Brian Travis invaded by bureaucrats

[John]

Are you what you eat?
There is a philosophical theory that says when we put things which have been abused,traumatized,and otherwise treated horrifically into our bodies that we are welcoming those things into ourselves.

[John]

Anyway, I came to this thread with the thought that at one time horse-thieves were hanged.
I'm not about to advocate hanging these horse-thieves, but wanted to make to point that "the law" now stands on its head. These horse-thieves are "the law."

[slim]

For what it's worth, I think cruelty to animals is reprehensible, I don't condone it, I don't wish to socialize or do business with anyone who thinks it's fun, funny or acceptable.  No, I'm not a vegetarian, and I don't consider raising and butchering animals, or hunting them for food, cruel.  Maybe that's imperfect logic; so sue me.  

The raising, butchering doesn't have to be cruel, but the way it's done in this country is cruel.  Here's an example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhlhSQ5z4V4

That is not how my family treated the cows. I clearly remember when I was 7 my father butchered my cow Bossy. We lead the cow to the upper portion of the barn, Dad shot bossy in the head and then we used the chain hoist to lift the caucus in the air to disassemble it. Bossy kept our family fed in some of the hardest times for the farm, if it was not for bossy we most likely would have lost or home to the bank.

[lastlady]

I've tried to stay out of this, but I have to admit to being rather saddened and disgusted by people who will take "property rights" to the extreme and say that because I "own" an animal, it is my "property", that that gives me the right to abuse, mistreat and torture said "property" at will.  An animal is not like a car or a stereo.  They are thinking, breathing, living beings that deserve to be treated with kindness and respect.  This whole argument makes me seriously question the character and morals of people who can justify mistreating animals under the guise of  "property rights".  

All I can say is karma, what goes around, comes around.

(My comments, BTW, have nothing to do with Brian, Heidi, et al.  I don't know them, have never met their animals, and as such am completely unqualified to give an opinion on that subject)

what she said..

[leetninja]

BaldEagle called into P411 - there seems to be more construction going on for shelters - if anyone can donate time to finish them off that would be great!

I can't make it because of my job i dont get home until 6 or 7 during the week usually ...

[cyne]

what I question lately is what people consider to be a farm animal/food source and pet. . . suppose someone in Brian's neighborhood decided he would raise horses for slaughter and butchering. . . perhaps he really liked the taste of horse.

I know, sick to me too. . . but would this man be jailed because he decided that animal was his livestock?  What would be unacceptable livestock?

The American Horse Council along with its affiliated State associations lobbied for an got federal legislation to make it illegal to grow horses in the US for human consumption.

Are you sure this has been passed?  They've been trying for years but I hadn't heard that it had actually been passed.  It isn't really a "consumption" bill, it's a transportation bill.   It will make it illegal to transport horses for slaughter for human consumption.  Presumably they could still be transported for slaughter to be used in pet food.   And if you have a horse in your backyard and want to kill and eat it without transporting it anywhere, that would be legal too.   

At one point they tried to stop horse slaughter by taking away funding for the (required) USDA inspectors at the horse slaughterhouses.  So the slaughterhouses stayed in business by paying for the inspectors.    Now there's the transportation bill in the works - unless it actually passed and I didn't hear about it - and it still won't make horse slaughter illegal even if it passes.   At this point I don't think there are any horse slaughter plants operating in the US anyway; horses for meat are being taken to Canada and Mexico now. 

[Fluff and Stuff]

At one point they tried to stop horse slaughter by taking away funding for the (required) USDA inspectors at the horse slaughterhouses.  So the slaughterhouses stayed in business by paying for the inspectors.    Now there's the transportation bill in the works - unless it actually passed and I didn't hear about it - and it still won't make horse slaughter illegal even if it passes.   At this point I don't think there are any horse slaughter plants operating in the US anyway; horses for meat are being taken to Canada and Mexico now. 

In 2007 or 2008 I remember a news report saying that because of a new law the plant(s) in Texas where horses were turned into human food would be closed.  It saddened my to think of all those hard working people losing their jobs.  I think the law was passed because of PETA type folks.  I am sure it would be easy to research this.

[cyne]

At one point they tried to stop horse slaughter by taking away funding for the (required) USDA inspectors at the horse slaughterhouses.  So the slaughterhouses stayed in business by paying for the inspectors.    Now there's the transportation bill in the works - unless it actually passed and I didn't hear about it - and it still won't make horse slaughter illegal even if it passes.   At this point I don't think there are any horse slaughter plants operating in the US anyway; horses for meat are being taken to Canada and Mexico now. 

In 2007 or 2008 I remember a news report saying that because of a new law the plant(s) in Texas where horses were turned into human food would be closed.  It saddened my to think of all those hard working people losing their jobs.  I think the law was passed because of PETA type folks.  I am sure it would be easy to research this.

That was a Texas state law that had been on the books for many years but unenforced.   Another plant in Illinois was closed for environmental violations.   

[AntonLee]

I just find it ridiculous that a government entity could tell me what type of animal it is that I like to eat.  I hope my view hasn't been skewed. . . I eat cow, and a lot of it.  I eat chicken because they're delicious.  I eat turkey because it's good on a sandwich.

I don't eat horse, but I most definitely wouldn't send armed goons in to arrest people who do.  Same goes for cats, same goes for rabbits, same goes for turtles.   

I do find it hypocritical, that I do not believe that torturing animals is right.  I don't believe that killing animals for sport (ie- kill a deer and move on to the next kill without using the body for something) is right either.  I wouldn't support arresting those people unless they were doing so without permission ON MY PROPERTY.  As a matter of fact, no arrest would be necessary because any hunter with a brain would leave my property after a warning.

[John Edward Mercier]

what I question lately is what people consider to be a farm animal/food source and pet. . . suppose someone in Brian's neighborhood decided he would raise horses for slaughter and butchering. . . perhaps he really liked the taste of horse.

I know, sick to me too. . . but would this man be jailed because he decided that animal was his livestock?  What would be unacceptable livestock?

The American Horse Council along with its affiliated State associations lobbied for an got federal legislation to make it illegal to grow horses in the US for human consumption.

Are you sure this has been passed?  They've been trying for years but I hadn't heard that it had actually been passed.  It isn't really a "consumption" bill, it's a transportation bill.   It will make it illegal to transport horses for slaughter for human consumption.  Presumably they could still be transported for slaughter to be used in pet food.   And if you have a horse in your backyard and want to kill and eat it without transporting it anywhere, that would be legal too.   

At one point they tried to stop horse slaughter by taking away funding for the (required) USDA inspectors at the horse slaughterhouses.  So the slaughterhouses stayed in business by paying for the inspectors.    Now there's the transportation bill in the works - unless it actually passed and I didn't hear about it - and it still won't make horse slaughter illegal even if it passes.   At this point I don't think there are any horse slaughter plants operating in the US anyway; horses for meat are being taken to Canada and Mexico now. 

The AHC site only has a change to a neutral position because of various member positions...
But I found another site that says you are correct. The bill passed the House, but was retained in the Senate (most likely due to not enough support). Not sure how long the Senate has to act on it.

[Free libertarian]

 is it still legal to say , " I'm so hungry I could eat a horse ? "

[Lloyd Danforth]

Uh Oh! I think I hear a siren!

[leetninja]

http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/From-Race-Horse-To-Main-Course.html

[Peacemaker]

is it still legal to say , " I'm so hungry I could eat a horse ? "

OMG!  How could you say such a thing!  We must keep quiet, else....Uhh-Ohh......I hear Sirens!  Sh.t dude, here's comes the Fuzz!

We gotta Scram Man!!

[Friday]

Brian and Heidi, I really think you should consult with your attorney before posting any more videos on YouTube.  You've got all kinds of admission of lawbreaking and probable cause in there.  Or at least, that's how it looks to me. If you choose to fight this thing in court, maximize your chances of success.

I am not an attorney, but I've seen many people pretend to be them on TV.