New Hampshire Underground

New Hampshire Underground => Porcupine Trading Post => Housing => Topic started by: Russell Kanning on February 26, 2007, 03:22 PM NHFT

Title: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 26, 2007, 03:22 PM NHFT
We are on a quest to provide affordable housing for incoming porcupines and other friends in the Monadnock portion of The Shire.

I have been looking at large houses/buildings to fill with porcupines and other situations (such as commercial lots) with land attached. I have been looking at places with owner financing and affordable prices and have found a few over time ... some of which have been snapped up by others ... but some still remain.

The church and rectory in Marlborough is sitting empty being heated and maintained by the manchester catholic diocese. They did not accept Caleb's first offer, but that is still a possibility. It is not an easy property to move ( at $600,000 ) and we could make use of it. It already has 5/6 bedrooms without changing a thing ... more with some modifications. :)

There is a piece of commercial property in Winchester (for sale since 10/06 for $340,000 ) that is interesting also. It has a house/office with 10 rooms and a large barn and 2 silos. There are 10 flat cleared acres and 25 acres of hills/woods. It is right on 78 and faces the old lumber mill. So the view is imperfect to the north but great everywhere else. I can picture us building houses or more dense housing even on the flat part and then building cabins in the woods or just logging it. Then we can live in the places and/or rent them out.

Every situation is made more affordable with our flexibility and ability to ignore the government's taxes and regulations.

Some situations are ready to put in residents, so the funding can come from the future occupants. We just have to find the interested renters and get them together. In some situations we would need to make monthly payments for months/years before we can occupy the land ourselves or find renters to pay back the investors.

I would like to communicate by forum post/pm/phone/in person with anyone interested in living free in our corner of The Shire or helping fund it for profit and/or future residency. If you have a dream living situation, let me know and we will work on it and connect you with others. If you have a little money you could invest each month, tell me the amount and what kinds of projects/people you are comfortable working with.

We have many handy guys in our group who will work cheap to maintain or build housing for each other. We would run these projects much like our tuath or an amish community. We would make decisions together and not use government to judge disagreements. We can voluntary make connections and free ourselves from "The Man".

Let the barnraising begin! :D


btw .... the old building in the middle of Keene is still vacant, but may be harder to be ignored by the government ... bad news or a challenge. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on February 26, 2007, 03:47 PM NHFT
 8)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: LiveFree on February 27, 2007, 10:52 AM NHFT
The place in Winchester looks great.  Other uses could include boarding for people's horses (not too sure of the market for that up here, but when I rode as a kid all through the 90's in northern MA, there was no trouble filling up stalls).  If you could get some renters for the rooms, or section it off into apartments somehow, it could be a decent moneymaker.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 27, 2007, 11:10 AM NHFT
http://www.century21thackston.com/propertysearch/MLSUDetails.asp?id=2630213&MLS=NNEREN&TYPE=COM

Part of that barn could be good for horses. I had not even thought of that. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 27, 2007, 11:12 AM NHFT
Hey Nick .... is this place gone?

http://www.century21thackston.com/propertysearch/MLSUDetails.asp?id=2629469&MLS=NNEREN&TYPE=MULTI
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 27, 2007, 11:15 AM NHFT
http://www.century21thackston.com/propertysearch/MLSUDetails.asp?id=2620008&MLS=NNEREN&TYPE=COM

I didn't know this place was up for sale. It is on the corner with the light in Winchester.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: error on February 27, 2007, 08:11 PM NHFT
If you have a place smack in the middle of Keene available within the next 30 days, I'm in.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 27, 2007, 08:44 PM NHFT
I haven't been looking there.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Quantrill on February 27, 2007, 10:23 PM NHFT
QuoteEvery situation is made more affordable with our flexibility and ability to ignore the government's taxes and regulations.

Quote of the year!  (+1)


I can help with HVAC-related duties and there seem to be a couple other HVAC guys around here too.  Maybe we can 'volunteer' them to help.  ;)

I was just thinking today about my plans for future residency.  It'll be awhile before I can afford to buy a house in The Shire.  I've been thinking about maybe purchasing an RV and looking for a PORC who has an acre or two that he/she could rent or sell to me.  Of course, when people find out you're living in an RV they tell the authorities and then you're forced to move.  :(    While living in an RV wouldn't be permanent it would suit me fine as long as I could weatherproof it appropriately.  Then it's just a matter of finding a place to park the damn thing.

Russell, I'm glad you bring this up.  There is obviously a need for decent-priced housing for new movers and this is a great way to meet people and make a little cash as well.  The email I got from Alec was he already has 3 people trying to move in ahead of me.  So the demand is there folks.  Anyone with cash to finance a project like this is sure to get a decent return on their investment.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Pat K on February 27, 2007, 10:36 PM NHFT
Tree Houses, I always liked Tree Houses. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: KBCraig on February 28, 2007, 01:05 AM NHFT
With apologies to Vic Mizzy.

Pooooorc Acres is the place for me.
Freeeeee livin' is the life for me.
Aaaaanarchy spreadin' far and wide.
Screw politics, I don't take either side.

;)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 28, 2007, 06:33 AM NHFT
The place with land in Winchester would also work for RV's as we added water/sewage lines and electricity, but before we filled in with buildings. We could have a mini-semi-permanent-porcfest going on from april-october.

Since those of us that are currently interested don't have enough cash to buy one of these places. I would like to talk with people about getting shares in our endeavor for $100/month payments.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: slim on February 28, 2007, 07:22 AM NHFT
I think this is a great idea. A group of porcs living in the same community will show that the porcs do not want to "take over" we want to build and contribute to the community. If there is a commercial building that could be subdivided for porcs with businesses that need storefront or just a separate location other then their homes. This could be a great starting point for a lot of the porcs moving in to the state.

Russell I was wondering how many people you would like to see commit to something like porc acres before moving forward. If there is enough of people in this community I can see possible business opportunities like a community grocery store like one that is close to where I live currently.

I do not have the money to invest in a idea like this yet but I think once I finish my commitment where I have some cash invested (which is why I have not moved yet) I would be willing to invest in a idea like this.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 28, 2007, 07:44 AM NHFT
For a really small project ... like a $100,000 house or building .... we would need to commit to say $1000/month payments. So that is about all we would have to have, if we had no initial renters. As we brought in rental money we could stop needing input from the shareholders. After we finisher necessary repairs and kept up maintenance, we could start paying the shareholders money. It would all be determined by the group involved. :)

For the rectory in Marlborough Caleb offered them $1,500/month .... and they wanted more. We could not offer more, because any more per month would not have given us a For the bigger place in Winchester we might need $2,000/month. Since I do not have the $340,000 or the $2,000/month, I need help.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Kat Kanning on February 28, 2007, 08:25 AM NHFT
Plus, it gives the feds a target when they feel like crispifying some dissidents.  :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on February 28, 2007, 08:29 AM NHFT
Porc Bar-B-Que
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: MikeforLiberty on February 28, 2007, 08:33 AM NHFT
Have money, need Freedom. I'm interested as a distant investor. I have no current plans to move but a NH address and a campsite would be nice.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on February 28, 2007, 08:34 AM NHFT
Quote from: Pat K on February 27, 2007, 10:36 PM NHFT
Tree Houses, I always liked Tree Houses. :)

Trying to frighten the poor  trees?
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 28, 2007, 08:39 AM NHFT
Quote from: IthacaLA on February 28, 2007, 08:33 AM NHFT
Have money, need Freedom. I'm interested as a distant investor. I have no current plans to move but a NH address and a campsite would be nice.
We can help with an address now. But if you want a stake in a piece of land or just investment call me at 357-2049 in The Shire area code of 603 and let me know what you are thinking.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 28, 2007, 08:40 AM NHFT
We might also need parallel groups .... one inside and another outside the system. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Kat Kanning on February 28, 2007, 11:59 AM NHFT
Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on February 28, 2007, 08:34 AM NHFT
Quote from: Pat K on February 27, 2007, 10:36 PM NHFT
Tree Houses, I always liked Tree Houses. :)

Trying to frighten the poor  trees?

I guess the next movie night should be Swiss Family Robinson.  :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: cathleeninnh on February 28, 2007, 12:28 PM NHFT
Have it up in a tree and invite PatK. I want to see that.

Cathleen
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Dreepa on February 28, 2007, 12:51 PM NHFT
You should talk about this at the next MVP meeting.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Pat K on February 28, 2007, 04:38 PM NHFT
Quote from: cathleeninnh on February 28, 2007, 12:28 PM NHFT
Have it up in a tree and invite PatK. I want to see that.

Cathleen


All ya need is a tree with strong branches.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on February 28, 2007, 05:19 PM NHFT
You don't need branches.  for a treehouse You could build a deck around a tree and support it with diagonals from its outer edge angled down to the trunk of the tree.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Pat K on February 28, 2007, 05:35 PM NHFT
Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on February 28, 2007, 05:19 PM NHFT
You don't need branches.  You could build a deck around a tree and support it with diagonals from its outer edge angled down to the trunk of the tree.


Gee ya think, MR. Funky Lloyd Wrong.
I was replying to Cathleen, who for some strange
reason wants to see me in a tree.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Puke on February 28, 2007, 05:47 PM NHFT
I find this idea quite fascinating.
I think it would be great to have a subdivision or apartment building that caters to Porcs.
My only concern would be the appearance of a cult like compound.
We don't need to be in one building like Waco.  :-\
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 28, 2007, 07:51 PM NHFT
Quote from: Dreepa on February 28, 2007, 12:51 PM NHFT
You should talk about this at the next MVP meeting.
Good idea

Hey shuvom ... can we get 5 minutes?
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 28, 2007, 08:02 PM NHFT
Quote from: Puke on February 28, 2007, 05:47 PM NHFT
My only concern would be the appearance of a cult like compound.
We don't need to be in one building like Waco.  :-\
How about being normal friendly neighbors? :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Kat Kanning on February 28, 2007, 08:40 PM NHFT
I think we should start a cult.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 28, 2007, 08:48 PM NHFT
I think I will also start a thread for "almost porcupine acres" for people who want to go around the banking establishment to buy something ... but want to pay property taxes and other rules afterward. Not as exciting for me, but the next step for some people.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on February 28, 2007, 08:50 PM NHFT
All those interested in the concept of living free and/or helping others through porcupine acres .... give me a call. We all need to get to know each other better for this journey. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Puke on February 28, 2007, 08:52 PM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on February 28, 2007, 08:02 PM NHFT
Quote from: Puke on February 28, 2007, 05:47 PM NHFT
My only concern would be the appearance of a cult like compound.
We don't need to be in one building like Waco.  :-\
How about being normal friendly neighbors? :)

Not that I have a problem with it. Just what others perception could be.
I still think it would be great to live in such a place.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Pat K on February 28, 2007, 09:05 PM NHFT
Quote from: Kat Kanning on February 28, 2007, 08:40 PM NHFT
I think we should start a cult.



Kats Cult and road clean up crew. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: dawn on March 01, 2007, 07:45 AM NHFT
Winchester does take properties for failure to pay taxes. There are actually a few of them coming up for sale in the immediate future. So, if you come to Winchester with the intention of not paying the property taxes, you can count on it being taken away. It takes a long time, but it will happen.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on March 01, 2007, 07:58 AM NHFT
I dub Dawn: The New, although,  more attractive and petite, 'Elizabeth' ;D

Well Gang,  I guess if we want to avoid taxes the conversation will have to go back to 'liberating' Pisgah
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 01, 2007, 08:31 AM NHFT
We already knew that evil town governments like to take property for not paying taxes.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 01, 2007, 08:32 AM NHFT
Quote from: Lloyd Danforth on March 01, 2007, 07:58 AM NHFT
Well Gang,  I guess if we want to avoid taxes the conversation will have to go back to 'liberating' Pisgah
Why would the Winchester town thugs be any happier about that?
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on March 01, 2007, 11:37 AM NHFT
It seemed more economical than buying property for them to confiscate
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 01, 2007, 04:06 PM NHFT
I don't plan on giving it over to them very easily.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 01, 2007, 04:30 PM NHFT
You could sell advertising space so when they burned you live on CNN the world would see you were sponsored by Reebok.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 01, 2007, 04:40 PM NHFT
I could come out in an orange robe and have the fuel can covered in nascar like stickers.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 01, 2007, 04:46 PM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 01, 2007, 04:40 PM NHFT
I could come out in an orange robe and have the fuel can covered in nascar like stickers.

;D

But, seriously folks...

Perhaps we could get sponsorship from folks that would like to buck the system, but aren't willing to risk their home. Maybe it would be worth 20 bucks a month to fund the CD effort.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: NC2NH on March 01, 2007, 04:48 PM NHFT
Quote from: KBCraig on February 28, 2007, 01:05 AM NHFT
With apologies to Vic Mizzy.

Pooooorc Acres is the place for me.
Freeeeee livin' is the life for me.
Aaaaanarchy spreadin' far and wide.
Screw politics, I don't take either side.

;)


:D ;D
+1
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 01, 2007, 05:15 PM NHFT
There are people who would like to see someone else buck the system .... and they could help from long distance. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 01, 2007, 05:21 PM NHFT
 It is not so important that many should be as good as you, as that there be some absolute goodness somewhere; for that will leaven the whole lump. There are thousands who are in opinion opposed to slavery and to the war, who yet in effect do nothing to put an end to them; who, esteeming themselves children of Washington and Franklin, sit down with their hands in their pockets, and say that they know not what to do, and do nothing; who even postpone the question of freedom to the question of free-trade, and quietly read the prices-current along with the latest advices from Mexico, after dinner, and, it may be, fall asleep over them both. What is the price-current of an honest man and patriot to-day? They hesitate, and they regret, and sometimes they petition; but they do nothing in earnest and with effect. They will wait, well disposed, for others to remedy the evil, that they may no longer have it to regret. At most, they give only a cheap vote, and a feeble countenance and Godspeed, to the right, as it goes by them. There are nine hundred and ninety-nine patrons of virtue to one virtuous man; but it is easier to deal with the real possessor of a thing than with the temporary guardian of it.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 01, 2007, 05:23 PM NHFT
we could have a "patrons of virtue" program. :)

"They know wot what to do" .... we can give them something. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Caleb on March 01, 2007, 07:29 PM NHFT
count me in for up to $200 per month.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 01, 2007, 07:53 PM NHFT
I will commit to labor (at the minimum).
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 01, 2007, 08:02 PM NHFT
Maybe I need to start threads in the region section about each potential project and the details so people can hop on certain buildings. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Pat K on March 01, 2007, 08:39 PM NHFT
I will bring Beer.  :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on March 01, 2007, 10:02 PM NHFT
Cool! Good Beer!
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 06:41 AM NHFT
... sure there is demand.
People around here pay $100+ a week for lodging. We can do it for the same ... and you can like your roomies.
We are also talking about land with houses.

All religions are man-made. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 06:45 AM NHFT
I am asking who is interested in these projects. Some people are ... some people are not.
If you think our idea is not realistic, please leave us to our fantasy. Some of us are quite happy doing what others think is impossible. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 07:05 AM NHFT
Caleb, Tom Sawyer, Fac, Tackle, Ithaca, Slim, quan, error, puke, livefree, lloyd .... all have some sort of interest in these projects
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on March 02, 2007, 07:07 AM NHFT
How do you know what my interest are?
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 07:08 AM NHFT
I read your posts.

Have I gotten it wrong?
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on March 02, 2007, 08:10 AM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 07:08 AM NHFT
I read your posts.

Have I gotten it wrong?

Lets see:
I got Pat up in a tree
I suggested liberating Pisgah rather than investing funds on property one plans to put at risk due to not paying taxes
I complemented  Pat's good taste in beer, thus denigrating Jim's and Roger's ;D
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 08:14 AM NHFT
How about we start about 3 project threads (house, acres, pisgah)?
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on March 02, 2007, 08:44 AM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 08:14 AM NHFT
How about we start about 3 project threads (house, acres, pisgah)?

Pisgah is a consideration for the future.

Partly related to the topic here is an interesting rent coming up I would be happy to do a third of, or, half.
http://nh.craigslist.org/apa/280663344.html
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on March 02, 2007, 08:45 AM NHFT
And another:
http://nh.craigslist.org/apa/264698378.html
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 02, 2007, 09:22 AM NHFT
I am willing to "invest" my labor to house Porcs in the Shire.

If we can get people to help spread the financial risk it would be a better deal than flushing money down the rent "toilet".

People can organize all the conferences with power speeches and it won't come anywhere close to the attention of one resisting property. Even if in the end the "man" gets the property we get something for our efforts... years of attention and housing for newly arriving compatriots. Plus a hell of alot of fun.

If Russell and others can go to jail I figure I can do construction, drink beer and build bonfires. ;D

Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 09:42 AM NHFT
I couldn't agree more.
That Tom Sawyer could talk me into paintin' a fence.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on March 02, 2007, 09:52 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 02, 2007, 09:22 AM NHFT
I am willing to "invest" my labor to house Porcs in the Shire.

If we can get people to help spread the financial risk it would be a better deal than flushing money down the rent "toilet".

People can organize all the conferences with power speeches and it won't come anywhere close to the attention of one resisting property. Even if in the end the "man" gets the property we get something for our efforts... years of attention and housing for newly arriving compatriots. Plus a hell of alot of fun.

If Russell and others can go to jail I figure I can do construction, drink beer and build bonfires. ;D



Maybe you get years. Maybe they concentrate on our radical asses and start the auction the day after the first check doesn't arrive ;D

I too will provide my labor and expertise and drink Pat's beer and sit around fires.  Its just that I could die any decade now and I don't want to risk the limited funds I have.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 02, 2007, 10:01 AM NHFT
Quote from: Lloyd 'Posterboy' Danforth on March 02, 2007, 09:52 AM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on March 02, 2007, 09:22 AM NHFT
I am willing to "invest" my labor to house Porcs in the Shire.

If we can get people to help spread the financial risk it would be a better deal than flushing money down the rent "toilet".

People can organize all the conferences with power speeches and it won't come anywhere close to the attention of one resisting property. Even if in the end the "man" gets the property we get something for our efforts... years of attention and housing for newly arriving compatriots. Plus a hell of alot of fun.

If Russell and others can go to jail I figure I can do construction, drink beer and build bonfires. ;D



Maybe you get years. Maybe they concentrate on our radical asses and start the auction the day after the first check doesn't arrive ;D

I too will provide my labor and expertise and drink Pat's beer and sit around fires.  Its just that I could die any decade now and I don't want to risk the limited funds I have.

Maybe the proprietor would rent you a room until you find your homestead. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: citizen_142002 on March 02, 2007, 12:15 PM NHFT
I'd be willing to help you guys out anyway I can, but this is going to be a big financial loss. There is not going to be a groundswell of support for you not paying property taxes. Most people think you should pay them and they won't bat an eyelash when you get evicted.
This really might generate more public backlash than its worth. Most people I've spoken to are in support of or indifferent to taking on the IRS and the ICE guys, but when you refuse local property tax, most people aren't going to feel to bad when the town takes your property. They will do so in 3 years or less, maybe just one if you never pay at all. So no matter how you look at it, there is a big financial loss, and I don't think it will do much constructive.

Personally I think the 'almost porc acres' idea is more sensible at the moment. But do what moves you.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 12:22 PM NHFT
Quote from: wholetthedogin? on March 02, 2007, 09:54 AM NHFT
Okay here it is for the entrepreneur.  5 unit on main drag in Berlin.  Existing laundromat(closed) additional storefront with a 1bedroom, 2 bedroom and four bedroom above.  $90k owner financed at 8% simple interest with a five year balloon.  Breathe some life back up there.   I have had no takers and what you are talking about doing may be affordable to do in Berlin if you wanted to live there.  
That is a possibility. I am mostly looking around our area, but we could also tackle other places as well. If anyone like the Berlin idea, just pipe up and we can start discussing it. Dog ... could you start a thread about this property in the north woods section of this forum?
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 12:31 PM NHFT
Quote from: citizen_142002 on March 02, 2007, 12:15 PM NHFT
I'd be willing to help you guys out anyway I can, but this is going to be a big financial loss.
Sometimes things work out better than you think.

If you give in to the government .... there are big financial losses.
25-50% of your income
1-4% of your (government assessed) house value every year
inflation if you hold their money

I support the Browns refusal to pay income taxes (and do likewise) and they are risking much to stand up to "the man".
If a slave never leaves the plantation (and risks being shot as he leaves), then he is never free.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: error on March 02, 2007, 12:43 PM NHFT
Quote from: citizen_142002 on March 02, 2007, 12:15 PM NHFT
So no matter how you look at it, there is a big financial loss, and I don't think it will do much constructive.

That's how you look at it.

It's not really your property if you have to pay rent to someone else in order to keep it, now is it?

For the government to come in and seize such a property would vividly demonstrate this for all to see.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 01:02 PM NHFT
... or for the government to not come seize the property.

There is a gang of bullies in the middle of towns like winchester. Does it seem better to pay those bullies 4% of your house a year or to spend your money the way you wish? Which one of those choices will help your neighbors be free to choose? :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 02, 2007, 02:49 PM NHFT
Quote from: citizen_142002 on March 02, 2007, 12:15 PM NHFT
I'd be willing to help you guys out anyway I can, but this is going to be a big financial loss. There is not going to be a groundswell of support for you not paying property taxes. Most people think you should pay them and they won't bat an eyelash when you get evicted.
This really might generate more public backlash than its worth. Most people I've spoken to are in support of or indifferent to taking on the IRS and the ICE guys, but when you refuse local property tax, most people aren't going to feel to bad when the town takes your property. They will do so in 3 years or less, maybe just one if you never pay at all. So no matter how you look at it, there is a big financial loss, and I don't think it will do much constructive.

Personally I think the 'almost porc acres' idea is more sensible at the moment. But do what moves you.


Nick any anecdotal info on the length of time and process that they attempt to take property would be very valuable...

I think moving forward and accessing as you advance is the best strategy... as opposed to sitting back at the base trying to plan the perfect way to move forward. Start off with the best guesses you can make and adapt to the situation. I don't think the support of the townfolk is even a deal breaker... everyone will want to see the drama unfold.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 03:33 PM NHFT
Some guys in Keene have said that no one has had their house seized in memory. Maybe they all just sell.
It sounds like some people have lost their houses or land in Winchester. Maybe we should contact these people and let them tell their story in our paper.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Pat K on March 02, 2007, 03:35 PM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 07:05 AM NHFT
Caleb, Tom Sawyer, Fac, Tackle, Ithaca, Slim, quan, error, puke, livefree, lloyd .... all have some sort of interest in these projects

Hey Windmill boy. Did you not see my
Post, I said Beer, you should know by now
That when I say beer I am serious.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: error on March 02, 2007, 03:36 PM NHFT
Hey, I'm serious about beer!
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 03:46 PM NHFT
The tree house idea is good for many locations and especially our homesteading of Pisgah. We can have a cooler at the bottom.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: citizen_142002 on March 02, 2007, 04:47 PM NHFT
I'm neither a lawyer nor town official so don't take this as legal advice. As far as I know Keene doesn't really seize houses, but the put a lien on it, and when you go to sell or you croak, then they seize what they are "owed".

Winchester does take properties, and it isn't uncommon in some towns for them to just auction off your house while you're still in it. I don't know how long Winchester takes to seize property for nonpayment of taxes, but it will. It might be 3 years or it might be one. Once you don't pay, they will probably send you a number of angry letters. After a certain amount of time you'll probably get a notice that your property has been seized and will be auctioned off. At this point you may be removed from the property, or you may just be left there until someone buys it at auction, then they will toss you, unless you buy your property back at auction.

This will devastate the credit score of anyone who has an official share in the property.

As far as the properties you mentioned, I think the big place with the barn on Warwick Road is still on the market. The other two I believe are under contract. I will check, but I can't since I'm on dialup right now, and it would take forever.

Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 02, 2007, 05:30 PM NHFT
Thanks for the incite. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 02, 2007, 06:07 PM NHFT
Quote from: wholetthedogin? on March 02, 2007, 05:40 PM NHFT
NH law only allows a town to earn an additional 15% over the three years owed (which was already collecting 18% per year).  Most lenders will throw non-escrowed real estate tax borrowers into foreclosure themselves for defaulting on mortgage instrument provisions(one of which is to pay real estate taxes when due).  Lenders spend a lot of time researching their borrowers tax liens/ it is rare that a lender gets caught off guard. 

If a town beats the property owner in a situation where there is no lender--- the former property owner would get any balance over the town's minimum reserve which would be all taxes owed at 18% per annum plus a 15% KICKER.  There is no usury law in NH.



+1 more useful information.  8)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 08:04 PM NHFT
It is very possible that a selling offering financing will want someone to promise to pay the town thugs. I am not interested in doing that.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: error on March 02, 2007, 08:07 PM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 08:04 PM NHFT
It is very possible that a selling offering financing will want someone to promise to pay the town thugs. I am not interested in doing that.

In that case, you'll have to pay cash. That should be fun. Take pictures of the seller and his lawyers when you spring that one on them. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: citizen_142002 on March 02, 2007, 08:40 PM NHFT
That's a good point. You'd have to buy it outright to avoid problems with the lender/ owner financeer.

Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 08:53 PM NHFT
It may be a problem. It may not.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Tom Sawyer on March 02, 2007, 09:56 PM NHFT
Russell has this old chest full of Krugerrands...
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 11:50 PM NHFT
and when the gold is gone ... I can live in the chest.

When the property tax guys come Caleb will say we are a Franciscan Order. We are not a good one, but we are trying to help people .... and we got that vow of poverty thing going for us. :
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Pat K on March 03, 2007, 01:15 AM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 11:50 PM NHFT
and when the gold is gone ... I can live in the chest.

When the property tax guys come Caleb will say we are a Franciscan Order. We are not a good one, but we are trying to help people .... and we got that vow of poverty thing going for us. :

Then Caleb will ask them if they, know any women he can date.  ;D
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: CNHT on March 03, 2007, 01:38 AM NHFT
Plenty of people have had their homes stolen out from under them and been evicted just prior to that by the town for not paying taxes.

Ask Bernie Bastien...he is but one.

He is in this video on the right I believe... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Orr070L-5gg

It takes about 3 years...they can by law do it. If they don't, it's only because they might choose to let you live there as long as the amount you owe doesn't exceed the amount for which they can sell.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 03, 2007, 02:47 AM NHFT
Quote from: Pat K on March 03, 2007, 01:15 AM NHFT
Then Caleb will ask them if they, know any women he can date.  ;D
We are very progressive.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on March 03, 2007, 07:00 AM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 11:50 PM NHFT
and when the gold is gone ... I can live in the chest.

When the property tax guys come Caleb will say we are a Franciscan Order. We are not a good one, but we are trying to help people .... and we got that vow of poverty thing going for us. :

Desales   or   Assisi?   They will ask. 
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 03, 2007, 07:15 AM NHFT
our own version of assisi ... not quite "secular" but with wives and beer.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Lloyd Danforth on March 03, 2007, 07:18 AM NHFT
I think there might be yet a third St. Francis.  In Hartford it is all about Desales.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: slim on March 03, 2007, 10:13 AM NHFT
Quote from: Russell Kanning on March 02, 2007, 11:50 PM NHFT
and when the gold is gone ... I can live in the chest.

When the property tax guys come Caleb will say we are a Franciscan Order. We are not a good one, but we are trying to help people .... and we got that vow of poverty thing going for us. :

I think you may be on something here. What if we started a "religion" where the only rule is that theft is wrong and none of the members should give in to threats against their lives, or property.
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 03, 2007, 05:07 PM NHFT
I don't like the term "religion", but I like your basic idea ... I try to follow what Jesus said ... and his simple instructions leave out theft and cooperation with evil. :)

Francis of Assisi broke from the evil system ... and I think he was on the right path. :)
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: Russell Kanning on March 04, 2007, 09:37 AM NHFT
How much does it cost to live at your place there?
Is it even better for you if people rent during the off season?
Title: Re: Porcupine House or Porcupine Acres
Post by: MikeforLiberty on March 05, 2007, 10:58 AM NHFT
I had a thought recently. A FreeStater leaving the area (NY) is selling his house. The property taxes here are extreme. My thought was to buy his house with Constitution/real money, about 10,000 silver dollars and have that as a tax base. As opposed to paying with FRaud money to the tune of $100,000. Knocking the tax rate down 90% would make it reasonable. Of course, the local socialist population would NOT support a tax protester here.

How many protesters would be needed to make a mess of a tax auction?