Redefining the SOI. Redefining Liberty.

[Russell Kanning]

I think it runs the risk...

Just to be clear, I'm not saying ...

Dale has officially now giving us too much information

you do know the long standing jokes start when you quote yourself .... right?

[Russell Kanning]

MF, it sounds like Hoyt Farm is going to be active all through Porcfest and then some. It's on private property and camping will be free. It's only about an hour to Gunstock for anyone who wants to do PF stuph, which is mostly just over the weekend portion anyway. I really think you should consider having the fun tent there unless I'm mistaken about it being open at the time.

You can't get to Gunstock from the Hoyt Farm.
We measure our distances like .... 2 hours away for Keeniacs
more than 2 hours from Porc Manor on the Ashuelot
hour from Concord
hour and some from Little Minnesota
I don't think the Shire has taken territory over by Gunstock mountain yet.

SOI at the Hoyt Farm stands for "Short On Ice" ... since the gang likes their drinks cold in midsummer.
If friends want to visit ... just contact us. We can let you know what is going on and what services will be up and running at that time.

Current status report:
no outdoor showers
tenting pretty harsh
no fire in bonfire pit

check back with us in May

[dalebert]

you do know the long standing jokes start when you quote yourself .... right?

Can you get hair on your palms from that?

[Russell Kanning]

not that I know of

[K. Darien Freeheart]

It sucks that there has to be a distinction between the "FSP" and the movement of liberty activsts to New Hampshire. I'll recruit and support the movement, not so concerned with the talking heads. I spoke with a BUNCH of active anti-drug war activists yesterday, many of whom were completely fired up about the FSP and the activity already happening. Regardless of what those heading the FSP want, all kinds of freedom activists are being targeted and in the end, we'll win. More freedom is a good thing!

[Lloyd Danforth]

Many of the FSP 'shakers and movers' are lliving in the state and are also activists.  I think it would be good for the FSP if the board were comprised of movers only.

[Friday]

MF, it sounds like Hoyt Farm is going to be active all through Porcfest and then some. It's on private property and camping will be free. It's only about an hour to Gunstock for anyone who wants to do PF stuph, which is mostly just over the weekend portion anyway. I really think you should consider having the fun tent there unless I'm mistaken about it being open at the time.

I saw this ad about the Happy Fun Tent (note: it's got a typo in it, and every instance of the word "tent" has been replaced by the word "ball").  Sounds awesome! 

Did SakalCAI authorize this??

[Porcupine Realtor]

IMO, the FSP is about getting people here.  What they do, or don't do, after arriving in the way of activism or civdis is up to them.  We want them only to be good neighbors and activists, thus good representatives of the FSP.  But involvement in the R party or D party or LP or anarchist non-party or whatever becomes a personal issue.

The FSP org is made up entirely of VOLUNTEERS, so they are doing a very good job overall.  The website is more than satisfactory, and the events are well planned and well attended.  The NHLF and PorcFest are effective in getting people to the state.  Then we hope they stay or move here soon.  Once here, "locals" tend to like to go to more narrowly focused, less mainstream events like Buring Porc or Liberty Festival, for example.

I think the overall recruitment approach is solid.  We need more hands on deck posting on blogs around the country, reaching out to like-minded individuals in special interest groups that overlap with libertarian thought.  Or contributing $$ to the marketing/advertising fund.  Most of you guys posting here are really good about welcoming people on the FSP forum; keep up the good work.  Honey, not vinegar.

[dalebert]

Honey, not vinegar.

Good post. I agree, and I also feel that welcoming bigots in a public forum falls into the vinegar category. Or I guess a better way of putting it is one man's honey is another man's vinegar. Sometimes there's no way to safely ride a fence and not upset anyone. Sometimes you're forced to choose whom you're going to upset. I would suggest that we try not to upset liberty-minded folks by welcoming bigotry. That still leaves a LOT of room for a plurality of viewpoints.

[Pat K]

I agree with my esteemed colleague Dale.

To put it in Pat speak.

You have every right to hold any bigoted view you like.

But I have every right to call you a lower than whale shit Jack ASS
and refuse to associate with ya.

[toowm]

I don't have any patience for bigotry, but...
...it does seem to be a thought crime. I prefer to assess people based on their actions. The anonymity of the internet does bring out some pretty vile thoughts, but maybe that's better than the forced tolerance that pervades public dealings.

There's something that's completely human in defining who is in your group and who is "other." While my kids have been actively raised not to be racist or homophobic, I cringe when I hear their stereotypes of kids from public schools. On forums we have banned people based on their words, although more specifically their actions disruptive to the site.

I grew up in a black neighborhood in the 60s and dealt with racial bigotry throughout my childhood. It's made me sensitive to bigotry issues, but also a little nuanced in my response. I'm sure that if some folks heard all my beliefs (like people who don't like science fiction can't truly be considered human  ) they would find some stereotypical or even bigoted.

[Russell Kanning]

I hate a lot of science fiction.

[dalebert]

I don't have any patience for bigotry, but...
...it does seem to be a thought crime.

But who's looking to punish anyone for it? Picture this. A guy comes on an FSP message board arguing to expand the state's intrusion into personal lives, and his method of debate was to paint an entire group of people in a horrible negative light based on the actions of a few people that are not representative of the group as a whole. Then I describe that as bigotry and I am told to STFU. I didn't say punish him or ban him. I did suggest that we shouldn't be throwing out the welcome mat but that's hardly a punishment for thought crime. What I'm wondering is, why isn't the bigot getting the vinegar and honey speech?

[toowm]

I wouldn't tell you to shut up. I think those folks on the board are wrong, but potentially teachable. Part of that teaching is vinegar, and some is honey. The bigotry part of the SOI can be read narrowly to keep the creeps out, or very broadly to eliminate many folks already here. (People who seem to hate all cops, anti-immigration activists, passionate people on both sides of the abortion issues, etc.)

My wife handles the emails that come into the generic FSP email. You would be surprised (or maybe not) how many come from people that love the freedom message but have one statist thing they cling to, like welfare, disability assistance, minimum wage, and yes, marriage. They often email because they like the concept of the FSP but get scared off the boards. She doesn't give in to their misconceptions, but challenges them to pursue a truly free society, and the "sacrifices" they would need to make personally to bring it about.

I don't agree with Ron Paul on immigration, but I can see where he's coming from in ending welfare first. Some people will not accept broadening marriage because the state will force them to accept it. For them, getting the government out of marriage is the first step.

This brings back an old memory for me, the second apartment my wife and I had. We had a nasty, bigoted landlady, who was especially mean to my wife. She complained about having a married couple; she felt that single roomates were better, as long as they didn't have dates over. The previous renters were a gay couple (she didn't know) that always deferred to her and never ever had girls over!

[toowm]

I hate a lot of science fiction.

So does that make you homo habilis or an alien?