Martian Real Estate

[citizen_142002]

Frank, I thought that by improving the land with labor and investment one gained an exclusive right to it. If one company's shareholders financed the alteration of an atmosphere to a habitable state. Wouldn't those shareholders have rights to the use of the atmoshphere? Their investment would have created that resource.
Are there any private space companies which are doing anything besides satellites? I have to disagree with Dada. Planetary exploration is vital to our future. You can keep people alive in metal tubes, it's true. But planets are self supporting ecosystems, which don't face the risk of massive decompression, and provide more renewable resources than just solar. If you want to live in orbit someday, I'm sure that will be an option, but as for me I'd like another Earth-like option.

[FrankChodorov]

I thought that by improving the land with labor and investment one gained an exclusive right to it

while there is a right to private possession of land on Mars, the right to possession must be made conditional by the equal right of all others to the same.

the condition is the sharing of economic rent when it appears so that absolute rights to labor are upheld.

[citizen_142002]

The people who put an effort into the creation of a biosphere have the exclusive right to economic control of that biosphere, because ONLY their labor went into the creation of that biosphere.
Those who put no effort into the creation of a habitable space would have to purchase rights to that space even under Georgist theory wouldn't they?
If they want to live in a bubble and take no advantage of environment improvements, i.e. not breathe any air but that which they import. Then I could agree that they have a right to go to mars and build their bubble, but I think that few people would do that if their was liveable real estate there.

I didn't intend this thread to be pricipally a debate on property rights. I have my own views on those and they aren't changing. I was asking what the current state of that real estate is. Is it no man's land, does the US govt. claim it, is it a global UN type zone,  or is there a way to purchase it right now?
Just so everyone knows, this is not number one on my priority list right now, its something that I do like to think about at times, and I think it deserves more attention from people in general. There are a lot of hurdles to overcome to even begin doing this type of thing, but that doesn't make it less possible or worthwhile.

[firsty]

Is it no man's land, does the US govt. claim it, is it a global UN type zone,  or is there a way to purchase it right now?

i'll sell you some of my martian land.

[citizen_142002]

If there was a universally recognized way that you could own martian land, then I would buy it firsty.
I know it sounds absurd at first, but yeah  I want to buy land on mars. It just has to be a real, secure investment.

[firsty]

details, details...

[KBCraig]

Say, don't we already have a Valentine on this forum?  I think he gets first dibs. 

+karma for the reference. 

[9thmoon]

So I was talking with my supposedly non-libertarian spouse last night about this here thread, and he said there's a company selling real estate on the moon.

Is it true?  Anyone know?  Because I'd want some, just for the novelty.  I'd buy property on Mars, too, but on Luna I might have a chance of actually seeing it before I die. 

[Alex]

I thought that by improving the land with labor and investment one gained an exclusive right to it

while there is a right to private possession of land on Mars, the right to possession must be made conditional by the equal right of all others to the same.

the condition is the sharing of economic rent when it appears so that absolute rights to labor are upheld.

Equal rights... given equal work towards the goal. A settlement of people that goes through the work and expense of terraforming Mars to make it like Earth definitely has more right to the land than someone who shows up after all the work is done and says "hey, I want some land too!"

[FrankChodorov]

Those who put no effort into the creation of a habitable space would have to purchase rights to that space even under Georgist theory wouldn't they?

the habitable space that occupies a specific location on the surface of Mars would only be conditionally owned so long as they shared any unimproved locational value (economic rent) with their neighbors (no neighbors no economic rent) and that would only attach to location if there were not "enough and as good left in common for others".

to get into the space itself which was constructed via labor and thus absolute private property would have to be purchased or gifted...

[FrankChodorov]

I thought that by improving the land with labor and investment one gained an exclusive right to it

while there is a right to private possession of land on Mars, the right to possession must be made conditional by the equal right of all others to the same.

the condition is the sharing of economic rent when it appears so that absolute rights to labor are upheld.

Equal rights... given equal work towards the goal. A settlement of people that goes through the work and expense of terraforming Mars to make it like Earth definitely has more right to the land than someone who shows up after all the work is done and says "hey, I want some land too!"

only if those already there left "enough and as good in common for others" according to Locke.

[Caleb]

People assume that since we live on a planet now, that is the best type of place for us.  But planets are probably more like wombs...a good place for earlier stages of our evolution but not the ideal place to live out our whole existence as a species.

Based on what we currently know about physics and biology, the best places for humans are probably mile-long cylinders orbiting relatively close to earth.

  :meteor:

Man, this Hawaiian island is alright ... but I could really go for a mile-long cylindrical tube orbiting relatively close to earth. 

[citizen_142002]

OK,
I did some checking. Basically there is no system for claiming any part of any celestial bodies. Governments are prohibited from claiming celestial bodies under a 1967 treaty. Looks like no one wanted to fight the Soviets for the Moon.
Essentially space has a legal status of the high seas. It's a jurisdictional no man's land. Which makes it a great place to go to avoid government interference in your life. The only way to legitimize a claim to a part of space is
A. Go there yourself
B. Buy it from someone who has gone there
C. Make some alteration to it via remote controlled device.

It's mostly one guy selling that lunar property. One day he just asserted that the Moon was his. It's pretty much just a novelty item.

Anyone have a solid fuel rocket lying around?

[Alex]

I thought that by improving the land with labor and investment one gained an exclusive right to it

while there is a right to private possession of land on Mars, the right to possession must be made conditional by the equal right of all others to the same.

the condition is the sharing of economic rent when it appears so that absolute rights to labor are upheld.

Equal rights... given equal work towards the goal. A settlement of people that goes through the work and expense of terraforming Mars to make it like Earth definitely has more right to the land than someone who shows up after all the work is done and says "hey, I want some land too!"

only if those already there left "enough and as good in common for others" according to Locke.

You can't build an atmosphere for a planet and then leave parts of it without an atmosphere.

[firsty]

so it sounds like the only real option for space inhabitants is to be a pirate.