420 protests and the medical marijuana override

[Jean Coutu]

I think both sides are making good points. I also see a lot of people on the same team who until recently all supported, for the most part, each other regardless of the paths that they chose to dealing with MJ laws reform, now having basicly a pissing match between themselves which isn't good or helps the cause either. Who would have known the smoke ins would have taken off this way & the hearing just happens to be less than 3 weeks away. Matt with many have worked hard with the path they chose. Your all good people fighting for the same thing, there's obviously an amicable solution to this. I must admit though, the K.P.D. lobby was a fucking classic. I was crackin up. but, anyone can see where that could stir things up.
ALSO, DID ANYBODY NOTICE THIS PIECE OF SHIT LTE IN THE CONCORD MONITOR? "Keene watch out" "FSP kicked out of northern NH" I could care less about the usual innuendo's with LFOD and LFOD is hosted equally by all, however, this LTE is new heights in misinformation.
http://www.concordmonitor.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2009910040343

[Ogre]

I haven't followed this particular bill, but isn't it completely and utterly pointless? Didn't we learn with the CA attempt that the feds are more than happy to show up, break down doors, destroy property, and cage people, no matter what the state laws are? In fact, wouldn't the fed like to see the state provide them with a nice list of all the places that are selling MJ so they can raid them at will?

I'm not opposed to legalizing MJ in any way possible, but I honestly don't think the law will have any effect other than attracting the attention of the feds.

[Rocketman]

I haven't followed this particular bill, but isn't it completely and utterly pointless? Didn't we learn with the CA attempt that the feds are more than happy to show up, break down doors, destroy property, and cage people, no matter what the state laws are? In fact, wouldn't the fed like to see the state provide them with a nice list of all the places that are selling MJ so they can raid them at will?

I'm not opposed to legalizing MJ in any way possible, but I honestly don't think the law will have any effect other than attracting the attention of the feds.

Now there's a good question!  One with an answer:

13 states have legalized medical marijuana.  The feds have only conducted raids in California, where the law contains virtually no restrictions.  There is virtually zero risk of federal raids on the non-profit entities that would dispense marijuana if this bill passes, and virtually zero risk of raids on the patients.

[lildog]

Lil Dog, there is no way to stop the 420 protest in Keene. It is completely organic, and will die when its time comes, but no one can shoot it dead. Any effort to kill it, will only make it stronger.

That's why the Keene PD is leaving it alone. They know that most participants will get over the novelty and it will start dwindling, but if they start arresting people, the participant numbers will explode.

Actually, Kevin, I think what we're hearing is that these protesters will now redouble their efforts in order to spite me.  Nice to see that I am so important, after all!

It kind of proves my point: when someone tries to shut it down, it gets stronger.

The question then is what's the best way to achieve the desired goal.

My belief here is that there are already undercover officers working the 420 events, getting names and perhaps trying to find leads to where people get their supplies.  They'll leave the groups alone to do their protests and as you point out, once interest dies down so will the protests.  Maybe a month or two later you'll see some arrests but they'll be quiet because the protests will be long since done.

What Matt is doing however has a chance at a real result.  If this bill passes and the feds kick down doors despite the state allowing it you'll see public support for legalization grow.

And if you are one of the person liberty folks instead of one of those who want to fight for the liberty of others, they why are you fighting?  If you feel the correct way is to simply ignore the government then why bother sitting in a park drawing the attention in a protest?  What is it your trying to accomplish?  It seems more of self promotion then of attempting to further the cause.

[Pat K]

Thanks, guys, I'm going to delete my account after I'm finished lecturing.  It will be much easier to change the laws we are all forced to live under when I am no longer associated with a bunch of disrespectful turds. 

If you want to further marginalize yourselves in the public square and call that activism, marginalize away!  Gee, I sure wish I had time to smoke pot in the park every day!

It seems someone has drunken a lot of this.

[dalebert]

And if you are one of the person liberty folks instead of one of those who want to fight for the liberty of others, they why are you fighting?  If you feel the correct way is to simply ignore the government then why bother sitting in a park drawing the attention in a protest?  What is it your trying to accomplish?  It seems more of self promotion then of attempting to further the cause.

I think this answers itself. Although someone may have implied to the contrary, it's a ridiculous mis-characterization to say that such people are out for liberty just for themselves. A lot of people have taken tremendous personal risks and made tremendous personal sacrifices for what they believe will advance liberty for all. Debate all you like about it's effectiveness, but they believe in it and they're clearly not selfish. I will concede there is an intangible personal reward to following your conscience even to the point of suffering punishment by the State. Read Thoreau to get a sense of that.

[Puke]

Gee, I sure wish I had time to smoke pot in the park every day!

You probably would if you weren't begging politicians all the time.

[tracysaboe]

I do want to draw a line in the sand between people who care about making the world a better place for all (except unretrainable bureaucrats) by increasing liberty for all, and people who only care about themselves, nobody else.  I am tired of being associated in any way with people who do not care one bit about the liberty of others,

So you're a freedom socialist LOL. "equal freedom for all." LOL.

Seriously, Rocketman I understand your frusterations. I'm not in NH, and probably wouldn't participate even if I was (don't care much for the pot thing.) But I would think that this civil disobedience would encourage politicians from those districts at least to support medical marijuana since they know that many people in the area think it should be legal period to the point that they're willing to break the law.

personally, I think mocking government is the best way to undermine it.

Tracy

[Sovereign Curtis]

Lil Dog, there is no way to stop the 420 protest in Keene. It is completely organic, and will die when its time comes, but no one can shoot it dead. Any effort to kill it, will only make it stronger.

That's why the Keene PD is leaving it alone. They know that most participants will get over the novelty and it will start dwindling, but if they start arresting people, the participant numbers will explode.

Actually, Kevin, I think what we're hearing is that these protesters will now redouble their efforts in order to spite me.  Nice to see that I am so important, after all!

Check your ears. I said the protest is organic, it has a life of its own. Every member of the NH "Freedom movement" could stop attending tomorrow, and it would still go on, probably through out the rest of October, before petering out (assuming nothing tries to interfere).

Ok, question time. How are you going to know who is and is not attending the protest, Matt? Going to be at central square in Keene at 4:20 every day between now and then? Perhaps you have a spy? Maybe you've become friendly with the KPD and they're going to give you info?

Seriously, you've really put your foot in your mouth here.

[Rocketman]

I'm not even going to dignify any suggestions that I would turn a person into the police for possessing marijuana.  I try to avoid the police unless I am debating with them on WMUR or something.

[Sovereign Curtis]

I'm not even going to dignify any suggestions that I would turn a person into the police for possessing marijuana.  I try to avoid the police unless I am debating with them on WMUR or something.

I did not suggest that you would give the police info, but rather made the outlandish suggestion that perhaps you were going to get your info from them.

[anthonybpugh]

There is a chance that a law will be passed which will benefit sick people by loosening some of the drug laws in this state.  Not a huge victory but a victory none the less, and a victory which will have an immediate beneficial impact.  It will be good press for the FSP because we'll have a tangible victory to point to.  It would help show that we can actually have an impact on rolling back government tyranny.  It would also make it easier to have future victories in the same area.  The camel's nose will be further in the tent.

I thought that we were coming to New Hampshire so that we could all work together for liberty but now you have an activist who has worked harder than anyone else here in trying to undo a bunch of horrible laws.  He requested that you cooperate with him for a short period of time because it would help him out and the response was to basically call him a Quisling and give him the finger.  Characterizing him as an Uncle Tom who is groveling at the feet of his overseer.  How is that working together for liberty? 

How about a compromise?  Why not simply declare victory on the 420 protests?  The police have already shown that they are not going to act.  They didn't rise to the challenge.  You won that little battle.  Declare victory and then have another celebration when the medical marijuana bill passes.  You'd have a real reason to celebrate then and I'm sure several of the politicos will join you.

[FTL_Ian]

Okay, I'll bite.

Who will declare victory?  No one is in charge.

Also, I'm not knocking Matt's efforts (especially since I have also put effort into them), but who says working harder is more valuable?  The activists in Keene have accomplished a lot (several front page news articles, nationwide publicity, world record, cannabis law enforcement-free-zones) in two weeks of doing virtually no work at all in comparison.

Finally, why should compromise be made with someone who says, "Do it my way, or you are an asshole."?

[Rocketman]

The patients and their advocates are the ones begging me to make you stop.  Don't do it for me... I AM an asshole.

[Ogre]

I could wrong, especially since I'm not yet in NH (Sadly -- trust me, I'm working on it, I've had 3 interviews in NH, but nothing's happening yet), but from what I read in these forums, there's about 40-100 people that have been involved in these protests, and it seems like I've only read about 4 posts from people who were actually there. Perhaps there's a few more, but it sure doesn't look that way. Instead, as others have pointed out, Rocketman, I don't think anyone here has the power nor ability to stop these things.