Main thread for Ed and Elaine Brown vs the evil IRS, Part 17

[Russell Kanning]

June 19, 2007

Certainly one of the most ignored components of the Plainfield, N.H. standoff between the feds and Ed and Elaine Brown will be the vast outgrowth of support they have received through alternative media channels. The owners of "mainstream" media in the U.S. – corporate, profit-driven, unconcerned with true, investigative journalism – will surely not report well on the numbers of people who have been rallying on blogs and Web sites for months now on the side of the non-taxpaying Browns, and who have been clamoring for a peaceful resolution.

The Brown family has thousands of supporters around the region and world, and most of them are peaceful – as I imagine them to be at core, although they're obviously very prepared for the worst. And the federal government might just give it to them since by sheer numbers of soldiers and guns it looks like they're getting ready to blow the place up. But watch closely for the role of the corporate media who may be inclined to help light the match by offering close-eyed, unabated coverage poring over any unflattering detail of the Browns' lives, condemning their stand as the last stand of a couple of crazies who won't pay taxes and who've had the audacity to question the motivations and increasingly violent actions of the U.S. government.

In particular the mainstream media might seek to demonize Ed and Elaine Brown on the basis of their (or their supporters') questioning of "the official story" of 9/11, which is fraught with so many inaccuracies and questionable events that it should be questioned and re-investigated thoroughly. But then again maybe they won't seek to give the 9/11 Truth Movement the kind of honest and unslanted coverage it deserves.

So how will it end? Will our federal government look at how this is going to play in Peoria, and decide to back off? Will they realize that at this point most people get their real news from the Net and already know from the Browns' blog and their MySpace account that the couple is intelligent and peaceful and generally reasonable, and that there is an answer far more effective than our stock response of defensiveness and fear and thoughtlessness and violence? Will they realize in time that there is no answer here but one of nonviolence, and that they hold the power to make that decision?

Let's hope so.

James Gage

Randolph

http://www.timesargus.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070619/OPINION02/706190353/1022/OPINION02

[Romak]

So much for a freedom forum. And to think when the FSP got started I was actually happy to welcome you all to our wonderful state. Unfortunately the majority of the people in here who run things are not capable of debate. All they do is ignore you, and hope you go away so they can continue to talk with like minded people who agree with everything they say and do. Some are even childish enough to give someone over 7K negative karma. Thought I could come in here and have some constructive conversations with people I disagree on about the whole Brown situation. But just like Ed Brown instead of talking you all yell when someone goes against you. You will not succeed this way, people will just think you are all kooks. Marshall Monier is handling this properly and has done so from the beginning and judging by experience he will continue to do so. Its almost like you all want them to go in there and kill the Browns so you can all say see I told you so. Whats going to happen when something convinces Ed Brown to surrender and this whole thing ends with a whimper? If you are so opposed to the income tax why don't you all get off your collective arses and do something about it. Me I put about ten hours a week into getting Ron Paul's message out hoping we get him elected. With three small children and an 60 hour a week job thats no small feat. I don't see any of you doing anything to get the tax laws changed, instead you go on a forum and complain about our Government. When in fact we are the Government, so in actuality you are complaining about yourselves and how you haven't done anything to get things changed. Afterall they got elected into office, if you were doing your job thing might be different.

[Dreepa]

I don't see any of you doing anything to get the tax laws changed, instead you go on a forum and complain about our Government.

In fairness Romak,  many of the people on this forum ARE doing those things.  Don't think that all FSPers are the same.

I don't know how you got -7K... I had to skip 35 pages of posts in thread.

[lildog]

Romak, you raise some very good points and you hit the nail on the head on several of them but I wouldn't judge everyone on this site in the same light.  There are some very different personalities among the people here, some you are correct are very childish and only see things the way they want to see them.  Others are very intelligent people who challenge you with debate when they disagree with you and try to get you to at least understand their point of view even if they can't convince you of it being right.

[Romak]

The very people I was referring to have me on ignore anyway so I probably wont get a response. No matter how much I may disagree with someone I wouldn't put them on ignore. Kind of a defeatist attitude don't ya think. Don't like what someone is saying put them on ignore, kind of makes my point of how they only want to talk to like minded people on here. I wasn't referring to everyone on this site, only a few. The person who is dictator of this site gave me -7K karma all on his own, he holds the power, I like to refer to him as Adolf.

[lildog]

In different light, 96.9 continued discussing Ed Brown last night during Jay Severins show.  I wasn't able to listen long but it sounded like he came off a lot more pro Ed then the earlier show.

Also, regarding the point raised several pages back in this thread about locals... I think it needs to be stressed that Ed Brown supporters should make sure to go out of their way not to be a bother to local residents.  Reports of supporters wondering on to other people's properties and such will only serve to help paint Ed and his wife out as villains.  Local government is one thing, but people who just happen to live around that area are not the bad guys here.

[LordBaltimore]

Its almost like you all want them to go in there and kill the Browns so you can all say see I told you so.

No, silly.  They want the Feds to go in and kill the Browns so that pictures of them holding nhfree.com signs will be seen on CNN, ABC, and FOX. 

They don't care what the Brown's message is or that it is hypocritical or inconsistent.  They don't care that the Browns are espousing a violent conflict when they themselves preach pacifism.  They don't care that Ed is mentally out to lunch, and that their very support may be a factor that results in his useless and tragic death.  They carefully pick and choose which posts to read so those pesky facts don't get in the way of their self promoting activism.

They only know that supporting the Browns is consistent with their unlimited hatred of anything remotely government related and are willing to turn a blind eye and deaf ear to anything that gets in the way of that hatred.

[LordBaltimore]

In different light, 96.9 continued discussing Ed Brown last night during Jay Severins show.  I wasn't able to listen long but it sounded like he came off a lot more pro Ed then the earlier show.

It was kind of sort of pro Ed but not really.  I listened for about an hour, and Severin's thesis was pretty clear. He respected the Brown's take on taxation, but wanted the Marshals to arrest them as convicted felons as soon as possible.

[E-ville]

Heardon the power hour on GCN,there will be a concert at the browns on saturday, the host isperofrming some freedom songsfor the event..

All that are avalableshould go for some entertainment.. and should get footage on video..

E-ville

[Romak]

Its almost like you all want them to go in there and kill the Browns so you can all say see I told you so.

No, silly.  They want the Feds to go in and kill the Browns so that pictures of them holding nhfree.com signs will be seen on CNN, ABC, and FOX. 

They don't care what the Brown's message is or that it is hypocritical or inconsistent.  They don't care that the Browns are espousing a violent conflict when they themselves preach pacifism.  They don't care that Ed is mentally out to lunch, and that their very support may be a factor that results in his useless and tragic death.  They carefully pick and choose which posts to read so those pesky facts don't get in the way of their self promoting activism.

They only know that supporting the Browns is consistent with their unlimited hatred of anything remotely government related and are willing to turn a blind eye and deaf ear to anything that gets in the way of that hatred.

I was just being nice my man, if I actually said what I felt the people on here would probably kick me off this site. Adolf is truly controlling what I say with the mere threat of being banned from this site. Im shivering in the corner of my office watching exactly what I say for fear of prosecution from the dictator who runs this site or..............maybe its too much for them to swallow and Im holding back so their world doesnt come tumbling down.

[LordBaltimore]

Ed and Elaine are in The Onion.

http://www.theonion.com/content/amvo/couple_in_fed_standoff?utm_source=onion_rss_daily

[Kat Kanning]

Heardon the power hour on GCN,there will be a concert at the browns on saturday, the host isperofrming some freedom songsfor the event..

All that are avalableshould go for some entertainment.. and should get footage on video..

E-ville

That's the main day of porcfest, so likely not many of us freestaters will make it.  :/  I hear people are heading over there Thursday, though.

[JosephSHaas]

Article published Jun 16, 2007
Plainfield
 
Ruby Ridge figure coming to Browns 
Standoff survivor to advise tax protesters 

By Margot Sanger-Katz
Monitor staff

Jun 16, 2007

Plainfield, meet Ruby Ridge.

Randy Weaver, who survived a standoff with U.S. marshals in Idaho that claimed the lives of his wife and son, is driving to New Hampshire this weekend to advise Ed and Elaine Brown on how to manage their own conflict with the marshal service...

Weaver, who was involved in white-separatist causes in the early 1990s, failed to appear for a court appearance in 1992 on charges he'd owned illegally shortened shotguns. When marshals came to his home to arrest him, a shootout ensued. A deputy marshal was killed, along with Weaver's 14-year-old son, Samuel, and his wife, Vicki...

Weaver said that his goal in visiting the Browns was to help the couple negotiate with the marshals and reduce the likelihood of bloodshed.

Mark Potok of the Southern Poverty Law Center, which tracks extremist groups, said that Weaver's appearance has symbolic value for the Browns.

"Ed Brown is trying desperately to portray himself as some kind of victim, and bringing Randy in is designed as evidence for that idea," Potok said....

1. MISSION STATEMENT. Thank you Mark Polok, "director of publications and information for the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) in Montgomery, Ala."* http://www.usatoday.com/community/chat/0517potok.htm which SPLC "is a nonprofit organization that combats hate", but isn't that a bit "kook"y as "they" say? of Ed, because according to your mission statement over at http://www.splcenter.org/center/about.jsp "Throughout its history, SPLC has worked to make the nation's Constitutional ideals a reality." So only for the past tense by the word: "has"?  Hopefully not, but as your continued mission for the reason WHY "the SPLC Intelligence Project** monitors hate groups and tracks extremist activity throughout the U.S." ** to click this I.P. on in a few minutes to go exploring there and get back to you.  In the meantime:

2. TO REVOLT OR REACT, OR BOTH? In the meantime thanks to you again for your Keynote Address given March 31, 2005 at the "Animal Rights Conference" over at http://www.friendsofanimals.org/news/2005/march/mark-potok-to-give-k.html wherein "The Southern Poverty Law Center knows something about peaceful change-- and about the line between the revolutionary and the reactionary."  These are "very" important words, and so great that you've added them into your Address.  So my question to you is: Is Ed "for" peaceful change?  or "A militant in the struggle for revolution", [from the revolutionary word @ page 604 of my The "American Heritage Dictionary" of the English Language, (c)1973] a "militant", page 448: meaning "Aggresive, esp. in the service of some cause", or can he be both?

3. ART. 10, N.H. CONSTITUTION. Here in New Hampshire we have the right to Revolution by Article 10, N.H. Const., Pt. 1 & Bill of Rights, http://www.state.nh.us The word revolution meaning: "A momentous change in any situation", and for momentous, page 456: "of utmost importance or outstanding significance".

4. ON THE WAY TO REALITY. Would you please report to over here for us this "line between" that you talked about, and in relation to this: the Ed Brown case, because my next question to you is: Is Ed a "reactionary"? page 586 as defined as: "An opponent of progress"?  If that progress is: Marshal tacts progressing from their receipt of the bench warrant for arrest into the custody of the Marshal, "and" the Marshal wishing not to "keep" the Browns under "house arrest" but to put them into a cage in some "correctional" institution, then: YES, Ed is a reactionary against THAT type of progress, BUT: back to your mission statement of "to make the nation's Constitional ideals a reality" then Ed is on your side! and on your side to the extreme, for which your tracking has found him to hate what has not happened FROM these ideals TO this reality, in the fact that the Feds are living in a fantasy world.  The U.S. Constitution sets up the rules of engagement: they must comply with the "Consent" agreement that our N.H. RSA Ch. 123:1 set up way back in 1883, and that is to file the necessary documentatiojn with our N.H. Secretary of State BEFORE they have jurisdictional authority to operate within the boundaries of our state of New Hampshire, per Art. I, Sec. 8, Clause 17 of the United States Constitution, that my ancestors fought for as descendants from the Pilgrims who landed here in 1620 and became members of the Massachusetts General Court under the John Howland name, as my lost-lost cousin is George Bush himself!

5. THE WORD: MILITATE. Now look on page 448 for a word I had not read before of: "militate" meaning: "To have force as EVIDENCE" (emphasis ADDed, because you mention above that Ed is "TRYing desperately to portray himself as some kind of victim", emphasis ADDed again for the word TRY, as in that very definition of to examine evidence, BUT what evidence?  You write that Randy is THAT evidence, or do you mean him as evidence for the attempt, or in other words: evidence of the procedural v.s. substantive due process of law? I think you mean for the process, because there IS evidence for the substantive, and that is the certificates of non-filing by the Feds to this 1-8-17 and 123:1 requirements (in 2001, 2005 + 2007) that Ed said the magic numbers in his court case, but that the judge REFUSED to allow evidence into the case as an exhibit to be examined by the jury in regards to "the law"! Thus we're at the point-in-time for when Sen. John E. Sununu has asked the Administrative Office of the Courts to get back to me for WHERE, if any, this RSA 123:1 evidence exists, and if not, then HOW do they intend to correct their fault or default position.

6. THE REAL PORTRAIT. Another word you use is: portray, (page 550) from the Latin word protrahee, to draw forth.  So Ed is not portraying himself technically, but taking a stand to have the government itself either "draw forth" this documentation, or be gone with you! To have the state, county and local Law Enforcement enforce the law: the law of RSA Ch. 123:1 in that they/ the Feds must or "shall" as the mandatory requirement file those papers, thus by sub-sequent in-time filing AFTER Ed's case, proving they had no jurisdictional authority for the trial in the first place, and for McAuliffe to declare a mistrial, and have a new trial to get it right from the start as a common denominator win for everybody in this nation we call the "United" States of America, where it is my hope that we stand United in this "Extreme, very great" cause (p. 196) as definition #3 for this "desperate" word, and not definition #1 nor 2 as Ed is NOT "1. Reckless or violent because of despair. 2. Nearly hopeless;" the word despair defined as: (a) for the verb: "to lose all hope" and for the noun: as "1. Utter lack of hope. 2. That which destroys all hope."  So there is still hope out there that what Sununu has put into motion to withIN the court system itself will "draw out" this answer for WHY the Feds are outlaws and will admit the error of their ways off the path toward this "reality" filing, or if need be, if no answer from withIN the court system bosses, then the Congress itself as the bosses of this Congressional Court, and us the bosses of these Federal public servants, demanding an Impeachment if we have to do this.

Yours truly, - - - - - - - - - - Joseph S. Haas, P.O. Box 3842, Concord, N.H. 03302, Tel. 603: 848-6059 (cell phone).

* pc: Mark Potok, Director of publications and information
The Southern Poverty Law Center
400 Washington Ave.
Montgomery, AL 36104
334-956-8200

[kola]

I saw the press conference from Monday when Ed and Elaine spoke but did not see Randy Weaver speaking. Anyone have a link to seewhat Randy had to say?

btw, I am thinking of heading up to the Browns for July 4th. Have the Browns agreed to the gathering?

Kola

[Russell Kanning]

I don't see any of you doing anything to get the tax laws changed, instead you go on a forum and complain about our Government.

In fairness Romak,  many of the people on this forum ARE doing those things. 

I for one have no interest in changing the tax laws in any country.