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Author Topic: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire  (Read 6096 times)

Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #45 on: November 29, 2012, 08:12 PM NHFT »

Whoops  just saw this, sorry for the slow response.  Stand by.
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Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #46 on: December 08, 2012, 01:04 AM NHFT »

OK anyway for those observing, helio and I may get together to discuss this project eventually in person.   If we do talk I will try to post a synopsis to this thread so that later participants can fill themselves in.
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Helio

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #47 on: December 08, 2012, 03:16 AM NHFT »

Ok, got a couple of ideas I want to bounce off of you, DadaOrwell.

Question: How important to you is it that New Hampshire is the setting of the game?
Reason I ask: Any game set in a real place will need real world graphics to make it work.  As I have said before, graphics is the most time intensive area of the game and the area we have zero talent for, at this time.  Fleshing out a map system for real NH geography, landmarks, and structures could be an enormous undertaking.  Seeing as we have no artists to go get the actual real world maps and translate that to some sort of game graphics, I want to present a couple of options that will allow us to skip that challenge.

Options...

1. We change the setting to the sea and build a game around the concept of Sea Steading.  Basically the same ideas as you outlined before, but on / below /above the water.  Water graphics are easier because you just reuse the same graphics over and over for your map and the map sizes could be quite large since it is just number crunching map coordinates.

2. We change the setting to space and have a futuristic game.  Space graphics are simple and space ship models are easy enough to make since they usually don't have 'bendy' parts like arms and legs.  Plus, space is really big and would allow a much more epic scope and size to the game. 

The only additional graphics needed are the structures and their various animations for exploding, sinking, imploding, building, and moving which is still a lot.  If I had to, I could brush off Blender and make some believable looking boats, floating houses or space ships, though that would be the absolute worst use of my time.

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Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #48 on: December 09, 2012, 12:40 AM NHFT »

Probably whatever's easiest is what you should do.   Eventually if it's successful we will move it toward the themes and locations outlined in the videos.  But for now I just need something playable with objects that we can fly and fire....As outlined here:

http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=24297.msg344291#msg344291

Strip it down even further from that outline if you like, though keep me informed in advance of what you plan to strip out.

The prototype doesn't really need real art as far as I'm concerned....this first version is all about gameplay characteristics.  These are pretty much unique, they will give us an instant one-of-a-kind game, and nothing other than these characteristics  counts for much yet. 

You'd mentioned we might need an artist, are you sure about that?  Anything off the shelf that we are permitted to use would probably be fine.  A black background screen with white wireframe circles for drones would be fine!  Sea would be fine too as it might draw in some seasteading fans.  Space would be my least favorite of the options for now.  But any of these options would probably work.

Thanks again Helio!
« Last Edit: December 09, 2012, 12:57 AM NHFT by DadaOrwell »
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Helio

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #49 on: December 10, 2012, 05:02 PM NHFT »

Quote
But for now I just need something playable with objects that we can fly and fire

Why?  To show people? If that is what you want, I can do that relatively fast (few weeks, work schedule and wife permitting). 

So just something where players can fly around and blow each other up?
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Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #50 on: December 11, 2012, 08:16 AM NHFT »

The purpose of the crude prototype is to recruit additional talent, and the first players.   The reason I've made the initial prototype so simple and limited is to get us easily over the most difficult hump... the hump between talk and first product creation.

I'm not sure I mentioned this in the outline but this will need to be something people can play as a one-player game.  Since we won't have players at first.  I also don't care yet if it's one played over the net or offline.
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Helio

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #51 on: December 11, 2012, 01:28 PM NHFT »

Actually, adding multiplayer in the prototype won't be much extra effort.  I'll start setting it up.  It will play in the browser on modern browsers so you can play it from nearly anywhere. 

Ill try to get something set up and working this weekend.
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Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #52 on: December 13, 2012, 03:41 AM NHFT »

Very cool Helio!

BTW here's the strategic plan I'm hoping to follow for getting us to the maybe-profitable game described in the original post.  I wrote this up before seeing your last post.

1)  Create crude playable skeleton for the game. Once it's good enough to be fun we use it to recruit players and volunteers. We make it super easy to play - I'm hoping without a registration requirement. This would need to be a game that can be played one-player even if it's multiplayer capable.
2)  Promote the skeleton while gradually making improvements.  We'd slowly provide elements that make it funner and more like the idea outlined in the original post.
3)  Cheaply as possible, we take the game online if it's not already, and make it multiplayer.  A.I. would still make up the bulk of the players however and these would tend to impact the game just like a human player does.
4)  Start making additional weapons and features available to players who will pay for them in Bitcoin.  People who work on the project after we start earning revenue....would be eligible to receive some of the revenue.  It would be token amounts at first but BTC makes that easy.

After that the goal would simply be to increase the number of people paying to participate and move the game closer to the sophisticated experience outlined in the original post.  We'd do this by adding improvements and features, adding community, promoting ourselves, expanding payment methods, etc.  Eventually, hopefully we'd replace the 2d game with a first person shooter.   Or better yet....leave the 2d game active while the first person shooter becomes a second game.

Somewhere in here there might be a role for selling certain versions of the game or selling ads.  We could also provide free features to successful volunteers.  But most of my hopes are pinned on people purchasing features for an otherwise free game.  We'll have to make 'em fun and sometimes unique!

I'm trying to follow J.J. Luna's three rules for making a successful business:

Start small.
Go where the money circulates.
Never take a business partner.

In keeping with that last, I'd view everyone as a volunteer until/unless money is coming in.  The work being done between now and then would not earn anyone anything except maybe a role as a contractor later.   Once the project has hit step 4 and is pulling in revenue I'd view everyone helping me from that point on as a contractor unless they'd volunteered to do something free.  If we got big enough I'd appoint a sort of "War Cabinet" with contractors who are in charge of other contractors.  I just call it that because it sounds exciting lol.

Not sure how we'd "go where the money circulates," but I'm open to ideas.


« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 03:49 AM NHFT by DadaOrwell »
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Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #53 on: March 22, 2013, 04:46 AM NHFT »

As time goes by this idea has gotten both simpler and "complicateder."    The plan for the initial prototype of the game, though unique, is now very bare bones 2d, with the "start small and doable" mentality.   But the more time I've had to think, the more expansive and groundbreaking the ultimate goal becomes.  I'm now aiming to (eventually) turn this into what I call the world's first "omni-game," a genre-starter.  Just as Wolfenstein or Xybots sort of created the first person shooter genre, just as Wing Commander Privateer and the first X-COM sort of created genres of their own, I want to create a *category* that's never been created before.

An "omni" would be defined as a game which lets you pick not just the way you play, but the very *genre* you play.  The game can be one of many genres, or a mix of your chosen genres.

For instance in the case of Free State in its ultimate form, you could play it as a first-person-shooter, a real-time strategy game or a relationship game like The Sims.  In a sense you could even play it as almost a turn-based strategy game by logging in once a day and issuing strategic orders and rules of engagement to your AI that roam virtual 2050 Nashua.

The world's first "omni" game.  Or maybe someone beats me to it, but then I can just enjoy playing their game and point to this thread while beating my chest.

I'd like to also explore the groundbreaking elements of gaming technologies which will likely be available in the real world between now and 2025.  The one which I believe will revolutionize gaming the most is ...well I don't even know what it's called.  The tech which would enable a game to sort of squeeze your arm or tap your shoulder, to simulate not just what your character is seeing/hearing but what it is *feeling.*  Obviously some folks would see and exploit the more prurient elements of this tech.   But it should be up to them. It obviously would allow this game and many others to harness humans' most powerful driving force.  But there'd need to be a way we could let parents impose a more G-rated mode on their home's access to the game.  Just as the real Nashua can be visited and experienced G rated or X rated.

Anyway so there you have it, laid out here strategically and in more detail higher up in the thread. The idea for the gaming world's first "Omni." 

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Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #54 on: April 06, 2013, 01:17 PM NHFT »

One of the ideas I'd meant to incorporate into the ultimate version of the game was the concept of 4d printing.  However before I could even write this into the scenario, the tech apparently became something of a reality.

My concept of 4d printing was that you'd have a device which literally existed in all 4 dimensions.  By that I mean you could program in advance when it came into existence and when it ceased to exist.   In real life 4d printing is apparently not that.  It is more like a device which changes shape depending on what circumstance it is in. For instance a drone that has a needle nose while flying in atmosphere but changes into a sphere while flying through space at ballistic speeds.

Anyway to stay ahead of the wave I guess I should articulate a concept for FIVE d printing LOL.   I would define that as printing out a device which can jump in and out of a dimension currently hidden.  Thus appearing and disappearing where and when you want to to.   
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Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #55 on: July 11, 2013, 03:26 PM NHFT »


Seeking recommendations.  Who's a good computer game programmer in the freedom community?  Preferably NH-based. Why do you recommend them?  Cavaet:  The MineThings.com guy is unavailable.
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Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #56 on: July 11, 2013, 10:10 PM NHFT »

Ok so I guess right after I posted my idea about 5d printing I saw this article about the fifth dimension and a 5d recording!

http://rt.com/news/5d-nanostructured-glass-optical-memory-941/
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Errol

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #57 on: August 01, 2013, 06:01 PM NHFT »

Not in New Hampshire yet.

I'm a graphics person and a coder, and willing to try new things. Has the Unity engine been decided on yet? Is there anything available to look at? I just want to get an idea of the present state of things.
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Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #58 on: August 03, 2013, 08:19 AM NHFT »

Thanks for signing in Errol!   By way of introduction to the rest of you..

Errol, A new fan of this idea, has decided to take a much-appreciated crack at programming the prototype.  Here are copies of the mails I've sent him, and I've invited him to carry on the discussion here.   I'm copying and pasting his updates here with his blessing meanwhile.

(The first email below is an answer to a question he asked....what do I mean by arcade style?)

-----

By arcade style I mean 2-d. The game it would probably be most similar to is the old Silent Death.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BvgxDCbZxE

But it would be slower moving, with less coming at you and the ships would shoot out the side rather than the nose. Later the game would become much deeper. maybe e-mail me via ridleyreport@live.com ?

-----

(This e-mail answers his question as to whether the game would be online-multipleyr)

Correct, although even the prototype needs to be something you could play online *alone* and enjoy.  For instance if no one else was logged in.   This could be done by having full fledged a.i. to fight but could initially, more easily, be accomplished by having static  targets that are there to kill when you're alone.   We won't have many players at first so we need to make sure games can occur with one or even zero people online.

my standards will be pretty low in terms of graphics and fanciness...  so your relative dearth of experience my not be a problem.  if the game actually caries out what's described in the URL i sent you, it will immediately be one of a kind.  once we've reached that point i think the rest will be easier.


-------

It's a business venture at the earliest possible moment; however I tend to avoid spending money speculatively.  my thinking is, if the project gets good enough to be playable and fun online any hour of the day , then we develop premium features and  charge for those.   I don't belive we need a large player base to get to that point, rather a model which does not depend other players being present in order for a lone player to have fun.

once we've reached that point I start employing someone using mainly the money our premium features generates.    the default paid contractor would be the person who successfully got us to that point.  The pay would be low even at that point but none of it would go to me until after the contractor has been paid a few hundred bucks at least.    Does that model sound workable?

Also would you have any objections to copying and continuing this discussion publicly at

http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?&topic=24297.0

I like to have a record in one place of all the significant activity and also some transparency to the public.  I'll copy and paste this note there for now but not your name or your e-mails; you can do that yourself if you wish.  Anyway thanks for the interst in this Errol; this has rekindled my passion for the project too!

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Dave Ridley

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Re: "Free State" game would simulate 2050 New Hampshire
« Reply #59 on: August 03, 2013, 08:21 AM NHFT »

Here's a message from Errol:  He already has a flyable sketch up!

<< I forgot to say go ahead an copy the discussion if you like. No objections.

Through something together.
http://www.errolpelchat.com/DroneGame/drone2.html

I create something to start with (something to evolve).
Doesn't do much, just lets you move around a bounded territory.

Uses the directional pad on your keyboard. I don't think it should be to hard to figure out (Turn left. turn right, throttle forward, throttle backward.)

Is this the sort of thing you had in mind for the stripped down 2D version? >>

And I replied:

"Yes that's an awesome start.... almost exactly what I had in mind.   The top speed would be lower , especially when going backward...and hopefully the screen would be bigger, with fullscreen option but you're totally on the right track!"
« Last Edit: August 04, 2013, 05:15 PM NHFT by DadaOrwell »
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