Property tax, the Original Income tax?

[BillG]

How are you doing that? Just not paying property tax or are you in an area that has no/little property tax?

ahhhhh ..... the first step is to dream about not paying property taxes.

it is pure folly to not understand that someone pays - either the landowner or tenant/future buyer

[Russell Kanning]

How are you doing that? Just not paying property tax or are you in an area that has no/little property tax?

ahhhhh ..... the first step is to dream about not paying property taxes.

it is pure folly to not understand that someone pays - either the landowner or tenant/future buyer

what?

[Ron Helwig]

How are you doing that? Just not paying property tax or are you in an area that has no/little property tax?

ahhhhh ..... the first step is to dream about not paying property taxes.

it is pure folly to not understand that someone pays - either the landowner or tenant/future buyer

what?

I would guess that what he means is that property taxes are unavoidable when they exist. If you are a renter, you essentially pay the property tax through your landlord. If you are the landowner and refuse to pay, then the meanies with the big guns will come and force you out, selling the land to get the money (thus the "future buyer").

Not saying resisting isn't worthwhile, but realistically you will eventually be forced to pay somehow.

[ladyattis]

I think indirect excises would be the best means to reduce the government budget. Then the government could focus on security and uniform legal structure over the services industry horse pucky.

-- Bridget

[Ron Helwig]

I think indirect excises would be the best means to reduce the government budget. Then the government could focus on security and uniform legal structure over the services industry horse pucky.

-- Bridget

Please more detail. Indirect excises?

[ladyattis]

I think indirect excises would be the best means to reduce the government budget. Then the government could focus on security and uniform legal structure over the services industry horse pucky.

-- Bridget

Please more detail. Indirect excises?

Fees for use of certain things. Like the excise fees on legal forms. These sorts of excises are not impounded on everyone since they're applied only to specific functions of government. That would literally cut down more than half of the government's purpose down to the initial notions of a uniform legal structure.

-- Bridget

[BillG]

I think indirect excises would be the best means to reduce the government budget. Then the government could focus on security and uniform legal structure over the services industry horse pucky.

-- Bridget

Please more detail. Indirect excises?

Fees for use of certain things. Like the excise fees on legal forms. These sorts of excises are not impounded on everyone since they're applied only to specific functions of government. That would literally cut down more than half of the government's purpose down to the initial notions of a uniform legal structure.

-- Bridget

then a title for land could be looked at as an excise tax.

[Ron Helwig]

Fees for use of certain things. Like the excise fees on legal forms. These sorts of excises are not impounded on everyone since they're applied only to specific functions of government. That would literally cut down more than half of the government's purpose down to the initial notions of a uniform legal structure.

-- Bridget

then a title for land could be looked at as an excise tax.

I would agree that this could be seen as an excise tax if we're talking about a one-time fee.

I don't have a problem with fees for service, as long as the government isn't in services that the market is or should be providing. (anarcho-capitalists feel free to jump in here  )

[BillG]

Fees for use of certain things. Like the excise fees on legal forms. These sorts of excises are not impounded on everyone since they're applied only to specific functions of government. That would literally cut down more than half of the government's purpose down to the initial notions of a uniform legal structure.

-- Bridget

then a title for land could be looked at as an excise tax.

I would agree that this could be seen as an excise tax if we're talking about a one-time fee.

I don't have a problem with fees for service, as long as the government isn't in services that the market is or should be providing. (anarcho-capitalists feel free to jump in here  )

well you have to understand what the title is for - right?

the title is for exclusive use of an area backed by the state force.

so the tax is therefore time-based since the services rendered are.

[ladyattis]

Fees for use of certain things. Like the excise fees on legal forms. These sorts of excises are not impounded on everyone since they're applied only to specific functions of government. That would literally cut down more than half of the government's purpose down to the initial notions of a uniform legal structure.

-- Bridget

then a title for land could be looked at as an excise tax.

I would agree that this could be seen as an excise tax if we're talking about a one-time fee.

I don't have a problem with fees for service, as long as the government isn't in services that the market is or should be providing. (anarcho-capitalists feel free to jump in here  )

well you have to understand what the title is for - right?

the title is for exclusive use of an area backed by the state force.

so the tax is therefore time-based since the services rendered are.

That's why you never pay for a bill of sale, which btw you never get for any object you buy anymore, especially cars and land. 

-- Bridget

[FTL_Ian]

I think there needs to be a Property Tax Revolt.  Kat has started it in Keene.   

[ladyattis]

I think there needs to be a Property Tax Revolt.  Kat has started it in Keene.   

Yep, I see no logic in allowing a government to have a permanent rental fee on land it does not service nor maintain.

-- Bridget

[Fluff and Stuff]

I think there needs to be a Property Tax Revolt.? Kat has started it in Keene.? ?

Yep, I see no logic in allowing a government to have a permanent rental fee on land it does not service nor maintain.

-- Bridget

But it does service the land.  It prevents the land from being taken over by the evil Mexicans or Frogs.

[SteveA]

I think there needs to be a Property Tax Revolt.  Kat has started it in Keene.   

Yep, I see no logic in allowing a government to have a permanent rental fee on land it does not service nor maintain.

-- Bridget

But it does service the land.  It prevents the land from being taken over by the evil Mexicans or Frogs.

They might take over and tax the land or something

[Ron Helwig]

Yep, I see no logic in allowing a government to have a permanent rental fee on land it does not service nor maintain.

-- Bridget

The main service I would see the government providing here is that they back up your title/ownership to the land. If some other person (or some other government in the case of invasions) claims that they own it, the government is supposed to protect your title. This is where the justification for police and armies comes from - to apply force as a response to aggression against property owners.

No matter who provides this service, be it government or some anarcho-capitalist company, they will require some sort of documentation linking your identity to the definition of the property - i.e. the Title. This does mean that all landowners need to be known at least to that organization. Renters, on the other hand, can essentially remain anonymous (especially if the landlord doesn't care about the identity of their tenants) and don't need to be identified by that organization.