My response to a speeding ticket

[Coconut]

That comment of mine was ill-considered; I agree that going to court isn't necessarily begging.  It just didn't feel like the right thing for me to do here.

Maybe someday.

You did exactly what they wanted you to: pay without resistance.

[Coconut]

Unless its different than around here... if you challenge a ticket and lose, you pay the court costs.

Are you in NH? I've never seen that happen in NH. I lost a ticket in Peterborough court once and only paid the fine on the ticket.

[Jacobus]

That comment of mine was ill-considered; I agree that going to court isn't necessarily begging.  It just didn't feel like the right thing for me to do here.

Maybe someday.

You did exactly what they wanted you to: pay without resistance.

I just don't see challenging this in court as a loss for the state.  "They" are really indifferent whether you select option A (to pay) or option B (to go to court and thereby recognize its authority in the matter).  The only path they really do not wish for you to go is to ignore them.

[John Edward Mercier]

Unless its different than around here... if you challenge a ticket and lose, you pay the court costs.

Are you in NH? I've never seen that happen in NH. I lost a ticket in Peterborough court once and only paid the fine on the ticket.

I haven't actually had to pay a ticket since I was 20 (about 22 years ago), but do remember Judge David Hout of Laconia District Court assessing me a $12 administrative fee on a $33 speeding ticket. I don't remember if I requested some documentation or what...

[David]

That comment of mine was ill-considered; I agree that going to court isn't necessarily begging.  It just didn't feel like the right thing for me to do here.

Maybe someday.

You did exactly what they wanted you to: pay without resistance.

Bingo.  Challenging a ticket doesn't really bother them, they are still gonna get paid.  But it does cost the system money, and particularly during a recession they don't have as much money as they would like. 

[Caleb]

Bingo.  Challenging a ticket doesn't really bother them, they are still gonna get paid.  But it does cost the system money, and particularly during a recession they don't have as much money as they would like. 

Depends on where you are at. In Indianapolis if you challenge the ticket you have a 95% chance of winning. The officers aren't paid to show up for the summons, so they usually blow it off and the judge dismisses your case. They call out dozens of names at the beginning and say, "your case has been dismissed" so you don't even have to wait around. I've challenged four or five tickets that way, and never once had the guy show up.

[David]

Cool.  Maybe the money squeeze gov'ts are under, will result in a curtailing of the OT the cops get to show up for court.   

[John Edward Mercier]

If I'm reading HB86 correctly... the NH Legislature is debating going back to the old system.

[Mike Barskey]

The reason is you can easily cost them more than the amount of the ticket making it a nonprofitable situation for them.
...
If more people contested the tickets, it would cease to be an income stream. My goal is always to cost them more than they cost me.

Who is "them?" If they hold a trial for you, it costs them $X. If you make the trial take 2 hours instead of 1, it costs $2X. Etc. But will the court run out of money? Will any expense be too much? Will the government see that spending $thousands on a $140-citation trial is inefficient and change its ways? Will the government hold its trials and pay ridiculous amounts and lose money in the process of collecting money, and then raises taxes and create a new bureaucracy to determine the "problem" or get more funds from the next higher-up government?

Every objection is better than no objection.

Whew! Then my objection to my citations (simply not participating - no letter to judge, no court trial, no paying fine; just treating the government like anyone else who tells me they think I drive too fast or should not carry a bottle in my car: ignore them) is better than no objection.

[Kat Kanning]

I went into court in Dublin once for a speeding ticket and asked to pay restitution to my victim.  The Judge was a little flummoxed and explained there was no victim.  I said 'You mean I didn't hurt anyone" and he had to admit that I hadn't, then got this funny look on his face when he realized what he'd said.  He still wanted me to pay half the original ticket though.

[Mike Barskey]

I went into court in Dublin once for a speeding ticket and asked to pay restitution to my victim.  The Judge was a little flummoxed and explained there was no victim.  I said 'You mean I didn't hurt anyone" and he had to admit that I hadn't, then got this funny look on his face when he realized what he'd said.  He still wanted me to pay half the original ticket though.

That is awesome!

[Lumpy]

that letter should be a form letter, it's great! Can you mail a letter to the judge,city requesting community service rather than a fine, I'll bet you can make a motion..

I agree with Cynthia.  If someome emails me a copy of one I'll upload it to a site where we can simply download forms when the stuff hits the fan with the "traffic enforcers" .  It might be worth it to have on hand.  Anyone think this is a bad idea or have suggestions?

[Jacobus]

Perhaps showing up and reading that letter (with many of us at your side at the time of reading) will bring about at least SOME awareness to them.  I'm willing to show up with you and all I know about you is that you understand and THEY don't.
Maybe THEY will get it, if even one tiny bit more.

After thinking about this situation more, I think Lumpy has the best strategy. 

The strategy I chose (immediate obedience but with a weak protest letter) might be "okay" for small tickets, but clearly it is unworkable for large fines.  My brother asked me what I would do if the ticket was for $10000 instead.  So I wondered about that and thought maybe doing something like what Lumpy suggests would be best.  You would go to court not to appeal the fine but rather to tell them you will not pay it (and to accept their retaliation).  This would seem to me to have several benefits:

- you still reject the legitimacy of their laws and courts
- you give the bad guys an opportunity to rescind their punishment
- the bad guys are revealed as bad if they continue punishment
- less stress about wondering when they might break down your door and haul you away
- opportunity to educate by-standers
- scalable response to any fines they initially impose

I'm not sure I have the fortitude to do this sort of thing for small penalties right now.  It can be hard to do the right thing when it is not easy.  My letter was a small step towards this though.  Maybe I can keep taking steps.

[John Edward Mercier]

I think the only real response is to turn your DL in (breaking the contract of usage).

[Kat Kanning]

Steps are good