Atheist soldier claims harassment

[Jim Johnson]

From CNN
     
JUNCTION CITY, Kansas (AP) -- Like hundreds of young men joining the Army in recent years, Jeremy Hall professes a desire to serve his country while it fights terrorism.


Spc. Jeremy Hall says the pressure to believe in God is so strong, "I was ashamed to say that I was an atheist."

But the short and soft-spoken specialist is at the center of a legal controversy. He has filed a lawsuit alleging that he's been harassed and his constitutional rights have been violated because he doesn't believe in God. The suit names Defense Secretary Robert Gates.

"I'm not in it for cash," Hall said. "I want no one else to go what I went through."

Known as "the atheist guy," Hall has been called immoral, a devil worshipper and -- just as severe to some soldiers -- gay, none of which, he says, is true. Hall even drove fellow soldiers to church in Iraq and paused while they prayed before meals.

"I see a name and rank and United States flag on their shoulder. That's what I believe everyone else should see," he said.

Hall, 23, was raised in a Protestant family in North Carolina and dropped out of school. It wasn't until he joined the Army that he began questioning religion, eventually deciding that he couldn't follow any faith.

But he feared how that would look to other soldiers.

"I was ashamed to say that I was an atheist," Hall said.

It eventually came out in Iraq in 2007, when he was in a firefight. Hall was a gunner on a Humvee, which took several bullets in its protective shield. Afterward, his commander asked whether he believed in God, Hall said.

"I said, 'No, but I believe in Plexiglas,' " Hall said. "I've never believed I was going to a happy place. You get one life. When I die, I'm worm food."

The issue came to a head when, according to Hall, a superior officer, Maj. Freddy J. Welborn, threatened to bring charges against him for trying to hold a meeting of atheists in Iraq. Welborn has denied Hall's allegations.

Hall said he had had enough but feared that he wouldn't get support from Welborn's superiors. He turned to Mikey Weinstein and the Military Religious Freedom Foundation.

Weinstein is the foundation's president and a U.S. Air Force Academy graduate. He had sued the Air Force for acts he said illegally imposed Christianity on students at the academy, though that case was dismissed. He calls Hall a hero.

"The average American doesn't have enough intestinal fortitude to tell someone to shut up if they are talking in a movie theater," Weinstein said. "You know how hard it is to take on your chain of command? This isn't the shift manager at KFC."

Hall was in Qatar when the lawsuit was filed September 18 in federal court in Kansas City, Kansas. Other soldiers learned of it, and he feared for his own safety. Once, Hall said, a group of soldiers followed him, harassing him, but no one did anything to make it stop.

The Army told him it couldn't protect him and sent him back to Fort Riley. He resumed duties with a military police battalion. He believes that his promotion to sergeant has been blocked because of his lawsuit, but he is a team leader responsible for two junior enlisted soldiers.

No one with Fort Riley, the Army or that Defense Department would comment about Hall or the lawsuit. Each issued statements saying that discrimination will not be tolerated regardless of race, religion or gender.

"The department respects [and supports by its policy] the rights of others to their own religious beliefs, including the right to hold no beliefs," said Eileen Lainez, a spokeswoman for the Department of Defense.

All three organizations said existing systems help soldiers "address and resolve any perceived unfair treatment."

Lt. Col. David Shurtleff, a Fort Riley chaplain, declined to discuss Hall's case but said chaplains accommodate all faiths as best they can. In most cases, religious issues can be worked out without jeopardizing military operations.

"When you're in Afghanistan and an IED blows up a Humvee, they aren't asking about a wounded soldier's faith," Shurtleff said.

Hall said he enjoys being a team leader but has been told that having faith would make him a better leader.

"I will take care of my soldiers. Nowhere does it say I have to pray with my soldiers, but I do have to make sure my soldiers' religious needs are met," he said.

"Religion brings comfort to a lot of people," he said. "Personally, I don't want it or need it. But I'm not going to get down on anybody else for it."

Hall leaves the Army in April 2009. He would like to find work with the National Park Service or Environmental Protection Agency, anything outdoors.

"I hope this doesn't define me," Hall said of his lawsuit. "It's just about time somebody said something."

[Tom Sawyer]

I noticed a trend to more "born again" type Christians in the military especially after I had gotten out. A weird kind of kill the infidels kind.

I was brought up going to church and have respect for many of the Christian families I've known, good people. But, alot of the "born again" zealot types I saw coming into the military worried me. They had a strange mix of nationalism blended in. Not following the teachings of Christ more the Old Testament vengeful God kind. I wouldn't have counted on them to cover my ass at all.

[Jim Johnson]

When I was in the Army, '76 to '80, people where just stunned silent by my atheism.
Maybe they've passed through the ridicule stage and are on to the 'attack them' phase... "and then you win".... not that there is anything to win.

[Puke]

Hmm, I never had any problems. I had a very religious Mormon roommate as well. We used to talk about religion every now and then.
Religion never came up much that I can recall.

[Tom Sawyer]

We were quite devout "worshippers of the vinyl object' 

[Jim Johnson]

So, the Schnergenbergers are real! 

The 'vinyl object' is fabled to be the center piece of the sacred table of the Prince of Schnergenborgen and is only used during the feast of Ikthemas, The Mass of Fish.

The Late 1800s... European researchers used an earlier discovered gas called vinyl chloride in a mixture, creating what they considered to be a useless rigid material. Although this material was examined by other scientists, none could find a commercial use for it.

The 1920s ... In 1926, Dr. Waldo Semon, a researcher at The BFGoodrich Company in Akron, Ohio, was attempting to find an adhesive that would bond rubber to metal. He began experimenting with the discarded material by combining it with other chemicals and exposing it to heat. The result was plasticized polyvinyl chloride - which we now call PVC or vinyl - a flexible "gel" that had striking similarities to natural rubber.

Throughout the late 1920s, Semon continued to experiment with this new material, but BFGoodrich had a difficult time marketing it.

The 1930s ... Vinyl (PVC or polyvinyl chloride) remained a laboratory curiosity until its first commercial use - shock absorber seals - opened the eyes of industry to other potential applications that might reduce the country's dependence on limited rubber resources. Of note, flexible vinyl was used to develop the first American synthetic tires, which we have on our cars today.

These early successes led to further experimentation with vinyl formulations. Vinyl plastisol, a solution of vinyl resin in plasticizer, was first used as a coating to make waterproof fabric for a number of products. Today, vinyl-coated fabrics are used to make everything from durable, lightweight inflatable rafts to easy-to-clean, attractive wallcovering.

The 1940s ... Vinyl played a significant role for the armed forces during World War II, addressing severe shortages of natural rubber. As a result of its superior safety and performance as a nonflammable electrical wire coating, vinyl has remained the standard material for wire insulation.

The 1950s ... Vinyl's capabilities continued to diversify, as new formulations further expanded the material's physical properties and opened new markets. The most important innovation came when irrigation pipe made from rigid vinyl was introduced to the United States. Now the largest market for vinyl production, PVC pipe is recognized as a less expensive, non-corrosive and more easily installed alternative to metal pipe.

Today and Tomorrow ... Since Dr. Semon's accidental discovery more than seven decades ago, vinyl's use has grown and expanded in virtually every industry, but most notably in the construction industry. Of the more than 30 billion pounds of vinyl produced worldwide today, about 60 percent is used in the construction industry. Industry projections indicate that this growth will continue well into the future, especially to meet the infrastructure needs of a growing global population.

So you see how a Mass of Fish can grow into the world wide domination of virtually every industry in the world!

Fight the Schnergenbergers, they're every where.   

[Tom Sawyer]

Wow, thanks for taken us down that rabbit hole. 

[Lloyd Danforth]

When I was in Basic Training, they had a hard time wrapping their heads around 'No Preference' which was the only non-religion reference, but, they had a real hard time with my refusal to buy US Savings bonds

[Kat Kanning]

they had a real hard time with my refusal to buy US Savings bonds

You rebel! 

[Otosan]

When I was asked to join the military, and as they were passing out dog tags, they asked me my religion, I said agnostic.  The guy looked up from the table and said we can not put that on your tags, saw I was from AL so he typed in SB (Southern Baptist).
Also when I was at boot camp they "required" you to attend services.
I guess they did not want us "non believers" just sitting around the barracks.

[dalebert]

Church services weren't required in my Navy boot camp but they were STRONGLY encouraged, and I remember thinking that I would be on someone's bad side if I didn't go.

When I was training on a power plant in Idaho, there was a lot of discussion by Christians about how silly the Mormon religion was and I couldn't help but think "Look who's talking." I would occasionally get in debates with some of the more fundamentalist types. There was this one chief who was constantly talking about religion with people, often with me standing right there, and once or twice I said something questioning what he was saying because it was nonsensical, and he would basically just rudely let me know that I wasn't welcome in the conversation. Once after that, he told me to let people know about some church social, and I said I wouldn't be able to attend, and he said "I didn't say you were invited. I just said to let others know.", i.e. it was open to anyone who wanted to attend, except me, and he expected me to advertise it for him.

[Lloyd Danforth]

When I was asked to join the military, and as they were passing out dog tags, they asked me my religion, I said agnostic.  The guy looked up from the table and said we can not put that on your tags, saw I was from AL so he typed in SB (Southern Baptist).
Also when I was at boot camp they "required" you to attend services.
I guess they did not want us "non believers" just sitting around the barracks.

Yeah, you might just ask yourself "What the Hell am I doing here?"



and, go home




like I did

[Puke]

I've never had a problem getting my tags with "no pref" on them.
After BCT I had some made that said "none" for religious pref.
I remember guys going to church during BCT b/c it meant not being in the barracks. They had to wear Class A's though. I preferred taking my chances with the Drill's and not having to wear those damn Class A's.

I wonder if my being in aviation had anything to do with it? Maybe the more religious types get suckered into the worse jobs?

[KBCraig]

Even as a Christian, I had either "NONE" or "NO PREF" on my tags. I always figured that if I were taking my last breaths, I really wouldn't care too much about who comforted me or what prayers he offered.

[Caleb]

When I was in Basic Training, they had a hard time wrapping their heads around 'No Preference' which was the only non-religion reference, but, they had a real hard time with my refusal to buy US Savings bonds

I'm not sure I understand this. Is there some unwritten rule that people in the military are supposed to buy US Savings bonds?