All you need to know about Bob Barr

[David]

My nonvoting stance is re-affirmed everytime I read something like this. 

All you need to know about Bob Barr
Posted on July 27th, 2008 by Brad Spangler
Bob Barr recently said he's running for the office of US president in order to "rekindle peoples faith in government". That is an anti-libertarian agenda.

Agorists, in particular among libertarians, recognize that perhaps the most crucial task in the process of building a revolutionary libertarian class consciousness is attacking and destroying faith in government. Only a fool or a villain would want to restore people's faith in government — because both the supposed moral legitimacy and the supposed practical utility of government are lies. Myths. Tall tales. Whoppers. Bullshit.

Those falsehoods are not merely lies, though. They are the lies that form the foundation the entire system of oppression known as "government" rests upon. Reference La Boétie's centuries old Discourse of Voluntary Servitude. Furthermore, note William Lind's observation that Fourth Generation Warfare is fundamentally about "a universal crisis of legitimacy of the state".

[Porcupine_in_MA]

True.

[dalebert]

I called minarchy voodoo in the FTL chat room last night. People got annoying with me. 

[FTL_Ian]

Good post.  That should seal it for anyone who really loves liberty.

[KBCraig]

Posted on July 27th, 2008 by Brad Spangler
Bob Barr recently said he's running for the office of US president in order to "rekindle peoples faith in government". That is an anti-libertarian agenda.

Agorists, in particular among libertarians, recognize that perhaps the most crucial task in the process of building a revolutionary libertarian class consciousness is attacking and destroying faith in government. ...

I'm not sure of the meaning when he writes, "Agorist, in particular among libertarians". Is he saying that agorists are a subset of libertarianism? That libertarians are a subset of agorism? I don't think either is true, but it's not clear which he intends.

That aside, it seems the intent is, "Agorists stand out among libertarians as recognizing that..." And I agree with that statement. Faith in government is anti-agorist. It's just not necessarily anti-libertarian.

Libertarianism is a political movement. It involves governing. Massively less governing than we now suffer, but it's still governing. If the LP dominated American government, we would still not have an agorist system. Agorism, by definition, is anarchy of the free market, voluntaryist sort -- something I think most here, including me, would love to see.

Libertarianism does try to "rekindle peoples faith in government". Look at how many people were thrilled by Ron Paul's campaign: they hoped, they had faith, that government could be good again if Paul were in charge. But if Ron Paul were president, and everything he advocated came to pass, it would be a libertarian nation, but it still wouldn't be agorism.

Instead of "That is an anti-libertarian agenda", it would be more accurate to say, "That is not agorism."

Duh, exactly: Barr is not the candidate of the Agorist Party, which would be just as silly as campaigning for president of the Young Anarchists Club.

[FTL_Ian]

Not the libertarianism I once knew.  Harry Browne would never have said such a thing.

[hydrodog]

I would voted for Ron Paul but would not vote for a bob bar...... just plain simple...

[J’raxis 270145]

Considering that libertarianism is an umbrella term spanning everything from minarchism to anarchism, Barr's statement isn't anti-libertarian. I certainly don't want to restore people's faith in the State, but there are some "libertarians" who do indeed see a revived strict-Constitutional government as the goal, not merely a small step in the right direction.

[Puke]

The candidate's ideas are pointless.
It's all about what team he is on.

Go my team, GO!

[Lloyd Danforth]

I called minarchy voodoo in the FTL chat room last night. People got annoying with me. 

Well it's not!  It's Minarchy!

[Kat Kanning]

Duh, exactly: Barr is not the candidate of the Agorist Party, which would be just as silly as campaigning for president of the Young Anarchists Club.

There's nothing silly about a president of the young anarchists club.  We object to coerced leaders, not voluntary associations.

[BillKauffman]

Is he saying that agorists are a subset of libertarianism? That libertarians are a subset of agorism? I don't think either is true, but it's not clear which he intends.

Agorists are a tendency amongst left-libertarians, as are mutualists (although probably a minor tendency), and left-libertarians are a minor tendency within libertarianism.

[Porcupine_in_MA]

Considering that libertarianism is an umbrella term spanning everything from minarchism to anarchism, Barr's statement isn't anti-libertarian. I certainly don't want to restore people's faith in the State, but there are some "libertarians" who do indeed see a revived strict-Constitutional government as the goal, not merely a small step in the right direction.

I doubt even libertarians who want to see a revived strict Constitutional government would want some one to have a revived faith in government. Its just a bad choice of words.

[John Edward Mercier]

Duh, exactly: Barr is not the candidate of the Agorist Party, which would be just as silly as campaigning for president of the Young Anarchists Club.

There's nothing silly about a president of the young anarchists club.  We object to coerced leaders, not voluntary associations.

Actually in the context that KBCraig used there would be... 'running for president' suggests a vote for leadership. Anarchist have no true leadership... consensus is only periodic.

[BillKauffman]

Anarchist have no true leadership...

Anarchists have rules just no rulers.