How's the chem

[error]

What do you mean, not a good idea! It's a great idea! Oh no, you don't need a parachute...

[SAK]

I'll make it to NH...again.  How high can you fly?  I've seen these "contrails" much much lower than 25k.  Try around 10-15k.

So if I point you to some pictures, will you tell me that they are "just normal contrails?"

I hate to reduce this discussion to such a level, but can you humor me by taking a small quiz?

True/False

1) Western governments had nothing to do with 9/11 -- it was Muslim jihadists with boxcutters.
2) The maniac child-molesting cultists at Waco burned themselves.
3) Iraq had WMDs
4) The national news is very biased, but there is no conspiracy to control the minds of the masses
5) The U.S. government has never run tests on the public without their consent
6) Global warming is (or is said to be) a major problem facing the environment
7) Industries such as the car industry and oil industry are very influential in politics
There is evidence to show chemtrails may exist


edit: typo

[SAK]

1) Western governments had nothing to do with 9/11 -- it was Muslim jihadists with boxcutters. [FALSE]
2) The maniac child-molesting cultists at Waco burned themselves. [FALSE]
3) Iraq had WMDs [FALSE] (this one is debatable)
4) The national news is very biased, but there is no conspiracy to control the minds of the masses [FALSE]
5) The U.S. government has never run tests on the public without their consent [FALSE]
6) Global warming is (or is said to be) a major problem facing the environment [TRUE]
7) Industries such as the car industry and oil industry are very influential in politics [TRUE]
8 There is evidence to show chemtrails may exist [TRUE]

[error]

I can't even count to six.

[Russell Kanning]

Where are the people suffering from these symptoms? Wouldn't it be a trifle bit obvious?

If there is some of it floating around .... it could just be small amounts.

[forsytjr]

OK, I'm a pilot (1500 hours in multi-engine jets).  I also happen to hold a PhD in Aerospace Engineering, with a specialty of computational fluid dynamics (see my company web page www.cobaltcfd.com).  Here's how contrails happen.  Higher pressure under the wing, and low pressure on the top generates lift of the aircraft.  Near the wingtips, the high pressure air moves around to the low pressure air, causing a little vortex (like a tornado). The speed of the air in the vortex is quite high, for the same reason a skater spins faster as he/she pulls their arms in - conservation of angular momentum.   This high speed leads to low pressure (Bernoulli's principle), which causes the water in the air to condense, and form a cloud.  Now the question is why does this persist for so long?  Well, what would normally mix the air up and kill off the high speeds is turbulence, which would mix the flow up.  If you pour milk into your coffee, you will notice that turbulence rapidly mixes up the milk with the coffee (look at all the eddies and mixing you get).  Well, in a vortex, the spinning motion, for complex mathematical reasons, kills off the turbulence.  The vortex itself makes the flow stable.  This lack of turbulence in the vortex means that the flow must mix through molecular mixing, which is a very long and slow process.  Hence the vortices last a long time, and so the pressure stays low, and you retain that cloud of water vapor. 

If there are any chemicals in the air due to the aircraft, it would be caused by engines, which is completely independant of the contrails.  The presence or lack of presence of contrails should only depend on local humidity conditions. They are just man-made clouds.

[MaineShark]

They do spray insecticides in some areas, pruportedly to save us from West Nile and EEE, but I don't think that's what SAK is talking about...

Joe

[Russell Kanning]

The trails I saw on our walk today ... were the kind that last a long time ... but are broken up across the sky .... that always makes me think that long lasting ones can be natural and are dependent on the localized humidity situation.

[KBCraig]

I'll make it to NH...again.  How high can you fly?  I've seen these "contrails" much much lower than 25k.  Try around 10-15k.

Can you tell us how you know the altitude of contrails?

[Pat K]

I'll make it to NH...again.  How high can you fly?  I've seen these "contrails" much much lower than 25k.  Try around 10-15k.

Can you tell us how you know the altitude of contrails?

Stanly Super Fat Max 15k, with the really large read numbers.

[Insurgent]

I'm glad to see a couple of pilots weighing in on the issue, and would like to see some credible research that discusses the difference between normal contrails and the alleged chemtrails. Granted, I have not researched the issue deeply because unfortunately all the sources that promote the theory seem to fall along the lines of moonbat theorizing. The major media is also silent on the issue, from what I've seen.

[error]

All the sources that promote the chemtrails theory have trouble constructing complete, coherent sentences and paragraphs. This makes research into the existing "literature" -- such as it is -- rather difficult.

[KBCraig]

all the sources that promote the theory seem to fall along the lines of moonbat theorizing.

+1 for the phrase "moonbat theorizing". 

[Insurgent]

  Thanks

Considering how sinister the people who own this country are, it would not surprise me that they would do try experiments with mind-control etc but there doesn't seem to be any conclusive evidence one way or the other.

Wikipedia has a fairly objective, albeit inconclusive article on the subject http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemtrail
A good criticism listed there: "Assuming drugging the population is the purpose, the people behind the conspiracy would breathe the same air the population breathes, so any harm inflicted on the population would also be inflicted on those in charge of the conspiracy, unless they were made immune through vaccination."

[Russell Kanning]

All the sources that promote the chemtrails theory have trouble constructing complete, coherent sentences and paragraphs.

That is not true.