On Pacifism

[Ogre]

So, I've had these thoughts wandering around my head for awhile, and I thought I'd put them down here after reading a bit about related things. Yes, perhaps it would have been better that I let them stay in my head, but, too late if you're reading this, they've escaped.

As a little background, I have been involved with the Free State Project since just after the state selection was made. I have been trying, in various ways, to get to NH, but I'll admit it, I'm apparently not willing to sacrifice enough to get there. I have (or at least really want to think I have) equity in my house that will not sell (been listed for about 5-6 years now at progressively lower prices); and I've been searching for jobs in New Hampshire in my current price range (or above, since the cost of living there is a little higher than where I am in North Carolina). However, I also have a wife and kids which not only makes it more difficult for me, but also gives the government substantial amounts of leverage over me. I'm not defending my lack of action, just weakly explaining it.

But I've been thinking more about pacifism and how to combat this government that is clearly no longer Constitutionally- or Freedom-based.

I have to admit, I used to be what Russell referred to as a "gun cleaner," though I'd never heard the term. I am quite skilled with firearms, and I have more than one. I had always vowed that the government would get me only after I fought back with firearms. I was (and am) perfectly willing to be killed by the government (because I know where I'm going after that time). However, after reading and watching so much of the freedom activities in NH, and certainly I've got to give Russell a lot of credit here (and I would Sam, too, only I really figured this out before Sam was kidnapped), I've changed my views, and I would encourage others to, as well.

Am I a pacifist now? I don't think so. And not just because of the age-old societal view that makes me a "wimp" because I won't fight back. I'm just not all the way there. I am, for example, willing to use violence against someone who is trying to hurt me or my family. It may be wrong in some circles, but I am willing to do it. At the same time, I am now a pacifist when it comes to government.

You see, the government -- which includes all people who are employed by government or obtain cash from the government (or food, housing, etc), is nearly unlimited. In addition, this same government now has a dedicated group that is also VERY large that is as close-knit as many families. And the members of this group are trained in violence and how to use it, and they WILL blindly follow any instructions of that government, no matter what. Does this mean they would round up people and throw them in concentration camps? Honestly? I believe they would. The government has been training these "law enforcement" officers to do one thing and one thing only: obey orders. Remember that classic scene from The Fugitive:

Innocent Man: "I didn't do anything."

Law Enforcement: "I don't care"

That IS Law Enforcement today. They obey orders and simply will not question those orders. That's what they are trained to do.

In addition, this same group of people is trained to deal with violence. That's what they expect. They know what to do with anyone who is violent -- treat them like an animal. Anyone who is captured by law enforcement is, to them, less than human. Anyone who has been in a jail cell will be able to tell you that. If you know someone who is a prison guard, ask them about it. That's what these people do.

Finally, these very same people, law enforcement, are completely blindly loyal to themselves and their leaders. If you use violence against them, you will lose -- there is no other outcome. If you don't believe me, watch what happens when a call goes out over the radio of "officer down." Dozens, if not more, law enforcement officers will show up looking to kill someone and get revenge. It's what they do. If you use violence against this sort of person, they will respond with more violence. Its what they understand.

The only way this government will be brought down using violence will be by a force that is tremendously huge -- I'm talking hundreds of thousands to a million people who are willing to use violence against them. If you shoot one, ten will quickly appear to take their place. If you are not immediately killed by them (which is highly likely), then you will be at the very least jailed for life and branded as something worse even than people who smoke cigarettes -- a "cop killer."

No, I can't say that I know what will bring down this government, but I am quite sure that it will not be done with violence unless the entire Chinese Army makes landfall in California. Even terrorist bombs don't have a chance. Seriously. Violence against this machine is completely pointless.



I would humbly suggest that the only chance one has against this government is pacifism. Only by clogging the gears and overloading will the system be slowed. I would suggest that enough people would be able to show the government that the system doesn't work. Enough people in the system might get one or two of these government workers to actually understand that those who are jailed are actually people. I think what Sam is doing is great work, even if it is at great cost.

And I'm not even suggesting that people intentionally go out and violate laws to point out their absurdity (like Andrew). No, I don't have anything against that action, and I think Andrew did an excellent thing to help liberty. I think that type of action is really good -- it's just not for everyone. Then again, just imagine what the police would have done if they showed up, and just as they were arresting Andrew, another person showed they had a leaf in their hand. And then a third. And another. How would they have arrested 100 people (all who refused to give their names)? Sorry, just dreaming there for a minute.

Personally, I have decided what I will do when I am jailed. I do not know when it will be, nor what it will be for. My family thinks that only those who are "instigating" the system will be taken. I don't believe that for a minute. Instead, when the police come for me, whether it be for not taking my dog to the vet for a shot, or daring to question the tax assessment people for the value of my house, I will simply not cooperate. I will not allow them in my house. If they force their way in, they will. At that point, they will do whatever they want. I vow not to cooperate with them in any way. My response to any question, no matter what it relates to will be total silence. I now have in my pockets at all times a small, handwritten card that says, "I invoke my right to remain silent." I will not answer questions of any kind. I will not nod my head to cooperate. I have an additional card that says, "I do not give my consent to search," but I think that one is pointless. I will continue to not cooperate until the police have left me. If they decide they will jail me, they will jail me. I do not honestly believe I have the power to stop them. I will not help them. I will not walk nor cooperate in any way.

From that point on, the government will do whatever it wants to do. Until the time they say that I am free to go, they will do things to me they want, but I will resist at all times. I will not use violence against them, as I know the result of that action (see above). But I will not speak and I will not eat until I am freed. If that means I die in government custody, so be it. Having not been tortured before, I do not know how my resolve will hold out, but I solemnly vow to attempt to resist at all times for as long as I am physically capable. I do not know what others will do, or how anyone will react to my actions. But as for me, I shall indeed Live Free or Die.

[TackleTheWorld]

Thanks for the run-down, Ogre.  Those are clear and strong sentiments. 
I have a question.  You predict that your death from starvation may be over refusal to pay a $5 government fee.  You also say the government has leverage over you because of your wife and kids.  What if the wife and kids don't want you to die?

[Mike Barskey]

Indeed, thanks for sharing these thoughts. Keep thinking and sharing. I'm learning.

[KBCraig]

Am I a pacifist now? I don't think so. And not just because of the age-old societal view that makes me a "wimp" because I won't fight back. I'm just not all the way there. I am, for example, willing to use violence against someone who is trying to hurt me or my family. It may be wrong in some circles, but I am willing to do it. At the same time, I am now a pacifist when it comes to government.

From my (admittedly meager) understanding of Gandhi, I think he shared that belief. He was not a pacifist as a bedrock principle, and even said that disarming India was one of the worst atrocities England ever committed, but he embraced pacifism as a tactic. He understood that England was susceptible to manipulation by moral outrage, and that using force against unarmed passive victims wouldn't set well with the English public. And he was right -- he won by winning the P.R. war first.

I fear that America today doesn't share Edwardian England's sense of fair play, or of right and wrong. There is altogether too much public support for violently attacking unpopular minorities (small religious groups, immigrants, marijuana smokers, tax protestors, war protestors, liberty lovers... )

The outrage might be awakened, but I worry that it will take a number of martyrs. So long as the government can label someone a "terrorist" and lock them away incommunicado, it's going to be hard to make the public aware. So long as the major media are complicit in this, and alternative news sources are perceived as kooks and oddballs, it will be tough to get public support.

[Ogre]

I have a question.  You predict that your death from starvation may be over refusal to pay a $5 government fee.  You also say the government has leverage over you because of your wife and kids.  What if the wife and kids don't want you to die?

To be honest, that will be one of the more difficult parts. They have already made it clear that they do not want me in jail. I have tried to make it clear to them that I will only be in jail against my will and not by my choice. I think that once they see it happening, they will be crushed, but then perhaps a few more people will see this government for what it really is.

There is altogether too much public support for violently attacking unpopular minorities (small religious groups, immigrants, marijuana smokers, tax protestors, war protestors, liberty lovers... )

The outrage might be awakened, but I worry that it will take a number of martyrs. So long as the government can label someone a "terrorist" and lock them away incommunicado, it's going to be hard to make the public aware. So long as the major media are complicit in this, and alternative news sources are perceived as kooks and oddballs, it will be tough to get public support.

Exactly right. That is something I have struggled with myself. I look at cases like SamIAms and see that the media simply will not cover it. So how much effect is it really having? How much effect can I have if I do the same? That has led me to realize that I'm not really doing it just so the media will report on it. I will be doing it because it is the right thing to do. If it advances freedom, great, I truly hope it does. If it effects just one person in the jail, great. But even if it does nothing, I will know that I have chosen death over slavery, which I can live with.

[Russell Kanning]

interesting
I find non-cooperation to be a good means and end
It gives you something to do now ... and I think it can bring about your final goals.

SamIAm is showing what can be done right now. it forces some people to think through your own methods.

[TackleTheWorld]

First let me say that I recognize your attitude in myself.  I've thrown myself into battle, not expecting to live and you describe it pretty well.  But there may be something else that makes you feel hopeless, something closer than the government. 

What if the wife and kids don't want you to die?

... they will be crushed, but then perhaps a few more people will see this government for what it really is.

I could have this completely wrong, but your wording makes me think that you would crush your family, and kill yourself for a long shot.  And the "few people" you mention that you would enlighten by these actions could also be your family.
It sounds like you are planing on dying to guilt trip a political viewpoint on your family.  Am I reading that wrong?

[Ogre]

No, I wouldn't say that's the plan. My plan is to live free and not harm anyone else. When government decides they don't like that, government may decide to kill me. I do not believe I have the power to stop government, if government should so decide. I have tried to explain this viewpoint to many others, but so many people (my family included) still completely believe that only "bad" people are arrested and jailed by government. There are many who know me that will not believe that government is so inclined (to kill harmless people) until they see someone like myself, someone they know, actually killed by government. I think perhaps a side benefit of government killing me would be that more people would come to see and believe that government really is what it is.

I guess if that were my main purpose, I would be more provocative of government. My main plan is simply to live free, as long as I can, no matter what the government shall dictate.

[Russell Kanning]

the government doesn't go straight to killing you usually ... and I bet you will change your mind before you starve to death

[Ogre]

That's certainly a possibility. Having never been in that situation, I cannot know how I will react.

[akmisrmaadi]

violence works, but you have to have superior power.

whether or not you want to accept it, violence rules the world. it always has and always will

[Bill St. Clair]

Actually, the threat of violence rules the world. Occasional real violence convinces most that the threat is real. But it isn't. If everybody ignored threats of violence and forced those who would have power to use real violence, the house of cards would collapse very quickly. Even if those who ignored the violence never used violence in return.

Unfortunately, ignoring the threat of violence is a bigger task than most humans can handle. So it works very well.

Freedom: I won't.

[David]

violence works, but you have to have superior power.

whether or not you want to accept it, violence rules the world. it always has and always will

You're right, that is why England still rules over India, and why our african american brothers still are legally required to sit in the back of the bus, and drink from separate water fountains.   

Sarcasm aside, violence is the greatest tangible power, but it is not the only power.  The greatest intangible power is that of legitimacy, which violence can almost never destroy. 
Peaceful direct action, on the other hand, is purpose made to destroy legitimacy.  It is frequently confused with pacifism, but it is not the same thing. 

[Kat Kanning]

Thanks for posting your thoughts, Ogre.  Can I print your post?

Another reason you might not want to use deadly force:  the possibility of making mistakes.  We've had several articles recently on police using deadly force on the wrong person.  It comes naturally with the use of force.  Armies often kill their own men by mistake.  During wartime, innocents are often killed. 

(I don't think that refraining from using deadly force necessarily equates with pacifism.)

[Ogre]

Oh, print away, if you like.

As for force and violence working, I agree, that can work. But in this particular instance, I challenge you to find enough force to overcome the entire law enforcement community, backed by a large percentage of the population, when we can't even find 1,000 people to move to NH for freedom. Check the post again -- if you use violence in America today against law enforcement, you will lose. It may not be right away, but you can be sure that you will lose very soon. If your actions kill a member of law enforcement, every member of law enforcement in the country will be strongly allied against you with one goal in mind: your death. At that point, facts will not matter one whit to them!

Violence MAY have its place, but using violence against government in America today is a fruitless effort, in my opinion.