cop stop 2007

[supperman15]

hello everyone
i had an idea today and i passed it around at taproom Tuesday and got some good feedback.   the basic premise is this, everyone talks about what they will do when they encounter a leo either at a traffic stop or while being stopped on the street, but who has choked who has gotten to in the situation and thought, hey what did so and so think i should say.  well wouldn't it be nice to have an opportunity to say "i never consent to searches"?    what this would be is essentially a dry run where you would be stopped either in your car or on the street by a leo or someone pretending to be a leo, and they would then tell you what you did that you didn't need to do and what you did to enforce your rights and then they would run you through it again
this would let you to have as real of an experience as possible and give you practice at respectively educating leos that there are people who know there rights and help build your confidence when you do get stopped for real.

thoughts or ideas?

[KBCraig]

I've got a friend who is a libertarian-leaning LEO, who salutes the FSP and wants to move to NH. If I ever convince him to make the move, I know he'd be willing to play the cop role.

While I am technically a LEO, I don't work in public, don't do traffic stops, and don't need to use cons and pretexts for searches. And I would suck at it, because I don't have that mindset.

[Kat Kanning]

Maybe Lauren and Jim would dress up in their nazi outfits and shake us down. 

[d_goddard]

This idea has been bouncing around in various forms for some time -- it would be great for someone to pick up the ball and run with it.

The incarnation I like best is to have a training session at PorcFest. Get a liberty-friendly current or former LEO (like maybe someone from LEAP, or armlaw) to "play cop" and run through the scenario. Give people a chance to role-play, to practice the magic phrases to use ("am I being detained?" "Sorry, I never consent to searches").

[Sam Adams]

Maybe a training video would work. The concept could be expanded to include runins with all sorts of bureaurats [sic], code enforcement officers, etc. Kind of a "What to say when the XXXX, XXXXs you."

[J’raxis 270145]

Having a real LEO do it would probably be the most useful—someone who's trained in and can use the intimidation/interrogation tactics real cops use in real situations.

[d_goddard]

I think you have to roleplay for this to be effective, and the more realistic the roleplay, the more effective.
Most people are, like myself, VERY intimidated when a cop pulls them over. The authority is so thick and so bred into us. You need practice at looking right into the eyes of the man with the gun, badge, and walkie-talkie, and asserting your rights.

"I do not consent to any search."
"Am I being detained?" "Yes? I wish to speak to a lawyer." "No? Good, I wish to go about my business."

[supperman15]

i think if we could find three leos willing to help the day will go faster.  i was thinking a porcfest might be the best place to do it on a large scale but maybe we can put together an afternoon to work out the kinks.  While videos are good, the whole point of this is to practice in as close to real to life interactions with leos.  Also if we can get some real leos to help us with this it may go a long way to meeting them on a common ground and help us discover ways that can help stop violence.

[Rev, Ron]

Hey anyone know of any old retired Cops,  or SS officers.
They're one of the same, They can teach us.   

[d_goddard]

Dick Marple, aka armlaw on this Forum, is a retired cop.
He's not exactly "normal cop", but I bet he could be scary when he turns it on.

Brad J. is a LEAP officer, I'll connect anyone who is serious about setting up Cop Stop with him if you don't already know him.