US occupation of Iraq: Time for some more Civil Disobedience

[Caleb]

Who are you talking to?  You're like a collection of cliches.

Bay of Pigs,

You are under the mistaken impression that we need to solve other people's problems.  Other people are not my property.

Caleb

[truckloadofpigs]

   Exuse the typo's.  I'm Not for the draft, I would hate to see anybody nuked?  Just getting you to provide idea's.  When I said, think and give me your input.  Whether you know it or not this is being monitored by the feds.  They need to hear intelligent well thought ideas.  If you don't want the draft explain why.  Not this slavery stuff.  Other countries have mandatory military service.  Sweeden?  You never see them going to war.  Why because every one's son at one time or another goes into the service.  Thats just an example.  No size jokes either. 

Lets just say every kid, man or women in the U.S. at the age of 18 had to go into the service.  Now every mother father and uncle aunt would surely use every available option to try and let diplomacy work in settleing world conflicts.  Why because everyone's son or daughter goes into the service.  Not just the young men and women who joined because of the GI bill or because there just wasn't any other oppurtunities available to them. 

If every kid has to enlist at one time or another during the course of history.  Every parent would insist the goverment use diplomacy until there is no other option.  Then the voters would truely have a voice in whether or not we go to war.  Imagine every parent in this country  protesting about war.  Then if we go to war every parent would want to win the war and get every son and daughter home as soon as possable.  A vested interest!!!!

You people are intelligent give me intelligent answers.  The feds will realize that they are not dealing with just abunch of one liners.  The Feds read this stuff.  Let them know you want change.

Thank you,
Hope the typing is a little better.

Now use your heads!

Cliche's yes I am intitle to a little pun too.

[Caleb]

truckload,

Well, I don't know about Sweden or Israel, or other countries for that matter who have a mandatory civil service. 

This country (theoretically, anyway) recognizes that our rights are "inherent", that is to say, that we have our rights merely because we are people, not because the government grants said rights.  Therefore, our rights cannot be taken away, even if it seems like it would serve the State's interests to do so.  It seems that it would serve the State's interests to limit almost every right.  However, that is not allowed under our Constitution.  Now ... the Constitution is dead ... so that really doesn't matter.  But at least in theory, the elected officials are still supposed to defend and protect the Constitution.  Included in the Constitution are the amendments, specifically the 13th amendment, which states:

Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
Section 2. Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

Words mean things.  Involuntary means "against my will".  Servitude means "service" with a connotation of "forced".  So compulsory military or civil "service" (see, it even uses the same words as the amendment) is unconstitutional.

We know that the feds read this forum.  They admitted so in court for Russell's trial.  It doesn't particularly concern us.  We hope they will see that they are working for a hopelessly corrupt system, and in fact are the only reason that it can continue to function as such.  Great evil always requires men who are "only doing their job".

Caleb

[truckloadofpigs]

   Thank you and with that intelligent comment.  I go to another posting.
Keep up the good work.  Your uncle Sam thanks you Caleb.  Did you register for selective service? 

[FTL_Ian]

I can't talk against the draft without referencing slavery, because as Caleb pointed out, that's the prime issue.   I'll go you one more though:

Not only am I against the draft, I'm also against the military and the government as a whole.  I've no problem with protection services being offered in the Free Market, but a standing military is a major threat to our freedom.  Not to mention that it is coercively funded, which is abhorrent to freedom and Liberty.

Hope that makes sense. 

[tracysaboe]

http://digg.com/political_opinion/I_Still_Owe_the_Military_Nothing

http://digg.com/political_opinion/Four_Reasons_We_Should_Abolish_the_Military

These are both really thought out.

The Military has done squat for us. All the wars we've been in volved in have been because our government stuck it's nose where it had no business. Even the War of 1812 to some extent. And that war wasn't even fought by the military. It was mostly fought by privatiers, letters of Marque, and private citizens defending their own property.  The reason we've only been invaded that one time, is because. . .  in the words of my liberal, socialist foster sister, "Them crazy American's have guns!"

I pro-gun liberal who even supports shoot-first gun laws like Florida's and Colorado's "Make my day" Law.  Who'd have thunk. 

Tracy

Tracy

[gone2gofish]

http://digg.com/political_opinion/I_Still_Owe_the_Military_Nothing

http://digg.com/political_opinion/Four_Reasons_We_Should_Abolish_the_Military

These are both really thought out.

The Military has done squat for us. All the wars we've been in volved in have been because our government stuck it's nose where it had no business. Even the War of 1812 to some extent. And that war wasn't even fought by the military. It was mostly fought by privatiers, letters of Marque, and private citizens defending their own property.  The reason we've only been invaded that one time, is because. . .  in the words of my liberal, socialist foster sister, "Them crazy American's have guns!"

I pro-gun liberal who even supports shoot-first gun laws like Florida's and Colorado's "Make my day" Law.  Who'd have thunk. 

Tracy

Tracy

Your an idiot. That's not opinion.

A paragraph is a well thought-out opinion? What are you, high or something as you posted that ?


Come on. World War II was the product of Europe and we got dragged into it.


For people WHO VALUE FREEDOM, you seem to oppose seeing it bloom anywhere else since that would require you or your nation to do work. What is so bad about us stopping Hitler? Becuase we used a draft? Isn't it better that those states didn't fall under fascism? And yes, I know we failed afterwards because the communists took over half of Europe. But that's an issue in the aftermath and not the war...

[Kat Kanning]

Your an idiot. That's not opinion.

It is quite lacking in grammar and finesse.

[truckloadofpigs]

 
Gone to go fish and the other guy.  I am glad to see someone speak of freedom.
Just thought I would stop buy and see how you are all digesting this info.
Remember! No one liners.  Use your intelligence and give me idea's on how we get our troops home, give Iraque a demorcracy, take care of our injured soldiers when they return, rebuild Iraque.  Did you know we are responsable to rebuild any country we blow up during war? 

Then we have to pay to rehabiltate our inhured soldiers and find them jobs.
We also have to say thank you!!!!!!  After all nobody is blowing us up yet although they try.  You can say thank you to the boys who are keepin it over there. 

There is a way to stop tererorism.  I think if everybody had to do two years in the armed services (no draft)  Just a law.  If you knew you had to go no matter what.  Wouldn't you want to straighten this crap out now and give the boys all the support they needed.  Then maybe when by the time you hit 18 the war would be over. Or maybe by the time your kids hit 18 the war would be over.  Or maybe still since everybodies kid would eventually go then their parents would insist on sanctions, diplomacy, fly by bombings of strategic targets. And yes one hell of a department of homeland security.  Let the foreigners go to their own colleges.  No more exchange students.  What the heck college is only 4 to 8 years any way.  No more woring about people sneaking into this country. 

Things have to change and you need to think about how you are going to change them.   Uncle Sam needs to hear from intelligent minds.

Thanks,
Truck load of pigs.

Don't bitch about it change it.

It's logical and it makes sence to me. 

[Caleb]

Except that you consistently dismiss the argument that it is immoral to force people to serve in the armed forces, because compulsory service is slavery.

You don't REFUTE the argument, you just ignore it and dismiss it and attack those who state it.

You have no right to try to force me to serve in the armed forces.  If you try, I will defy the law and you will have to throw me in a prison cell.  Immoral laws should be disobeyed.

If you're looking for support for conscription, you've come to the wrong place.

Caleb

[FTL_Ian]

Use your intelligence and give me idea's on how we get our troops home, give Iraque a demorcracy, take care of our injured soldiers when they return, rebuild Iraque.  Did you know we are responsable to rebuild any country we blow up during war? 

I did not blow up any country.  Please don't include me in your "we".

Then we have to pay to rehabiltate our inhured soldiers and find them jobs.
We also have to say thank you!!!!!!  After all nobody is blowing us up yet although they try.  You can say thank you to the boys who are keepin it over there. 

I won't thank anyone for initiating force in my name, nor thank anyone who blindly follows orders.

There is a way to stop tererorism.  I think if everybody had to do two years in the armed services (no draft)  Just a law.

Sir, what you are describing is conscription.  That's also known as involuntary servitude, or slavery.  How can you be for slavery?

And yes one hell of a department of homeland security.  Let the foreigners go to their own colleges.  No more exchange students.  What the heck college is only 4 to 8 years any way.  No more woring about people sneaking into this country. 

Not only are you for slavery, but you also sound like a xenophobe.  Why is there a difference between someone who was born on this plot of land vs. that plot of land?

There's not a difference.  It's all in your nationalistic head.

Things have to change and you need to think about how you are going to change them.   Uncle Sam needs to hear from intelligent minds.

Uncle Sam is not a real person, and the government he represents doesn't need more intelligent minds.  It needs to be dismantled.

[truckloadofpigs]

  Dimantle! How?  Throw you in Jail? No then we would have to feed and provide you all the comforts of home and free HBO.  Your idealism of slavery is imputant (lacks Ridgedness)! I still haven't heard anything of substance from you.  Poof! Your the president of this country!  Tell me how woulld you protect the citizens of the U.S. if you had no military.  You seem to forget the only reason you have the freedoms you do is because we fought and died for them.  (we being soldiers) 

I think you love your fredom but yet you are not prepaired to sacrifice to keep it.  So what your telling me is if we the U.S.  got attacked again and had to fight to regain control of our country.  You would sit back and say "not me"!  That's week! Not only is it week. It's just being yellow!
You have given me nothing to support your ideology that mandatory service is slavery.  Don't quote the  constitution on the isue of the draft!  It was written over two hundred years ago. Nobody liked draft dodgers in the sixties and they don't like there ideology now.  You live in this country you should be willing to fight for it.  Thats why you need to try and change the government and it's policy not dismantle it.  We don't have the draft!  Why because there are many brave men and women who volenteer their service to their country.  So your lucky there.  The Armed forces doesn't need your yellow belly, YET!

If some terrorist attacked your home and killed your family.  The first thing you cry is Save me! Somebody save me.  That somebody would be all the brave women and men of the armed forces, Police, Firemen and so on.  You need to put your ass on the line for the benifit of others.  To understand what I am talking about and you obviously don't.  Don't get me wrong,  I don't like war and I don't believe every war we fought was for the right reason.  But we faught them just the same.  Change the government so that we will only have to go to war as a last resort.  Not for political agenda!!!  Impliment policy that has very strict rules and then make it law.

[Pat McCotter]

He don't know us vewy well, do he?

truckload. Appears you haven't read much on these forums. We are very much for a defense scenario. We just don't like a world police force scenario. Let others take care of their own despicable governments. If "they" come here we will defend our own.

Too much info to convey in too little time so shred my little paragraph. Come to gatherings and meet us. Listen to our more cogent answers with the information that is missing in a text format.

Dimantle! How?  Throw you in Jail? No then we would have to feed and provide you all the comforts of home and free HBO.  Your idealism of slavery is imputant (lacks Ridgedness)! I still haven't heard anything of substance from you.  Poof! Your the president of this country!  Tell me how woulld you protect the citizens of the U.S. if you had no military.  You seem to forget the only reason you have the freedoms you do is because we fought and died for them.  (we being soldiers) 

I think you love your fredom but yet you are not prepaired to sacrifice to keep it.  So what your telling me is if we the U.S.  got attacked again and had to fight to regain control of our country.  You would sit back and say "not me"!  That's week! Not only is it week. It's just being yellow!
You have given me nothing to support your ideology that mandatory service is slavery.  Don't quote the  constitution on the isue of the draft!  It was written over two hundred years ago. Nobody liked draft dodgers in the sixties and they don't like there ideology now.  You live in this country you should be willing to fight for it.  Thats why you need to try and change the government and it's policy not dismantle it.  We don't have the draft!  Why because there are many brave men and women who volenteer their service to their country.  So your lucky there.  The Armed forces doesn't need your yellow belly, YET!

If some terrorist attacked your home and killed your family.  The first thing you cry is Save me! Somebody save me.  That somebody would be all the brave women and men of the armed forces, Police, Firemen and so on.  You need to put your ass on the line for the benifit of others.  To understand what I am talking about and you obviously don't.  Don't get me wrong,  I don't like war and I don't believe every war we fought was for the right reason.  But we faught them just the same.  Change the government so that we will only have to go to war as a last resort.  Not for political agenda!!!  Impliment policy that has very strict rules and then make it law.

[Lloyd Danforth]

Dimantle! How?  Throw you in Jail? No then we would have to feed and provide you all the comforts of home and free HBO.  Your idealism of slavery is imputant (lacks Ridgedness)! I still haven't heard anything of substance from you.  Poof! Your the president of this country!  Tell me how woulld you protect the citizens of the U.S. if you had no military.  You seem to forget the only reason you have the freedoms you do is because we fought and died for them.  (we being soldiers) 

Many died in the Revolution and since then  soldiers have died while training to protect us.  Our involvement in all of the wars we have been involved in since the Revolution has been arbitrary and had nothing to do with protecting the rights of American citizens.  On the contrary, after every war, we have been left with fewer rights.

[maineiac]

Gone to go fish and the other guy.  I am glad to see someone speak of freedom.
Just thought I would stop buy and see how you are all digesting this info.
Remember! No one liners.  Use your intelligence and give me idea's on how we get our troops home, give Iraque a demorcracy, take care of our injured soldiers when they return, rebuild Iraque.  Did you know we are responsable to rebuild any country we blow up during war? 

Then we have to pay to rehabiltate our inhured soldiers and find them jobs.
We also have to say thank you!!!!!!  After all nobody is blowing us up yet although they try.  You can say thank you to the boys who are keepin it over there. 

There is a way to stop tererorism.  I think if everybody had to do two years in the armed services (no draft)  Just a law.  If you knew you had to go no matter what.  Wouldn't you want to straighten this crap out now and give the boys all the support they needed.  Then maybe when by the time you hit 18 the war would be over. Or maybe by the time your kids hit 18 the war would be over.  Or maybe still since everybodies kid would eventually go then their parents would insist on sanctions, diplomacy, fly by bombings of strategic targets. And yes one hell of a department of homeland security.  Let the foreigners go to their own colleges.  No more exchange students.  What the heck college is only 4 to 8 years any way.  No more woring about people sneaking into this country. 

Things have to change and you need to think about how you are going to change them.   Uncle Sam needs to hear from intelligent minds.

Thanks,
Truck load of pigs.

Don't bitch about it change it.

It's logical and it makes sence to me. 

WOW! Is this trucker a government agent-provocateur or merely a product of governmental schooling/indoctrination?

Also, I am wondering if chronic misspelling is the plague of the new millennium? I read many boards and I have noticed lately that whenever I read a well spelled and grammatically correct post it almost seems incorrect somehow!

???