
gaw-dal'

man: (human) H
eesh

khaw-lal' (H) rah (H) min (H) eesh (H)
kalaraminish (H) (to begin harm against a man)

khaw-lal' (H) rah (H) min (H) gaw-dal' (H)
kalaramingadal (H) (to begin harm against an adult)

khaw-lal' (H) rah (H) min (H) naw-kee' (H) gaw-dal' (H)
kalaraminakigadal (H) (to begin harm against an innocent adult)


Greek:

cause to be: (to start) G
ghin'-om-ahee

aggressor: G
hoo-bris-tace'

!hurt: G
ad-ee-keh'-o

against: G
kat-ah'

innocent: G
an-ah'ee-tee-os

grown: (adult) G
owx-an'-o

man: (human) G
anth'-ro-pos

ghin'-om-ahee (G) ad-ee-keh'-o (G) kat-ah' (G) anth'-ro-pos (G)
ginomayadikeyokatanthropos (to initiate harm against a man)

ghin'-om-ahee (G) ad-ee-keh'-o (G) kat-ah' (G) owx-ah'-o (G)
ginomayadikeyokatoiso (to initiate harm against an adult)

ghin'-om-ahee (G) ad-ee-keh'-o (G) kat-ah' (G) an-ah'ee-tee-os (G) owx-ah'-o (G)
ginomayadikeyokatanitiosoisao (to initiate harm against an innocent adult)

Example: You are a ginomayadikeyokatanitiosoisao.   :biglaugh:
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Braddogg on December 10, 2006, 11:34 PM NHFT
The problem with Hebrew is that you'll have to remember whether to use the female or male version.  I've learned how to communicate the basic message of libertarianism: Ani ohev hofesh -- I love freedom :)
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: MattLeft on December 11, 2006, 08:13 PM NHFT
I kinda like 'sprag.'  It has a nice ring to it.  Maybe throw another 'g' at the end of it to set it apart from its other previous definitions:  'spragg'

Then we could accuse someone of displaying spraggadocio, or being spraggadocious.  A spragnasticator? 
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: FrankChodorov on December 11, 2006, 08:23 PM NHFT
<<"Violence" doesn't cut the muster?>>

no, because most of us agree that violence against criminals can be justified if it's in self defense.  and most state coercion does not involve violence, but is still evil.


Ahh, I guess I've been using my own connotations for the word for so long that I haven't explained it. I generally distinguish between force and violence in this way:

"Force" can be described as physical action, or the use of physical action to exert one's will over another. "Violence" is specifically theinitiation of force with the intent of violating an individual's rights. In that sense, all violence is force, but not all force is violence.

In that sense, the force that a criminal uses to steal, assault, murder, etc., is violence, but the actions, even physical actions used to prevent him or catch him after the fact, are force.

State coercion doesn't often involve force (or what I would call violence), but the threat of it, which in my mind is a crime of equal degree.

very nicely explained and worded...

karma to you!
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Sweet Mercury on December 12, 2006, 02:36 PM NHFT
<<"Violence" doesn't cut the muster?>>

no, because most of us agree that violence against criminals can be justified if it's in self defense.  and most state coercion does not involve violence, but is still evil.


Ahh, I guess I've been using my own connotations for the word for so long that I haven't explained it. I generally distinguish between force and violence in this way:

"Force" can be described as physical action, or the use of physical action to exert one's will over another. "Violence" is specifically theinitiation of force with the intent of violating an individual's rights. In that sense, all violence is force, but not all force is violence.

In that sense, the force that a criminal uses to steal, assault, murder, etc., is violence, but the actions, even physical actions used to prevent him or catch him after the fact, are force.

State coercion doesn't often involve force (or what I would call violence), but the threat of it, which in my mind is a crime of equal degree.

very nicely explained and worded...

karma to you!

Thank you.

Actually, those are thoughts I've had and argued in response to idealistic pacifism, or the statement that people often say: "violence" doesn't solve problems."
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: FrankChodorov on December 13, 2006, 06:43 PM NHFT
<<"Violence" doesn't cut the muster?>>

no, because most of us agree that violence against criminals can be justified if it's in self defense.  and most state coercion does not involve violence, but is still evil.


Ahh, I guess I've been using my own connotations for the word for so long that I haven't explained it. I generally distinguish between force and violence in this way:

"Force" can be described as physical action, or the use of physical action to exert one's will over another. "Violence" is specifically theinitiation of force with the intent of violating an individual's rights. In that sense, all violence is force, but not all force is violence.

In that sense, the force that a criminal uses to steal, assault, murder, etc., is violence, but the actions, even physical actions used to prevent him or catch him after the fact, are force.

State coercion doesn't often involve force (or what I would call violence), but the threat of it, which in my mind is a crime of equal degree.

very nicely explained and worded...

karma to you!

Thank you.

Actually, those are thoughts I've had and argued in response to idealistic pacifism, or the statement that people often say: "violence" doesn't solve problems."

I make a similar case based on Nock between the state as illegitimate and legitimate local governance as agency.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Sweet Mercury on December 13, 2006, 09:39 PM NHFT
I make a similar case based on Nock between the state as illegitimate and legitimate local governance as agency.

I actually just recieved Our Enemy, the State in the mail. I'll be reading it soon.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Michael Fisher on December 15, 2006, 06:21 PM NHFT
Hmmm... there must be a better word than:
-sprag
-chagg
-initicoercinnociadultus
-kalaraminakigadal
-ginomayadikeyokatanitiosoisao
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Dave Ridley on December 17, 2006, 05:37 PM NHFT
ideally it should rhyme with something poeple already consider evil...just as spragg rhymes with fragg.

trogging rhymes with flogging and isnt in use...
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: KBCraig on December 17, 2006, 06:32 PM NHFT
In Shreveport, Sprague Street is pronounced "spragg". It's also a place where a lot of violence is initiated.

Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Michael Fisher on December 28, 2006, 11:12 AM NHFT
This liberty-vocabulary development effort is more important than we might know.

"Words are a mirror of their times. By looking at the areas in which the vocabulary of a language is expanding fastest in a given period, we can form a fairly accurate impression of the chief preoccupations of society at that time and the points at which the boundaries of human endeavour are being advanced."
-John Ayto, lexicographer (1949- )
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: David on December 28, 2006, 12:32 PM NHFT
Authoritarian?
Title: Best
Post by: outlaw4freedom on December 28, 2006, 06:34 PM NHFT
Best answer to thread I've seen:

Aggress doesn't cut it?

Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.0.1)
ag?gress /??gr?s/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[uh-gres]   
?verb (used without object)
1.   to commit the first act of hostility or offense; attack first.
2.   to begin to quarrel.
?verb (used with object)
3.   to behave aggressively toward; attack (often fol. by upon): wild animals aggressing their prey.
[Origin: 1565?75; < L aggressus (ptp. of aggred? to attack), equiv. to ag- ag- + gred- (see grade) + -tus ptp. suffix]

American Heritage Dictionary
ag?gress   (?-gr?s')     
intr.v.   ag?gressed, ag?gress?ing, ag?gress?es
To initiate an attack, war, quarrel, or fight: "America . . . guaranteed that no EC state would aggress against another" (John J. Mearsheimer).
[French agresser, from Latin aggred?, aggress-, to attack : ad-, ad- + grad?, to go; see ghredh- in Indo-European roots.]
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: error on December 28, 2006, 07:54 PM NHFT
Racketeering comes to mind. Extortion also a subset.  How many times does the government break its own laws to go after individuals?

I lost count long ago.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Dave Ridley on December 29, 2006, 11:17 PM NHFT
Spragg still seems to be the front runner term in my mind.   For now I'm Waiting to hear something better.... 
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Michael Fisher on January 06, 2007, 12:56 PM NHFT
On the topic of developing a vocabulary of liberty, a professor found this homeschooling or independent-learning term for me:

autodidact: n. a person who has learned a subject without a teacher or formal education; self-taught person. ?autodidactic, adj (Webster's American College Dictionary. 1998. New York: Random House, Inc.).
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Braddogg on January 06, 2007, 10:52 PM NHFT
Spragg still seems to be the front runner term in my mind.   For now I'm Waiting to hear something better.... 

I'm giving it a shot in my profile . . . .
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Michael Fisher on January 12, 2007, 09:58 PM NHFT
Vocabulary shapes thought. It is true. Read this great article by Kevin Van Horn.

Getting the State Out of Our Heads
by Kevin S. Van Horn
http://www.strike-the-root.com/71/horn/horn1.html

"As Orwell and various linguists have pointed out, vocabulary shapes thought."
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Dave Ridley on January 13, 2007, 10:29 PM NHFT
very honored , 'dogg!

it aint a political movement until it's invented its own word....
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force-initation-against-adults-who-haven't-harmed-others
Post by: ksvanhorn on January 21, 2007, 07:56 PM NHFT
currently there is no word for initiation of force, only the phrase.  and in any case the phrase "initiation of force" doesn't really cover all the bases anyway.

Can anyone think of a better word for it than sprag?

Sure.  "Aggress" or "trespass".
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: ksvanhorn on January 21, 2007, 08:05 PM NHFT
It's hard to pin accusations of "aggression" on stony bureaucrats because the type of force they use is so controlled and invisible.

The word for that is "intimidation" or "extortion".

I really don't think we should invent new words here.  Just use the same words we would use to describe the act if someone outside of the government were to do it: "assault", "extortion", "aggression", "breaking and entering", "trespass", "theft", etc.  Part of the problem we face is the new words that were invented in the past to describe criminal acts of government; since these differ from what we call those acts when people outside the government commit them, this special vocabulary has tended to obscure the essentially criminal nature of government.  Examples: taxation (extortion / theft); conscription (enslavement); war (mass murder); inflation (counterfeiting / fraud).
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: jaqeboy on January 30, 2007, 11:16 PM NHFT
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprag

In my field, mechanical engineering, this is a sprag - a type of one-way clutch.

Jack
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: jaqeboy on January 30, 2007, 11:24 PM NHFT
Borg Warner sprag clutches: http://www.bwauto.com/products/ts/one-way_clutch/sprag_clutch.shtml
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Caleb on January 30, 2007, 11:35 PM NHFT
Hey, don't you sprag my clutch! 

or ..

is it, clutch my sprag?  :book1: :confused2: :dontknow:

 ;D
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Michael Fisher on February 02, 2007, 12:59 AM NHFT
Here's a good one. Dragoon. It's an existing word, too.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/dragoon

dra?goon  [druh-goon]

?noun 1. (esp. formerly) a European cavalryman of a heavily armed troop. 
2. a member of a military unit formerly composed of such cavalrymen, as in the British army. 
3. (formerly) a mounted infantryman armed with a short musket. 
?verb (used with object) 4. to set dragoons or soldiers upon; persecute by armed force; oppress. 
5. to force by oppressive measures; coerce: The authorities dragooned the peasants into leaving their farms. 

tr.v.   dra?gooned, dra?goon?ing, dra?goons

To subjugate or persecute by the imposition of troops.
To compel by violent measures or threats; coerce.

[Origin: 1615?25; < F dragon, special use of dragon dragon, applied first to a pistol hammer (so named because of its shape), then to the firearm, then to the troops so armed]

-------

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=dragoon

dragoon 

1622, from Fr. dragon "carbine, musket," because the guns the soldiers carried "breathed fire" like a dragon. The verb is from 1689, lit. "to force by the agency of dragoons" (which were used by the Fr. kings to persecute Protestants).

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"The openly hostile minority was driven out or dragooned into obedience..."
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: lildog on February 08, 2007, 02:31 PM NHFT
The sky is blue and all the leaves are green.
The sun's as warm as a baked potato.
I think I know precisely what I mean,
When I say it's a shpadoinkle day.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: SAK on February 20, 2007, 06:06 PM NHFT
OK, I apologize ahead of time -- I truly do -- for an off-topic post.  But this thread made me think of a funny joke and I can't resist :D

Quote
A radio station was running a competition ? words that weren?t in the dictionary yet could still be used in a sentence that would make logical sense. The prize was a trip to Bali.

DJ: ?96 FM here, what?s your name??

Caller: ?Hi, my name?s Dave.?

DJ: ?Dave, what?s your word??

Caller: ?Goan... spelt G-O-A-N pronounced ?go-an?.?

DJ: ?You are correct, Dave, ?goan? is not in the dictionary. Now, for a trip to Bali: What sentence can you use that word in that would make sense??

Caller: ?Goan fuck yourself!?

The DJ cut the caller off and took other calls, all unsuccessful until later on...

DJ: ?96 FM, what?s your name??

Caller: ?Hi, me name?s Jeff.?

DJ: ?Jeff, what?s your word??

Caller: ?Smee, spelt S-M-E-E, pronounced ?smee?.?

DJ: ?You are correct, Jeff, ?smee? is not in the dictionary. Now, for a trip to Bali: What sentence can you use that word in that would make sense??

Caller: ?Smee again! Goan fuck yourself!?
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: SAK on February 20, 2007, 06:15 PM NHFT
spragg is good, except I'm wondering if we can't come up with something more creative that has some sort of association (any association is better than nothing) with a violent thug type.  Dragoon has this in "goon."  Since dragoon is already a word (not to mention it's kind of silly-sounding) and we really can't use it for this purpose -- we'll have to think of something else.  Let's keep working.

Should we come up with a fitting word -- then the only challenge will be to market that word widely enough to get it to be used.


I'm sure few people here have an idea of the true power of language.  Our entire language is a gigantic web of mind-programming.  It's very effective too :)
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Michael Fisher on March 09, 2007, 09:40 AM NHFT
Here's a set of phrases that somewhat shows the contrast between voluntary action and fiat.

ipso facto (IP-so FAK-to) adverb

   By the very fact or action.

[Latin ipso facto (by the fact itself).]

Note: The counterpart of this term is ipso jure, which means by reason of a particular law.

(From: Wordsmith.Org)
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Spencer on March 09, 2007, 11:17 PM NHFT
Here's a set of phrases that somewhat shows the contrast between voluntary action and fiat.

ipso facto (IP-so FAK-to) adverb

   By the very fact or action.

[Latin ipso facto (by the fact itself).]

Note: The counterpart of this term is ipso jure, which means by reason of a particular law.

(From: Wordsmith.Org)

So, should we call those who initiate force against those who haven't harmed others IPSHITS?
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Michael Fisher on September 18, 2007, 07:59 AM NHFT
More liberty vocab.

buckram (BUK-ruhm) noun

   1. A stiff cotton fabric used in interlining garments, in bookbinding, etc.

   2. Stiffness; formality.

verb tr.

   1. To strengthen with buckram.

   2. To give a false appearance of strength, importance, etc.

-Wordsmith.org
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: David on September 20, 2007, 12:14 AM NHFT
It's been a long time since we heard from you Michael.  Glad you're still with us online.   :)
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Michael Fisher on February 13, 2008, 12:40 AM NHFT
Here are two beautiful and useful liberty-related words I had never bothered to look up before: Autonomy and autonomous.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/autonomy

autonomy (noun) (plural autonomies)

1. Self-government
2. (philosophy) The capacity to make an informed, uncoerced decision.

Etymology: From Greek autonomia, noun of quality from autonomos “independent, living by one’s own laws”, from auto- “self” (comb. form) + nomos “custom, law”.


http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/autonomous

autonomous (adj.)

1. Self-governing. Governing independently.
2. Acting on one's own. Acting independently. Acting without being governed by parental or guardian rules.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Dave Ridley on February 13, 2008, 01:07 AM NHFT
i think "agress" may be the best option of the lot, when it comes to a word for harming others unjustly.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: grasshopper on February 13, 2008, 10:03 AM NHFT
Stacalupus, meaning from old "english", staca: meaning,  attacking and lupus meaning Wolf in latin.  Could almean a storm trooper.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: Bill St. Clair on February 13, 2008, 12:58 PM NHFT
"Assault" works for me.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: J’raxis 270145 on February 16, 2008, 01:27 AM NHFT
I usually use aggress… which, amusingly, Firefox is highlighting as a typo as I write this post.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: John Edward Mercier on February 17, 2008, 06:03 AM NHFT
I think your looking for 'transgress'.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: J’raxis 270145 on February 18, 2008, 05:01 PM NHFT
No, aggress, as in “to commit aggression.”
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed others
Post by: Free libertarian on February 20, 2008, 07:39 PM NHFT
 I'll confess I can think of no new word...but the tried and true "Bushwacked" is apropo these days.
Title: Re: Let's create a word for force initation against adults who haven't harmed ot
Post by: mackler on February 24, 2008, 02:13 AM NHFT
v. to batter
n. battery
Often preceeded by assault, i.e., a threat of battery.