Arrested for flying flag upside down

[Nicholas Gilman]

Scarborough told Mark Kuhn he was going to be issued a citation and asked for identification. Kuhn refused, slammed the door on the deputy's hand, breaking the glass pane out of the door and cutting Scarborough's hand, the Sheriff's Office said.

    Probably saw the homeowner closing the door and stuck his hand in during an attempt to force entry.
That is whats called a "reacher".   When people with guns approach your front door, you don't ever
open it, especially when they pretend to be concerned about your welfare.

[David]

They can't investigate real crimes.  After all, they are bound by oath to investigate all complaints, and of course, it is just easier to go after a flag issue than a murder. 

[Russell Kanning]

just doing their job

"to protect the government from the people"

[Kat Kanning]

Listening to this lady on Alex Jones.  Absolutely horrifying.  The cop tried to arrest her just after she took the flag down.  She says she never hit the cop.  There were witnesses.  The cop put her husband in a choke hold.

BTW, they also had a Ron Paul for President sign and they think they were partially being harassed for that.

[CNHT]

Listening to this lady on Alex Jones.  Absolutely horrifying.  The cop tried to arrest her just after she took the flag down.  She says she never hit the cop.  There were witnesses.  The cop put her husband in a choke hold.

BTW, they also had a Ron Paul for President sign and they think they were partially being harassed for that.

This kind of stuff happened when Buchanan was running, same old stuff....always dragged out during a presidential campaign so they can smear people who support certain candidates to make them look bad to people who haven't followed the candidate for years like some of us have. It's just part of the media mind control.

My husband was alive in '96 and he explained that an upside down flag is an accepted legitimate marine distress signal, he learned while in the Coast Guard. There was no one more patriotic than he and even he knew the upside down flag thing was NOT a sign of disrespect for the flag or the country, but a distress signal...I had it on my car window for years, it is now stuck to the wall of my garage...(I removed it when I sold the car)

[J’raxis 270145]

My husband was alive in '96 and he explained that an upside down flag is an accepted legitimate marine distress signal, he learned while in the Coast Guard. There was no one more patriotic than he and even he knew the upside down flag thing was NOT a sign of disrespect for the flag or the country, but a distress signal...I had it on my car window for years, it is now stuck to the wall of my garage...(I removed it when I sold the car)

The first person who saw their flag upside-down even knew this, but it still ultimately led to this desecration nonsense:—

Deborah Kuhn said an Asheville police officer stopped by last week to make sure the couple was OK, after recognizing the upside-down flag as a distress signal.

[CNHT]

The first person who saw their flag upside-down even knew this, but it still ultimately led to this desecration nonsense:—

Deborah Kuhn said an Asheville police officer stopped by last week to make sure the couple was OK, after recognizing the upside-down flag as a distress signal.

Wow... yes an older cop might know.. flags are used as signals and representation..
However, if you are well enough to turn your flag upside down the gist of the distress message was meant as a different type of thing, not that you are lying on the floor in need of help or anything, but such as you are unhappy with the way your country is going.

If you are on a boat, then it means something different - out of gas, man overboard, etc.

[LiveFree]

I can see why the city cop stopped by to make sure they were okay though.  You never know, and it might have been a "help, there's someone keeping us hostage" distress signal though.  From the sounds of it, the interaction with the city cop might have gone something like Cop:  "Hey guys, you okay?  I noticed the upside down flag which is typically a distress signal."  Homeowners:  "Yeah, we're fine, it's more of a political message."  Cop:  "Oh, okay, have a nice day then."

Cops need to have it drilled into them during their initial training and as a routine matter of other on the job training that people have rights that they are NOT to question or infringe upon, or they WILL lose their jobs.

[Kat Kanning]

  Flag charges dropped
Sheriff: Deputy shouldn't have been at scene

Mike McWilliams and Adam Behsudi
CITIZEN-TIMES.COM
Friday Aug 3, 2007

Related: Couple Terrorized, Assaulted and Arrested For Flying an Upside Down U.S. Flag

ASHEVILLE- Buncombe County's sheriff and district attorney have dropped charges against a couple accused of desecrating the American flag, saying they stood little chance in court.

The Sheriff's Office will continue an investigation into the actions of Deputy Brian Scarborough, who issued the charges after a complaint from a fellow National Guardsman, Sheriff Van Duncan said Thursday.

Duncan said he "had rather we responded to that call differently" and that Scarborough "probably shouldn't have been there to begin with."

The sheriff said he asked District Attorney Ron Moore to drop the charges against Mark and Deborah Kuhn, who also said the deputy assaulted them.

The Kuhns had pinned signs to an upside down American flag that included a photo of President Bush with "Out now" written on it.

Their case marked only the third time in North Carolina since 1917 that the state's flag desecration statute had been enforced, according to the N.C. Administrative Office of the Courts.

U.S. Supreme Court decisions in 1989 and 1990 protected flag desecration as a form of expressive conduct under the First Amendment. The state law also was challenged and ruled unconstitutional in 1971.

"It's pretty apparent to us where the Supreme Court stands on this issue (flag desecration)," Duncan said. "Also, it has been dealt with in this state in 1971, and we do not feel like we can successfully prosecute the desecration of the flag statute."

Scarborough issued charges against the Kuhns on July 25 at their Brevard Road home in Asheville.

An ensuing scuffle with the deputy put the Kuhns in jail on charges of assault on a government employee, obstruction and flag desecration, all misdemeanors.

Debbie Kuhn said Thursday she was relieved all charges had dropped but wants to the deputy who charged them fired.

Scarborough could not be reached.

The flag confiscated by the Sheriff's Office was returned. Kuhn said she and her husband plan to post their flag again. It also will be flown upside down but not until the Sheriff's Office investigation is done.

"We do want to give Sheriff Duncan the chance to do the right thing," Kuhn said.

The couple have not filed a formal complaint with the Sheriff's Office, she said.

Duncan said he hoped the internal investigation would be done next week. The office has received "hundreds" of phone calls from people expressing both support and anger at Scarborough's actions, Duncan said.

As it's written in the code, state law prohibits anyone from knowingly mutilating, defiling, defacing or trampling the U.S. or North Carolina flags. The Kuhns have said they were displaying the flag upside down to protest the state of the country. An upside down flag is a universal distress signal.

The Sheriff's Office has said the signs pinned to the flag, not the fact that it was flying upside down, led to the charges.

Sheriff's reports allege the Kuhns assaulted Scarborough as he was trying to place them under arrest, including slamming the door, breaking a glass pane and cutting the deputy's hand.

The Kuhns said Scarborough broke into their house and violated their civil rights.

"The stories of the people who saw the incident and the deputy's stories are very, very close," Duncan said.

Mark Radford, a staff sergeant in the National Guard's Asheville-based 105th Military Police Battalion, is the one who told Scarborough about the Kuhns' flag. Radford would not comment Thursday.

Someone, not Radford, had complained to Asheville police about the Kuhns' flag days before their arrest. The city police officer investigated but did not issue a citation.

Duncan said it's normal practice to refer calls within city limits to Asheville police unless a crime is committed in the deputy's presence or in an emergency.

Scarborough, 25, started at the Sheriff's Office in 2003 as a reserve deputy. He was hired full time June 13, after serving seven months in Iraq with the National Guard.

"Whether we agree with someone's actions whether or not to hang the flag upside down, it does seem to be the intention of the Supreme Court, which is the supreme law of the land, to allow that," Duncan said. "So in other words, the Kuhns are allowed to do what they're doing.

"On the other side of that, if it weren't for young men like Deputy Scarborough, we wouldn't have those rights."

Duncan said the District Attorney's Office likely could have prosecuted the Kuhns on the assault and obstruction charges. Duncan said he wanted to make amends with both sides and bring closure to the issue.

"I don't think we gain anything by dividing the charges and going on," Duncan said. "We feel like the sooner we can move on from this, the better all parties involved will be."

[Russell Kanning]

I guess we know who was lying about the events.

[Puke]

This is why I hate old laws that are "no longer enforced".
That is until it conveniences the state.
All laws should have to come up for review every 5 years or something.

Or just not have any laws. 

[srqrebel]

ASHEVILLE- Buncombe County's sheriff and district attorney have dropped charges against a couple accused of desecrating the American flag, saying they stood little chance in court.

Their case marked only the third time in North Carolina since 1917 that the state's flag desecration statute had been enforced, according to the N.C. Administrative Office of the Courts.

U.S. Supreme Court decisions in 1989 and 1990 protected flag desecration as a form of expressive conduct under the First Amendment. The state law also was challenged and ruled unconstitutional in 1971.

Why is this specific law still being enforced after after it was ruled unconstitutional by the courts?  For that matter, why is it still on the books?

"Whether we agree with someone's actions whether or not to hang the flag upside down, it does seem to be the intention of the Supreme Court, which is the supreme law of the land, to allow that," Duncan said. "So in other words, the Kuhns are allowed to do what they're doing.

"On the other side of that, if it weren't for young men like Deputy Scarborough, we wouldn't have those rights."

Nothing could be further from the truth.

[NC2NH]

Why is this specific law still being enforced after after it was ruled unconstitutional by the courts?  For that matter, why is it still on the books?

Good questions. Here's another: Since NC put a new state constitution in place in 1971, how can a law from before that time still be enforced?

The answer to all these questions: Becuase the state is run by a good-old-boy network of idiot tyrants and most people here either don't realize it or don't care.

[penguins4me]

The answer to all these questions: Becuase the state is run by a good-old-boy network of idiot tyrants and most people here either don't realize it or don't care.

... or aren't yet willing to risk their physical freedom, family, possessions, and/or life over what has been, in historical terms, very gradual implementations of tyranny.

[Dreepa]

That is why we need to start getting the NH house to start repealing who sections of the law that are no longer needed.
Start searching the RSAs... If you find some start a new thread and we can see about getting them repealed.