Free Nation Project: Belize

[maxxoccupancy]

Exactly.  One of the arguments used for small states was that each state has two US Senators.  Hmmm...  An argument given for NH was its first in the nation primary status, but few freestaters have mentioned any interest in national politics at all.  If we had multiple libertarians on just one Congressional committee, that would help us reach a large CSPAN audience.

I am thinking of another country as a backup, only because I see the national government getting dramatically worse.  I hate the idea of leaving my country, but Belize (or a similar country) would be more like a safe base to turn to if things went straight to hell in a hurry.  We could just hide out in the mountains of NH somewhere, but I don't like that idea too much.

The prospect of a kind of Switzerland/HK/Amsterdam somewhere in the world would be nice, but is far off anyway.  With a FNP, we could live in a country with only a few minor excise/sin taxes.  We could prove the feasibility of a lot of ideas that can't be brought about under the grip of the US Gloverment.  It would be nice to live in a country in which the average citizen saw neither a tax collector, nor a government agent during the course of a given day.  It would be nice to live in a country where SWAT teams did not exist.  In America, there are 50 different federal agencies with SWAT teams.  HUD, the Department of Education, and even the US Forest Service now have SWAT teams.  It's the new status symbol.  You're not a real gov't agency unless you have your own SWAT team.... and once you have one, you've got to justify its budget....

NH could have the best laws on the books, but we still live under the control of Uncle Sam.

...and other reasons...

--Max

[Lloyd Danforth]

I remember reading positive things about Belize 30 years ago in Mother earth News.  I say go for it Max.  The main downside I see is that we are just at  the beginning of a long period of violent hurricaines.
Here is the CIA's take on it.
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/bh.html

[Dreepa]

Just as important, of the people I have talked to outside of the FSP, most are hesitant to move to cold New England. 

I think it could be good as a backup or 'winter place'.

However when I hear about people that want to fight for liberty and freedom but... 'NH is too cold'  I think of Thomas Paine:
"These are the times that try men's soul's. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of his country; but he that stands it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and women"

Too cold = summer soldier

[maxxoccupancy]

That's the quote I was looking for.  The point is, I am thinking that those summer soldiers had the right idea all along.

I had thought of Belize as a winter hideaway... a much less ambitious project where we could grow some roots.  There are already communities down there (including many Americans), and it wouldn't take much convincing to simply tell many of my "ready to leave the country" friends to just migrate to Belize.

Now that we know more about how to change a political system, we could manage a tiny country (population 279,000) as a secondary project.  More importantly, we could channel some of the people there who... well, are sunshine soldiers.

Not every activist is going to be a complete libertarian.  Not everyone will devote their entire life to such a thing.  I know that there are thousands of people out west who are willing to make the move to a western free state, and I see no reason that Nevada/Wyoming/Idaho couldn't offer a separate alternative.  The bottom line is that there will be a need for a second (warmer) free state.  I am simply suggesting that we add small, Latin American countries to the list of alternatives.  I will make the case for Belize, because of its small population and the ability to affect national policies more easily.

--Max

[Russell Kanning]

How about moveto Belize .... and not "manage" it.

[maxxoccupancy]

I should say, manage a project down there.  The tricky part about the English language is that words like "manage" have many different synonymns.  An FNP might focus on a less ambitious effort of educating the public and elected officials.  FNPers would also vote, presumably, and be active in elections, but perhaps less to the degree than we are in NH.

The biggest gain for the FSP is not from the candidates we have run (most of whom have lost their bids by small margins, including myself), but the close races we've influenced, the voters we've gotten involved, and the elected officials who've either changed their voting records or resigned from office because they knew about the "pro-liberty jugernaut."

We wouldn't run the country, but encourage proliberty activists to consider Belize (or a similar country/western free state).  With lots of activists in one small country (small population), you'll get more proliberty people in over time.  Basically the idea behind the FSP, but with less political ambition.  Lots of like minded people who would be willing to concentrate in one country to help push that nation's political system toward more limited government.  NH FSPers could lend some time and expertise to getting people active and involved.

--Max

[Russell Kanning]

Aha .... I like the idea of moving to Belize, but I am too busy here. Have fun.

[maxxoccupancy]

Once again, I'm not suggesting FSP-NHers move to Belize.  I'm suggesting that those who won't move to NH consider Belize (or at least a Western Free State), and that FSP-NH people keep a country like Belize as a kind of vacation spot.  You wouldn't have to spend your whole life there to help.  A lot of people are helping NH from out of state, even thought they rarely get to see NH.

--Max

[Russell Kanning]

I hope you have a nice trip.

[Dave Ridley]

You going to start a FNP website?  It seems like fun...

[aries]

The thing that strikes me about Belize is that guns are legal there.

I am going to look into it further. As Daniel Webster said "I was born an American; I live an American; I shall die an American!"

But I wouldn't mind a summer home in Belize 

[Lloyd Danforth]

You'll probably need guns surrounded by Guatemala and mexico and a, largely, unprotected coast.

[maxxoccupancy]

Hey, let's throw Belize into the secodary free state project.  I can convince quite a few people to migrate their myself, if it wins the vote.  There are a lot of other merchant mariners moving to other countries, right now, and it would not be difficult to mention that there is a project going on in a small, tropical country like that.

There are already quite a few Americans moving there.  It might be best to start talking to them about the idea first.  Does anyone know someone who lives in Belize, right now?

--Max

[Caleb]

Why don't you take a trip.  You can plan a tour.  Usually, if you get so many people signed up for a tour, the tour organizer will be given a free pass.  Since you know so many people who are interested, this seems like a great thing for you to work on.

Wish you luck,

Caleb

[Dave Ridley]

The more I think about max's idea the more exciting it sounds.  i think there is a logical connection to be formed between new hampshire and belize, heck it only costs 600 bucks to fly there and back from boston.  Things are pretty cheap there too, and the lack of federal control as well as the various tax exemptions for foreigners means it is a place one step further toward freedom than NH is, a place to do constructive or just fun harmless things you can't do here.  add in the fact that some people don't like to winter here and it's likely to be a real marriage for some.

Max you've certainly inspired me to research the place a bit.   It's not really the place for me, but it's a fun idea and I like the idea of visiting a second "free state".