The Georgists

[Cotton]

If you come from the other side of the world? say Scotland you don't have a right to demand the Cherokee of North Carolina give you land to use. If you are a villager that encloses the common used land then you owe the other villagers compensation.? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? If you are the Scotsman your Scottish Villagers or the Barons may owe you compensation but the Cherokee villagers in NC. do not. The Cherokee may understand that most Scotsman are poor stewards practicing slash and burn crop production and have no understanding of birth control, so your demands as a Scotsmen mean nothing in the Cherokee village, come to them like a decent civil person and something? might be worked out, if not go back to Scotland and take your case up there.

A very poor example. The Scots and Cherokees were happily intertwined, with the Cherokees adopting many of the Euro-American ways that they saw to be of value.

You should read up on John Ross, an ancestor of mine who was principle chief of the Cherokee Nation from 1839 until his death in 1866. He was also 7/8ths Scot.

Kevin

I know I'm part Scottish and Cherokee, my mom  had as much Cherokee in her as John Ross but it still is a good example. A lot of the Cheokee who married only Cherokee begin to get pissed at many of the Scots because most of them like to have a lot of kids, the Cherokee perfer to have small familes. Land was given to the woman based on the number of children she had so the Cherokee women who married Scots or breeds got a lot more land than the Cherokke women who married  full bloods.                                                                                                                                                                           
My point was private property or community based common property is best over either large area collective or large area common property. Its silly to say the Scots are owed anything when they come on Cherokke land and it is silly to say if a Cherokee goes to Scotland he is owed Scottish land.                                                                                                             
   Of course if someone encloses common use land in a Scottish village the Scotsman is owed compensation, The same with a Cherokke if someome encloses common used CHerokee land.                                                                                               
  Also if either the Sctosman or Cherokee finds and use unfound unsed land if he uses it he owes no one anything, he is the first homesteader.

[Cotton]

Use and occupation gives a person that right, you found it, you use it, no one else is using it, it is yours. If everyone in the? village uses it but not necessarliy on the same day then it is commonly used by the people of the village. If you come from the other side of the world? say Scotland you don't have a right to demand the Cherokee of North Carolina give you land to use. If you are a villager that encloses the common used land then you owe the other villagers compensation.? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
If you are the Scotsman your Scottish Villagers or the Barons may owe you compensation but the Cherokee villagers in NC. do not. The Cherokee may understand that most Scotsman are poor stewards practicing slash and burn crop production and have no understanding of birth control, so your demands as a Scotsmen mean nothing in the Cherokee village, come to them like a decent civil person and something? might be worked out, if not go back to Scotland and take your case up there.

Is this Hankster? I recognize a total lack of coherency and any kind of logic which makes me think Cotton is Hankster...

No, I'm not Bill, I'm Terry and I'm soory for my poor communication skills but I was being logical and I'm sorry you could not understand it. I will try to explain it better next time.                                                                                                               
   Now about that sock, there is a sock mill up the road so I can get good socks pretty cheap.

[Lex]

Also if either the Sctosman or Cherokee finds and use unfound unsed land if he uses it he owes no one anything, he is the first homesteader.

I don't understand how that is different from what we have been saying all along?

[KBCraig]

My point was private property or community based common property is best over either large area collective or large area common property. Its silly to say the Scots are owed anything when they come on Cherokke land and it is silly to say if a Cherokee goes to Scotland he is owed Scottish land.                                                                                                             
   Of course if someone encloses common use land in a Scottish village the Scotsman is owed compensation, The same with a Cherokke if someome encloses common used CHerokee land.                                                                                               
  Also if either the Sctosman or Cherokee finds and use unfound unsed land if he uses it he owes no one anything, he is the first homesteader.

Dude... put down the pipe, and don't try to type while feeding your munchies. Aside from Doritos crumbs in your keyboard, you're babbling, and I'm not talking about typos.

Kevin

[Dreepa]

All this fuckin' philso-bullshit. 
Georgists, geo-lin, Objectivist, AynRand, etc etc etc  Just repeal some fuckin' laws and leave me alone.

I own the land.. get the fuck off.  I will sell you my apple.

[Lex]

I own the land.. get the fuck off.  I will sell you my apple.

That's a philosophy too my friend. Just so happens it's so simple and obvious that we don't consider it to be an arguable philosophy, but the georgists, socialists, etc think we are kooky to believe that we own our land. Heh.

[polyanarch]

I own the land.. get the fuck off.  I will sell you my apple.

An apple a day keeps the Georgists away.

[Kat Kanning]

Is that the land tax?

[Lex]

Is that the land tax?

I wonder what they do to those who don't grow apples on their land?

[Dreepa]

Is that the land tax?

I wonder what they do to those who don't grow apples on their land?

They send William Tell over there.
Or is it Johnny Appleseed?

[Kat Kanning]

Pound of flesh?

[polyanarch]

Is that the land tax?

I wonder what they do to those who don't grow apples on their land?

The tax wouldn't "apple -apply"

[Cotton]

My point was private property or community based common property is best over either large area collective or large area common property. Its silly to say the Scots are owed anything when they come on Cherokke land and it is silly to say if a Cherokee goes to Scotland he is owed Scottish land.? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
? ?Of course if someone encloses common use land in a Scottish village the Scotsman is owed compensation, The same with a Cherokke if someome encloses common used CHerokee land.? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
? Also if either the Sctosman or Cherokee finds and use unfound unsed land if he uses it he owes no one anything, he is the first homesteader.

Dude... put down the pipe, and don't try to type while feeding your munchies. Aside from Doritos crumbs in your keyboard, you're babbling, and I'm not talking about typos.

Kevin

? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?First the Scot/ Cherokee scene is very, very secondary to my point I think it is true but it may not be. The point is there is? good reasons for private property and local people common use property claims. One is the right of freedom of association and the survival need to exlude others sometimes. Some people don't take care of their property, they aren't good stewards so yeah that makes other peoples property more valuable to them.? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
? ? ? IF those who take own can't exclude the poor stewards from their land including the local peoples common use land then the good stewards survival is in? garve doubt.
Ok Dude, Bud, Vern, Sam, Space Trucker, Cool Breeze or whatever, I will try to explain a little better but I thought I was pretty clear.? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
? ?If a person finds unused unfound land and uses it he or she has a right to claim it, he or she does not owe anyone any compensation because no one else no one else is using the land.? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
? If land is being used in common then if a person encloses? a portion he or she must either leave as good and enough or pay compensation to the other common users. Of course he owes nothing to newcomers who just show up because they have not been using the land.? Thus the Georgist  arer only partly right.

[Cotton]

All this fuckin' philso-bullshit.?
Georgists, geo-lin, Objectivist, AynRand, etc etc etc? Just repeal some fuckin' laws and leave me alone.

I own the land.. get the fuck off.? I will sell you my apple.

? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
? ? ? ? ? ? Fine my me, I pretty much say the same thing about my 4 acres but are you sure another person my not have a legtimate claim,? occupation and use is only nine tenths of the law it is not ten tenths.? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
? ? ? ?I ask the same question to you and myself that I ask the mutualist. What if you? or I or them go away for a couple of weeks, someone else moves in and start using the land? Historically this was a legitimate question in many parts of America and according to Hernado Desoto it is a letimate question in Peru with squatters on government land or Latifundo land.? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
? So that is one point the mutualist and libertarian socialist don't think enough about.? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
? Mainstream libertarians and conservatives don't get what Rothbard got, that government titles will not necessarily give the title holder rights in a libertarian society or a post state society. Now personally I think titles, lease agreements and rent recepits may count in some  or many cases but case by case it will depend on the facts, what the jury decides and appeal judges decide.

[Cotton]

Also if either the Sctosman or Cherokee finds and use unfound unsed land if he uses it he owes no one anything, he is the first homesteader.

I don't understand how that is different from what we have been saying all along?

Well I'm sure some one brought that point up but I'm not sure if any brought up my other points because I have not read all 20 pages. Still I wonder how much land in the US can be traced all the way back to the first homesteader or traced back as far as it can be traced without that land being taking over by force by the government or titled to others who took it by force. I think it is probally a small percentage in most states and that is one big problem in standing to much on government property titles.                                                                                                                       
  Also what about all the home loans backed by the federal government should people have to pay them back?