actually doing nothing

[DC]

Rights themselves have to be gifted

rights are not gifted or purchased - you are born with them.

Slaves and people living under oppreasive dictatorships arn't born with rights. They have to be taken and then gifted to some or all of the people.

You are forcealbly taking money

I am saying the act of exclusive use of a specific location forces a legal and monetary obligation (a tax on wages) on others (those being excluded) denying their rights to self-ownership.

Enclosing a specific piece of property doesn't tax anyones wage. They don't have a right to the specific location.

You are saying it is an entitlement

the entitlement comes via the state privilege to enclose backed by force...

People have enclosed and backed property when there is no state. You arn't entitled the specific piece of land you had to purchase it. The entitlement would be the money that was taken backed by force and gifted without my concent. This sounds like Goerge Bush when he says he is a compasionate conservative. You can't be compasionate with other peoples money.

[FrankChodorov]

we have a number of fundamental disagreements that create an impasse

whether or not you are born with rights...
whether or not enclosure creates an obligation on others...
whether or not economic rent appears even in an anarchy...

[KBCraig]

Slaves and people living under oppreasive dictatorships arn't born with rights. They have to be taken and then gifted to some or all of the people.

I disagree. All people are born with rights, even slaves. Being unable to use those rights due to opression is not the same as not having rights.

Kevin

[president]

Slaves and people living under oppreasive dictatorships arn't born with rights. They have to be taken and then gifted to some or all of the people.

I disagree. All people are born with rights, even slaves. Being unable to use those rights due to opression is not the same as not having rights.

So, how do you define "people"?
And why do "people" have rights that other animals do not have?

[Dreepa]

So, how do you define "people"?
And why do "people" have rights that other animals do not have?

Should we also include plants?

[president]

So, how do you define "people"?
And why do "people" have rights that other animals do not have?

Should we also include plants?

Sure, you can include that in your answer if you want. Include all life if you want. What gets rights, and why?
Do plants and animals have self-ownership?

I didn't say I believe anything has rights. This question is for those arguing that "people" have rights.

[FrankChodorov]

Slaves and people living under oppreasive dictatorships arn't born with rights. They have to be taken and then gifted to some or all of the people.

I disagree. All people are born with rights, even slaves. Being unable to use those rights due to opression is not the same as not having rights.

Thank you Kevin.

I concur!

[DC]

Slaves and people living under oppreasive dictatorships arn't born with rights. They have to be taken and then gifted to some or all of the people.

I disagree. All people are born with rights, even slaves. Being unable to use those rights due to opression is not the same as not having rights.

Thank you Kevin.

I concur!

Who decided what the rights were?

[Lloyd Danforth]

I found someone doing something.
http://www.freestateobserver.com/

I forgot about  one of the posts that agrees with the old name of this topic.  Is there a link to this on the Wiki?

[Pat McCotter]

I do active selective ignore. It's just the short ones catch my eye and I wonder how their brains got to be so twisted.

Pat - Mr. Jefferson himself, who you quote, was a proto-georgist.

Didn't quote anyone there - came out of my own simple mind. If the Mr. Jefferson you speak of is Thomas of Declaration of Independence fame, I am honored to be thought of as thinking like him.

sorry in your signature...

That government is best which governs the least,
because its people discipline themselves.
? THOMAS JEFFERSON

Oh, OK. I like that quote because it finishes the oft-quoted first part. TJ let folks know why he said it. Can we go so far as to have no government except our own discipline? I'd like the chance to try.

[Russell Kanning]

I found someone doing something.
http://www.freestateobserver.com/

I forgot about  one of the posts that agrees with the old name of this topic.  Is there a link to this on the Wiki?

It is just on the front .... I don't have a permanent link anywhere yet.

[Lloyd Danforth]

OK

[Dreepa]

The new name is perfect.. whoever changed the name karma to you!!!

[Lloyd Danforth]

I'm pretty sure it wasn't Kat

[president]

The new name is perfect.. whoever changed the name karma to you!!!

For what the FSP/FSP participants are getting done  ???