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I have a question about somebody coming on a property if they were told not to

Started by Raineyrocks, September 30, 2008, 09:29 PM NHFT

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Raineyrocks

Hypothetical situation:

If a homeowner told these creepy, sneaky, scumbags to get off their property and never come back on it again can that person ever come on the property even if it's in a car, in the driveway?     If they did come back after being told and the homeowner told them to get the f**k out of their driveway again and the scumbags didn't leave what are the homeowner's rights?

What if these assholes said they were harrassed?  What if they made up lies about what the homeowner did like physically confronting them, which is probably fine but then said the homeowner broke their car window which was a total lie?

Pat McCotter

Video of the incidents are best. Pictures are OK but you need sound and motion. Just remember - be nice  - you are on the video also. If they are not nice, it works against them.

If these hypothetical trespassers are "official government types" you will need to be standing on principle and aware of the consequences of any actions you take and willing to suffer them.

If they are ordinary run of the mill trespassers just videoing them should make them think twice but we've seen what has been happening in Salem with leetninja - so record and let folks here know about it.

Tom Sawyer

Once you tell someone to leave if they don't it is considered Trespass. Although involving the cops can be a real drag sometimes.


Sam A. Robrin

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 01, 2008, 04:43 AM NHFT
Once you tell someone to leave if they don't it is considered Trespass. Although involving the cops can be a real drag sometimes.

Literally, in certain cases I could mention . . .

KBCraig

Relevant portions in bold:

635:2 Criminal Trespass. –
    I. A person is guilty of criminal trespass if, knowing that he is not licensed or privileged to do so, he enters or remains in any place.
    II. Criminal trespass is a misdemeanor for the first offense and a class B felony for any subsequent offense if the person knowingly or recklessly causes damage in excess of $1,000 to the value of the property of another.
    III. Criminal trespass is a misdemeanor if:
       (a) The trespass takes place in an occupied structure as defined in RSA 635:1, III; or
       (b) The person knowingly enters or remains:
          (1) In any secured premises;
          (2) In any place in defiance of an order to leave or not to enter which was personally communicated to him by the owner or other authorized person; or
          (3) In any place in defiance of any court order restraining him from entering such place so long as he has been properly notified of such order.
    IV. All other criminal trespass is a violation.
    V. In this section, "secured premises'' means any place which is posted in a manner prescribed by law or in a manner reasonably likely to come to the attention of intruders, or which is fenced or otherwise enclosed in a manner designed to exclude intruders.
    VI. In this section, "property,'' "property of another,'' and "value'' shall be as defined in RSA 637:2, I, IV, and V, respectively.

Jim Johnson

Besides what Pat and Tom said.

Traditionally we have had to rely on the Galactic Defense Force, colloquy know as the GDF's, for home defense.  The GDF's also have a subdivision know as The Constitutional Rangers.  But GDF's seem to be ineffective at home defence as seem in the Brown Case.

Now, there are many options for Hypothetical Home Defence, 2HD.
We have just been connected to the Rebel Alliance, formally The Ron Paul Rebel Alliance, who have a rapid response team as well as a rubber coated Wookee.
There is also the Gort Robot which is very low maintenance and can preform rescue operations as well as medical aid.
Captain America covers the south west of NH, while Capt. Liberty cover parts of south east NH.

For home owners who do not have a great deal of money and a lot of extra time the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance, NHLA, is a growing defense force.  Although actual defense of your home may take from 15 to 150 years.

For anyone who has connections to the military... and I know some of you do, a proactive defense called the Little Home Nuke, LHN, maybe the ticket to happiness, safety and security for you.  MAD, Mutually Assured Destruction, has been US Government approved since the 1950's and as small as a backpack since the 1970's.  Many Nations have approved of them, Russia, Briton, France, India, Pakistan... the list goes on and on.  

Remember the basic thing when purchasing any violent home defense force, mutual destruction is not always guaranteed but it is assured.

Tom Sawyer

Gort is my favorite choice...  ;D
(Although if the blue light gang kidnaps me he might destroy the world  :o )

Pat K


Jim Johnson

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 01, 2008, 10:39 AM NHFT
Gort is my favorite choice...  ;D
(Although if the blue light gang kidnaps me he might destroy the world  :o )


Oh!  Great, thanks... just give away the secret... I can see my Gorts just rotting in the corner... yea... buy durable goods... I could have had LHN's... but the robots do so much more... like have a secret phrase that now any body can use to turn it off!   :garlic:

freeborn

Here you go. New Hampshire law concerning force:

    627:4 Physical Force in Defense of a Person. –
    I. A person is justified in using non-deadly force upon another person in order to defend himself or a third person from what he reasonably believes to be the imminent use of unlawful, non-deadly force by such other person, and he may use a degree of such force which he reasonably believes to be necessary for such purpose. However, such force is not justifiable if:
       (a) With a purpose to cause physical harm to another person, he provoked the use of unlawful, non-deadly force by such other person; or
       (b) He was the initial aggressor, unless after such aggression he withdraws from the encounter and effectively communicates to such other person his intent to do so, but the latter notwithstanding continues the use or threat of unlawful, non-deadly force; or
       (c) The force involved was the product of a combat by agreement not authorized by law.
    II. A person is justified in using deadly force upon another person when he reasonably believes that such other person:
       (a) Is about to use unlawful, deadly force against the actor or a third person;
       (b) Is likely to use any unlawful force against a person present while committing or attempting to commit a burglary;
       (c) Is committing or about to commit kidnapping or a forcible sex offense; or
       (d) Is likely to use any unlawful force in the commission of a felony against the actor within such actor's dwelling or its curtilage.
     III. A person is not justified in using deadly force on another to defend himself or a third person from deadly force by the other if he knows that he and the third person can, with complete safety:
       (a) Retreat from the encounter, except that he is not required to retreat if he is within his dwelling or its curtilage and was not the initial aggressor; or
       (b) Surrender property to a person asserting a claim of right thereto; or
       (c) Comply with a demand that he abstain from performing an act which he is not obliged to perform; nor is the use of deadly force justifiable when, with the purpose of causing death or serious bodily harm, the actor has provoked the use of force against himself in the same encounter.
       (d) If he is a law enforcement officer or a private person assisting him at his direction and was acting pursuant to RSA 627:5, he need not retreat.

Tom Sawyer

Quote from: Facilitator to the Icon on October 01, 2008, 12:18 PM NHFT
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 01, 2008, 10:39 AM NHFT
Gort is my favorite choice...  ;D
(Although if the blue light gang kidnaps me he might destroy the world  :o )


Oh!  Great, thanks... just give away the secret... I can see my Gorts just rotting in the corner... yea... buy durable goods... I could have had LHN's... but the robots do so much more... like have a secret phrase that now any body can use to turn it off!   :garlic:

Oh so now I'm a stinker :garlic:

Of course you know (or should) that the Mark 2 model has programable passphrases. (shish)  ;D

Raineyrocks

Quote from: Pat McCotter on October 01, 2008, 02:20 AM NHFT
Video of the incidents are best. Pictures are OK but you need sound and motion. Just remember - be nice  - you are on the video also. If they are not nice, it works against them.

If these hypothetical trespassers are "official government types" you will need to be standing on principle and aware of the consequences of any actions you take and willing to suffer them.

If they are ordinary run of the mill trespassers just videoing them should make them think twice but we've seen what has been happening in Salem with leetninja - so record and let folks here know about it.

There wasn't anytime for videos, it was a spur of the moment thing.  :-\   I agree though videos are a great idea, thanks!  :D

Raineyrocks

Quote from: Tom Sawyer on October 01, 2008, 04:43 AM NHFT
Once you tell someone to leave if they don't it is considered Trespass. Although involving the cops can be a real drag sometimes.



I know personally I like to leave the cops out of almost everything possible and handle things my way so I hear you on that one.  :)

Raineyrocks

Quote from: KBCraig on October 01, 2008, 10:04 AM NHFT
Relevant portions in bold:

635:2 Criminal Trespass. –
    I. A person is guilty of criminal trespass if, knowing that he is not licensed or privileged to do so, he enters or remains in any place.
    II. Criminal trespass is a misdemeanor for the first offense and a class B felony for any subsequent offense if the person knowingly or recklessly causes damage in excess of $1,000 to the value of the property of another.
    III. Criminal trespass is a misdemeanor if:
       (a) The trespass takes place in an occupied structure as defined in RSA 635:1, III; or
       (b) The person knowingly enters or remains:
          (1) In any secured premises;
          (2) In any place in defiance of an order to leave or not to enter which was personally communicated to him by the owner or other authorized person; or
          (3) In any place in defiance of any court order restraining him from entering such place so long as he has been properly notified of such order.
    IV. All other criminal trespass is a violation.
    V. In this section, "secured premises'' means any place which is posted in a manner prescribed by law or in a manner reasonably likely to come to the attention of intruders, or which is fenced or otherwise enclosed in a manner designed to exclude intruders.
    VI. In this section, "property,'' "property of another,'' and "value'' shall be as defined in RSA 637:2, I, IV, and V, respectively.


The difficult part in this situation would be not getting the cops involved, right?  :-\

Raineyrocks

Quote from: Facilitator to the Icon on October 01, 2008, 10:30 AM NHFT
Besides what Pat and Tom said.

Traditionally we have had to rely on the Galactic Defense Force, colloquy know as the GDF's, for home defense.  The GDF's also have a subdivision know as The Constitutional Rangers.  But GDF's seem to be ineffective at home defence as seem in the Brown Case.

Now, there are many options for Hypothetical Home Defence, 2HD.
We have just been connected to the Rebel Alliance, formally The Ron Paul Rebel Alliance, who have a rapid response team as well as a rubber coated Wookee.
There is also the Gort Robot which is very low maintenance and can preform rescue operations as well as medical aid.
Captain America covers the south west of NH, while Capt. Liberty cover parts of south east NH.

For home owners who do not have a great deal of money and a lot of extra time the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance, NHLA, is a growing defense force.  Although actual defense of your home may take from 15 to 150 years.

For anyone who has connections to the military... and I know some of you do, a proactive defense called the Little Home Nuke, LHN, maybe the ticket to happiness, safety and security for you.  MAD, Mutually Assured Destruction, has been US Government approved since the 1950's and as small as a backpack since the 1970's.  Many Nations have approved of them, Russia, Briton, France, India, Pakistan... the list goes on and on.  

Remember the basic thing when purchasing any violent home defense force, mutual destruction is not always guaranteed but it is assured.


I am so confused, what does this have to do with the hypothetical situation?   :)