New idea for civil dis!

[freeborn]

I don't believe I have ever seen a legislator's penis.

That's because none of them have one aand they don't have any balls either.
It is only the lobbyists that have a penis and the legislators suck on them all the time.

[Pat McCotter]

...laws that make you more free...

{head explodes}

[MaineShark]

Yes, Anton, there is a lot of jerking under the golden dome, but I don't believe I have ever seen a legislator's penis.

If they were using the dome for public masturbation, that would be a far better thing than what they do use it for.

I don't know who coined the term "ultra-minarchist," but a guy by the name of Jason Sorens uses that term to describe his personal philosophy.  I adopted it because I think it's the most accurate term to describe my own views.  I'll be sure to let Jason know he is a statist.

Sorens isn't even a minarchist, based upon his posted political opinions on the FSP forum.  There is little he hasn't said the government should regulate, control, and generally use arbitrary violence to enforce.  Maybe he was one, someday in the distant past, but right here and now, he makes some of the worst legislators in Concord look like devoted friends of liberty, and has done more damage to liberty in NH than every public-pot-smoker in the entire state, combined.  I've lost count of how many FSP participants have dropped out rather than be publicly associated with him.

Joe

[AntonLee]

I'm about to finally move to NH. . .and I'm torn.  Do I inform the FSP that I've arrived, and be associated negatively with groups of people who choose to enable and condone violence towards peaceful people. . . or do I just come to NH and be a liberty loving activist without bothering to inform them.

What I read on the FSP boards sometimes is nothing more than true and honest statism.  You don't have to be an anarchist to choose to support non-aggression against your neighbors. . . . but some feel that you can love liberty and simultaneously support groups and ideas that would take liberty from others.

Sorens, for all his great wisdom, has had the same fucking idea lots of people do.  Geez, never ever thought someone would get the great idea of moving groups of people with similar mindsets together in order to form a community of people.   I originally FOUND the Free State Project because of a couple of statist friends from Massachusetts that had this great idea of moving all their fellow Masshole socialist types to NH in order to gain more "progress". . . .

at that point, I wanted to start something just like that, but instead of for socialists, for people that love liberty.  I found the FSP, I was excited for a long time.  .  . and then I found that those principles don't matter to some in the movement.

I've always wanted to move to NH.  Now I am, and to be honest, I'm quite turned off by many who claim they love liberty yet won't support very principled people.  I'm torn because there are people who I really admire in the movement that are very happy for every new person that moves and lets them know such. 

whatever, there are better things to deal with.

[Mike Barskey]

I'm excited that you're moving here (even though you're mere minutes away ). Where are you moving to? I'm guessing Keene.

Should you update the FSP when you move? What's your goal, or how would you benefit from doing it? One benefit is that the numbers go up, and the higher the number the slightly more attractive the FSP seems to potential movers (those who care about the number aren't super activists, in my opinion). One disadvantage is that you'll be on a list that the feds (or the state of NH?) might abuse some day (and I wouldn't put it past the FSP to hand the list over to the State if the State demanded "legally").

You also mentioned the disadvantage of being associated with statists. I don't think I agree with this argument: it sounds like the "poisoning the well" argument, but in reverse: "if I'm on a list that statists are on, then I might look like less of an anarchist!"

[FTL_Ian]

Most of us were statists at one time.  I say the FSP is still a valid concept that deserves your participation in that you should inform them of your move.  Spreading the FSP concept is still good, despite the confused members.  The more of "us" there are, the more likely the unprincipled ones will be influenced by us.

[AntonLee]

you both make good and valid points.

[William Lee]

I'm about to finally move to NH. . .and I'm torn.  Do I inform the FSP that I've arrived, and be associated negatively with groups of people who choose to enable and condone violence towards peaceful people. . . or do I just come to NH and be a liberty loving activist without bothering to inform them.

People inform the FSP when they arrive?  I never signed up with the FSP before moving.  (Actually, I hadn't even read the FSP website before moving.)  I guess it makes sense that people would update their status from potential to actual mover.  I agree with Mike.  If you see it as beneficial, do it. 

There are people who care about those numbers.  I've had fingers wagged at me for not signing up.  I didn't avoid it for fear of association or being on a list the State might find interesting.  I just don't think the numbers are an effective advertising strategy and don't really see the point.  It's honestly just something I haven't bothered to do.  What I see bringing in people is the activism and the events, not the numbers.  I've never met anyone who said, "well, the numbers got to x,xxx and I thought it's time."  That doesn't mean such people do not exist but I have not encountered that.

Personally, I hadn't really been paying much attention to either before I moved.  I just liked the idea of trying to build a libertarian community, a new world in the shell of the old, to borrow from the Wobblies, and you need a bunch of libertarians all in one place to make that happen. 

[dalebert]

The more I think about it, the numbers are a political thing. They're the ones with a strategy based on overpowering their opponents and that requires numbers. I keep saying I'd rather have 20 more Laurens or 20 more Russells or 20 more Sams than 20 thousand more political activists. It actually seemed like a pipe dream when I first said it but now I'm beginning to think it may happen! Should we have a counter that goes up to 20? haha.

[William Lee]

The more I think about it, the numbers are a political thing. They're the ones with a strategy based on overpowering their opponents and that requires numbers. I keep saying I'd rather have 20 more Laurens or 20 more Russells or 20 more Sams than 20 thousand more political activists. It actually seemed like a pipe dream when I first said it but now I'm beginning to think it may happen! Should we have a counter that goes up to 20? haha.

I think you're probably right about that.  When I had first heard of the FSP, I thought the whole point was taking over the state government, which turned me off to it.

[K. Darien Freeheart]

I'm a Free Stater and I advocate so much non-aggression I cancel those screwballs out.

[Keyser Soce]

I'm about to finally move to NH. . .and I'm torn.  Do I inform the FSP that I've arrived, and be associated negatively with groups of people who choose to enable and condone violence towards peaceful people. . . or do I just come to NH and be a liberty loving activist without bothering to inform them.

I just don't think the numbers are an effective advertising strategy

They are.

and don't really see the point

The point is that they are

I've never met anyone who said, "well, the numbers got to x,xxx and I thought it's time."  That doesn't mean such people do not exist but I have not encountered that.

Many people who are signed up used triggers to formalize their commitment. Originally, I was committed to  move when there were x signers. That passed and I was on the way out of the country were it not for the first 1,000. The numbers do matter. It's not too late to move the counter. Contact Seth.

[anthonybpugh]

http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/104260