Religious ramblings

[Russell Kanning]

I didn't know that Penn had an imaginary friend .... I thought he just had a mute sidekick.

[freedombabe]

Organized religions are run by statists, IMO. ?

The most spiritual people I've met have long since freed themselves from the shackles of religious materialism that preoccupies most clerics.

[freedombabe]

For starters, the root cause of hate, strife, and war is man. Primitive hominids fought over food, territory, mates, and "things" just the same as all animals do. Possessiveness is a survival trait.

The crusades, jihads, Irish Protestants vs irish Catholics, Palestinians vs Jews in Middle East, Christians vs Jews in Germany, and on.  How many examples do you need?

Religious government is often dictatorial.  The absence of authority in religious government could approach a utopian religious society where the members enjoy complete freedom to worship what and how they wish.

Freedom is a worthy value in all aspects of one's life; not only when interacting with the local tax collector.  Freedom also applies to the local minister directing parish members how to live their lives. 

Political Correctness has no place when challenging religious power players with their rules and regulations.  We should be insulted when religion power brokers wrap themselves with vestments and demand obedience from free peoples.

[Pat McCotter]

For starters, the root cause of hate, strife, and war is man. Primitive hominids fought over food, territory, mates, and "things" just the same as all animals do. Possessiveness is a survival trait.

The crusades, jihads, Irish Protestants vs irish Catholics, Palestinians vs Jews in Middle East, Christians vs Jews in Germany, and on.? How many examples do you need?

Religious government is often dictatorial.? The absence of authority in religious government could approach a utopian religious society where the members enjoy complete freedom to worship what and how they wish.

Freedom is a worthy value in all aspects of one's life; not only when interacting with the local tax collector.? Freedom also applies to the local minister directing parish members how to live their lives.?

Political Correctness has no place when challenging religious power players with their rules and regulations.? We should be insulted when religion power brokers wrap themselves with vestments and demand obedience from free peoples.

The local minister cannot force a member to live in a way they find uncomfortable. His church is not the only game in town. Find another church or worship your god personally. The religious government is the only game in town. Find another town (country) is the only way out of this.

The discussion in this thread was not about converting or forcing anyone to live in a specific way - you don't like the message, turn it off.

(And just so you know where I am coming from -

I do not wear my beliefs on my sleeves. I do not "belong" to a specific church. I have studied different religions/belief systems and spoken with members of them in an effort to learn about people I live on this world with. I don't discuss spirituality with people who don't want to discuss it.

I was raised Lutheran for 10 years, Jewish for 8 years. I chose to believe that man's mind is the source of his efficacy and not a supernatural being for 27 years. Then Gloria and I met and we know personally that there is greater than us (leyword, freedombabe, is "personally." I'm not trying to force this on you.) Gloria ascribes this to God/Jesus/Holy Spirit; mine is not circumscribed by any limitations of language or thought; I just keep a thought pattern of thanks to something/someone for all that I have. I used to think of it as my conscience but that was too limiting.

This is where I come from not the way things ought to be for everyone. This is for me personally, not to be taken as an affront in how other people see the world/cosmos or whatever.

Thanks for reading.)

[Russell Kanning]

I am very thankful for your comments.

[Lloyd Danforth]

If Caleb and I convert anyone ..... we don't make any money.

You should work on this.  Get....lets say....$5.00 from each convert and donate it to the LSF.

[Caleb]

Great!  $5.00 per convert.  Sounds like an interesting plan.  But I think we can beat it.  Let's go with Scientology ... or Mormonism.   Some church with a serious funding plan.  Then we go to the church and say, "Hey, the average income is, say, $40,000.  You demand 10% of that.  That is $4000 per year.  I will convert people to your religion if you give me the first year's tithe."

Should be able to save souls AND make good money doing it! 

[Pat McCotter]

L. Ron Hubbard created Scientology on a bet, ya'know.

[Russell Kanning]

L. Ron Hubbard created Scientology on a bet, ya'know.

Hey this is a rambling thread ...... what is that story?

[Pat McCotter]

http://www.skepticfiles.org/skeptic/scient4d.htm

I took a class with Joe Haldeman back at Tech and got the story first-hand.
Several sci-fi writers, including Joe and L. Ron, were sitting around
drinking at a Con.  Someone mentioned that any science fiction writer worth
his/her salt should be able to create a religion that people would follow
en masse.  Much drunken raving ensued, the upshot of which was that if
L. Ron hadn't made one million dollars within ten years, he'd pay Joe
$10.  In fact it only took around three years.

[donlovelace]

If someone came up to you today and said that they had been talking to god, would you consider them a prophet or a loony?
Most likely you would lean towards loony and look for the fastest reason to or avenue of escape.
But a lot of people accept the bible as the word of god, even though they never met the authors, and cannot tell  from personal experience whether the authors were loony or not.
I was born and raised catholic and attended catholic schools. Even after all that Indoctrination, I cannot beiieve that the bible isn't just a collection of fictional stories. Some of the stories make me feel good, but are just stories.
I choose to treat my fellow humans with respect for their beliefs, and would hope that they respect mine.
My brother is a very dedicated catholic, but has married a protestant. On Sunday they attend both services. So I think they attend church enough for the both of us.
Maybe the person who approached you about talking to god said that he wrote down everything god told him in a book. Part of what god told him was that everyone should be naked all the time, and he has a name for the book.
The person calls his writtings "The Book Of Zack" 
Would you then disrobe because he claims that it is the word of god?
I'm not trying to pick a fight or get into an argument, but thinking contra positive, if the bible writtings from way back when are true, then the person's statement on the street today should also be true.

N'est pas?

Don ducks for cover

[freedombabe]

Don:  Interesting thoughts.  For a while here, I've felt like the kid in church caught wispering by the priest.  (Religious guilt is a powerful thing).

So, for today, i'd just like to wish everyone a Happy Thanksgiving.  Enjoy!

Later, I'll go and get a "Book of Zack" as you recommend, get naked under the covers, and read.   

[Russell Kanning]

If someone came up to you today and said that they had been talking to god, would you consider them a prophet or a loony?
I'm not trying to pick a fight or get into an argument, but thinking contra positive, if the bible writtings from way back when are true, then the person's statement on the street today should also be true.

N'est pas?

Don ducks for cover

Depends on whether the guy is always right and if he can perform miracles. If a prophet is ever wrong ..... then you stone him. The Bible has an answer for your question too.

[Russell Kanning]

Don: Interesting thoughts. For a while here, I've felt like the kid in church caught wispering by the priest. (Religious guilt is a powerful thing).

I would say that your conscience is speaking to you.

[polyanarch]

Don:  Interesting thoughts.  For a while here, I've felt like the kid in church caught wispering by the priest.  (Religious guilt is a powerful thing).

So, for today, i'd just like to wish everyone a Happy Thanksgiving.  Enjoy!

Later, I'll go and get a "Book of Zack" as you recommend, get naked under the covers, and read.   

At least you weren't caught by the priest and bent over the pew for a candy bar and a sip of communion wine...


And watch out about talking about reading naked under the covers or one of these geeky libertarian boys is going to burrow down in their with you to get a look






-at the book...