Violent, filthy muslims

[Objectivist]

lildog, I like you . (Karma for lildog). We can play chess some time.

If Swizerland has avoided attack, Denmark, Belgium and the Netherlands have NOT. Though they were neutral in WWII, Hitler invaded.

THE ONLY REASON the Nazis didn't attack Swizerland was because the Nazi's were sending millions of looted wealth there for deposit, preparing for the inevitable fall of the Thousand Year Reich.

And if the Sep 11 attacks weren't an instance of the Muslims bringing the fight to us, what is?

- Objectivist

[FrankChodorov]

And if the Sep 11 attacks weren't an instance of the Muslims bringing the fight to us, what is?

it was a criminal act not an act of war.

we played right into their hands by invading Iraq and getting rid of Hussein for Osama (his enemy) and uniting the jihadist world.

they can't defeat us militarily but they can sow so much internal desention that we destroy ourselves and that is what is happening...

[Michael Fisher]

Objectivists realize that people are individuals.

Only statists lump people together to judge them (kind of like this).

[David]

I also worked for several muslim individuals.  Good people.  Poor managers.   
Collective guilt and collective innoscence lead to horrendous murders, and tremendous crimes justified as being neccessary.
Everytime a group is collectively punished, it feeds into the propaganda of those who otherwise can't sell their ideas. 
Osama can say till he's blue in the face that christians or westerners want to kill muslims, but no one believes him untill he can say see, see, I was right.  Osama has been saying that for decades, and they remained a small dangerous group of individuals, untill the US gov't feeds into their propaganda by attacking a new country.  You need to study Rands works on collectivism a little more. 

[lildog]

lildog, I like you . (Karma for lildog). We can play chess some time.

Since my son learned checkers, it's all about that game lately.  He's four and actually beating people on Yahoo online games.     I'd love to find out who these people are and point out that they've been beaten by a four year old.   

[Objectivist]

Objectivists realize that people are individuals.

Only statists lump people together to judge them (kind of like this).

There were a lot of "innocent" people living in Germany and Japan in WWII, but their blood is on the hands of their dictators, even if they died from USA bombs.

If your country attacks another, you can't whine and moan, "But I didn't want to attack you, only my government wanted to."

Your government represent you. That is EXACTLY the reason why politics is so important: you are responsible for the actions of your government, good or bad.

That's why I'm in favor of carpet bombing Iran (firstly) and while we're at it, Iraq and Afghanistan, until they're as peaceful and docile as The Axis Powers after WWII.

Then we can force a constitutional government on them, like we did to Germany and Japan, fuck this pansy voting crap, letting them elect their own dicatators and such. And after that, we'll build freeways and Walmarts everywhere, and everyone will live happily ever after, like thay have in Germany and Japan.

Bombs away!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :dragonball:

-Objectivist

[Jason Rand]

If your country attacks another, you can't whine and moan, "But I didn't want to attack you, only my government wanted to."

Your government represent you. That is EXACTLY the reason why politics is so important: you are responsible for the actions of your government, good or bad.

Great news!  Finally we have someone who will take moral responsibility for the IRS and its involuntary taxation.  Where should I send the bill for restitution?

But seriously, I am not responsible or guilty for the coercive acts of the US govt. simply by virtue of existing and living in this country.  As Spooner points out, the constitution has no authority, and the government, while nominally existing with my consent, does not in fact have it.

[Dog On]

Objectivists realize that people are individuals.

Only statists lump people together to judge them (kind of like this).

There were a lot of "innocent" people living in Germany and Japan in WWII, but their blood is on the hands of their dictators, even if they died from USA bombs.

If your country attacks another, you can't whine and moan, "But I didn't want to attack you, only my government wanted to."

Your government represent you. That is EXACTLY the reason why politics is so important: you are responsible for the actions of your government, good or bad.

That's why I'm in favor of carpet bombing Iran (firstly) and while we're at it, Iraq and Afghanistan, until they're as peaceful and docile as The Axis Powers after WWII.

Then we can force a constitutional government on them, like we did to Germany and Japan, fuck this pansy voting crap, letting them elect their own dicatators and such. And after that, we'll build freeways and Walmarts everywhere, and everyone will live happily ever after, like thay have in Germany and Japan.

Bombs away!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :dragonball:

-Objectivist

This is a rediculous comparison.

The German army had millions of willing participants, and they actually INVADED other countries.

Terrorism is just murder.

I don't know why are you comparing WWII Japan and Germany with terrorism.

As to my knowledge there is no TERROR LAND.

The Afghanistan war wasn't 'revenge' for 9/11

Fifteen of the attackers were from Saudi Arabia, two from the United Arab Emirates, one from Egypt, and one from Lebanon.

Trying to say bombing Afghanistan did anything but help terrorists is idiotic.

You could argue that it was to get rid of a oppressive regime (taliban) although I completely disagree with using carpet bombing to change governments for other nations.

The taliban were "hiding" Al queda so apparently thats why bombing Afghanistan was a good idea.

It is well known that Pakistan has lots of 'Al queda' members living there, although I dislike using the term Al queda as it is often used as a blanket term to cover any islamic terrorism. There is not a master mind. You can't destory islamic terrorism by killing Osama bin Laden. The reason Pakistan is not now a crater in the ground is because it has nuclear weapons.

You cannot stop terrorists by invading countries.

The fuel that Islamic fundamentalists drive its ideas with is videos of dead and tortured muslims.

Do they call America the evil liberal society or do they call it the evil attacking invaders/crusaders. It's extremely hard to make someone want to kill themselves and other people, and make them believe they will go to heaven, for killing people who like to let their people act "immorally". It's alot easier to say "LOOK! Look at what the evil americans are doing. They want to kill all muslims, we must fight back against them".

All bombing countries that have links to terrorism will do is reinforce the recruiting power of islamic terrorists and make it seem right for all muslims to attack innocent civillians, and lets be clear, it IS a minority that is commiting terrorist acts. If every muslim was intent on commiting terrorist acts as you seem to believe, we would have a full scale war on our hands.

You can't win a war on terror, just like you can't win a war on anxiety, or melancholy.

The idea that we need to "fight them over there" is just going to increase the power of islamic terrorism. If we "withdraw" from the "war on terror", or stop killing thousands of people based on the actions of a few hundred as I like to call it, then yes, there will still be terrorism. There is a tremendous momentum for anti americanism, and a great feeling of being under seige by the west, but although people are often guilible and lazy thinkers, they aren't completely retarded. If the west stops using aggressive action against arab nations, people are going to start to realise, all this stuff about "the west being evil imperialists" isn't really true.

As the people of the middle east become wealthier and stop getting bombs dropped on them, they will stop caring.

If arab countries are continually invaded to "remove a dictatorship" or "stop a threat to world peace" then all that will happen is Islamic terrorism will go from something a few hundred people have partaken in to hundreds of thousands. 9/11 was only 19 people, there are cults far larger than that, now think about all the people who have had family members killed in Iraq and Afghanistan, and how their country has been destroyed, now think how many people that is going to attract to fundamentalist ideas. If 9/11 had just been done by a bunch of wackjob christians who thought the devil was alive in the twin towers then hundreds of thousands of people would still be alive today, but people love to get their war on, and arabs have to pay because the people who did it were arabs so that must mean all arabs are just waiting for their chance to do another 9/11.

Its kind of hard not to believe Americans aren't evil invaders when they have destroyed your country and hundreds of thousands of your people for seemingly no reason. And lets be clear, there was NO reason for the Iraq war. It was a waste of tax payer money, a waste of human life, a waste of time, and is now going to cause a massive civil war, not to mention turning a previously secular arab state, that was previously a force against Al Queda into a giant pot of muslim fundamentalism.


Ireland is a perfect example of how you can't stop terrorists by trying to kill them (especially in the case of Iraq and Afghanistan were massive civillian casualities occured). The Republic of Ireland is a very prosperous country now, people just don't care when they have money in their pocket and a good standard of living.

If you don't think these wars in the middle east aren't acting as giant recruiting posters for muslim terrorists, try and find a feed of Al Jazeera one day and imagine if this stuff was going on in your country.

America's support of Israel really isn't helping muslims not want to kill americans. If you weren't paying attention during the Lebannon-Israeli conflict, you might have missed the sickening behaviour of the IDF. Billions of dollars worth of damage has been done to lebannon. For less than 100 deaths of Hezbollah militants the IDF killed over a 1000 of Lebanese civillians, not to mention the Lebanese army refused to attack the Israel. To put the sheer extremity of Israels actions into perspective, Hezbollah, a supposedly terrorist organisation, killed more IDF soldiers than Israeli civillians, and they had non of the satellite imagery, spy drones, and high tech bombers the IDF have.

The Israeli government do not have to care about civillian deaths because it doesn't matter one bit when it comes to polling day how many people they kill.

I find the killing of any innocent civillians abhorent, butthe so called "war on terror" has done nothing but worsen the situation.


"Your government represent you. That is EXACTLY the reason why politics is so important: you are responsible for the actions of your government, good or bad. "

You disproved your own point right there. The acts of the people on 9/11 were not done by a nation or government, just less than 2 dozen psychotic individuals. If you apply your own logic, then YOU are responsible for the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Afghans and Iraqis, because it was YOUR government which unless you dont pay taxes, YOU helped fund.

"Then we can force a constitutional government on them, like we did to Germany and Japan, fuck this pansy voting crap, letting them elect their own dicatators and such. And after that, we'll build freeways and Walmarts everywhere, and everyone will live happily ever after, like thay have in Germany and Japan."

I really hope this is a joke. You seem to be displaying a spectacular disillusionary state of mind on what actually happens in the world.

[Objectivist]

As to my knowledge there is no TERROR LAND.

Its Iran.

You cannot stop terrorists by invading countries.

Destroying Iran and Saudia Arabia would do it. Iraq and Afghanastan are one the west and east border of Iran, respectivly, so we're nicely positioned for a good attack on the homeland of terror.

Do they call America the evil liberal society or do they call it the evil attacking invaders/crusaders. It's extremely hard to make someone want to kill themselves and other people, and make them believe they will go to heaven, for killing people who like to let their people act "immorally". It's alot easier to say "LOOK! Look at what the evil americans are doing. They want to kill all muslims, we must fight back against them".

most Iraqis are killed by other Iraqis. Its a civil war. America isn't killing the muslims, muslims are killing muslims.

All bombing countries that have links to terrorism will do is reinforce the recruiting power of islamic terrorists and make it seem right for all muslims to attack innocent civillians, and lets be clear, it IS a minority that is commiting terrorist acts. If every muslim was intent on commiting terrorist acts as you seem to believe, we would have a full scale war on our hands.

we DO have a full scal war on our hands, every Muslim or not. It isn't the case that EVRY SINGLE GERMAN was a Nizi, why need it be the case that every single Muslim be a terrorist? That's assanine.

You can't win a war on terror, just like you can't win a war on anxiety, or melancholy.

There's a book titled "Jefferson's War on Terror" which America won, and could win again with the same moral attitude we had back then.

If the west stops using aggressive action against arab nations, people are going to start to realise, all this stuff about "the west being evil imperialists" isn't really true.


As the people of the middle east become wealthier and stop getting bombs dropped on them, they will stop caring.

That's not what they're mad about. Actually, they're motivated by a hate for wealth, industry and liberal ways of life, like women having jobs or being free to work in the porn industry. That's waht makes their blood boil. Why do you think they hit the TRADE center?

And how will they ever get wealthier? They hate wealth.

Iran is the home of terrorism and its cheif supporter. I hope Israel nukes them before they get a nuke, or they may nuke Israel. After all, they have declarted that Israel has no right to exist and should be wiped off the planet.

Watch this 30 second video if you doubt the evil of Islam in any way. You can find a lot more evidence if you open your eyes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rH4UuWFk5Sg

-Objectivist

[Caleb]

It's obvious this idiot is a troll.  He comes around earlier trying to dictate the definition of poetry.  For as idiotic as that persona was, at least it wasn't venomous.  This current incarnation of "Objectivist" is downright hateful.  I'm putting him on ignore.

[Dreepa]

  I'm putting him on ignore.

Thank you for that. Me too

[FrankChodorov]

me too...can you believe this guy's views within a freedom movement?

[Objectivist]

A divorce, you say? Granted! 

[Dreepa]

me too...can you believe this guy's views within a freedom movement?

[Objectivist]

me too...can you believe this guy's views within a freedom movement?

For the record, I can't believe the views I've found in this "freedom" movement. No wonder Ayn Rand thought Libertarians were unprincipled and short-sighted. She was right. I'm rather sad about this realization. I didn't know you were all so cluless about the nature of Islam and terrorism.

ta ta