Who was Carl Drega?

[Russell Kanning]

And the lefties are trying to align you people with Drega to discredit you for sanctioning his actions or something.
Most of you had never even heard of him before...
Don't give those idiots over at DFNH any more ammo.

That is the reason for this thread I think. We are being accused of stuff that some of us had never even heard of. Discussing things openly is more comfortable to me. If people don't even want to discuss Drega, then they can not post here or do as some of you have done and distance yourselves from it.

[Lex]

And the lefties are trying to align you people with Drega to discredit you for sanctioning his actions or something.
Most of you had never even heard of him before...
Don't give those idiots over at DFNH any more ammo.

Who cares what the lefties think? 

[Mark]

I would suggest that he employ stealth and devise a plan where, without getting caught or killed, he make it dangerous (preferably) or deadly to be the people his enemies are.

(Note to self... don't screw over Lloyd)

But, beside the joking. A couple of things that I've wanted to mention, but didn't 'cause I didn't want to be called a murderer (again).

So you're saying you managed to get through your conflict with your busybody neighbors without killing anyone?

Novel concept.

Unless you are up in age (like I'm starting to feel) and if you don't have kids and such to keep you restrained (like I do). You aren't viewing the terrible situation through the right perspective.

Imagine you don't have another 10 years and the resources to flee and start a new someplace else. And you've seen the relentless advance of the freedom thieves. You've scraped together your piece of paradise in a rural setting where they don't have intrusive rules. Yet in this final retreat position the thieves advance on your humble dream and wear you down through years of battling in the system that is tilted against little guys like you. Under these conditions you must view this mortals actions. And view it for what it appears to me to be... a suicide, taking some of the tormenters with you.

I see it clearly now. He wasn't just a murderer. He was an old and frustrated murderer.

Sorry, but he's still a douche.

The other thing that keeps coming back to me is the fact the police cruiser had two officers in it. I think from my experience that is a very unusual case, especially in a small town department with a limited budget. It suggests that the defective equipment pull over was a pretext.

Cops ride together on occasion for a number of reasons. Keep in mind that the stop was in Colebrook, not Columbia where he lived and had his land dispute. Let's say it was a bullshit stop, though. I'd still say it's an overreaction.

[Mark]

What if you were Carl Drega's friend and he confided in you the day before he died:

"This town's public servants have gone too far. All I wanted was to be left alone on my own property, but for ten years they've been ordering me to spend money where I can't afford it.  They've been commanding me to appear in court over a truckload of gravel.  They've been pulling me over for rust in the bed of my pickup.  I can't swallow it anymore."

"You know, people like you have kids and family to provide for and can't risk getting in trouble.  People like you are afraid to stand up to the authorities because they could take your vehicle, then you couldn't get to work.  You're afraid to stand up because they may put you in jail, then you'd lose your job.  You're afraid because they may take your house, then where would your kids sleep?  I understand, I used to be afraid of all those things too."

"But you know what?  I'm not afraid anymore, I'm way beyond fear, I'm angry.  I'm so angry I'd pick up my whole farm - house, barn, and the top twelve feet of topsoil - and dump it on city hall if I could.  I'm so angry I'd give up my life to see those tyrants bleed."

"What do you think?  Am I insane, am I a criminal?"

Not insane. Just immoral.

I don't think anyone's arguing that it's impossible to understand what Drega did. I understand how men beat their wives and single moms abandon their babies too. Being able to understand how you'd get to that point doesn't excuse actually carrying it out.

[tracysaboe]

I'd still say it's an overreaction.

I don't think anybody here is really disagreeing w/ you.

There's a difference between understanding why somebody would do something and endorsing/condoning it.

Nobody here (that I know of) is trying to claim that Drega is some sort of hero.

Tracy

[Mark]

I'd still say it's an overreaction.

I don't think anybody here is really disagreeing w/ you.

There's a difference between understanding why somebody would do something and endorsing/condoning it.

Nobody here (that I know of) is trying to claim that Drega is some sort of hero.

Tracy

Eukreign has said more than once that he was his hero. You said that when a cop dies he probably deserved it and said of the judge, "the benifit (sic) of the doubt goes to Drega."  Several others here have attempted to justify his actions. They mostly start with some statement that they're not trying to justify or condone his actions, and then offer a justification for his actions.

[Tom Sawyer]

Hey Mark,
I thought maybe you were redeemable when you retracted the "White Trash" slur. But, after rereading your posts I see that polarization, emotion and vulgarity are your trump cards. And it appears that others feel the same based on your karma rating. Guess this will be my first use of the ignore option.

I'm much more interested in the doers than the talkers anyway.

[president]

Eukreign, the Carl Drega hero worshipper, has said he plan on moving to Grafton.
I think Tracy has said if he move to NH, it would probably be Grafton.

At the 2005 deliberative session in Grafton, John Babiarz said he felt a Carl Drega situation was brewing in Grafton. I think he may have just been trying to scare people into voting for his warrant article to get rid of the planning board...but then again, he probably hangs out with the Carl Drega types, so I guess he would know what is going on with the crazy people. Why do people try to rationalize what crazy people do?

[president]

Not insane. Just immoral.

Nah. Both.

[Mark]

Hey Mark,
I thought maybe you were redeemable when you retracted the "White Trash" slur. But, after rereading your posts I see that polarization, emotion and vulgarity are your trump cards. And it appears that others feel the same based on your karma rating. Guess this will be my first use of the ignore option.

I'm much more interested in the doers than the talkers anyway.

It's terrible, isn't it? If Drega weren't rotting in a well-deserved grave, his karma rating would probably be through the roof. I don't know if it's funny or scary that you seem to find my vulgarity more offensive than Drega's multiple murders.

As for my karma rating... if opposing the idea that Drega was in any way justified in what he did lowers it, I hope they have to invent new numbers to describe how low my karma goes.

[Mark]

Not insane. Just immoral.

Nah. Both.

Can you be both insane and immoral? If you're truly insane, do you have the mental capacity to make the choices that are considered immoral? Something to ponder, since I'd probably be more lenient in my judgement of Drega if he were truly insane. I wouldn't make fun of a guy in a wheelchair for sucking at baseball, so it would be hard for me to hold a truly insane person to the same behavioral expectations as someone who isn't insane.

[president]

Can you be both insane and immoral?

Yes.

If you're truly insane, do you have the mental capacity to make the choices that are considered immoral?

Just because someone does not realize what they are doing is immoral....that does not make the act moral. I don't care how crazy someone is....raping a child is always immoral. I don't care what they believe.

Something to ponder, since I'd probably be more lenient in my judgement of Drega if he were truly insane. I wouldn't make fun of a guy in a wheelchair for sucking at baseball, so it would be hard for me to hold a truly insane person to the same behavioral expectations as someone who isn't insane.

Every adult needs to take responsibility for their actions. Be as crazy as you want as long as you don't violate the rights of others. Am I suppossed to let insane people violate my rights because they don't know what they are doing is wrong?

[Mark]

Can you be both insane and immoral?

Yes.

If you're truly insane, do you have the mental capacity to make the choices that are considered immoral?

Just because someone does not realize what they are doing is immoral....that does not make the act moral. I don't care how crazy someone is....raping a child is always immoral. I don't care what they believe.

Something to ponder, since I'd probably be more lenient in my judgement of Drega if he were truly insane. I wouldn't make fun of a guy in a wheelchair for sucking at baseball, so it would be hard for me to hold a truly insane person to the same behavioral expectations as someone who isn't insane.

Every adult needs to take responsibility for their actions. Be as crazy as you want as long as you don't violate the rights of others. Am I suppossed to let insane people violate my rights because they don't know what they are doing is wrong?

I see where you're coming from, and I'm not suggesting that we let crazy people violate our rights. I don't think we should allow them to harm others -- I'm talking about my perception of Drega. If he were mentally unable to control himself (and I don't believe this was the case), I'd probably be less harsh on him.

[CNHT]

Not insane. Just immoral.

I don't think anyone's arguing that it's impossible to understand what Drega did. I understand how men beat their wives and single moms abandon their babies too. Being able to understand how you'd get to that point doesn't excuse actually carrying it out.

True and people are trying to smear you by connecting the FSPers to those who would sanction what Drega did (just because Vin wrote about it and he was at that freedom forum last year) and of course no one sanctions cold blooded murder. That is why I care what the lefties are doing.

[Mark]

Not insane. Just immoral.

I don't think anyone's arguing that it's impossible to understand what Drega did. I understand how men beat their wives and single moms abandon their babies too. Being able to understand how you'd get to that point doesn't excuse actually carrying it out.

True and people are trying to smear you by connecting the FSPers to those who would sanction what Drega did (just because Vin wrote about it and he was at that freedom forum last year) and of course no one sanctions cold blooded murder. That is why I care what the lefties are doing.

I think I missed something -- was there an article about Drega/FSP somewhere, or are you talking about something in this thread?