There's No Such Thing As An Illegal Human Being...

[AlanM]

So instead of more border, as our demagogues are demanding, how about less of it?

Why not simply open borders?
A Tex-Mex Marshall Plan? Robbery.
Beware of the comparisons to the EU. Absolutely reeks of the One Worlders.

[CNHT]

When we get Jane at SDJ/P'fest, we're gonna 'Brainclean' her

Um, I'm not the one who needs brain cleaning. I'm brave enough not to care what I'm called, because it's not going to stop me from discussing any issue, as intended.

[Lloyd Danforth]

They all say that before they're 'Braincleaned'

I didn't call you anything or ask that you stop discussing anything.

[Dreepa]

When we get Jane at SDJ/P'fest, we're gonna 'Brainclean' her

Um, I'm not the one who needs brain cleaning. I'm brave enough not to care what I'm called, because it's not going to stop me from discussing any issue, as intended.

Jane I will help defend you... and I am bigger than Lloyd. 

[Recumbent ReCycler]

I was born in Finland, but since my father was an American citizen, I was automatically an American citizen at birth.  My twin brother and I shared our first passport.  Because I was born in Finland and my mother was Finnish, I am eligible for dual citizenship.  I have been contemplating getting dual citizenship because it would allow me to travel and work in Finland and most of the EU without all of the restrictions that are placed on visitors.  I would also be able to get firearms licenses in Finland.  It looks like it is a lot easier and cheaper to get licences for "grenade launchers; mortars; breech-loading cannon and firearms corresponding to these in structure and purpose; missile and rocket-launcher systems; [and] automatic firearms" in Finland than in the US.    Firearms permits are 32 Euros in Finland.  Suppressors (also referred to as "silencers") are not only not restricted, but are encouraged by the Finnish government.

[Ron Helwig]

that they don't have a clue that they are being exploited

Are they really being exploited if they don't believe that they are? 

[Russell Kanning]

Lets see .... they are free to work at Tyson and make money....
they are free to boycott and still go back to work the next day...
they can party on Friday night and all day Saturday with their exploited wages...
they are free to go back to Mexico if they ever actually feel exploited....

not bad.

I use to feel pretty free in America .... now that I don't pay taxes I feel even better. I might be delusional, but it doesn't feel too bad.

[Kat Kanning]

I thought this one was funny....


Dear Congressman,

by Jim Davies

Exclusive to STR

I'm writing about those eleven million undocumented aliens among us. You recently decided to ship them back South, and although I do have an opinion about that, please allow me to not reveal it, for today I want to urge upon you only one point: that if you do enforce the law in that way, you do so efficiently and fairly. 

First though, I can understand your reasoning. You make a law, and 11 million swarthy aliens flout it. Such makes you-all look like 435 idiots, and that will never do. 

There then arises the big "How?" question, and maybe I can help. The problem of identifying, rounding up and transporting these 11 million is not quite unprecedented. Back in the early ?40s the German government faced a similar task and they went about it with gusto and intelligence. You could learn from their example--up to a point, of course. 

The identification was a long job, but there were physical attributes and ethnic names that helped, and they relied also upon neighbor identification. You could implement some kind of reward system that would bring out informers from the woodwork of apartment and farm or factory, as well as having the IRS and SSA match you some computer records--and more about them below. Given the will, you can find a way. Otherwise you-all might appear impotent, and that would never do. 

The other clever thing those Germans did was to pick out leaders from the community to be transported or organized into work gangs, give them some kind of uniform, and make them responsible for the task--without diverting valuable government resources. Smart! I recall that in the Lodz and Krakow ghettoes, for example, those leaders were called the Judenrat." 

Eleven million, spread widely around the country, would need several hundred thousand to do the job--and in the present tight job market, you couldn't possibly hire that many, even if you had the money to pay them--so all you'd need do is to pick out (say) one of them in 20, give them armbands with a Special Service insignia and a modest expense account, and set them to work with promises of no deportation. Hey, if you break those promises later on, to whom will they complain?  They will have no standing in this country, no Representative in Congress. 

The actual transportation will be tricky, in these days of $3 gasoline, but you'll find a way. Perhaps there are trains with empty compartments one-way, or some such. Anyway, it has to be done, otherwise you-all would appear incompetent, and that would never do. 

Shipping the 11 million is of course only one part of the task. Laws were broken by their employers too, and you must punish them; otherwise the law would be revealed as an ass, and that would never do. 

Here are my suggestions about that. First, you can get the departing illegals to snitch on their employers. Promise them a better class of travel on the trip or something. Then (because so many of the employers are individual householders, like those who were picked for high office by Clinton before it was found they had hired undocumented nannies) you could do a simple sweep of everyone in the Border States who is earning more than, say, $130,000 a year. The IRS will spot them for you easily. Pay them each an unexpected visit, and check the papers of anyone gardening who looks Hispanic. That could be very productive! 

Yes, I know that people in that class are among your most generous supporters, come election time. But you must be fair in enforcing the law; otherwise, you-all would appear not to be acting without fear or favor, and that would never do. 

So far, so good. But then comes a class of villain that you may not have considered yet. To be consistent and fair, however, you must prosecute them too; for the law is the law. I refer to government agents who have taken money from these illegals but delivered no services in return. You will recognize that as pure theft, and it must be dealt with; otherwise you-all might be seen as a bunch of crooks, and that would never do. 

I refer to the IRS and SSA, which have money deducted from the paychecks of these illegal workers for income tax and Social Security tax, without checking first to make sure they are legit--the very same crime of which their employers are guilty--and without the slightest obligation to provide any services or eventual pensions in return. If $3,000 a year is deducted from each paycheck, that's $33 billion annually, and in aggregate I suppose it could amount to a heist of a quarter of a trillion. That's massive fraud! 

Probably, you'll not feel able to fire, fine or incarcerate all 120,000 IRS employees and however many work for the SSA--there might be a downside to that, an impact on your revenues. But that need not stop you going after the ringleaders! The top 100 managers in each agency, say, could be picked out and given long prison sentences, along of course with the Administrators and Commissioners for the past dozen or so years that this huge influx of illegals has been a-building. The key people, who were actually responsible for the fraud, but perhaps not the grunts who were just obeying orders. You really have to do this; for otherwise voters might perceive a double standard and see you-all as two-faced, and that would never do. 

Well, that's about all I have for you today. Hope it was helpful! Until next time, 

Your earnest and supportive constituent, 

My Name 

[FTL_Ian]

Billy, it's a tough job educating people like Ian who should know better (Caleb is just a young one so I don't fault him) etc, but someone's gotta do it!

Um, Caleb is 28, and I'm 25.  The difference between us and you is principle.  We oppose border control, you support it.  We oppose big government, you support it when it suits your purposes (keeping the UN out).  We believe the market can provide protection from dangerous entities on a voluntary basis, you do not.

Age is not a factor here, the factor is your fear of lettting go of your precious constitutional state.

It should also be noted, that you worked on the LPNH website, which I really appreciate.  Though I wonder, did you know in advance of your work that you were supporting an organization that calls for open borders?  Check the LP platform.

[ravelkinbow]

Billy, it's a tough job educating people like Ian who should know better (Caleb is just a young one so I don't fault him) etc, but someone's gotta do it!

Um, Caleb is 28, and I'm 25.  The difference between us and you is principle.  We oppose border control, you support it.  We oppose big government, you support it when it suits your purposes (keeping the UN out).  We believe the market can provide protection from dangerous entities on a voluntary basis, you do not.

Age is not a factor here, the factor is your fear of lettting go of your precious constitutional state.

It should also be noted, that you worked on the LPNH website, which I really appreciate.  Though I wonder, did you know in advance of your work that you were supporting an organization that calls for open borders?  Check the LP platform.

You are showing your lack of age in your response, and that does not necessarily mean in years.  You should be able to debate your points without being insulting, perhaps is a talent you will gain with age.  Jane has never said she was for big government in anyway.

The constitution is important and one can only hope you will realize that someday.

As for the LP website I hope your not representing them, good way to loose unpaid volunteers.

[tracysaboe]

Just take a look at the Vt Commons website. Should be called Vt Commies!

??? ??? ???

Jane, for whatever you may think of the agenda, you shouldn't throw labels around so freely.  You may not like what the Vermont group is all about, but they AREN'T communists.

Caleb

It is not about whether I like them or not, it's about what they are really doing and to whom they are connected. Please read more about the Agenda 21. They are part of the UN, petitioning them, as if the UN had authority, to join the UNs geo-political area, mapped out for the northeast...enuff said? Thus they are enabling the globalism, or as we call it, one world government, which is based on socialism and the ultimate political correctness ensured by the control of the people by the government. I'd rather take the US Constitution than the one the UN is writing, thank you very much.

I might add that before people go around screaming 'secession' they take care that they are not indeed jumping from the frying pan into the fire!
Once again, it's not about disliking people, it's about the bigger issue of sovereignty, of both states and countries. (But if they can get you off track using the race card, they have suceeded in keeping you away from the bigger issue)

"State sovereignty is a major obstacle to globalism. The twin hurricanes, Katrina and Rita, prompted President bush to announce on September 26 that he will seek to FEDERALIZE disaster emergencies so that federal response bypasses state and local officials, and, by the way, the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878."

Educate thyselves!
http://www.augustreview.com/

Jane is dead on here people, pay attention.                                       

If keeping national soveranty is a deterent to 1 world government. Abolishing the national government and keeping State Soverenty is even a better deterent.

TRacy

[tracysaboe]

Jane, for whatever you may think of the agenda, you shouldn't throw labels around so freely.  You may not like what the Vermont group is all about, but they AREN'T communists.

Aren't many of them 'Georgists'?

That would mean communists.  (economic rent and that bullshit)

Land Commies

Tracy

[FTL_Ian]

You are showing your lack of age in your response, and that does not necessarily mean in years.  You should be able to debate your points without being insulting, perhaps is a talent you will gain with age.

The original insult was hurled by Jane at Caleb, calling him younger than me and ignorant.  She's wrong on both counts.

Jane has never said she was for big government in anyway.

She would never say that, but if she wants border controls, that's what she's going to get!

The constitution is important and one can only hope you will realize that someday.

I used to think the constitution was important, now I realize it's just a piece of paper written on by some guys a long time ago.  Since I never signed it, it's not binding on me, and since those few who did sign it are dead now, it's a dead letter.  The constitution will not save us from tyranny, it never has.  At best it has slowed the tyrants down.

As for the LP website I hope your not representing them, good way to loose unpaid volunteers.

Just making sure she knows who she's helping, I wouldn't want her to discover that she was helping the open borders crowd on her own and feel used.  I'll reiterate that her efforts are much appreciated.  You must have missed that compliment.

[tracysaboe]

By the way, the Vermont plan is not to join a U.N. "region".  It is to create a "confederacy" among New England States, wherein each state retains its own sovereignty.  They actually have plans to decentralize even the states, so that communities actually gain sovereignty.  You can debate the merits of the plan all you want, but at least get the facts right.  There's no Vermont plan to surrender Vermont sovereignty.

Caleb

Read their platform again. They want to request membership in the UN.

TRacy

[ravelkinbow]

I truly just wish people would stop with the personal attacks, there is so much of that on here.
There should be no reason why people can't have healthy debate and leave the sarcasm, insults,anti-faith and such out of it. 

There are those who are good at this, Kat and I don't always see eye to eye, but we can disagree on one topic and agree on the next, we never insult each other or attack each others personal beliefs, and we have stood together and will continue too at events and protest we do agree on.  We have a good friendship and I am glad to know her, there are others I wouldn't want to be within 10 feet of and most certainly not around my child.  I am sure they wouldn't want to be around me either and that works out just fine.

But, I suppose that is to be exspected given the size of the group, it just doesn't make it right or acceptable.  There is a saving grace in that there are many intelligent and great people who can make their point without attacking others.  This forum has changed and not for the better as of late.