Advice Please for a parenting issue with 18 year old son

[Raineyrocks]

Hi Everybody!

I wasn't sure what topic to put this under so I put it here.  I need all the advice I can get right now so please help if you have any.
My 18 year old son moved from NH a few weeks after he turned 18 and now he wants to come home, which I'm happy about but...........
he has been lying out of his teeth to me about everything, stealing from his sister (who he's staying with in Maryland), and he's being very promiscuous (sp?)  with any female that looks at him.
My husband said he will have to change his evil ways or hit the road.  I don't want it to come to us having to kick him out and besides that he would have no where to go.  My daughter is so glad he's coming back up here she feels used and stepped on but has a heart of gold and would never kick her brother out no matter what he did, so I feel like I'm helping her by letting him come home too.
I'm just worried that he's going to cause problems for himself and the rest of us living here plus I want him to have a nice life for himself but he never sticks to his word, has a horrible temper and lies like a rug.  What to do?
 

[Lloyd Danforth]

First of all, he's not promiscuous. That is just a word coined by people who either don't understand or, ignore human nature. At his age the woman part is normal.

Show him this post.  Ask him to pretend he is a stranger and have him explain what he sees in your concerns about him.

You, your daughter....someone, give him a month to:   get a job, any job, some job. Pay something into the household.  Keep any of his habits that you don't like out of the house.  Take care of his space and treat everyone with respect.

If you are not do not see any improvement after a couple of weeks, suggest where, besides NH & MD, he would most like a Bus Ticket too.

If nothing by week 3,  tell him you are in the planing stages of his leaving, not to bring anything into the house and to stay out of the house except during meals and sleep.

If nothing after Two more days tell him to pack his bags.  He is not going to improve in 4 more days and catching him short will add to the seriousness of the situation.  Let him know you would prefer he left your community and to accept  the Bus Ticket, because thats all he is getting.

Stick to your guns!   You won't be helping him if you don't.

[AlanM]

Good advice, Lloyd. He is now an adult. Require him to act as such. If he refuses, he will have to strike out on his own. It won't be easy for you, or him, but it must be done.

[Lloyd Danforth]

Apon further thought it occurred to me that you don't have to garrentee him a month.  Tell him  up too a month.  You'll be taking stock of his efforts every day and weighing his improvemet.  Let him know the axe could come down at any time.  Stick to what you say you're going to do.

[dawn]

Sounds like he needs some "tough love". It's your house, you set the rules. He abides by them, or finds his own place to live. You will do him no favors by enabling poor behavior (especially the temper issue). Be clear, be firm. Don't threaten - just inform him of the facts of life and let him make his own choices. He's 18 - you are no longer "responsible" for him. Letting him live with you is a choice - you offer the terms, he makes the choice whether or not to accept them.

While your daughter may be a sweetheart for taking him in, it sounds like she should be advised to not let it happen again.

Good luck!!!!

[Pat McCotter]

My oldest was the same way. He and my youngest lived with me for a while. I thought that we had it licked when the youngest was berating him for lying and stealing but it didn't work. I gave him three chances for improvement (out twice before finally giving up). Well, Mom couldn't see him staying out there - wherever he was staying - so he became her problem - and he still didn't change.

Chilluns like that need to come to grips with the consequences of their actions.

[eques]

I can only speak from the other side of the coin... and all I can say is that you're not going to do your son any favors by going easy on him.  Whatever it is you decide to do, you need to stick with it.  The suggestions above are probably going to work the best from your perspective, especially since it sounds like he needs a wake-up call.

I don't know if this resonates with you, but for me, it would all be about mutual respect.  He doesn't get respect if he doesn't give it... and it's a two-way street.  Respecting him as an adult may mean giving him a bus ticket.

[eques]

I started telling my sons when they were young that at 18 or graduation from high school (which ever comes last), they were on their own. 
So they knew I meant it and the summer after graduation they had jobs and started college the next fall and not come home since.

When your son comes home and acts up, load him up in a car and take him to the local army/navy/marine/coast guard/airforce recruiter and let him out.
(not necessarily in that order)

If the mother bird does not kick the bird out of the nest, the baby bird nevers learns how to fly.

Gah!

I hope that raineyrocks can do better than shoving her son towards the armed forces!

[Raineyrocks]

Thank you so much for your advice Lloyd, Alan, Dawn, Pat , Otosan, and Eques!

I do understand the advice regarding taking him to a recriuter but my husband and I could never live with possibly burying our son because we took him there.  He (my son) used to use "I'm going to join the Marines" as a way of manipulating me because I would get all upset and beg him not to. When I caught on to his game I started saying, "sounds good Jon, good luck", well he stopped saying it after he saw it wasn't bothering me (even though it did).
As far as his  promiscuous behavior , I know it's normal but what bothers me is he is just using girls, not using protection (I know this because my daughter and I were concerned that he may have gotten a girl pregnant and when I talked to him about it he said, "I don't know if she is", I said, "Jon what are you going to do?" and he seemed nonchalant (sp?) like he just didn't care.  She wasn't.  My husband and I talked to him about protection and he just blew us off. I'm concerned because I want him to have respect for himself and women and it seems he doesn't have either.
My daughter (at home, here) is worried about him sneaking into her room and stealing her cds while she's at school so my husband is going to put a lock on her door for her but this should not be necessary.  My little 9 year old son is so afraid that the fighting between my husband, myself and Jon are going to start again.  I reassured him that it takes 2 to argue and dad and I won't be fighting with Jon, he'll be fighting with himself because we're not going to yell back.
The good thing is that Rick and I are on the same page with this so we won't be fighting with each other. Rick would find it easier to take him to the bus station and get him a ticket (last resort of course), than me.
My mom kicked me out when I was younger, (for coming home late and not being responsible), I lived in my car for awhile and I never ever wanted to do that to one of my kids.  But I guess that is the only answer if he keeps on this path.
Rick says if it comes to getting him a bus ticket and he choose Maryland (which he will), and Laura (our oldest) takes him back in then she is being an enabler and that's her problem. Do you think he's right? Jon is eating his nephews (Laura's 2 sons) snacks, milk, cereal, ect.  Laura has talked to him, it does no good, she put a note on her refrigerator, still not working. He just doesn't care. She lent him her cell phone (dumb thing to do), he incurred $70 of extra charges on it and has no job to pay her for it, he even denies doing it but who else could have.
Here's the rules we've thought up can you tell me what you think of them?
1. Get a job, pronto
2. Pay Laura back first
3. It's either go to tech school, college or pay room and board
4. If he's going to be out later than 11pm (we go to bed mostly at 11), call us and let us know where he is so we don't worry that he's dead somewhere.
5. No drugs, drinking.
6. No name calling, stealing or you can find somewhere else to live.

We're thinking of giving him a key so we don't have to wait up to let him in but should we wait on the key until he shows some positive changes?

I know this is alot to read and I appreciate the time and care each of you have taken to read and respond.

[Dreepa]

Here's the rules we've thought up can you tell me what you think of them?
1. Get a job, pronto
2. Pay Laura back first
3. It's either go to tech school, college or pay room and board
4. If he's going to be out later than 11pm (we go to bed mostly at 11), call us and let us know where he is so we don't worry that he's dead somewhere.
5. No drugs, drinking.
6. No name calling, stealing or you can find somewhere else to live.

I think that those rules sound fair.
Maybe offer to help him find a job so he thinks you are on his team.

[Raineyrocks]

I think that those rules sound fair.
Maybe offer to help him find a job so he thinks you are on his team

Hey Dreepa I was just posting on your thread about Freedom to Fascism. Good I'm glad you think our rules sound fair, I am at a loss at what to do with my sonny boy sometimes.
Rick wants to try to get Jon a job with him so that would good as long as they can get along.  Rick told him it is time to grow up and coming back up here could be a way of starting fresh and leaving the bad things behind him.

[Sweet Mercury]

You've gotten good advice and have a good plan to proceed.

For a bit of info from the other side, or as best as I can apprximate, I can offer you my views. When I was 18 I was lazy, unhelpful, barely working, had no direction in life, etc. I wasn't drinking, doing drugs or otherwise involved in criminal activity, but I was pretty useless as an adult. This was the cause of constant arguments between me and my father for several years.

To be short about it, he sat me down and said I had to start paying rent, and had to start contributing positively to the household as an adult, or leave. He wasnt' a jerk about it, and I'm extremely grateful that he laid down his terms. You really can't approach this situation as a parent laying down rules and expecting obedience as with a child, but as a leader/owner of a household asserting your right to dictate terms for and adult who wants residence.

[Raineyrocks]

You really can't approach this situation as a parent laying down rules and expecting obedience as with a child, but as a leader/owner of a household asserting your right to dictate terms for and adult who wants residence.

That's an excellent way to think of this whole situation, thanks!  My daughter that my son is living with just called me and our old neighbors just found out that my son is messing around with their 17 year old grandaughter so my old neighbor Jack just found Jon (my son) and smacked him upside his head and threatened to call the cops.

[Raineyrocks]

Otosan,

I think the discipline from the military would be very good for Jon, it would probraly be an easier choice if the USA wasn't at war.  I just keep picturing my little baby scared in the military and it makes me cry.  I really do understand that I need tough love with Jon and your right about it being an absolute last choice if I could even do it then.
I really know what he's like on the inside even though he is acting like a creep right now, he has such a sweet, kind heart, he's just not using it now.  I remember when we saw a guy standing on the corner with a "I'm hungry" sign and Jon rolled down his window and gave the guy his soda (unopened) and snack that I just bought him at the store.  We would be driving down the road and he would point out what shapes the clouds looked like. When we were in an accident in Florida our van got rear ended first by a mack truck then went into 6 other cars and as we were feeling sorry for ourselves Jon pointed out that the young high school girl in a compact car in front of us would've been dead if we weren't there to take the first impact.
Oh Lord, I'm crying like a baby right now, I have to go get some tissues.

[Dreepa]

Otosan,

I think the discipline from the military would be very good for Jon, it would probraly be an easier choice if the USA wasn't at war. 

Coast Guard?