Fasting for Russell's release

[Notanumber]

Im not discouraging this in any way.  I just have a question for those who know about fasting.  It has always been my understanding that fasting, and even modified fasting, is potentially counterproductive in maintaining health due to 1. lack of necessary protein, 2. metabolic adaptation, 3. loss of significant lean body mass, which also lowers metabolism long term.  Is this incorrect?  Can anyone refer me to studies which show the physical benefits of fasting?

[Lex]

There are crazy vegans that can go for years perfectly fine without supplementing with B12 and not eating any meat.

What you don't realize is that those people walk by night and drink blood. Cancer incidence is strongly linked to several vitamin deficiencies. Good nutrition is a good idea during caloric restriction.

My point is that I find it absurd that people think that pills manufactured god knows where are necessary to being healthy. People adapt to whatever environment they live in and what food they have available.

The Eskimos don't exactly get the 'recommended' dose of fruits and veggies and they have survived for quite some time.

Diets, pills, nutritional supplements are all scams in my opinion based on the above logic.

Eat good, natural, healthy food and you'll be fine. If you are truely lacking in some nutriet/mineral due to sickness or other problems than instead of taking supplements find a food item that has this nutrient naturally and eat that instead.

[Lex]

Im not discouraging this in any way.  I just have a question for those who know about fasting.  It has always been my understanding that fasting, and even modified fasting, is potentially counterproductive in maintaining health due to 1. lack of necessary protein, 2. metabolic adaptation, 3. loss of significant lean body mass, which also lowers metabolism long term.  Is this incorrect?  Can anyone refer me to studies which show the physical benefits of fasting?

It's all relative. There is a big difference between a two week lemon cleans and a two month juice fast. Which one are you asking about specifically?

I will not be able to answer your question but I just thought I'd help you hone it down to something specific so that someone else would be better able to answer it Different kinds of fasts and for different periods of time all have different affects on the body I would think.

[kola]

Im not discouraging this in any way.  I just have a question for those who know about fasting.  It has always been my understanding that fasting, and even modified fasting, is potentially counterproductive in maintaining health due to 1. lack of necessary protein, 2. metabolic adaptation, 3. loss of significant lean body mass, which also lowers metabolism long term.  Is this incorrect?  Can anyone refer me to studies which show the physical benefits of fasting?

I think you have been told some lies.

If you are truely interested in learning about the benfits of juicing I am sure the internet has plenty of valid available information. If your interest is only to consider juice fasting as quackery then anything presented (by me or anyone else) will only ridiculed.

Internet access is a great way to learn if that is what you are wanting to do. Why not see what you can find and post it here for us. Thanks!   

Kola

[kola]

Lex, I am not a big fan of supps but they do have a place.

It is my belief that B12 supps should be used as a a precautionary measure when juicing or when being a strict vegan. I have seen many people become B12 deficient who becme anemic and/or get some type of neurological problem. (numbness, tingling, muscle weakness). I often use and advise B12 injections (or tabs) as do many MD's where B12 deficiency is quite common in the elderly) because of their poor eating habits (living alone, unable to make meals etc). B12 deficiency is a reality but not all docs are looking for it.

Supps have a place. Sailors would not have gotten scurvy if they had Vit C tablets. Thank god they finally figurered out they were lacking it and supplemented with limes onboard. Damn Limeys!

OTOH, most of the food we now get is lacking vits/mins and other nutrients becuase the soil is depleted and there are GMO's being grown. There are only certain things the body can make and others are needed from diet. If we can't get it by eating the right food then we have to get it from somewhere. In my practice I have seen some people cause themselves harm because they attempted to do a alternative program and did not have all the facts.

Kola

[Kat Kanning]

I was having tingling/numbness in my index fingers and thumbs sometime, before I started this fast, so I'd take B12 sups.  Strangely enough, it's gone away during the fast and I hadn't been taking any B12.

[kola]

That could have been swollen wrists/fluid retention causing carpal tunnel sumptoms. Juicing will reduce that. Some folks do fine witout B12. I advise it as precautionary but its not the rule. If you feel ok, Kat continue as you are. but just be aware of it in case you get symptoms. Thats all.

Kola

[kola]

btw, for CTS folks, I advise B6 not B12.

Kola

[Lex]

I generally only buy oranic or locally grown produce which tastes better and I would assume also has much more nutritional value than the generic GMO imported stuff. I also eat meat, so get plenty of B12

But I should definitely do a fast or a cleans soon. It's my spring time resolution, maybe sometime next month I'll do a lemon cleans for two weeks.

[kola]

Yeah Lex, fall and spring are great times to do a cleanse. (and anytime you begin to get sick).

I advise folks to go for at least 30 days...but encourage 2-3 months.  I like the program Kat is doing for one very big reason. WHY? Because it is a 92 day cleanse. 3 months devoted to cleaning out the sludge and rebuilding. IMO it takes at least 60-90 days to clean out the crud and then start reparing things.

We subject our bodies to a lot of funk and gunk. It takes more than a week or two to make big changes.
otoh if you are relatively healthy then a short term clease is beneficial.

although I strongly believe in cleanses I think it is most important to adapt to the lifelong nutritional eating regime that is enjoyable and productive. Prevention.

I personally eat some meats and fish and eggs and goat cheese, but only organic or wild. All my produce is either homegrown (by myself) or purchased from co-op organic farmers. When I had cancer and was on the Gerson program I could not eat no meats, fish or poultry,no dairy, no spices and no oils except flax. I am currently 3 years in remission and have had no new tumor growths. (btw I refused chemo and radiation). A cancer patients chances are much better if you avoid it and boost your immune sytem instead of destroying it.

Kola

[Notanumber]

Im not discouraging this in any way.  I just have a question for those who know about fasting.  It has always been my understanding that fasting, and even modified fasting, is potentially counterproductive in maintaining health due to 1. lack of necessary protein, 2. metabolic adaptation, 3. loss of significant lean body mass, which also lowers metabolism long term.  Is this incorrect?  Can anyone refer me to studies which show the physical benefits of fasting?

I think you have been told some lies.
If you are truely interested in learning about the benfits of juicing I am sure the internet has plenty of valid available information. If your interest is only to consider juice fasting as quackery then anything presented (by me or anyone else) will only ridiculed.
Internet access is a great way to learn if that is what you are wanting to do. Why not see what you can find and post it here for us. Thanks!   
Kola

Maybe I have been lied to, maybe I havent.  That is why I asked for you to give me the counterargument.  I have no interest in ridiculing anyone.  I have read studies which show that extreme calorie restriction can cause a loss of lean body mass, which in turn lowers metabolism, and can create a negative cycle.  I have also read studies that show that fruit juices without the corresponding fiber of the fruit can cause insulin to spike which also has the effect of lowering metabolism and potentially enhancing adipose storage.

You all seem to know alot about these modified fasts, so I asked you to share your information with me.  If you don't want to, that's fine, and Im sorry I offended you.  I will continue on in blissful ignorance.  Carry on.

[kola]

You all seem to know alot about these modified fasts, so I asked you to share your information with me.  If you don't want to, that's fine, and Im sorry I offended you.  I will continue on in blissful ignorance.  Carry on.

My apologies in refusing to copy and paste information for you but like I said, if you are really interested they are many places to find the information. (internet access makes it a cakewalk)

You comment stating that you "will to continue on being blissfully ignorant" tells me you have no real interest in pursuing the topic on your own. Why not google it out and do some reading on your own and then come back. I would gladly discuss it then. Fair enough? 

Kola 

[Notanumber]

You all seem to know alot about these modified fasts, so I asked you to share your information with me.  If you don't want to, that's fine, and Im sorry I offended you.  I will continue on in blissful ignorance.  Carry on.

My apologies in refusing to copy and paste information for you but like I said, if you are really interested they are many places to find the information. (internet access makes it a cakewalk)
You comment stating that you "will to continue on being blissfully ignorant" tells me you have no real interest in pursuing the topic on your own. Why not google it out and do some reading on your own and then come back. I would gladly discuss it then. Fair enough? 
Kola 

No apology necessary.  I have researched this subject all that I care to in the past, and ended up with what is clearly different information than you have.  From this point on, I purposely engage in rational ignorance.  For me to spend more time researching this, I need to believe there will be a return on that investment.  I saw that you all do something different, and wondered what information you have that I don't.  But its not worth spending an hour or two on, just as it probably isnt worth it to you to link me to your information, so then, no information will be exchanged. 

[Lex]

Fascinating discussion you guys are having! 

[Notanumber]

Fascinating discussion you guys are having! 

Or not having.