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Keene going through evacuations again!

Started by jgmaynard, October 14, 2005, 05:38 PM NHFT

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Kat Kanning

#30
October 17, 2005, 03:23 AM NHFT
If that article is correct, that really sucks.  We went out to the dam Saturday & they were releasing water and way under capacity.  Now they evacuate people because they want to release water full blast?  My neighbors came by to leave their cat.  The woman was just a nervous wreck over all this...being forced out 3x, not knowing if you're going to have your house washed away. 

They're not being 'forced' out at gunpoint, and no doors are being broken down as far as I know.  They're scaring the shit out of people and telling them the dam is about to break, and telling them if they don't leave, they wont be rescued from the flood.

Kat Kanning

#31
October 17, 2005, 03:37 AM NHFT

Kat Kanning

#32
October 17, 2005, 04:10 AM NHFT
I just sent this to the Union Leader:

I live in Tanglewood Estates, the upper section.  My neighbors are complete nervous wrecks from being evacuated three times, wondering if they were going to lose their home.  They stayed with us Friday night, but left town they were so frazzled last night.

If you want a good story, find out why the Army Corps of Engineers cut the discharge from the dam for 24 hours prior to this crisis.  I can think of no reason to do this and it appears to me that this cut in discharge precipitated yesterday's crisis.  Your article stated that Tanglewood residents were evacuated because the water level in Surry dam was reaching the spillway level.  It doesn't look like this would have happened if they had not shut down the discharge from the dam so much.

I got my data from here:

https://rsgis.crrel.usace.army.mil/nae/pls/nae/nae_web.nae_webmenu.displaymenu?menu=main

I don't know how long the data will remain online, so I took a screenshot of the chart and put it up here:

http://www.soulawakenings.com/surry_data.jpg (chart is readable when viewed at full size)

The chart clearly shows that the discharge (dark blue line) was cut for 24 hours, causing the pool stage (dark red line) to rise to near the spillway crest level (dotted red line).  Why was the discharge taken so far below the channel capacity for so long?

Kat Dillon

Kat Kanning

#33
October 17, 2005, 04:21 AM NHFT
Sent this too:

I should have mentioned that I was out with my family at Surry Dam on Saturday and wondered why the discharge had been reduced.

Photo of the discharge:
http://www.soulawakenings.com/underground/tikiwiki/tiki-browse_image.php?offset=0&sort_mode=created_asc&desp=37&galleryId=43&imageId=1307

After the flood in Keene we viewed the dam at a higher discharge rate and you could see it splashing way up the channel walls.  You can see in this photos where the walls are very wet from that.

This is just to say that the chart of reservoir data confirmed my own observations of what was happening.

Kat Kanning

#34
October 17, 2005, 06:09 AM NHFT
Sent this to the dam controllers (Guess I'm a reporter for the Keene News Network, now):

The Union Leader is reporting:

"About 93 residents of lower lying areas of Tanglewood mobile home park were asked to head again to a Red Cross shelter at Keene Recreation Center.
...
Last night?s evacuation was called as the Army Corps of Engineers planned a controlled release of water at Surry Dam this morning, said Metzger."

It appears to me that the outflow from the dam was reduced over a twenty-four hour period prior to this evacuation, which seems to me to have precipitated this emergency.  I would like to find out what reason there was to reduce the discharge from the reservoir so dramatically?

Here is a screenshot of the data taken from your website:

http://www.soulawakenings.com/surry_data.jpg

Thank you for your time,
Kat Dillon
Tanglewood resident

Kat Kanning

#35
October 17, 2005, 08:41 AM NHFT
They didn't reduce the output??  :o

Kat:

The report from the Union Leader is not entirely factual.  The reason
for the
evacuation, from my standpoint, was that the Surry Mountain Dam, due to
rising reservoir levels, may have experienced spillway discharge from
the
dam.  If that woulld have happened flow along the Ashuelot River would
have
created serious flooding issues at Tanglewood.  Over the past 24-hrs
releases
from Surry Dam were not reduced, they were actually increased to try to
avoid
spillway discharge from occurring.  At this time we do not expect
spillway
discharge from Surry Dam.

Hope this clarifies things.

Paul Marinelli
Corps of Engineers

AlanM

#36
October 17, 2005, 09:12 AM NHFT
Something is definitely wrong here. We saw your pictures, and the graph backs up the pictorial evidence. The flow was reduced, contrary to what Mr. Marinelli said to you. Why would he lie? Is this a case of covering your ass because of a wrong decision? Hmmmm........

Kat Kanning

#37
October 17, 2005, 09:20 AM NHFT
Why though?  If they made a mistake, fine.  Lying about it is infuriating.  Technically it wasn't in the last 24 hours I was talking about, but just before then.  I wrote back and asked him about the previous 24 hour period.

Kat Kanning

#38
October 17, 2005, 09:42 AM NHFT
I asked about the previous 24 hours:

Kat:

This was due to the 3 to 4 inches of rain that occurred on Friday night
into
Saturday.  The Ashuelot River was flooding downstream of the Tanglewood
Estates area in other parts of the city.  We had to stop our releases
so we
would not contribute to this flooding that was occurring.  Once the
flooding
ended, we began our releases to try to stop the reservoir level from
rising
to spillway crest. which we were successful in doing so this morning.

Hope this helps.

Paul Marinelli

Michael Fisher

#39
October 17, 2005, 09:46 AM NHFT
Quote from: katdillon on October 17, 2005, 08:41 AM NHFT
Over the past 24-hrs releases from Surry Dam were not reduced, they were actually increased to try to avoid spillway discharge from occurring.

::) ::) ::)

Why the cover-up of the truth by refusing to answer the REAL question and avoiding talking about their actions from the last 48 hours?? WHY would they try to hide this?

Or is this guy just uninformed about what happened the day before?? Highly unlikely.

What the hell is going on here? :o


Quote from: katdillon on October 17, 2005, 08:41 AM NHFT
They didn't reduce the output??? :o

We all know they did.? ?::)

Michael Fisher

#40
October 17, 2005, 09:55 AM NHFT
They're probably trying to cover up for someone who made a huge mistake by decreasing the output to a very low level and not paying attention to the water level for hours and hours.

Hey, we all make mistakes.  The least they could do is admit it and not blatantly omit the truth.

Kat Kanning

#41
October 17, 2005, 10:41 AM NHFT
Ashuelot river @ Keene, NH

Oct-15-2005 06:45 pm     73.69    n/a    n/a
Oct-15-2005 10:45 pm    73.78    n/a    n/a
Oct-16-2005 02:45 am    73.83    n/a    n/a
Oct-16-2005 06:45 am    73.71    n/a    n/a
Oct-16-2005 10:45 am    73.49    n/a    n/a
Oct-16-2005 02:45 pm    73.29    n/a    n/a
Oct-16-2005 06:45 pm    73.21    n/a    n/a
Oct-16-2005 10:45 pm    73.18    n/a    n/a
Oct-17-2005 02:45 am    73.14    n/a    n/a
Oct-17-2005 06:45 am    73.08    n/a    n/a
Oct-17-2005 10:45 am    73.06    

Ashuelot River @ West Swanzey
Oct-15-2005 03:45 pm     4.29    n/a    n/a
Oct-15-2005 07:45 pm    4.69    3,770    11.9
Oct-15-2005 11:45 pm    5.04    n/a    n/a
Oct-16-2005 03:45 am    5.21    4,630    14.7
Oct-16-2005 07:45 am    5.22    4,650    14.7
Oct-16-2005 11:45 am    5.11    4,460    14.1
Oct-16-2005 03:45 pm    4.97    4,230    13.4
Oct-16-2005 07:45 pm    4.82    3,980    12.6
Oct-16-2005 11:45 pm    4.70    3,790    12.0
Oct-17-2005 03:45 am    4.60    3,630    11.5
Oct-17-2005 07:45 am    4.47    3,420    10.8

http://waterdata.usgs.gov/nh/nwis/uv/?site_no=01160350&Parmeter_cd=00065,00060
http://waterdata.usgs.gov/nh/nwis/uv/?site_no=01158110&Parmeter_cd=00065,00060

Those last two graphs seem to back up what he was saying.

Dave Ridley

#42
October 18, 2005, 07:14 PM NHFT
Nice work kat, keeping their feet to the fire.

>>They're scaring the shit out of people and telling them the dam is about to break, and telling them if they don't leave, they wont be rescued from the flood. >>

Actually that is not so far from what I 'd want a government to do ....just inform people, give them one chance to go and then leave them be.  rather than forceably remove and then rescue later.   This is better than in mass where they threatened to arrest people for not leaving.

Maybe the ideal thing is for them to do nothing but they are closer to that mark here in NH

Kat Kanning

#43
October 18, 2005, 07:44 PM NHFT
/nod  I agree.  Just don't want anyone getting the idea they can do an New Orleans on us.

Russell Kanning

#44
October 18, 2005, 09:05 PM NHFT
Quote from: DadaOrwell on October 18, 2005, 07:14 PM NHFTActually that is not so far from what I 'd want a government to do ....just inform people, give them one chance to go and then leave them be. rather than forceably remove and then rescue later. This is better than in mass where they threatened to arrest people for not leaving.

The way it actually works is they keep pounding on your door until you give in and leave. It isn't mandatory, but they pressure, threaten with no assistance, and then turn off your power.
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