Probably best to avoid a state marriage license

[malcolm]

His wife kicked him out without just cause.  She got everything...kids, house, all of Russell's personal possessions (which she wouldn't give to him).  Last he saw her she was driving a brand new Escalade.  After she kicked him out, she got a restraining order claiming he was violent (Mr. Pacifist, violent  ).  She refused to let him see his children.  She refuses to let him even call his children.  He decided he was not going to be a slave to some woman who treated him like that - to pay for her to take his children away from him.   He's offered to take the children.  He wanted nothing more than to stay there and raise the kids, be a family.  She chose otherwise.  Now he's in jail for not paying child support.  The kids don't even know why he doesn't call or see them - the mother lets them think he just doesn't care.  He won't be mean enough to her to tell the kids what's happening.

If he takes $50 off the debt for every day in jail, he'll be in there like 10 years.

Take heed, gentlemen.  The Family Courts are one of the few state institutions which can be effectively avoided.

DO NOT MARRY.  Until the courts see major reform (ahem, yeah right) it's just too risky.

Your pleas will go unheard.  You have no rights as a father.  You have no rights as a husband.  You are an asset to be raided.  And you can be jailed for not paying your ex.  (You thought debtor's prisons were abolished?  That's cute.)

I posted a thread on this issue not 24 hours ago: http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=13356.0  Replies regarding father's rights should probably go there, so as to not thread-jack this topic.

It's a shame that Russell has been entrapped like this.

[lildog]

His wife kicked him out without just cause.  She got everything...kids, house, all of Russell's personal possessions (which she wouldn't give to him).  Last he saw her she was driving a brand new Escalade.  After she kicked him out, she got a restraining order claiming he was violent (Mr. Pacifist, violent  ).  She refused to let him see his children.  She refuses to let him even call his children.  He decided he was not going to be a slave to some woman who treated him like that - to pay for her to take his children away from him.   He's offered to take the children.  He wanted nothing more than to stay there and raise the kids, be a family.  She chose otherwise.  Now he's in jail for not paying child support.  The kids don't even know why he doesn't call or see them - the mother lets them think he just doesn't care.  He won't be mean enough to her to tell the kids what's happening.

If he takes $50 off the debt for every day in jail, he'll be in there like 10 years.

Take heed, gentlemen.  The Family Courts are one of the few state institutions which can be effectively avoided.

DO NOT MARRY.  Until the courts see major reform (ahem, yeah right) it's just too risky.

Your pleas will go unheard.  You have no rights as a father.  You have no rights as a husband.  You are an asset to be raided.  And you can be jailed for not paying your ex.  (You thought debtor's prisons were abolished?  That's cute.)

Avoiding marriage wont help.

A roommate of mine in college was served papers for a child he fathered and didn't even know about 8 years prior.  He messed around with a girl in high school but she left him.  Turns out she was pregnant but never let him know.  She raised the baby for 8 years and made a choice that she didn't want him part of it so she didn't tell him.  8 years later she lost her job and filed for unemployment.  The state she lived in required her to list how much support the father gave and when she listed zero the state forced her into suing for back child support.  After the paternity tested proved the girl was his he was forced to pay out thousands of dollars for a child he didn't even know about even with the mother saying she wanted no part of him in their lives.

[Kat Kanning]

Fuck you, Malcolm.  Go to fucking hell.

His wife kicked him out without just cause.  She got everything...kids, house, all of Russell's personal possessions (which she wouldn't give to him).  Last he saw her she was driving a brand new Escalade.  After she kicked him out, she got a restraining order claiming he was violent (Mr. Pacifist, violent  ).  She refused to let him see his children.  She refuses to let him even call his children.  He decided he was not going to be a slave to some woman who treated him like that - to pay for her to take his children away from him.   He's offered to take the children.  He wanted nothing more than to stay there and raise the kids, be a family.  She chose otherwise.  Now he's in jail for not paying child support.  The kids don't even know why he doesn't call or see them - the mother lets them think he just doesn't care.  He won't be mean enough to her to tell the kids what's happening.

If he takes $50 off the debt for every day in jail, he'll be in there like 10 years.

Take heed, gentlemen.  The Family Courts are one of the few state institutions which can be effectively avoided.

DO NOT MARRY.  Until the courts see major reform (ahem, yeah right) it's just too risky.

Your pleas will go unheard.  You have no rights as a father.  You have no rights as a husband.  You are an asset to be raided.  And you can be jailed for not paying your ex.  (You thought debtor's prisons were abolished?  That's cute.)

I posted a thread on this issue not 24 hours ago: http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=13356.0  Replies regarding father's rights should probably go there, so as to not thread-jack this topic.

It's a shame that Russell has been entrapped like this.

[malcolm]

Fuck you, Malcolm.  Go to fucking hell.

Whoa, Kat!  Has it escaped your notice that I'm FIRMLY on his side, and feel for his plight.  Ignoring the facts of the state of our legal system won't make things any better.  I want to see a better world, and am willing to work for that.

[lildog]

Fuck you, Malcolm.  Go to fucking hell.

His wife kicked him out without just cause.  She got everything...kids, house, all of Russell's personal possessions (which she wouldn't give to him).  Last he saw her she was driving a brand new Escalade.  After she kicked him out, she got a restraining order claiming he was violent (Mr. Pacifist, violent  ).  She refused to let him see his children.  She refuses to let him even call his children.  He decided he was not going to be a slave to some woman who treated him like that - to pay for her to take his children away from him.   He's offered to take the children.  He wanted nothing more than to stay there and raise the kids, be a family.  She chose otherwise.  Now he's in jail for not paying child support.  The kids don't even know why he doesn't call or see them - the mother lets them think he just doesn't care.  He won't be mean enough to her to tell the kids what's happening.

If he takes $50 off the debt for every day in jail, he'll be in there like 10 years.

Take heed, gentlemen.  The Family Courts are one of the few state institutions which can be effectively avoided.

DO NOT MARRY.  Until the courts see major reform (ahem, yeah right) it's just too risky.

Your pleas will go unheard.  You have no rights as a father.  You have no rights as a husband.  You are an asset to be raided.  And you can be jailed for not paying your ex.  (You thought debtor's prisons were abolished?  That's cute.)

I posted a thread on this issue not 24 hours ago: http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=13356.0  Replies regarding father's rights should probably go there, so as to not thread-jack this topic.

It's a shame that Russell has been entrapped like this.

Did I miss something here?  What exactly did Malcolm say merit that response?

[malcolm]

Avoiding marriage wont help.

A roommate of mine in college was served papers for a child he fathered and didn't even know about 8 years prior.  He messed around with a girl in high school but she left him.  Turns out she was pregnant but never let him know.  She raised the baby for 8 years and made a choice that she didn't want him part of it so she didn't tell him.  8 years later she lost her job and filed for unemployment.  The state she lived in required her to list how much support the father gave and when she listed zero the state forced her into suing for back child support.  After the paternity tested proved the girl was his he was forced to pay out thousands of dollars for a child he didn't even know about even with the mother saying she wanted no part of him in their lives.

Avoiding marriage will preserve your assets and avoid alimony.  Child support (back-door alimony) is just another hurtle, but after 18 years you're free.  She can't take your house and 401k unless you sign a marriage license.

And use a condom.  Your own condom.  Not one that she provides.

[JJ]

Fuck you, Malcolm.  Go to fucking hell.

Whoa, Kat!  Has it escaped your notice that I'm FIRMLY on his side, and feel for his plight.  Ignoring the facts of the state of our legal system won't make things any better.  I want to see a better world, and am willing to work for that.

I believe a modicum of tact is useful in a situation such as this.  You may still execute your freedom of speech but consideration and tact will serve to lubricate the gears of communication. 

[Caleb]

I think it makes sense to say that Kat is probably very distraught right now. She is Russell's WIFE.

Malcolm took this case of the state attacking someone who was just sitting there to post his anti-marriage thoughts. The irony that our sympathy is with Kat precisely because she is married to Russell seems to have escaped his notice.

That being said I think (hope) that what Malcolm was really saying is not to involve the State in your marriage.

[David]

Kat is very happy in her marriage  to Russell, and was very upset after his arrest.  I has got to be difficult to know that the one you love has been taken from you. 

[picaro]

And use a condom.  Your own condom.  Not one that she provides.

Or... find a good woman.    Life is full of risks.   Betting on the most cynical, worst-case scenario is safer -- but it will also close-off your potential to reap many of life's rewards.

Does NH treat common law marriage differently?   In IL, they treated common law couples as married -- licensed or not.

[malcolm]

That being said I think (hope) that what Malcolm was really saying is not to involve the State in your marriage.

That is what I am saying, and I'm sorry for not making more clear.

My point is that by avoiding a marriage license, you can largely avoid the perils of the Family Courts.

[malcolm]

Or... find a good woman.    Life is full of risks.   Betting on the most cynical, worst-case scenario is safer -- but it will also close-off your potential to reap many of life's rewards.

Does NH treat common law marriage differently?   In IL, they treated common law couples as married -- licensed or not.

I have earned my cynicism.  For four years I worked as a Human Resources Manager, overseeing a staff of between 190 and 450 people.  I knew most of their personal stories, and could tell you things that would set your hair on end.  I've seen every possible permutation of marital perfidy that is possible.

[Caleb]

That being said I think (hope) that what Malcolm was really saying is not to involve the State in your marriage.

That is what I am saying, and I'm sorry for not making more clear.

My point is that by avoiding a marriage license, you can largely avoid the perils of the Family Courts.

still, just for future reference, you probably want to keep sentiments like that out of a thread about someone getting arrested, particularly so soon after it has happened. These threads are for saying nice things to the family, wishing him well, showing your support, and wishing all manner of ill upon the goons who did it. 

[malcolm]

still, just for future reference, you probably want to keep sentiments like that out of a thread about someone getting arrested, particularly so soon after it has happened. These threads are for saying nice things to the family, wishing him well, showing your support, and wishing all manner of ill upon the goons who did it. 

Understood.

When I hear of something like this, I go into strategy/damage-control/public-warning mode.  I've seen more of this scenario than I ever care to again.  I want to protect as many men from this fate as possible.  (And, yes.  It's always men.  I have never seen a woman jailed for obstructing parental visitation.)

[Caleb]

well i have. my ex-wife's mother (who lives in near poverty and is a single mother caring for a disabled child) is still having the state seize her stuff because of alicia's asshole father who makes over $200 grand a year, but got awarded custody and child support...He would lie to Alicia about her mom, and then make rules like "Brittany (alicia's baby sister) can't go to see her mom unless alicia chooses to". of course, since alicia had been convinced that her mom was the devil, alicia didn't want to go, and thus brittany (who loved her mom and really wanted to see her) wasn't allowed. it goes both ways, and I'm going to separate this thread off, so hopefully that will get you out of trouble.