On star Big Brother Vehicle Integration Continues....Now they shut your car off.

[les nessman]

http://www.livescience.com/technology/071010-onstar-police.html

General Motors plans to equip 1.7 million of its 2009 models with a system that allows OnStar operators to cut engine power in the car if the police request it. The system was demonstrated in Washington, D.C. today.
GM's OnStar system already contains built-in GPS tracking that would allow police to find any OnStar-equipped vehicle. With the new technology, if the police request it, an OnStar operator will inform the occupants of the vehicle and then cut power. The engine will be slowed to idle speed, to allow the driver to move to the side of the road. Brakes and other electrical functions of the vehicle will still work.
The intent of the system is to cut down on the number of police chases, which can be dangerous for both bystanders and police. A recent study showed that from 1994 through 2002, there were 2,654 crashes involving 3,965 vehicles and 3,146 fatalities during police pursuits.
The idea for this capability was showcased recently in science fiction author Greg Bear's book Quantico. In the novel, a near-future story about biotech and the war on terror, police could use Cop Block to stop a car or truck in its tracks.
"...When the truck's driver ignored his lights and siren and the trucks failed to respond to Cop Block, the patrolman became aware he might have a situation..." All cars and trucks in the U.S. were now required to have Cop Block. A patrol car could radio a coded signal that slowed and then shut down the engine.
(Read more about Cop Block)
GM also stated that the owner of the vehicle may opt out of the service upon request. GM's research has indicated that 95% of current OnStar subscribers would like to participate.
Take a look at other initiatives to make the roads safer, like the prototype car seat and Nissan Pivo 2 in-dash robot, which try to detect drivers sleeping behind the wheel. Read an interview with Greg Bear about Quantico. Story via ABC News.

    Anyone who pays for this garbage deserves what they get.  In ten years I'll probably
be able to earn my livelihood offering solutions when these systems become common.
What happens if someone finds a system vulnerability and starts shutting down vehicles
all over the country?

[Ogre]

What happens if someone finds a system vulnerability and starts shutting down vehicles
all of the country?

I'm sure you meant "WHEN," not if...

[Lloyd Danforth]

We need an electronics guy in NH who knows how to overide those black boxes in cars and the GPS squealers in cell phones, build RFID scanners, bug detectors..............................

[Bald Eagle]

We don't have teenagers?

[Lloyd Danforth]

Teenagers still like money, don't they?   They just need some direction and a soldering gun.

[Ogre]

If I did know how to do any of that stuff, like build cell phone jamming devices that are illegal, I'd never admit it here... 

[les nessman]

  An interesting weakness of the GPS E-911 systems for cellphones is that the handset
requires at least an open view of the sky, they usually require reception of at least
3 or 4 satellites to get a fix.  If one were to get underneath the center metal canopy of a
gas station,pavilion, etc the probability of the exact coordinates being sent is slim.
A handheld GPS receiver will display satellites available, and if you learn how to read
the display, will tell you roughly where they are located in relation to your location.
They can still triangulate through the cell sites, but it is a hassle and the position
info is not as near as accurate as GPS.  If privacy is a concern the best thing is to not
carry a cell phone at all, or carry it in a Faraday cage.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faraday_cage
until needed.

[Lex]

  An interesting weakness of the GPS E-911 systems for cellphones is that the handset
requires at least an open view of the sky, they usually require reception of at least
3 or 4 satellites to get a fix.  If one were to get underneath the center metal canopy of a
gas station,pavilion, etc the probability of the exact coordinates being sent is slim.
A handheld GPS receiver will display satellites available, and if you learn how to read
the display, will tell you roughly where they are located in relation to your location.
They can still triangulate through the cell sites, but it is a hassle and the position
info is not as near as accurate as GPS.  If privacy is a concern the best thing is to not
carry a cell phone at all, or carry it in a Faraday cage.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faraday_cage
until needed.

1. This is true in theory but you have to consider that the Earth is round and the satelites aren't directly overhead (if they were then they couldn't triangulate). Most GPS systems are smart enough to temporarily compensate for lost satelites. I have a Garmin GPS in my car that works pretty much all the time, even for a little bit going into a tunnel and then a little bit before coming out of a tunnel. It also works under a gas station canopy. Keep in mind that my Garmin is a slightly older system (6 years old?) and the newer ones, especially the ones built into cars have gyro sensors which can detect movement and this is used in combination with the GPS. This means that unlike my GPS which will cut out in long tunnels yours will most likely continue to work. The only time that won't work is if the computer didn't know where to start calculating the gyro movement from (eg, you were inside the tunnel, you disconnected the battery from the car, waited a few hours for any charges to drain and GPS system to clear, turned the car back on and then started driving, in that case it probably wouldn't know where you are... but your cellphone probably wouldn't work either, so even if the GPS worked the system couldn't send your location to Big Brother...)

2. I'm not sure what you mean by cellphone triangulation being a 'pain'. It is merely a technology and it does work, really well in fact. If you're GPS+gyro system doesn't pinpoint your location then the cellphone triangulation might just do it.

Moral of the story is don't have cellphones and don't use built-in car GPS systems. Most of the handheld over the counter GPS systems don't have any communication hardware and even if they did you can always buy one for cash and then even if someone was tracking it they wouldn't know what they were tracking.

[kawi600]

There are systems that disable the cars ignition via an EM pulse too I think. part of my logic in buying an old diesel with no electronics in it. Doesnt surprise me the surveillance state wants to be able to shutdown your car remotely. When will these people learn?

[sandm000]

but it's being marketed as an anti-theft device.

So that if someone steals your car, you just call on-star, utter the password, and they stop the car.

Police swoop in and take the bad guys away. Simple.

Until someone gets your password. And uses the system against you.

[Recumbent ReCycler]

Earlier today my wife needed help turning off our car.  She tried to turn it off and removed the key, but it kept running.  She called me and asked what to do.  I told her to pull the fuse for the fuel pump.  She didn't know which one it was, so I told her to ask someone.  Fortunately someone came along and was able to help her.  Apparently until we find the problem, we will have to pull a fuse to shut the car off.  I think there is a fuse that can disable OnStar systems.

[specter34]

but it's being marketed as an anti-theft device.

So that if someone steals your car, you just call on-star, utter the password, and they stop the car.

Police swoop in and take the bad guys away. Simple.

Until someone gets your password. And uses the system against you.

or the feds

[Lex]

Earlier today my wife needed help turning off our car.  She tried to turn it off and removed the key, but it kept running.  She called me and asked what to do.  I told her to pull the fuse for the fuel pump.  She didn't know which one it was, so I told her to ask someone.  Fortunately someone came along and was able to help her.  Apparently until we find the problem, we will have to pull a fuse to shut the car off.  I think there is a fuse that can disable OnStar systems.

Does she have a lot of other keys and keychains hanging off of her car keys? I've been told that a lot of times all the doodads that people put on their car keys can sometimes mess up the ignition system because they put too much downward force on the keys and the problem is exacerbated when you go over bumps and stuff, overtime this can cause internal parts to wear out and prevent the car from starting, keys from turning smoothly or as in your case not being able to turn off the car.

[Sheep Fuzzy Wool]

Enjoyed a fun day with the family at a go-cart track, a few years ago, gas powered, semi-fast riders and lengthy track. When our time was up, instead of calling us in or giving us the red light, the attendant liked to use the gadget that shut off the engines from afar as we had to roll into the parking lane.
This is when we learned, this technology will be used in regular autos...soon.

[Recumbent ReCycler]

Earlier today my wife needed help turning off our car.  She tried to turn it off and removed the key, but it kept running.  She called me and asked what to do.  I told her to pull the fuse for the fuel pump.  She didn't know which one it was, so I told her to ask someone.  Fortunately someone came along and was able to help her.  Apparently until we find the problem, we will have to pull a fuse to shut the car off.  I think there is a fuse that can disable OnStar systems.

Does she have a lot of other keys and keychains hanging off of her car keys? I've been told that a lot of times all the doodads that people put on their car keys can sometimes mess up the ignition system because they put too much downward force on the keys and the problem is exacerbated when you go over bumps and stuff, overtime this can cause internal parts to wear out and prevent the car from starting, keys from turning smoothly or as in your case not being able to turn off the car.

Um, yeah, she collects keychains.  She called me a few hours ago and told me that she couldn't get the car to start.  Now it's parked at the Mall of NH near Sears and Ruby Tuesdays.  She got a ride from her sister to her house in Hancock.  I need to find a ride to Manchester in the morning.