Russian forces battle Georgians

[PattyLee loves dogs]

Why did the Russian government give out passports to Ossetia citizens and pays them retirement benefits? What does Russia get out of all of this?

The most valuable commodity for kleptocrats: distraction.

[Lex]

Why did the Russian government give out passports to Ossetia citizens and pays them retirement benefits? What does Russia get out of all of this?

The most valuable commodity for kleptocrats: distraction.

Who is being distracted?

Distraction from what?

Who benefits from this distraction and how?

[Alex Libman]

Here's how history should remember this war...


Before:

After:

[Raineyrocks]

Here's how history should remember this war...


Before:

After:

If only everyone explained things as simple as you do, I'd understand it all, thanks Lloyd!

[Pat McCotter]

If only everyone explained things as simple as you do, I'd understand it all, thanks Lloyd!

Lloyd! You've changed your name and avatar and EVERYTHING!!!

[Raineyrocks]

If only everyone explained things as simple as you do, I'd understand it all, thanks Lloyd!

Lloyd! You've changed your name and avatar and EVERYTHING!!!

Oh Gosh!  It was early, sorry Alex!  Credit goes to Alex, not Lloyd!

P.S. Thank Pat!

[hydrodog]

simple and to the point thoughts...... georgia has a 35000 man army..... and it was a cakewalk for the russians.....
..... but if georgia had a well regulated militia.... like say the swiss .... then they could field almost a million man army.... now equip the most patriotic and the most athletic of the militia with 50 cal rifles and the appropriate armor piercing / explosive rounds and you would have a nitemare for any occupying force.....
I believe poland and other former eastern bloc democracies should form militias pronto....
I will even contribute 300 from my next paycheck if I was sure it would help liberty's cause.....

[John Edward Mercier]

So, what's the deal with Russia and Ossetia?

I mean, what IS in Ossetia? As far as I know there is nothing there of any value other than some mountains and some sheep.

Why did the Russian government give out passports to Ossetia citizens and pays them retirement benefits? What does Russia get out of all of this?

Oil pipelines.

[John Edward Mercier]

simple and to the point thoughts...... georgia has a 35000 man army..... and it was a cakewalk for the russians.....
..... but if georgia had a well regulated militia.... like say the swiss .... then they could field almost a million man army.... now equip the most patriotic and the most athletic of the militia with 50 cal rifles and the appropriate armor piercing / explosive rounds and you would have a nitemare for any occupying force.....
I believe poland and other former eastern bloc democracies should form militias pronto....
I will even contribute 300 from my next paycheck if I was sure it would help liberty's cause.....

The Russians could release a biological resulting in the complete dearth of any standing army within two weeks.

[J’raxis 270145]

simple and to the point thoughts...... georgia has a 35000 man army..... and it was a cakewalk for the russians.....
..... but if georgia had a well regulated militia.... like say the swiss .... then they could field almost a million man army.... now equip the most patriotic and the most athletic of the militia with 50 cal rifles and the appropriate armor piercing / explosive rounds and you would have a nitemare for any occupying force.....
I believe poland and other former eastern bloc democracies should form militias pronto....
I will even contribute 300 from my next paycheck if I was sure it would help liberty's cause.....

The Russians could release a biological resulting in the complete dearth of any standing army within two weeks.

They could also just drop a dozen nukes on the country, but you don't see them doing that either. The diplomatic fallout would far outweigh whatever benefits they'd gain from using WMDs so blithely.

[Pat McCotter]

simple and to the point thoughts...... georgia has a 35000 man army..... and it was a cakewalk for the russians.....
..... but if georgia had a well regulated militia.... like say the swiss .... then they could field almost a million man army.... now equip the most patriotic and the most athletic of the militia with 50 cal rifles and the appropriate armor piercing / explosive rounds and you would have a nitemare for any occupying force.....
I believe poland and other former eastern bloc democracies should form militias pronto....
I will even contribute 300 from my next paycheck if I was sure it would help liberty's cause.....

Like the USSR in Afghanistan?

[John Edward Mercier]

simple and to the point thoughts...... georgia has a 35000 man army..... and it was a cakewalk for the russians.....
..... but if georgia had a well regulated militia.... like say the swiss .... then they could field almost a million man army.... now equip the most patriotic and the most athletic of the militia with 50 cal rifles and the appropriate armor piercing / explosive rounds and you would have a nitemare for any occupying force.....
I believe poland and other former eastern bloc democracies should form militias pronto....
I will even contribute 300 from my next paycheck if I was sure it would help liberty's cause.....

The Russians could release a biological resulting in the complete dearth of any standing army within two weeks.

They could also just drop a dozen nukes on the country, but you don't see them doing that either. The diplomatic fallout would far outweigh whatever benefits they'd gain from using WMDs so blithely.

Any good tactician would simply station the army around the pipeline. Diplomacy? Are the French going to with their strongest words to show their unhappiness with the action... while buying the oil?
Or do you believe Russia will sit still while its major source of hard currency (oil ) is devalued? They might be willing to pull back if say... the US taxpayer sends them free wheat. The same way North Korea stops building nukes if we send them oil.

[David]

So, what's the deal with Russia and Ossetia?

I mean, what IS in Ossetia? As far as I know there is nothing there of any value other than some mountains and some sheep.

Why did the Russian government give out passports to Ossetia citizens and pays them retirement benefits? What does Russia get out of all of this?

I am convinced this is a proxy war.  The US has been quietly but steadily moving its 'sphere of influence', read, empire, into the traditional Russian sphere of influence.  Of course it is only 'quiet' to everyone but the Russians.  The US tried to get Georgia into NATO.  That did not make Russia happy. 

I believe there is a lot more to this than we realize, and these types of issues will continue for the forseeable future.  The US overreached, and did not apparently expect the Russians to react as aggressively as they did.  In fact, I suspect the US thought the Russians would not react at all.  But Georgia started the violence, and it was an opportunity for Russia to act without looking like the aggressor, because, in the end, no matter what the US politicians want everyone to think, Russia didn't start the fight. 

[Alex Libman]

Why did the Russian government give out passports to Ossetia citizens and pays them retirement benefits? What does Russia get out of all of this?

It's difficult to explain the circumstances of the Soviet Union breakup to someone who didn't live there.  (I left Moscow for this country in June 1992.)  At that time everyone held Soviet passports no matter what "republic" (i.e. Russia, Georgia, etc) they lived in.  There was a very large migration of people during the 20th century, and when USSR broke up there were (and still are) tens of millions of Russians left in other republics.

If USA was to break up, would you want the citizenship of the state you were born in, lived in the longest, live in now, or what?  The newly-formed Russian Federation was very liberal in giving out passports to anyone who requested them - I don't see how it could have done otherwise.

The neocons are making it sound as if Russia forced those passports on them as a power-grab, and that's retarded.  (At least within the paradigm that any nation can call any person a "citizen", as opposed to everyone being sovereign individuals, but that's a whole 'nother topic.)

simple and to the point thoughts...... georgia has a 35000 man army..... and it was a cakewalk for the russians.....

Comparing Russian and Georgian armed forces isn't relevant.  The initial conflict was between the Georgian puppet government trying to reign in South Ossetia (a secessionist part of Georgia that overwhelmingly wants to join wealthier Russia).  The former (Georgia) had its military budget grow 3,000 percent in the past few years, and on paper its military-as-percent-of-GDP numbers are second only to North Korea (and that's not counting the free stuff and deep discounts they're getting from the West).  The latter (South Ossetia) has some goat cheese they can throw at the Georgians, and thousands were killed.  (Your tax dollars at work.)  When comparing the powers backing them, Russia has 1/16th the military budget of NATO, and that's not counting Georgia itself, or allies like Israel, Japan, SK, etc.

I do agree with your main point about militias though.


EDIT: fixed some typos.

[Lex]

It's difficult to explain the circumstances of the Soviet Union breakup to someone who didn't live there.

How do you know I didn't live in the Soviet Union?