Lunatic cop storms into rock show, tazers people, throws people to the ground

[burnthebeautiful]

One of the pictures clearly shows a Che Guevara sticker on one of the guitars, so the crowd is most likely mostly left wing type people. But it doesn't change the fact that acting the way that cop did is unacceptable.

[KBCraig]

Having finally gotten to a computer/network were I could view the videos, I'm also puzzled by the very selective editing.

Color me neutral at this point. I've seen too many "victim" videos, where the victims did everything they could to provoke the response they got, and then cried "foul". That's mostly a tactic of leftists, such as the "social anarchists". It amounts to dishonesty, and I can't stand lies on either side.

Kevin

I hear what you are saying, but we know that it does not take much to "Provoke a response".  The cop arresting the skate boarder said he was being arrested for not leaving when told.  I guess his crime was not respecting the cops ownership of him.  Cops are quick with the tazers and pepper spray.  why shouldn't a person resist arrest, especially if they are being arrested for not being good little sheep.

I was talking about the club video from Houston. The arrests in the California park are absolutely ridiculous.

[FTL_Ian]

It would have been sweet had someone in the crowd been armed with their own tazer.  Taze the cop then get the hell out of there. 

And get shot in the back of the head... and the cop gets a gold medal and free healthcare, salary etc for life (and is of course discharged as a hero) while your family pretends they didnt know you and only a few attend your funeral out of respect

By whom?  Another clubgoer?  There was only one cop there.

[burnthebeautiful]

I posted on the Two Gallants messageboard telling people who were there to call up the show.

[lildog]

Having finally gotten to a computer/network were I could view the videos, I'm also puzzled by the very selective editing.

Color me neutral at this point. I've seen too many "victim" videos, where the victims did everything they could to provoke the response they got, and then cried "foul". That's mostly a tactic of leftists, such as the "social anarchists". It amounts to dishonesty, and I can't stand lies on either side.

Kevin

Exactly!!!  The video starts at the arrest... the news paper points out that the cop was shoved by the guitarist who was therefor arrested.  If the guitarist took up violence against the cop then he SHOULD be arrested.  The fact the video leaves that part out leads me to lean toward believing the police officer was in the right here.

[Revmar]

Having finally gotten to a computer/network were I could view the videos, I'm also puzzled by the very selective editing.

Color me neutral at this point. I've seen too many "victim" videos, where the victims did everything they could to provoke the response they got, and then cried "foul". That's mostly a tactic of leftists, such as the "social anarchists". It amounts to dishonesty, and I can't stand lies on either side.

Kevin

Exactly!!!  The video starts at the arrest... the news paper points out that the cop was shoved by the guitarist who was therefor arrested.  If the guitarist took up violence against the cop then he SHOULD be arrested.  The fact the video leaves that part out leads me to lean toward believing the police officer was in the right here.

Let's see.  A cop shows up alone and start throwing his weight around on stage in front of a hostel crowd.  And he gets shoved!  How dare those kids push back against an authority figure!  Don't they know that Sheep are to follow orders like good little...well...sheep

As far as I see it, the crime was failure to listen to your masters.  Yeah, they should go to jail.

[Tom Sawyer]

What the hell was the cop doing on stage? Go to the club manager, the soundman... these would be the first steps to take. How about wait till the song ends.

I bet it is against the police's own policy to handle it the way he did.

[citizen_142002]

Most shows I've been to, the cops stay out of the way, and they would have some problems if they messed with the crowd.

[lildog]

Guys read the story... the cop showed up to respond to a noise complaint.  Now was it valid?  Who knows.  Remember your rights end where mine begin so if I were to turn on blasting music at late hours of the night when you have to work the next day would I be violating your rights?

So question one is did the club/ band violate the noise ordanace?

Let's assume it did for argument sake.

So a cop is called in about the noise.  He goes into the club and who knows who he talked to (the video leaves all this off).  Let's assume he did talk to the club owner.  This appeared to be a small club and based on the two person band I doubt they had a sound guy.

So the cop asked the band directly to turn it down.  The article on the story says they did turn it down then as soon as he walked away turned it back on then the guitarist bumped the cop with his chest.

I'm sorry but if that's correct this band A) was violating the noise ordance and B) took out aggrisive acts toward the cop which could be viewed as assult.

So unless you don't believe in your rights ending once they disturb others and that you shouldn't be able to take agression out on others then I don't see how you can view this as anything other then the band being in the wrong.  But clearly there are those here who as SO anti authority they WANT to view the cops as the bad guys no matter what.

[MattLeft]

Even if the ossifer was 100% in the right, I think we should applaud the crowd's pushing him around.  Any instance of standing up to the police state should be encouraged.  There are just too damn many cops in America with too much power and too little respect for the "thems" in the us-against-them outlook they all seem to subscribe to.  It'd be nice if only the righteous, good people stood up to the police, but if some bad guys do it too, I can't complain.  After all, the distinction between "law breaker" and "good, upstanding member of the community" is fading every day and with every new law passed.

Although bad laws and politicians are obviously a huge part of the problem, it's not Ted Kennedy or George Bush kicking in peoples' doors in the middle of the night.  You can't have a police state without a shite-load of police.  You can't have a Nazi Germany without legions of jack-booted thugs.

One could counter my argument with the question, "If we root for the badguys, we're supporting violent offenders."  So I say buy a gun. Train the wife and have her pack heat so she can defend your children.  Stop relying on the cops to protect you, because they really don't, anyway.  "To Protect & Serve" needs to be properly amended to "To Harass & Intimidate."

[Revmar]

Guys read the story... the cop showed up to respond to a noise complaint.  Now was it valid?  Who knows.  Remember your rights end where mine begin so if I were to turn on blasting music at late hours of the night when you have to work the next day would I be violating your rights?

So question one is did the club/ band violate the noise ordanace?

Let's assume it did for argument sake.

So a cop is called in about the noise.  He goes into the club and who knows who he talked to (the video leaves all this off).  Let's assume he did talk to the club owner.  This appeared to be a small club and based on the two person band I doubt they had a sound guy.

So the cop asked the band directly to turn it down.  The article on the story says they did turn it down then as soon as he walked away turned it back on then the guitarist bumped the cop with his chest.

I'm sorry but if that's correct this band A) was violating the noise ordance and B) took out aggrisive acts toward the cop which could be viewed as assult.

So unless you don't believe in your rights ending once they disturb others and that you shouldn't be able to take agression out on others then I don't see how you can view this as anything other then the band being in the wrong.  But clearly there are those here who as SO anti authority they WANT to view the cops as the bad guys no matter what.

Okay, so let's assume what you say is correct.  Bar has band making too much noise.  Cops called. cop talks to manager/owner, whoever is running the place that night.  Manager ignores/ pisses off cop.  What would be the reasonable cop response.  how about, you write the citation for the noise violation and go on with your day.  See, the club owner is responsible for what happens on his property.  They are the one who has to obey all the silly rules just to run a business.  But, cops being what they are today, the response is the jump on stage and start messing with the musicians equipment.  Just because the jerk has a badge does not give Him the "Right" to do what ever he wants. 

Lets say it was the person who called in the complaint who went to the bar.  They decided to jump up on stage and forcibly take the musicians property.  Would they be in the right to taze and toss around a few people?  Woudn't the musicians be in the "right" to fight back?  Cops think they are above the law and more power to those that stood up to this bully with a badge!

[Recumbent ReCycler]

Revmar, you make a good point.  A proper response should have been to write a citation rather than use force to enforce a noise ordinance.  Prior to the officer taking action, nobody was usng force against another, as far as we know.
Also, what was the noise ordinance?  How did the officer determine that they were in violation?  What are the PD's policies about the enforcement of noise ordinances?  Did he have a decibel meter?  It appears that the officer overreacted.

[lildog]

Okay, so let's assume what you say is correct.  Bar has band making too much noise.  Cops called. cop talks to manager/owner, whoever is running the place that night.  Manager ignores/ pisses off cop.

The manager could have been cooperating with the officer.  We don't know.

Looking at the video closely it's clear this is a small time band.  Most likely they controlled their own equipment.  The cop most likely was told to talk directly to the band.

Now the article does say the band did turn down then turned right back up when the cop started to walk away.

What would be the reasonable cop response.  how about, you write the citation for the noise violation and go on with your day.

Let's say you live next door.  You have an important job interview which is why you called the police in the first place.  Their issuing an violation and then letting the club finish the night at full volume isn't going to help you.  They are the ones in the wrong if they are playing music too loud and they need to stop as they are violating your rights to piece and quite.

See, the club owner is responsible for what happens on his property.  They are the one who has to obey all the silly rules just to run a business.  But, cops being what they are today, the response is the jump on stage and start messing with the musicians equipment.

The article states the band turned it down then turned it back up taughting the police.  I'm sorry but that's not right.  Put your hate for the police aside for a second and look at just the band's side.

They were playing too loud and someone living near by complaned.
They acknowledged the complant and turned the music down, then as soon as the person complaining left they turned it back up.
Then when confronted a second time they bump chests with that person.

Do you think that is right?  If it were me and someone bumped me, they'd be flat on their back because I'd punch their lights out.

Lets say it was the person who called in the complaint who went to the bar.  They decided to jump up on stage and forcibly take the musicians property.  Would they be in the right to taze and toss around a few people?  Woudn't the musicians be in the "right" to fight back?  Cops think they are above the law and more power to those that stood up to this bully with a badge!

The band drew first blood by bumping the officer, HE not the band was the one fighting back.  Don't you think he has the "right" to fight back if someone takes out an act of agression against him?

Step back and look at the whole scene from just an average person walking in.

Joe lives near a bar.  The bar has an agreement that their music will tune down by X o'clock at night which is common (I lived near bars during college so I know bars do this).

Two guys in a band turn their amps up to 11 and play away.  Because the croud digs them they go past X o'clock, still playing at 11.

Joe having something important tomorrow goes to the bar to complain.  The owner points to the band and says they control their own equipment.

Joe walks up to the band and asks them to turn down.  They do.

No sooner then Joe reaches the door to the club then the band turns back up to 11.

Joe walks back up to the band at which time the guitarist bumps chest to chest with him.

And now the crowd gathered is starting to yell at Joe and getting upset with him.


You're Joe, what do you do?

[Skooma]

Pushing little children!
With their fully automatics!
They like to push the weak around!

[KBCraig]

Pushing little children!
With their fully automatics!
They like to push the weak around!

errrr...  ???