420 at 4:20 in Manchester

[AntonLee]

I like it

[Lloyd Danforth]

Works for me.

[Kat Kanning]

It really hit me last night, Ayn Rand was so right.  The Aristocracy of the Pull is alive and well in NH.

[Sam A. Robrin]

This is just a guess on my part, but based on what Denis posted on FB, I suspect that some in-the-system activists have spoken with one or more politicians and found that all the work Rocketman has done to try to get medical marijuana legalized in NH, which is coming to a head at the end of October, may be in jeopardy because of this particular out-of-the-system activism.

It was loudly proclaimed by the self-described "Silent Majority" in the 1960s that all the anti-war demonstrations were prolonging hostilities--but what was actually meant was Shut up and go home, and just let us do our job of ruling over you.  History has clearly shown that the widespread opposition to the war, unexpected by a population that had become ovine from two World Wars with a depression between, was all that did succeed in bringing the conflict to an end.
When your opponent actually possesses a sense of decency, there's no better tactic than to invoke it on false pretenses (See, e.g., various video interviews with Shane Maxwell, or any book with the word women in the title . . .).

[Feanor7]

Yeah Jose, screw medical, legalize it!  Fuck those cancer and MS patients who can't get out of bed in the morning.   Call me Joe Anarchist, who can't get outside of my own head for long enough to understand that real life doesn't work on a binary black/white, free/unfree basis.  Some of these prospective patients are terrified to use the medicine they need to survive while it's illegal because they could lose their disability, job, or children.  Yes, those people exist, and they live their short, miserable lives in brutal pain.

If there's one thing that never ceases to amaze me, it's the inability that so many people have to prioritize and work towards achieving goals over time.  What the hell is the point of these protests?  To "start a dialog?"  About what?  Are you framing the dialog so that people who walk by come away with the right message?  Or does it look like a combination of hippies and Insane Clown Posse fans smoking pot in a park?

Anyways... if you guys tip the scales and make the one important vote go against the medical bill, I hope you will have the character to do something charitable for those patients or volunteer in a hospice so that you can see the pain and suffering you helped to make happen.

[AntonLee]

c'mon. . . this medical marijuana thing is a scam.  Does it help them, absolutely.  They should just go ahead and do it.  Let the cops arrest them.

The world does work in a free/unfree way, you choose not to accept it.  Those people might be out there to "create a dialogue" as you put it.  . . . but some might be out there to , I don't know, GET HIGH?

Some are out there supporting their friends.  Some are smoking cloves.  Some like to hang around with other people.  Some don't like cops.

The point of why these individuals show up isn't any of your concern.  After all, they're just there in the park.

If the political system were to have worked it would have done so by now.  No one should be jailed for the use, production, cultivation, sales, transport, possession of cannabis period end of story sianara.

Those medical marijuana patients, my heart goes out to them. . .so they should just continue to smoke marijuana or pick it up if it helps them.  No one is stopping them just like no one really can stop me from doing it myself.

[Feanor7]

c'mon. . . this medical marijuana thing is a scam.  Does it help them, absolutely.  They should just go ahead and do it.  Let the cops arrest them.

The world does work in a free/unfree way, you choose not to accept it.  Those people might be out there to "create a dialogue" as you put it.  . . . but some might be out there to , I don't know, GET HIGH?

Some are out there supporting their friends.  Some are smoking cloves.  Some like to hang around with other people.  Some don't like cops.

The point of why these individuals show up isn't any of your concern.  After all, they're just there in the park.

If the political system were to have worked it would have done so by now.  No one should be jailed for the use, production, cultivation, sales, transport, possession of cannabis period end of story sianara.

Those medical marijuana patients, my heart goes out to them. . .so they should just continue to smoke marijuana or pick it up if it helps them.  No one is stopping them just like no one really can stop me from doing it myself.

Let me guess - you're between 20 and 30, unmarried, white, and male, right?  Me too.  People like us don't have much to lose for being arrested.  Not everyone in the world can just get sent to the pokey for a weekend and shrug it off.  People with careers get fired.  People with children lose custody.  There are all kinds of consequences that follow the decision to "just be free" that are unbearable to most.  I'm sure the grandmothers who don't want to lose their 20 hour a week meal ticket are ashamed that they don't share your fortitude and blase attitude towards legal sanctions and jail time.

[bigmike]

It really hit me last night, Ayn Rand was so right.  The Aristocracy of the Pull is alive and well in NH.

Very true.

Anyways... if you guys tip the scales and make Gatsas vote against the medical bill, I hope you will have the character to do something charitable for those patients or volunteer in a hospice so that you can see the pain and suffering you helped to make happen.

Nobody is making him do anything. He doesn't want to support the medical bill, he wants to snub Lynch. And nobody here caused any patients pain and suffering, their illness did. I do understand what you were getting at.

It seems after a great suggestion by Pat K a solution has emerged from all of this back and forth. I have absolutely no problem encouraging participants in these events to call Gatsas and DeVries and ask them to override the veto. I even plan on doing it myself.

Also Feanor, if you know of any groups of sick patients that actively lobby in support of the bill's passage would you forward the contact info to me? In Michigan the largest opponent of medicinal marijuana and assisted suicide was hospice, the organization not so much the workers.

As far as the dialog goes I was hoping to use the public smoking as a way to demonstrate to the police that they can use their discretion in isolated incidents just like they can in the park. This entire process of "we need to legalize/decriminalize or change the laws" is a waste of time. They can simply choose to ignore it.

If the police agreed to stop making arrests for drug possession I'd never show up to the 420 events. To encourage them to stop I have started contacting every person arrested in Manchester for drug possession charges and offering to walk them through the legal process of defending against the allegations if they're willing to reject the plea agreement offered to them. This will slowly start to make it cost-prohibitive to prosecute peaceful people and, hopefully, over time will cease to occur.

Once I have a good system in place I'm going to do this across the state. The problem so far is tracking down the people arrested has to be done in person, as I'm finding it difficult to locate telephone numbers for them.

[bigmike]

Let me guess - you're between 20 and 30, unmarried, white, and male, right?  Me too.  People like us don't have much to lose for being arrested.  Not everyone in the world can just get sent to the pokey for a weekend and shrug it off.  People with careers get fired.  People with children lose custody.  There are all kinds of consequences that follow the decision to "just be free" that are unbearable to most.  I'm sure the grandmothers who don't want to lose their 20 hour a week meal ticket are ashamed that they don't share your fortitude and blase attitude towards legal sanctions and jail time.

He makes a great point, Anton. Not everyone has it in them to deal with the consequences. I hope over time people will begin to lose that fear but we're a long way off from that happening.

[FTL_Ian]

Anyways... if you guys tip the scales and make the one important vote go against the medical bill

I can not be blamed for what some gangster does and neither can any other public toker in Keene or Manch.

[FTL_Ian]

To encourage them to stop I have started contacting every person arrested in Manchester for drug possession charges and offering to walk them through the legal process of defending against the allegations if they're willing to reject the plea agreement offered to them. This will slowly start to make it cost-prohibitive to prosecute peaceful people and, hopefully, over time will cease to occur.

Once I have a good system in place I'm going to do this across the state. The problem so far is tracking down the people arrested has to be done in person, as I'm finding it difficult to locate telephone numbers for them.

Okay, that's awesome.  How are you getting the arrest info? 

[Feanor7]

To encourage them to stop I have started contacting every person arrested in Manchester for drug possession charges and offering to walk them through the legal process of defending against the allegations if they're willing to reject the plea agreement offered to them. This will slowly start to make it cost-prohibitive to prosecute peaceful people and, hopefully, over time will cease to occur.

Once I have a good system in place I'm going to do this across the state. The problem so far is tracking down the people arrested has to be done in person, as I'm finding it difficult to locate telephone numbers for them.

Okay, that's awesome.  How are you getting the arrest info?

Agreed, that project sounds like it would rule

[bigmike]

They're listed in the Manchester Express that comes out every week. It lists the name and address, where the arrest occurred and the charge. The problem is most of the addresses listed are apartments and the unit isn't listed.

If anybody knows of a better way to find the arrests please let me know. I'll start a separate thread with more details.

[AntonLee]

c'mon. . . this medical marijuana thing is a scam.  Does it help them, absolutely.  They should just go ahead and do it.  Let the cops arrest them.

The world does work in a free/unfree way, you choose not to accept it.  Those people might be out there to "create a dialogue" as you put it.  . . . but some might be out there to , I don't know, GET HIGH?

Some are out there supporting their friends.  Some are smoking cloves.  Some like to hang around with other people.  Some don't like cops.

The point of why these individuals show up isn't any of your concern.  After all, they're just there in the park.

If the political system were to have worked it would have done so by now.  No one should be jailed for the use, production, cultivation, sales, transport, possession of cannabis period end of story sianara.

Those medical marijuana patients, my heart goes out to them. . .so they should just continue to smoke marijuana or pick it up if it helps them.  No one is stopping them just like no one really can stop me from doing it myself.

Let me guess - you're between 20 and 30, unmarried, white, and male, right?  Me too.  People like us don't have much to lose for being arrested.  Not everyone in the world can just get sent to the pokey for a weekend and shrug it off.  People with careers get fired.  People with children lose custody.  There are all kinds of consequences that follow the decision to "just be free" that are unbearable to most.  I'm sure the grandmothers who don't want to lose their 20 hour a week meal ticket are ashamed that they don't share your fortitude and blase attitude towards legal sanctions and jail time.

The consequences are not with me.  I'm not rounding anyone up for smoking a joint.  I'm not taking people's children away.  I'm not the one voting to add new laws against others.  I'm not the guy you're looking for.

the decision to "just be free" is one that's not easily taken.  Never said it was easy to be free, especially with all kinds of people looking to take your shit away and toss you in jail.    I personally would rather not spend my life trying to plead with people to just see it my way and die a failure.  Nah, I'd rather spend my life just doing what I damn well feel like (which is quite normal in society's terms).

don't tell me that my 'acting free' has any responsibility on their chosen actions. 

[Tom Sawyer]

Medical Marijuana is not a scam...
Many amazing medical properties and miraculous improvements in peoples lives. ie. Stopping progressive blindness, calming debilitating pain, spasms etc.

That said...
Many people trying to move Cannabis Law Reform forward see "Medical Marijuana" as one of the steps in the process, because it is the apparent short path to their goal. However, like most things in life the shortest path is not always the best path.

The three branches in the Cannabis Reform Movement are the recreational, medical and industrial (hemp). They started in the same group of activists. Over the last 25 years they have moved apart and today the hemp and medical advocates are hostile to the recreational activists. The "potheads" are seen as the obstacle to their efforts. The truth is, if it wasn't for the "potheads" you would have never heard about the medical and industrial uses of Cannabis.

The "authorities" granting you the privilege to medicate yourself with a herbal remedy goes against fundamental rights.

In fact, most people don't even consider that the federal government didn't even have the power to make Cannabis illegal in the first place. That is why the law created in 1937, was the "Marijuana Tax Act". They just put a prohibitively high tax on it. They would have needed a Constitutional Ammendment like they did to make alcohol illegal.

Finally, the truth is the "War on Marijuana People" is an evil, shameful black mark in history. The fact is the goverments lost the war. Nothing short of unconditional surrender is acceptable. Maybe, if the politicians, cops and mean bigoted people who waged this war do the right thing, history and their grandchildren won't be as ashamed as people are today to admit their ancestors owned slaves.

Decriminalization and other half measures get in the way of the process that must happen before this war is over.

(As to the scoundrel Gatsas, he is the head mother-fucker who sold us out on Real-ID.)